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#Post#: 24900--------------------------------------------------
Re: Explaining without being defensive
DIR By: guest657
Date: January 29, 2019, 11:58 am
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I agree that your wording doesn't sound defensive at all, and
the phrase "don't get defensive" seems to come out of left
field.
When you say you've been accused of being defensive multiple
times, is that coming from a variety of people in different
contexts? Or just your mom and other family members?
If it's people in a lot of different contexts, I'd suspect tone
of voice.
If it's always family, I'd suspect it's a family dynamic when
someone wants to shut down the conversation because they've been
caught talking nonsense.
#Post#: 24903--------------------------------------------------
Re: Explaining without being defensive
DIR By: mime
Date: January 29, 2019, 12:11 pm
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--- Quote from: Twik link ---
>
> [quote author=camlan link=topic=963.msg24894#msg24894
date=1548782413]
> [quote author=lowspark link=topic=963.msg24893#msg24893
date=1548782353]
> The wording, as it is written, does not come across as being
defensive. So if multiple people have accused you of being
defensive, I'm guessing it's your tone of voice.
>
--- End Quote ---
Either that, or someone thinks any explanation is defensive. And
not just, you know, an explanation.
[/quote]
Yes. Accusations that the other person is being defensive is an
ultimate gambit in defensiveness.
[/quote]
Yeah, that "you're being defensive" statement just changes the
argument from "which wording is traditional" to "hey, you have a
character flaw, and to address this flaw, you should just stop
pressing and accept that I'm right." Kind of clever, actually
:P
#Post#: 24905--------------------------------------------------
Re: Explaining without being defensive
DIR By: Hanna
Date: January 29, 2019, 1:16 pm
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I talked to Mom again and she was just tired and had a few
things on her mind. She said after the fog lifted she knew what
she’d said was incorrect.
I still want to work on my way of communicating because I think
there can be times when I don’t feel defensive but I do come
across that way. My Tone is definitely a likely candidate for
improvements.
Appreciate all the comments!
#Post#: 24919--------------------------------------------------
Re: Explaining without being defensive
DIR By: TootsNYC
Date: January 29, 2019, 5:24 pm
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ladies first.
Ignore that person. Even if she is your mom.
In fact, trust yourself more! Even if you're disagreeing with
your mom.
--- Quote ---
> Me: I looked it up and they are all done this way. Am I
getting it wrong?
--- End Quote ---
Try to internalize: Your mom is not automatically right.
And in fact, this was really rude of her, to IGNORE your comment
about having looked it up. That's amazingly cocky, to think that
she's right because she remembers it, but you must automatically
be wrong even though you looked it up.
#Post#: 24920--------------------------------------------------
Re: Explaining without being defensive
DIR By: TootsNYC
Date: January 29, 2019, 5:26 pm
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I think you will sound less defensive if you trust yourself
more, and believe that you are right and they are wrong, and
that you don't need to defend yourself to them, because you're
right and they're wrong.
Be definitive. If you are right, you will sound more
authoritative and perhaps even a bit dismissive.
People who sound defensive often believe they're wrong.
You're not wrong. Be more cocky, yourself!
Notice how your MOM didn't sound defensive when you said, "I
looked it up, and they're all like this."
That's because she is absolutely convinced that she is right and
you are WRONG.
Be convinced you're right. That will help a lot.
#Post#: 24923--------------------------------------------------
Re: Explaining without being defensive
DIR By: Hanna
Date: January 29, 2019, 6:26 pm
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--- Quote from: TootsNYC link ---
>
> ladies first.
>
> Ignore that person. Even if she is your mom.
>
> In fact, trust yourself more! Even if you're disagreeing with
your mom.
>
> [quote]Me: I looked it up and they are all done this way. Am I
getting it wrong?
--- End Quote ---
Try to internalize: Your mom is not automatically right.
And in fact, this was really rude of her, to IGNORE your comment
about having looked it up. That's amazingly cocky, to think that
she's right because she remembers it, but you must automatically
be wrong even though you looked it up.
[/quote]
Toots, I know as a mother this may be hard for you to believe,
but I doubt there is a woman on the planet that thinks their mom
is always right! ;)
#Post#: 24924--------------------------------------------------
Re: Explaining without being defensive
DIR By: Hanna
Date: January 29, 2019, 6:34 pm
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--- Quote from: TootsNYC link ---
>
> I think you will sound less defensive if you trust yourself
more, and believe that you are right and they are wrong, and
that you don't need to defend yourself to them, because you're
right and they're wrong.
>
> Be definitive. If you are right, you will sound more
authoritative and perhaps even a bit dismissive.
> People who sound defensive often believe they're wrong.
>
> You're not wrong. Be more cocky, yourself!
>
> Notice how your MOM didn't sound defensive when you said, "I
looked it up, and they're all like this."
> That's because she is absolutely convinced that she is right
and you are WRONG.
>
> Be convinced you're right. That will help a lot.
>
--- End Quote ---
I pretty much knew I was right here. Most of the time I’m
pretty damn certain I’m right, even when I’m not. It’s more of a
need to clarify and get the other party to come to consensus
that translates as defensive. Heck, mostly I don’t even care if
I’m wrong, I just want the right answer (if there is one) or
else to be heard and my position understood.
If you read my update you’ll see my Mom actually told me later
she recognized pretty much immediately after our call that she
was half asleep and actually wrong.
#Post#: 24949--------------------------------------------------
Re: Explaining without being defensive
DIR By: Hmmm
Date: January 30, 2019, 7:57 am
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--- Quote from: Hanna link ---
>
> snip
>
--- End Quote ---
I pretty much knew I was right here. Most of the time I’m
pretty damn certain I’m right, even when I’m not. It’s more of a
need to clarify and get the other party to come to consensus
that translates as defensive. Heck, mostly I don’t even care if
I’m wrong, I just want the right answer (if there is one) or
else to be heard and
my position understood.
If you read my update you’ll see my Mom actually told me later
she recognized pretty much immediately after our call that she
was half asleep and actually wrong.
[/quote]
I think this might be the cause. If you know your right and the
other person insists your wrong, unless it can be looked up and
authenticated right then, it's best just to drop and come back
later. So the conversation could have gone:
Mom: Man comes first.
You: I don't think so. The resources I looked at and my printer
indicated woman first.
Mom: well tradition is man.
You: OK, I'll do a little more digging. Can you send me a link
or reference? Maybe customs have changed.
Then either mom goes back and realizes you are wrong. Or you
send her a link or reference to your source.
I tell my staff that consensus does not always need to be
reached in the moment. If someone is digging their heels in on a
point, we table it to come back to after everyone gets to go
back to their own research.
#Post#: 25703--------------------------------------------------
Re: Explaining without being defensive
DIR By: Effie
Date: February 11, 2019, 9:03 am
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When it come to save the date notices, there really isn't a
tradition. They have only been a thing for the last few decades.
#Post#: 25825--------------------------------------------------
Re: Explaining without being defensive
DIR By: Lilac
Date: February 12, 2019, 4:39 pm
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To appear less defensive, don't defend or argue.
I have a few know-it-all people in my life around whom it's
necessary to walk on eggshells. I have mastered the art of
saying "huh. I didn't know that" or "really? go figure.." or
"I'll have to keep that in mind" and other appeasing phrases,
and then doing whatever I wanted to do in the first place.
Just practice saying "Hmm, that's a good point." "Oh, I see,
I'll keep that in mind."
On a semi-related note -- I received, in error, the master
calendar mailing for my area's large and busy Roman Catholic
congregation, which is in a new, relatively affluent suburb.
I.e. most congregants are white-collar folks in their
30s/40s/50s, so this isn't a terribly old-school group. I was
paging through it and to my surprise all of the weddings were
listed groom-first.
Saturday, xxx, Wedding of Theodore Lawrence to Amy March
Saturday, xxx, Wedding of Romeo Montague to Juliet Capulet
Saturday, xxx, Wedding of Ashley Wilkes to Melanie Hamilton
Is this a quirk of this parish or is that a widespread custom?
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