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#Post#: 4582--------------------------------------------------
Echo1 m16
By: Zipcode Date: October 17, 2011, 4:16 pm
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What do you guys think i should get for upgrade parts if i want
to change it to a dmr. :-\
#Post#: 4583--------------------------------------------------
Re: Echo1 m16
By: Cheif Date: October 17, 2011, 4:20 pm
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pcs nub, firefly bucking, 6.03 prothemus tight bore for starters
and a good scope.
#Post#: 4585--------------------------------------------------
Re: Echo1 m16
By: Zipcode Date: October 17, 2011, 4:28 pm
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that sounds pretty good for starter how much would it cost for
it all
:-X
#Post#: 4587--------------------------------------------------
Re: Echo1 m16
By: spetz Date: October 17, 2011, 5:32 pm
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Prothemus barrels are expensive (509 is around $70). If you want
a cheaper way go with the madbull tbb for around $35-$40. For
hop-up I'd get a G&P hop up with a nice nub (I don't know enough
about nubs to say which one). You'll also want a good scope and
besides that look at upgrading the gearbox.
#Post#: 4590--------------------------------------------------
Re: Echo1 m16
By: Carignan1022 Date: October 17, 2011, 9:30 pm
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If you want a good DMR this is what I think would be something
to look into.
First a tight bore barrel. For a DMR get a 6.01mm. Don't skimp
on it too. Look around and find the best one, price is what it
is. The longer does not mean the most accurate. So you don't
need to over due it. I would start around a m16 length and go
from there.
Second a good hop up system. There is no exact one I can say
because each gun like what it likes. It is something that takes
time and tuning to find which is best for it. Mess around with
the rubber and bucking. (even make your own bucking out of 16
gauge wire instillation. Use different hardness and materials.
you might find something that your gun really likes.)
Third is good compression. The FPS should be on the higher side
but that does not mean it will be accurate. I would start around
450 to 475. Then go from there. First make sure the seals and
compression is good before you get a heavy spring. Using a less
power full spring in a good sealed gun will push fps up there.
(That is what i did, and for a stock G&G spring, mine is pushing
420 fps)
From there, a nice scope would work, but don't go over done, I
simple dicks sporting goods scope is all you need for all
reality a BB gun.
The last and I think one of the most important is BB choice. You
need to have a good BB that you gun likes. Get several weights
and brands to try. ( get a sample pack of like 2000 rounds)
Again this is personally what I would do and look into for a
DMR. From my own experiences working with airsoft guns.
#Post#: 4592--------------------------------------------------
Re: Echo1 m16
By: Cheif Date: October 18, 2011, 7:42 am
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[quote author=Gunny link=topic=662.msg4590#msg4590
date=1318905046]
First a tight bore barrel. For a DMR get a 6.01mm. Don't skimp
on it too. Look around and find the best one, price is what it
is. The longer does not mean the most accurate. So you don't
need to over due it. I would start around a m16 length and go
from there.
Third is good compression. The FPS should be on the higher side
but that does not mean it will be accurate. I would start around
450 to 475. Then go from there. First make sure the seals and
compression is good before you get a heavy spring. Using a less
power full spring in a good sealed gun will push fps up there.
(That is what i did, and for a stock G&G spring, mine is pushing
420 fps)[/quote]
A 6.01 will need a LOT OF CLEANING so make sure it gets done or
else your gun will jam a lot.
if you ever plan on using said DMR don't go over 450. My tokyo
mauri has only like 280fps if that but I can almost drive tacs
with it and has a range of 100ft at this time. ( i have only
been able to use black .25s so sighting in has been hard)
#Post#: 4593--------------------------------------------------
Re: Echo1 m16
By: Chappie Date: October 18, 2011, 8:22 am
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[quote author=Chief link=topic=662.msg4592#msg4592
date=1318941737]
A 6.01 will need a LOT OF CLEANING
[/quote]
This if you get a 6.01 you will spend more time cleaning it then
you will shooting out of it. go with a 6.03, a nice piston,
awesome piston head, and maybe a higher spring, then like gunny
said a new hop up, remember yours is a two piece, a new bucking,
a new nub, other then that you'll be all set. If you want an
awesome DMR rifle you will need to put a lot of money into it
like $400.
#Post#: 4595--------------------------------------------------
Re: Echo1 m16
By: spetz Date: October 18, 2011, 9:06 am
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Remember in choosing your parts:
Hop-up= Range
Fps= How fast it gets there
Barrel= grouping
Other things to note:
If the barrel is too long it creates a vacume that will actually
reduce your velocity, but if it is too short the bb will not
have enough contact time and will be less percise. All of the
studies I have read (3) conluded that the ak47 barrel was about
the best legnth.
If the hop up is not set up right it can cause your bbs to shoot
to the sides or reduce the velocity.
Good bbs is the most important thing in a DMR. My m4 shoots
about 100-150 ft with .20s, however with a high hop and .25s I
can reach out over 300ft just not super accurately. In a DMR I
would use .28 or .30, because higher masses have greater inertia
wich means their more resistant to change in acceleration. The
more mass in a bb the longer it will hold a constant speed and
avoid changes in direction.
On the other side of that be careful not to get too high of a
weight for your rifle because it will take more energy to get it
moving.
The stats I would personally want on a DMR is:
Fps=about 380 with a .25
Percision= 1.5 ft grouping at 250 ft with low wind and air
pressure
Range= Land bbs at about 300ft ( you can atleast scare them with
that)
ROF= Between 8 and 15 RPS
#Post#: 4613--------------------------------------------------
Re: Echo1 m16
By: Carignan1022 Date: October 19, 2011, 10:09 pm
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[quote author=spetz link=topic=662.msg4595#msg4595
date=1318946810]
If the barrel is too long it creates a vacume that will actually
reduce your velocity, but if it is too short the bb will not
have enough contact time and will be less precise.
[/quote]
This is a good point that i really like, I would like to add
more too it. This is talking about volume of both the barrel and
the cylinder. To get the best results you need to match the
right ported cylinder with the right barrel length. It is true
that the barrel length is to long, the volume will be more then
the cylinder. This makes the vacume that spetz is talking about.
On the other hand, I will add that you don't want to over power
the barrel. If the cylinder volume is to great, you will loose
velocity. How this works is two ways. First the volume will push
the BB out of the barrel before the piston is finished moving
forward. This is wasting a lot of the energy to wasted air. The
other is that the piston needs to work harder to move forward
faster. This means it wont get the full speed before the BB
leaves the barrel. This once again is wasted energy. A third
point, if you match the right ported cylinder with the right
barrel length, a weaker power spring can get more FPS out of the
gun. This is because the speed of the piston is maxed out in the
cylinder and the full energy is put in to the BB.
Also when matching the cylinder volume with the barrel volume,
remember that air is compressible. So make sure you keep in
count the compression difference. So the cylinder need's to have
a little more volume than the barrel.
On tight bore barrels. I would like to reiterate about the 6.01
and the 6.03. It is true what chappie and cheif says. That 6.01
needs a lot of taking care of. I personally would not say it is
not less reliable then a 6.03. I think it pays off if you are
sniping with the DMR. If you make sure it stays clean, wet, and
using high end BB's you have no problem. So at meets bring a
cleaning rod with you. At breaks quickly run the rode through
it. Also if you give a good gap between were you inner barrel
ends to your outer barrel that will help a lot. This keeps the
dirt from getting to the actual inner barrel of the gun. Keep is
wet, by making sure you BB's, hop up, and barrel is sprayed with
silicon. This helps a lot for any gun and needed to make sure
any gun does not jam and break. BB choose once again is so
important. You need perfect BB's. This will coast a little more
but in the end pays off for any barrel.
Now if you are going to use the DMR for assault too, the 6.03 is
the way to go. Also the 6.03 is a lot more forgiving so you can
use the gun for extended full auto, and abuse. It gives you
better accuracy but you can still treat it like a stock barrel.
So really think on how you play, then from there pick between
the two.
On the two piece hop up. You need to change it to a one peace if
you are building a DMR or upgrading to get any accuracy an
performance. A two piece looses to much air from a bad seal
between the two pieces to have it worth keeping. Changing to a
one piece is not hard, but takes a lot of care. I have done it
to my own gun and it looks great and works great too. I would be
glad to help you on showing and teaching the correct cuts to you
lower receiver. Don't just start hacking and cutting, that is
the easiest way to ruin the lower receiver.
(sry for the long reply :P )
#Post#: 4701--------------------------------------------------
Re: Echo1 m16
By: Zipcode Date: October 24, 2011, 6:04 pm
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I will look into every thing that you guys posted thank you for
the help
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