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#Post#: 35885--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: Fearless Fred
Date: January 17, 2020, 3:55 am
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--- Quote from: Quinten Poulsen link ---
>
> Farrell, and other players, could think all they liked, but
unless they knew all the details of every players' contract, and
had access to a calculator, then that's all they could do -
think.
>
--- End Quote ---
Indeed. Plus they will no doubt have been told by Wray & their
agent that it was all above board & they'd found a clever wheeze
that meant it wouldn't count as part of the Celery Cap...
#Post#: 35886--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: Vernon74
Date: January 17, 2020, 3:55 am
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Not sure about the players but there is no way McCall, Sanderson
etc didn't know what was going on
#Post#: 35890--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: stoquin
Date: January 17, 2020, 4:13 am
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On one of the recent podcast with dayglo, he stated that as a
director at Wasps he was entitled to read the findings but
hadn't yet because he didn't want to know the full horrors of
the extent of the cheating. So he must of heard rumors but
assume if he read it he would be unable to share findings as
part of confidentiality. I think I would prob be the same as I
would certainly end up spilling the beans but we do need a
whistleblower.
#Post#: 35892--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: honkytonk
Date: January 17, 2020, 4:16 am
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My guess is that is why Sarries never asked for a review, they
took the punishment as they did not want the full details of the
cheating known. That way they could hide behind the "It was not
malicious, just a mistake and we are only taking the punishemnt
for the good of the game" rubbish.
#Post#: 35894--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: stoquin
Date: January 17, 2020, 4:19 am
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Exactly, will be great at Stoop in a couple of weeks
#Post#: 35898--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: Twickersman
Date: January 17, 2020, 4:28 am
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Three things:
1. The players that they try to offload, will want the remainder
of their contract honoured. This will be added to the salary
cap. So, not really an option.
2. I think they will take the relegation option, this will
trigger relegation clauses in all of the players contracts. No
pay offs and can offload them. They I'll still be true strong
for Championship.
3. If no English clubs can afford to buy the players, where does
that leave England? Logically player will look to maximise there
personal wealth. Imagine how much the French and Japense teams
would pay for Farrell, Super Maro, Vunipolas, Daly etc...etc...
they would, there fore, unless given special dispensation, be
ineligible to play for England.
What a mess.
#Post#: 35901--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: JammyGit
Date: January 17, 2020, 4:45 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I find myself incredibly happy this is happening. Not just
because I think the guys in charge at Saracens are genuinely
awful, or because of the arrogance of some of their fans, but
because this is the long awaited comeuppance for the team that
tried to hold English rugby to ransom. It seemed for a long time
that they'd get away with it, that we'd be on the slow burn to a
football-style dominance of the sport by a couple of teams with
more money than anyone else. Instead we have a chance to excise
the cancer and get some sanity back into proceedings.
Fans of Saracens from back in the day will get my sympathy, even
those who became bitter and spiteful, because we all know what
it's like when your club is under attack. Eventually the
majority of them will realise who's to blame here, and Sainted
Nigel might find he's not quite as popular as he hoped.
But if the club ends up below the likes of Irish and Newcastle,
then good.
#Post#: 35903--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: Grins
Date: January 17, 2020, 4:55 am
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Sarries have really shafted their playing squad
#Post#: 35904--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: ah306
Date: January 17, 2020, 5:03 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Hi everyone. This is my first post but I've been reading the
forum for a while.
I've just read section 14 of the salary cap regulations
(
HTML https://d2cx26qpfwuhvu.cloudfront.net/premier/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/16173132/Salary-Cap-Regulations-2019-20-Board-Approved-Feb-2019.pdf)<br
/>and it makes interesting reading. There's quite a few relevant
things that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere here or in the
press so here's a summary.
The line since the judgement was published has been Saracens
were awarded the maximum penalty permitted under the
regulations. However, if you actually read the regulations there
is actually no limit to the sanctions as 14.3(d) says "The
points sanctions dictated by Regulation 14.3(c) represent the
starting point and the Disciplinary Panel shall have the
discretion to increase or decrease the points sanction...".
On top of that the table in 14.3(c) setting out the starting
point for points sanctions shows a linear increase of 5 points
per each £50,000 more than £350,000 over the cap but only goes
up to a breach of over £650,000 the cap. It's as if when the
regulations were written no-one envisaged anyone breaking the
cap by that much so they didn't bother to write out any more
lines of the table.
Rumours now are that Saracens broke the cap by over £1,000,000.
If that's the case (obviously it's all conjecture at the moment
but transparency, or lack there-of, around all this is another
issue) and you were to extrapolate from the table, the implied
fair sanction would would be over 70 points and that's just for
one seasons breach. There's no reason in the regulations why
that couldn't have been the sanction.
There's also provision for the additional sanction of reducing
the offending clubs salary cap in subsequent seasons so it
actually starts to look like the punishment so far dealt was
pretty soft, even if you have to work within the constraints of
the salary cap regulations.
It also begs the question why everyone in the media has been so
happy to go along with the "Well, they couldn't be punished any
more under the regulations" line when that's clearly not the
case. Surely at least a few journalists have bothered to read
the regulations they are reporting on?!
#Post#: 35906--------------------------------------------------
Re: Saracens facing automatic relegation....
DIR By: dinsdale
Date: January 17, 2020, 5:13 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: ah306 link ---
>
> Hi everyone. This is my first post but I've been reading the
forum for a while.
>
> I've just read section 14 of the salary cap regulations
(
HTML https://d2cx26qpfwuhvu.cloudfront.net/premier/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/16173132/Salary-Cap-Regulations-2019-20-Board-Approved-Feb-2019.pdf)<br
/>and it makes interesting reading. There's quite a few relevant
things that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere here or in the
press so here's a summary.
>
> The line since the judgement was published has been Saracens
were awarded the maximum penalty permitted under the
regulations. However, if you actually read the regulations there
is actually no limit to the sanctions as 14.3(d) says "The
points sanctions dictated by Regulation 14.3(c) represent the
starting point and the Disciplinary Panel shall have the
discretion to increase or decrease the points sanction...".
>
> On top of that the table in 14.3(c) setting out the starting
point for points sanctions shows a linear increase of 5 points
per each £50,000 more than £350,000 over the cap but only goes
up to a breach of over £650,000 the cap. It's as if when the
regulations were written no-one envisaged anyone breaking the
cap by that much so they didn't bother to write out any more
lines of the table.
>
> Rumours now are that Saracens broke the cap by over
£1,000,000. If that's the case (obviously it's all conjecture at
the moment but transparency, or lack there-of, around all this
is another issue) and you were to extrapolate from the table,
the implied fair sanction would would be over 70 points and
that's just for one seasons breach. There's no reason in the
regulations why that couldn't have been the sanction.
>
> There's also provision for the additional sanction of reducing
the offending clubs salary cap in subsequent seasons so it
actually starts to look like the punishment so far dealt was
pretty soft, even if you have to work within the constraints of
the salary cap regulations.
>
> It also begs the question why everyone in the media has been
so happy to go along with the "Well, they couldn't be punished
any more under the regulations" line when that's clearly not the
case. Surely at least a few journalists have bothered to read
the regulations they are reporting on?!
>
--- End Quote ---
Well done for wading through that. I've just downloaded a copy
and might read it at my leisure.
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