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Bad Manners and Brimstone
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#Post#: 12177--------------------------------------------------
Re: Refusing a gift on behalf of your children
DIR By: Rose Red
Date: August 24, 2018, 5:09 pm
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Yes, I agree this is about graciously accepting gifts. Even if
you hate a gift, you still say thank you and get rid of it in
private. Anna thinks she's honest and practical, but she's just
throwing people's thoughtfulness back in their faces. And
deciding for her children without showing them *socks*
especially after Beth explained the reason of the choice is just
disrespectful to them.
If it were me, I would stop giving Anna gifts except greeting
cards.
#Post#: 12184--------------------------------------------------
Re: Refusing a gift on behalf of your children
DIR By: GardenGal
Date: August 24, 2018, 6:11 pm
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You did a great job with that email you wrote to Beth! I agree
with PP that Anna wasn't doing the right thing by saying no to
gifts for her kids without even asking them first if they wanted
them. Also, kids (and, apparently, some adults, too) need to
learn to accept gifts gratefully and to express their
appreciation, even if they end up giving away or throwing away
gifts.
That said, it is fair to refuse a gift if it's something the
giver knows does conflict with one of your major values. For
example, I'm an atheist, and all my friends know that. If one
of them was to try to give me a religious gift I'd politely say
something like, "No thank you, as an atheist I don't need a
prayer book, but perhaps someone else you know would appreciate
it." OTOH, if they gave me a pair of socks in a size I couldn't
use or a color I hated, I'd thank them politely and figure out
what to do with it. (I'm sure that men's XXXL socks in green
with yellow polka dots would be useful for dusting the blinds
with!)
#Post#: 12193--------------------------------------------------
Re: Refusing a gift on behalf of your children
DIR By: gramma dishes
Date: August 24, 2018, 7:38 pm
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--- Quote from: Uncle Rupert link ---
>
> Anna is not “pragmatic,” she’s boorish and rude. If I were
Beth, I would never buy another gift for anyone in the whole
damn family.
>
--- End Quote ---
Is it just me? Am I the only one wondering if the kids oooh and
ahhh over the socks and how awesome they are, will Anna even
reveal they're from Beth?
#Post#: 12196--------------------------------------------------
Re: Refusing a gift on behalf of your children
DIR By: guest657
Date: August 24, 2018, 11:02 pm
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I'm a fairly pragmatic mom. I see it as my role to provide the
kids what they need, plus a treat here or there. But we aren't
in a position to indulge a lot of whims or trends.
That's what gifts are for - so the kids get something special to
enjoy, beyond their practical needs.
Personally, I would be ashamed to ask my friends to put
necessary clothes or underwear on my kids. If we really were in
dire straits and couldn't clothe them properly, I'd go to family
or the private pastoral fund at church, or a community clothes
closet, or something. I'd never beg for charity from my friends
to keep my kids in the basics.
I wouldn't spend $20 on a pair of kids socks, either. But I'm
not going to tell someone else they can't. As long as a gift
isn't bad for the kids, I'll accept it. (I count hoarder junk as
bad for the kids, because God knows what's been living in it.)
#Post#: 12200--------------------------------------------------
Re: Refusing a gift on behalf of your children
DIR By: LifeOnPluto
Date: August 25, 2018, 1:41 am
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I guess technically parents have the right to veto any gift for
their children which is in opposition to their (the parents')
values.
That said, socks sounds like such an innocuous gift to get upset
about! Even if Alice thinks Beth paid way too much for the
socks, her reaction just seems so ungracious and over the top.
If Alice felt she simply couldn't accept the socks on moral
grounds, a better script would have been something like: "Beth,
this is so thoughtful of you! But I just don't feel comfortable
accepting them because of X reason. I know your heart was in the
right place, but I'm sorry, but I will have to give these back
to you."
#Post#: 12204--------------------------------------------------
Re: Refusing a gift on behalf of your children
DIR By: Runningstar
Date: August 25, 2018, 7:07 am
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Does Anna give gifts? I can't help but wonder what she thinks
is appropriate. In any case, I would stop the gift exchange
now. Mention it up front before holidays hit that you are not
going to be doing gifts anymore. I've done this with a few
people because we all were getting too much stuff and decided to
just enjoy a holiday lunch together with each paying their own
way. Less stuff is great! It went over very well.
I have a friend whose daughter got married and had babies, it
was one thing to buy a gift for one, then two kids. Now it is 4
kids and I just can't spend that much on them. Sure I could get
each a very small inexpensive gift but they didn't seem happy
with what I used to get them. I never receive even verbal
thanks, and the last time I took three gifts over to friend's
house I was asked where youngest's gift was (it was there, just
still in the bag). No thank you, but questioned where the other
gift was. Weird. I just stopped giving. Didn't give a baby
gift for the new baby. I'd feel badly, but I don't and I guess
it is just lack of reciprocity (my kids have never been given
gifts) and a lack of appreciation.
The coffee giftcard would be my last gift, that was rude.
#Post#: 12207--------------------------------------------------
Re: Refusing a gift on behalf of your children
DIR By: Pattycake
Date: August 25, 2018, 9:25 am
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--- Quote from: Anon4Now link ---
>
> I'm a fairly pragmatic mom. I see it as my role to provide the
kids what they need, plus a treat here or there. But we aren't
in a position to indulge a lot of whims or trends.
>
> That's what gifts are for - so the kids get something special
to enjoy, beyond their practical needs.
>
> Personally, I would be ashamed to ask my friends to put
necessary clothes or underwear on my kids. If we really were in
dire straits and couldn't clothe them properly, I'd go to family
or the private pastoral fund at church, or a community clothes
closet, or something. I'd never beg for charity from my friends
to keep my kids in the basics.
>
> I wouldn't spend $20 on a pair of kids socks, either. But I'm
not going to tell someone else they can't. As long as a gift
isn't bad for the kids, I'll accept it. (I count hoarder junk as
bad for the kids, because God knows what's been living in it.)
>
--- End Quote ---
This is where I land, not as a mom but as an auntie. My two
closest friends are practical, and I always enjoyed giving their
kids fun things that their parents wouldn't buy them. (If they
were truly in desperate need, I would give them something that
would fulfill that, but I would still give them the fun socks
gift too.)
#Post#: 12212--------------------------------------------------
Re: Refusing a gift on behalf of your children
DIR By: lakey
Date: August 25, 2018, 10:45 am
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--- Quote ---
> My two closest friends are practical, and I always enjoyed
giving their kids fun things that their parents wouldn't buy
them.
>
--- End Quote ---
This. I always felt that a gift could be something someone will
enjoy, but that they might not splurge on for themselves,
because they're spending most of their budget on necessities.
#Post#: 12287--------------------------------------------------
Re: Refusing a gift on behalf of your children
DIR By: AtHomeRose
Date: August 26, 2018, 6:11 pm
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I think Ann was rude in her interaction with Beth over the
socks, however I think it is fine for parents to refuse gifts on
behalf of their kids if they don’t want their kids to have that
particular item. I don’t think it needs to be a safety or even
morality issue and I don’t think a parent needs to ask the kid
about the gift if it is something the parent won’t let them
have.
I have refused several gifts on behalf of my kids. For example,
we don’t have licensed character items or apparel in our house.
No matter how trendy, popular, fun, status symbol a new star
wars character shirt is my kids won’t be having one. I don’t
have a moral objection to star wars, we have watched and liked
the movies but I would not accept a gift of a character shit. I
could explain why but it does not matter. When I have had to
refuse a gift I have always kept it simple - “Thank you so much
for thinking of the kids, that is so kind of you but we can’t
accept that. I hope you can return it or find someone else who
will love it.”
I think where Ann was really rude was trying to redirect the
gift offered. I think turning down the socks would have been
fine but not trying to get them exchanged for something else.
#Post#: 12301--------------------------------------------------
Re: Refusing a gift on behalf of your children
DIR By: NFPwife
Date: August 26, 2018, 8:32 pm
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--- Quote from: AtHomeRose link ---
>
> I think Ann was rude in her interaction with Beth over the
socks, however I think it is fine for parents to refuse gifts on
behalf of their kids if they don’t want their kids to have that
particular item. I don’t think it needs to be a safety or even
morality issue and I don’t think a parent needs to ask the kid
about the gift if it is something the parent won’t let them
have.
>
> I have refused several gifts on behalf of my kids. For
example, we don’t have licensed character items or apparel in
our house. No matter how trendy, popular, fun, status symbol a
new star wars character shirt is my kids won’t be having one. I
don’t have a moral objection to star wars, we have watched and
liked the movies but I would not accept a gift of a character
shit. I could explain why but it does not matter. When I have
had to refuse a gift I have always kept it simple - “Thank you
so much for thinking of the kids, that is so kind of you but we
can’t accept that. I hope you can return it or find someone else
who will love it.”
>
> I think where Ann was really rude was trying to redirect the
gift offered. I think turning down the socks would have been
fine but not trying to get them exchanged for something else.
>
--- End Quote ---
You've hit the nail on the head! It's the re-directing that
drives me crazy and is rude. If she politely said, "Oh that's
kind of you, I can't accept them. I hope you can return them or
find them a good home," without lecturing or moralizing about
trendy socks, that'd be fine.
For everyone who asked more about the socks - I didn't put this
detail in the original post because it didn't seem necessary,
but in the texts from Beth, Beth told Anna that she bought the
boys socks, Anna said something to the effect that they didn't
need socks. Beth then said that these are trendy socks and the
kids in her church's youth group love them, she said something
else to signal that the socks were "special."
Then the texts went to that the kids didn't need more socks,
Beth should just send Anna a check and Anna would give them the
Costco socks and say they were from Beth. And Beth's response
went to "Forget it. I'll give them to kids at church." (I read
the texts and I think Beth was more annoyed than Anna picked up.
Maybe it was because the car was reading the texts to her or
maybe it was because she was hell bent on getting a check for
the Costco socks, but she didn't seem to fully grasp that Beth
was getting exasperated with her.)
Then, when I met Anna and she was all perplexed that she wasn't
getting reimbursed for the Costco socks, I explained that they
are indeed trendy and I said they're $14-$20 a pair. At which
point Anna said, "Well she could just pay me $20 and she'll save
money!" Anna really thought the re-direction was win-win. Beth
saves $8-$20 ("and doesn't have to ship them!"), Anna saves $20,
and the boys get socks. Anna said, "It makes perfect sense!"
To which I replied, "Except it doesn't. Beth wants to treat the
kids. She wants them to have the trendy socks." This is about
where I said something about only refusing a gift if it's
against your values and then she said the bit about $14 socks
being against her values. That went to "I bet the boys don't
even know what Nike Elite socks are anyway." (There was a bit of
a "my kids don't go for materialistic things like $14 socks" air
about that.) I said, "Bet they do," and she facetimed. (I really
should have bet her lunch. The boys knew exactly what they were
and were asking if they were this pattern or that team.)
To the poster who asked if Anna will try to pass them off as
coming from her; she can't. She already said, during the
facetime, that Beth bought them the socks. I think the socks
will arrive and boys will be excited about the socks and Anna
will try to wee all over it. She'll say, "Really are those
better than Costco socks?" Boys - "YESSSSSS!" Anna - "You can
buy an entire pack of Costco socks for less than one pair of
those. Would you rather have (X number - think it's 8) pair of
Costco socks or one pair of those?" Boys- "These!!" Then she'll
drop it, but be annoyed that the boys like the socks and can't
do "sock math."
I said to my husband that I should buy her Costco socks but he
said she'll have a "finally someone gets it and is practical!"
reaction and the joke will be lost. (And that would make it
funnier to me and I'd have to bite through my lip to keep from
laughing in the moment.)
I think the last gift I bought was the baby outfit she tried to
exchange with me and have me buy something for an 18 month old.
I wasn't returning a gift that I'd bought almost a full year
earlier. I gave it to the newborn baby shower for women with
crisis pregnancies we have at church. (I told her that I donated
it.)
The coffee card was a bit before that and I was souring on
gifting and had dropped holiday and birthday exchanges with her.
I usually buy her dinner on or around her birthday. (This year
she reciprocated or I wasn't buying hers.) It's kind of a bummer
because I like to buy small gifts, that's my love language,
except she makes it such an averse process that I won't gift her
anymore.
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