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#Post#: 176088--------------------------------------------------
Re: Politics, Religion, etc. (4.15.14 - 9.10.15)
By: WshflThinking Date: April 16, 2014, 1:51 am
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Take the time to view all of these photos and facts. Is long.
Amazing WW2 Aircraft Facts.
On average 6600 American service men died per MONTH, during WW2
(about 220 a day).
People who were not around during WW2 have no understanding of
the magnitude. This gives some insight.
276,000 aircraft manufactured in the US.
43,000 planes lost overseas, including 23,000 in combat.
14,000 lost in the continental U.S.
The staggering cost of aircraft in 1945 dollars
B-17 $204,370. P-40 $44,892.
B-24 $215,516. P-47 $85,578.
B-25 $142,194. P-51 $51,572.
B-26 $192,426. C-47 $88,574.
B-29 $605,360. PT-17 $15,052.
P-38 $97,147. AT-6 $22,952.
From Germany 's invasion of Poland , Sept. 1, 1939, until Japan
's surrender on Sept. 2, 1945 = 2,433 days.
America lost an average of 170 planes a day.
A B-17 carried 2,500 gallons of high octane fuel and carried a
crew of 10 airmen.
9.7 billion gallons of gasoline consumed.
108 million hours flown.
460 thousand million rounds of aircraft ammo fired overseas.
7.9 million bombs dropped overseas.
2.3 million combat flights.
299,230 aircraft used.
808,471 aircraft engines used.
799,972 propellers.
WWII MOST-PRODUCED COMBAT AIRCRAFT
Russian Ilyushin IL-2 Sturmovik
36,183
cid:X.MA1.1356187553@aol.com
Yakolev Yak-1,-3,-7, -9 31,000
cid:X.MA2.1356187553@aol.com
Messerschmitt BF-109 30,480
cid:X.MA3.1356187553@aol.com
Focke-Wulf Fw-190 29,001
cid:X.MA4.1356187553@aol.com
Supermarine Spitfire 20,351
cid:X.MA5.1356187553@aol.com
Convair B-24/PB4Y Liberator/Privateer 18,482
cid:X.MA6.1356187553@aol.com
Republic P-47 Thunderbolt 15,686
cid:X.MA7.1356187553@aol.com
North American P-51 Mustang 15,875
cid:X.MA8.1356187553@aol.com
Junkers Ju-88
15,000
cid:X.MA9.1356187553@aol.com
Hawker Hurricane 14,533
cid:X.MA10.1356187553@aol.com
Curtiss P-40 Warhawk 13,738
cid:X.MA11.1356187553@aol.com
Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress 12,731
cid:X.MA12.1356187553@aol.com
Vought F4U Corsair 12,571
cid:X.MA13.1356187553@aol.com
Grumman F6F Hellcat 12,275
cid:X.MA14.1356187553@aol.com
Petlyakov Pe-2
11,400
cid:X.MA15.1356187553@aol.com
Lockheed P-38 Lightning 10,037
cid:X.MA16.1356187553@aol.com
Mitsubishi A6M Zero 10,449
cid:X.MA17.1356187553@aol.com
North American B-25 Mitchell 9,984
cid:X.MA18.1356187553@aol.com
Lavochkin LaGG-5 9,920
cid:X.MA19.1356187553@aol.com
Grumman TBM Avenger 9,837
cid:X.MA20.1356187553@aol.com
Bell P-39 Airacobra 9,584
cid:X.MA21.1356187553@aol.com
Nakajima Ki-43 Oscar 5,919
cid:X.MA22.1356187553@aol.com
DeHavilland Mosquito 7,780
cid:X.MA23.1356187553@aol.com
Avro Lancaster
7,377
cid:X.MA24.1356187553@aol.com
Heinkel He-111
6,508
cid:X.MA25.1356187553@aol.com
Handley-Page Halifax 6,176
cid:X.MA26.1356187553@aol.com
Messerschmitt Bf-110 6,150
cid:X.MA27.1356187553@aol.com
Lavochkin LaGG-7 5,753
cid:X.MA28.1356187553@aol.com
Boeing B-29 Superfortress 3,970
cid:X.MA29.1356187553@aol.com
Short Stirling
2,383
cid:X.MA30.1356187553@aol.com
The US lost 14,903 pilots, aircrew and support personnel plus
13,873 airplanes ---inside the continental United States. There
were 52,651 aircraft accidents (6,039 involving fatalities) in
45 months.
Average 1,170 aircraft accidents per month---- nearly 40 a day.
It gets worse.....
Almost 1,000 planes disappeared en route from the US to foreign
climes. But 43,581 aircraft were lost overseas including
22,948 on combat missions (18,418 in Europe) and 20,633 due to
non-combat causes overseas.
In a single 376 plane raid in August 1943, 60 B-17s were shot
down. That was a 16 percent loss rate and meant
600 empty bunks in England. In 1942-43, it was statistically
impossible for bomber crews to complete the intended 25-mission
tour in Europe.
Pacific theatre losses were far less (4,530 in combat) owing to
smaller forces committed. The B-29 mission against Tokyo on May
25, 1945, cost 26 Superfortresses, 5.6 percent of the 464
dispatched from the Marianas.
On average, 6,600 American servicemen died per month during
WWII, about 220 a day. Over 40,000 airmen were killed in combat
and another 18,000 wounded. Some 12,000 missing men were
declared dead, including those "liberated" by the Soviets but
never returned. More than 41,000 were captured. Half of the
5,400 held by the Japanese died in captivity, compared with
one-tenth in German hands. Total combat casualties were
121,867.
The US forces peak strength was in 1944 with 2,372,000
personnel, nearly twice the previous year's figure.
Losses were huge---but so were production totals. From 1941
through 1945, American industry delivered more than 276,000
military aircraft. That was not only for US Army, Navy and
Marine Corps, but also for allies as diverse as Britain,
Australia, China and Russia.
Our enemies took massive losses. Through much of 1944, the
Luftwaffe sustained hemorrhaging of 25% of aircrews and 40
planes a month.
Experience Level:
Uncle Sam sent many men to war with minimum training. Some
fighter pilots entered combat in 1942 with less than 1 hour in
their assigned aircraft..
The 357th Fighter Group (The Yoxford Boys) went to England in
late 1943 having trained on P-39s, then flew Mustangs. They
never saw a Mustang until the first combat mission.
With the arrival of new aircraft, many units transitioned in
combat. The attitude was, "They all have a stick and a
throttle. Go fly `em." When the famed 4th Fighter Group
converted from P-47s to P-51s in Feb 44, there was no time to
stand down for an orderly transition. The Group commander,
Col. Donald Blakeslee, said,
"You can learn to fly 51s on the way to the target".
A future P-47 ace said, "I was sent to England to die." Many
bomber crews were still learning their trade. Of Jimmy
Doolittle's 15pilots on the April 1942 Tokyo raid, only five
had won their wings before 1941. All but one of the 16
co-pilots were less than a year out of flight school.
In WW2, safety took a back seat to combat. The AAF's worst
accident rate was recorded by the A-36 Invader version of the
P-51: a staggering 274 accidents per 100,000 flying hours.
Next worst were the P-39 at245, the P-40 at 188, and the P-38 at
139. All were Allison powered.
Bomber wrecks were fewer but more expensive. The B-17 and B-24
averaged 30 and 35 accidents per 100,000
flight hours respectively-- a horrific figure considering that
from 1980 to2000 the Air Force's major mishap rate
was less than 2.
The B-29 was even worse at 40 per 100,000 hours; the world's
most sophisticated, most capable and most expensive bomber was
too urgently needed to be able to stand down for mere safety
reasons.
(Compare: when a $2.1 billion B-2 crashed in 2008, the Air
Force declared a two-month "safety pause").
The B-29 was no better for maintenance. Although the R3350 was
known as a complicated, troublesome power-plant, only half the
mechanics had previous experience with it.
Navigators:
Perhaps the greatest success story concerned Navigators. The
Army graduated some 50,000 during WW2.
Many had never flown out of sight of land before leaving "Uncle
Sugar" for a war zone. Yet they found their way across oceans
and continents without getting lost or running out of fuel - a
tribute to the AAF's training.
At its height in mid-1944, the USAAF had 2.6 million people and
nearly 80,000 aircraft of all types.
Today the US Air Force employs 327,000 active personnel (plus
170,000 civilians) with 5,500+manned and perhaps 200 unmanned
aircraft. That's about 12% of the manpower and 7% of the
airplanes of the WW2 peak.
SUMMATION:
Another war like that of 1939-45 is doubtful, as fighters and
bombers have given way to helicopters and remotely-controlled
drones, eg. over Afghanistan and Iraq. But within our living
memory, men left the earth in 1,000-plane formations and fought
major battles five miles high, leaving a legacy that remains
timeless.
#Post#: 176089--------------------------------------------------
Re: Politics, Religion, etc. (4.15.14 - 9.10.15)
By: WshflThinking Date: April 16, 2014, 1:55 am
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According to the bottom there are 29 attachments (the pics).
Those wont cut and paste. I still think you need to get the
whole e-mail to see the pics. That's 29 planes
JJ.............29. Oh well have fun
#Post#: 176096--------------------------------------------------
Re: Politics, Religion, etc. (4.15.14 - 9.10.15)
By: davep Date: April 16, 2014, 10:31 am
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When I was stationed in Schrevesport, LA in 1966 I served with a
guy named Frank Jones, who was a Warrent Officer that had served
since the beginning of WWII. He told me this story.
From 1942 to 1944 he was at a training base that trained pilots.
I wish I could remember which one, but all I remember was that
it was in texas. One of his jobs was to purchase land and
create a cemetery for pilots that died in crashes during
training. He said that at the time he left, there were more
than 3 thousand graves just at that one base.
#Post#: 176106--------------------------------------------------
Re: Politics, Religion, etc. (4.15.14 - 9.10.15)
By: guest118 Date: April 16, 2014, 12:22 pm
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Jes...the biggest problem with ObamaCare (and there are massive
amounts of problems) is the cost....we can't afford it, we NEVER
could afford it...it is increasing our deficeit significantly.
Obama PROMISED ObamaCare would not cost 1 penny more than $900
billion. HE LIED. It's already estimated at $2.6 trillion AND
RISING. Money we do not have.
Are we supposed to keep borrowing until we go broke? and we will
one day.
People should pay what they can for insurance. What happened to
working hard and getting a head? 97% of country wants a hand
out. I am sorry if healthcare is not affordable - but it's not
somehtng our gvernment can offer - we can't afford it. + WHY
should we be paying for people who make bad choices - smoking,
eating, daredevils, drinkers, drug addicts - those folks should
be on their own,
"if you like your coverage, you can keep your coverage"- LIE
#Post#: 176132--------------------------------------------------
Re: Politics, Religion, etc. (4.15.14 - 9.10.15)
By: Keysbear Date: April 16, 2014, 3:14 pm
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It is going to get very interesting when all these "formerly
uninsured" ( it's bs but ok I'll play) realize what a
deductable is and finally understand that they will be paying
the first 2-5 grand out of their own pocket before the insurance
kicks in the first dollar.
#Post#: 176134--------------------------------------------------
Re: Politics, Religion, etc. (4.15.14 - 9.10.15)
By: WshflThinking Date: April 16, 2014, 3:19 pm
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[quote author=Jackiejokeman link=topic=128.msg176072#msg176072
date=1397614208]
I know that. What I am saying is repost the original e-mail and
I can hunt down the pics that wernt posted and post them.
[/quote]
I cant do that, I did all I can do without an e-mail addy to
forward it to. If that's not satisfactory you need to provide me
with an e-mail addy of your choice. Preferably via the message
system we have above so that your e-mail addy and my e-mail addy
are secure.
#Post#: 176150--------------------------------------------------
Re: Politics, Religion, etc. (4.15.14 - 9.10.15)
By: Jes Beard Date: April 16, 2014, 4:21 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Beerfan21 link=topic=128.msg176106#msg176106
date=1397668951]
Jes...the biggest problem with ObamaCare (and there are massive
amounts of problems) is the cost....we can't afford it, we NEVER
could afford it...it is increasing our deficeit significantly.
[/quote]
I strongly disagree. The biggest problem is that it is a major
step toward socialism and a massive expansion of the power of
government. The problems with its cost are insignificant in
comparison.
#Post#: 176152--------------------------------------------------
Re: Politics, Religion, etc. (4.15.14 - 9.10.15)
By: WshflThinking Date: April 16, 2014, 4:26 pm
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Yes, it makes us right on a par with Europe and their socialized
medicine and their bankruptcy issues.
#Post#: 176154--------------------------------------------------
Re: Politics, Religion, etc. (4.15.14 - 9.10.15)
By: Keysbear Date: April 16, 2014, 4:44 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Ahhh...don't like the numbers? Just change the way they're
counted.
HTML http://news.yahoo.com/census-bureau-picked-bad-time-change-counts-uninsured-173556286.html
This is the kind of announcement every Obamacare enrollment
truther has been waiting for — the Census Bureau is changing the
questions it asks about health insurance, to the point that the
data won't be comparable to past years, according to the New
York Times. An Obama administration official told Vox's Sarah
Kliff that this will affect census data starting with the 2013
data released this fall, meaning we'll have one year of
pre-Obamacare data with the new questions. Still, the Census
Bureau said “it is coincidental and unfortunate timing” that the
new questions are lining up so closely to the start of the
health care law.
Census officials said it will be difficult to determine how much
of the change is attributable to Obamacare. That change will
likely be a lower number of uninsured. “We are expecting much
lower numbers just because of the questions and how they are
asked,” Brett J. O’Hara, chief of the health statistics branch
at the Census Bureau, told the Times.
#Post#: 176160--------------------------------------------------
Re: Politics, Religion, etc. (4.15.14 - 9.10.15)
By: WshflThinking Date: April 16, 2014, 5:27 pm
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O'Reilly: Fraud, Not Racism, Behind Voter ID Card Proposal
HTML http://www.newsmax.com/US/voter-fraud-ID-Bill-OReilly/2014/04/16/id/565908/?ns_mail_uid=25462434&ns_mail_job=1564773_04162014&promo_code=jjzgycsz
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