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#Post#: 8063--------------------------------------------------
Gender Blending?
By: Thitpualso Date: July 7, 2018, 2:29 pm
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A Grandniece (GN) has announced that she is now gender fluid.
I’ve looked this up and can understand how, some days a person
may feel more like Jack and feel more like Jill another day.
Since the 1970s I’ve had friends and co-workers who were LGB or
T. There have never been problems. What people are doesn’t
concern me unless I’m asked for advice.
The problem with GN is that she’s very mercurial. You can sit
down to dinner with Jill and have dessert and coffee with Jack.
It’s very disorienting.
I understand that people in their late teens and early 20s often
have questions about their identities. However, there’s
something here that puts me on my guard and makes me worry for
her.
Since the age of three, GN has been ‘She Who Must Be Obeyed’.
She’s used to getting whatever she wants whenever she wants it.
She’s also very good at turning the charm to manipulate the
unsuspecting. Given GN’s history, I can’t help but suspect that
this is another attention grab. She’s not living with her
parents and she will be meeting people who will not be
overwhelmed by the glory of her brilliance. Yes, she has spoken
about herself in those terms.
If this is a genuine decision on her part, I want to be
supportive but I don’t want to be sucked into a black hole of
narcissism either.
We don’t see her often but any tips on how to deal with the
yo-yo identities would be helpful.
#Post#: 8065--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gender Blending?
By: sandisadie Date: July 7, 2018, 3:43 pm
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My tip, for what it is worth, is, that since you already are
very aware of her personality, just ignore whatever comes out of
her mouth. I've known several people similar to this and that's
what I've done when in their presence. I've even been known to
laugh at their statements. Some people just can't be taken
seriously!
#Post#: 8068--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gender Blending?
By: Tea Drinker Date: July 7, 2018, 4:19 pm
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You can take advantage of the fact that the English
second-person pronoun isn't gendered. Whenever possible, just
address your niece directly as "you": "Would you like some pie?"
doesn't have to be "Jill, would you like some pie?" That won't
always work, of course--sometimes you do need to address a
specific person or people out of a larger group--but it reduces
the number of times you risk getting it wrong.
If your niece is likes attention but not fights, you can ask for
help: "I don't want to upset you by using the wrong name or
pronouns. Is there something I can call you that would feel
comfortable wherever on the gender spectrum you are, like
darling or a nickname that isn't connected to your names?" I
know a woman who goes by "Spike," and a man who goes by "Chip,"
in each case because they picked a nickname and told people to
call them that.
As a side note, is "niece" still your relative's preferred term
for that relationship? I know people who use "nibling" to mean
"niece or nephew," usually because they have at least one of
each gender and "my niblings" is faster than "my nieces and
nephews." But, like "sibling," it works for non-binary people as
well as for mixed-gender groups and people whose gender the
speaker doesn't know.
#Post#: 8071--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gender Blending?
By: OnyxBird Date: July 7, 2018, 5:42 pm
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Could you explain in more detail what is happening that makes
you aware of their gender identity changing over the course of a
meal? I'm having trouble picturing how that would happen in a
way that affects their dinnermates. Are they literally asking
you to call them by different names based on how they currently
feel and expecting you to pick up on which applies at any given
moment? ???
In a one-on-one dinner, I wouldn't expect much in the way of
gender-specific dialog (gender-specific pronouns and even names
are typically needed to talk about a person rather than to
them). And trying to switch to a gender-neutral pronoun when
talking about the person (if that's what they'd like) seems like
a reasonable accommodation that wouldn't require following
transient changes in where they are on the spectrum.
Conversation content with someone you know is generally based on
them as an individual rather than their identity as a man or
woman, so again that doesn't seem like it would be affected by
short-term fluctuations in gender identity.
#Post#: 8082--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gender Blending?
By: Jem Date: July 7, 2018, 8:43 pm
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[quote author=sandisadie link=topic=511.msg8065#msg8065
date=1530996186]
My tip, for what it is worth, is, that since you already are
very aware of her personality, just ignore whatever comes out of
her mouth. I've known several people similar to this and that's
what I've done when in their presence. I've even been known to
laugh at their statements. Some people just can't be taken
seriously!
[/quote]
Agreed. I am all for being sensitive to people struggling with
whatever issues, but the way this is described screams “look at
me” instead of “please respect that I am Jack now.” I would do
my best to ignore the drama and just talk with this person about
things s/he is doing, interested in, etc. This person’s gender
is the least interesting thing about them, in other words.
#Post#: 8085--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gender Blending?
By: Celestia Date: July 7, 2018, 9:35 pm
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I would think the best way to treat it regardless of the truth
of her case is as an insignificant detail. Anytime s/he corrects
you, "auntie, I'm Jack," you just smile, acknowledge it, "sorry,
Jack, now let me tell you about my...".
If it's genuine, you respect the expression (even if it's out of
the norm to swap pronouns on THAT much of a whim) and show
you're supportive.
If it's attention-seeking, you aren't giving undue attention.
It'd be a much bigger deal and much more drama to refuse and
call hir identity into question.
I suspect if it's genuine, Jack/Jill will eventually get tired
of having to correct people 17 times a day, and will find a way
to compromise with a gender-neutral nickname or by just ignoring
some misgendering. It's possible that right now it feels like
the most important thing in the world to be gendered correctly
at every moment, but it must get exhausting if it does change
that often. Without knowing the individual, I wouldn't think
attention-grabbing until a year or so had gone by and they were
still doing it.
#Post#: 8096--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gender Blending?
By: Hanna Date: July 8, 2018, 8:59 am
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[quote author=OnyxBird link=topic=511.msg8071#msg8071
date=1531003365]
Could you explain in more detail what is happening that makes
you aware of their gender identity changing over the course of a
meal? I'm having trouble picturing how that would happen in a
way that affects their dinnermates. Are they literally asking
you to call them by different names based on how they currently
feel and expecting you to pick up on which applies at any given
moment? ???
[/quote]
I was wondering this also.
#Post#: 8103--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gender Blending?
By: Thitpualso Date: July 8, 2018, 10:19 am
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In my limited understanding of gender fluidity, the person is
still the same person. We’re all mixtures of male and female.
It’s just that in these folks, one gender predominates at any
given time.
I’ve only seen this once but, in the case of GN, she changes
like a character with multiple personalities in a film. It’s
quite theatrical. The voice and the posture changes. This is
what makes me wonder if it’s a , ‘Hey! Look at how unique I
am!’ Ploy. GN loves to ‘scare the squares’ and she’ll probably
move on to something else once the shock effect wears off.
Thanks to everyone for good, solid and sensitive advice.
#Post#: 8113--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gender Blending?
By: MrsG Date: July 8, 2018, 2:09 pm
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[quote author=Celestia link=topic=511.msg8085#msg8085
date=1531017349]
I would think the best way to treat it regardless of the truth
of her case is as an insignificant detail. Anytime s/he corrects
you, "auntie, I'm Jack," you just smile, acknowledge it, "sorry,
Jack, now let me tell you about my...".
If it's genuine, you respect the expression (even if it's out of
the norm to swap pronouns on THAT much of a whim) and show
you're supportive.
If it's attention-seeking, you aren't giving undue attention.
It'd be a much bigger deal and much more drama to refuse and
call hir identity into question.
I suspect if it's genuine, Jack/Jill will eventually get tired
of having to correct people 17 times a day, and will find a way
to compromise with a gender-neutral nickname or by just ignoring
some misgendering. It's possible that right now it feels like
the most important thing in the world to be gendered correctly
at every moment, but it must get exhausting if it does change
that often. Without knowing the individual, I wouldn't think
attention-grabbing until a year or so had gone by and they were
still doing it.
[/quote]
I think this is very well stated and completely true. That said,
though, from what the OP has described I think that this might
be more of a sociopathic attention-grab more than anything else.
Honestly, I would ignore her and watch how things develop.
#Post#: 8116--------------------------------------------------
Re: Gender Blending?
By: VorFemme Date: July 8, 2018, 3:05 pm
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I was going to say "drama llama" attention grab, possibly with
the adjective "sophomoric" but I do see that it just doesn't
come across as "real" when Jack/Jill is being so theatrical
about it. It just doesn't come across the same way when
Jack/Jill is being so over the top about what a huge problem it
is. Go with a gender-free nickname (J, Jay, Jackie, or
something). You're not being brilliant by telling everyone how
brilliant you are, you're being...well, the opposite...even of
"interesting".
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