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#Post#: 76281--------------------------------------------------
Re: Damaging library books
DIR By: DaDancingPsych
Date: July 10, 2022, 6:13 am
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I don't have any experience in this area, but I imagine every
library has dealt with this issue. You are working with your son
and he soon will not make these errors. Also you are willing to
correct things when damage is done. So, I just don't see the
problem. It might be reassuring to speak with the children's
librarian at your local library. I am assuming that they with
confirm that it is something that happens. And maybe I'm wrong,
but I think that if you are willing to fix any damage that there
really isn't a set limit where they will deny your library card.
The librarian might also have some suggestions... maybe even a
book recommendation to help your son!
To me it is just common sense that many small children go
through a stage where their growing motor skills and cognitive
skills combine to be somewhat destructive. I am guessing that
you are also working with him to not throw sand and keeping ones
cup upright and not tracking dirt everywhere. This is all normal
for a growing two year old!!! I do think that your concerns are
normal and I would be highly disappointed with a library that
doesn't offer some grace and understanding of this stage.
#Post#: 76286--------------------------------------------------
Re: Damaging library books
DIR By: VorFemme
Date: July 10, 2022, 2:08 pm
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I still have steam coming out of my ears over thirty years later
over this.
I'd checked out some books for research for a personal project
from the military base library. Went back a while later to
update my notes (they'd gotten damaged & there were a couple of
changes I needed to check). Someone had CUT multiple pages out
of most of the books, to the point that whole chapters were
missing...
The librarian knew I'd researched this over time & took care of
books...so she checked the history, to find that the same family
had checked out ALL the damaged books. Apparently, copiers were
too expensive or too much trouble - so whoever had used them had
razored out the pages they wanted to keep and returned the
(sometimes much slimmer) books.
Sadly, the way things were set up- they were not allowed to
either ban the family for the history of damage or fine them to
replace the books (mostly out of print - which is why I was
relying on finding them at the library).
Still remember the librarian's face when she realized that it
was an ongoing issue with no way to resolve it, under the rules
they had to follow at that time & place.
#Post#: 76289--------------------------------------------------
Re: Damaging library books
DIR By: lisastitch
Date: July 10, 2022, 10:11 pm
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Retired children's librarian here.
As long as you're acknowledging the damage and paying for it as
needed, we wouldn't keep track. Actually, we couldn't. Our
system was large enough that the clerical staff didn't have time
to check materials for damage when they checked things in--and
for several years now, the returns have been automated. They
may notice if there's significant damage (waterlogged, looking
as if a car ran over it several times), but rips and tears don't
get caught until someone else checks them out.
In our system, once the title is checked in, it's removed from
your account, so we didn't have a way to go back to see who had
it out last--and even if we had, there's enough of a chance that
you checked it out that way that we wouldn't do anything.
And, yes, we do accept your word that you checked it out that
way.
Would it help to put library books on a shelf that is high
enough that your 2yo can't reach it? Then he only gets to look
at library books with an adult, who can prevent most (not all!)
damage.
#Post#: 76294--------------------------------------------------
Re: Damaging library books
DIR By: Winterlight
Date: July 11, 2022, 1:40 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Bada link ---
>
> [quote author=Winterlight link=topic=2369.msg76243#msg76243
date=1657247201]
> Current public librarian here.
>
> As long as you tell us when there's damage and pay when
something is too damaged to fix, we're good. We don't keep track
of whose kid tears what, unless you're bringing back ruined
books weekly or something like that.
>
> If you find a book that's damaged before you check out, bring
it to the librarian so we can pull it and either fix it or
discard it. If you find it when you get home, then tell us when
you bring it back. We err on the side of believing the patron as
a rule, so there won't be a charge.
>
--- End Quote ---
Thanks Winterlight, that's reassuring--weekly destruction is
maybe the line of "too much"? We're definitely not there!
About the board books... the library has a very, very limited
selection of those. And 2yo attacks books his older brother
borrows too. So if people thought we were creating too much
damage (which some people on here seem to be hinting at?), if he
damaged another book and hasn't outgrown it like I'm hoping,
then I'd just stay away from the library for the next 6 months
or whatever until 2yo completely stopped tearing up books. We
have lots of books at home (including board and a few cloth
books). It's just really nice to get the variety that the
library offers. And nice for them to go somewhere other than
home.
[/quote]
Weekly destruction would be a "Time to have a talk with your
child and also put the books where he can't get them," thing for
me. The occasional torn book happens, if it was that often it
would probably be more of a concern (for the parent having to
buy replacements, at least!)
We used to tell our Aussie pup, "Gentle kisses are permitted,"
because she was something of a staplemouth when she got excited.
So maybe some variation of that for books? It worked for Addie,
at any rate, at least as far as her not biting us (much.) ;D
#Post#: 76299--------------------------------------------------
Re: Damaging library books
DIR By: Bada
Date: July 11, 2022, 3:30 pm
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When 2yo destroyed the first library book, it was because he
accidentally ripped a page and found it to be thrilling, so
he'd lull us into thinking he'd be nice, then he'd tear a page
out of the blue. He was restricted to board books for a week or
so until he broke the desire. Now the rips usually happen when
he's trying to turn the page when we read to him or his brother
and it's accidentally. So I don't think further education is
needed, it's just his exuberant hands most of the time. (He's
not gentle with putting the books down, especially when he
doesn't wantvto read that book, and we are working on that too.
)
Incidentally, we just checked out another book with multiple
taped up pages. I discovered why. The pages are SO easy to tear
that even when we're gentle they rip. So much for a book of
vehicles for kids...
It's reassuring, if extremely frustrating, to find out that
adults are damaging books too. Thanks to all of you for sharing
your experiences!
#Post#: 76303--------------------------------------------------
Re: Damaging library books
DIR By: NFPwife
Date: July 11, 2022, 10:37 pm
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Bada, I was just thinking of you when we stopped at the Free
Little Library in our town, it was filled with board books and
children's selections. Do you have any near you?
#Post#: 76305--------------------------------------------------
Re: Damaging library books
DIR By: camlan
Date: July 12, 2022, 11:28 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: VorFemme link ---
>
> I still have steam coming out of my ears over thirty years
later over this.
>
> I'd checked out some books for research for a person project
from the military base library. Went back a while later to
update my notes (they'd gotten damaged & there were a couple of
changes I needed to check). Someone had CUT multiple pages out
of most of the books, to the point that whole chapters were
missing...
>
> The librarian knew I'd researched this over time & took care
of books...so she checked the history, to find that the same
family had checked out ALL the damaged books. Apparently,
copiers were too expensive or too much trouble - so whoever had
used them had razored out the pages they wanted to keep and
returned the (sometimes much slimmer) books.
>
> Sadly, the way things were set up- they were not allowed to
either ban the family for the history of damage or fine them to
replace the books (mostly out of print - which is why I was
relying on finding them at the library).
>
> Still remember the librarian's face when she realized that it
was an ongoing issue with no way to resolve it, under the rules
they had to follow at that time & place.
>
--- End Quote ---
Ugh. When I was in grad school, I was a Teaching Assistant and
taught many sections of Freshman English. We were required to
have the students write a research paper. I knew from experience
that a couple of students would always get to the library first
and check out all the books on the subject, so before assigning
the paper, I put about 25 books on Reserve, so that all the
students could use them.
Couple of weeks later, I get a call from the Reserve Desk at the
library asking me to stop by. They showed me 5 of the books, all
with entire chapters cut out. There was nothing they could do,
and nothing I could do, but they wanted me to know that it was
probably one or more of my students.
Trust me, I read the riot act to both my sections of Freshman
English the next day. I pointed out that the books could not be
repaired. I pointed out that, like most academic books, they
were long out of print. I pointed out that if the library
decided to replace them, they would have to hunt out used
copies, using up time and money and resources they could have
been using to bring new books into the collection. And if the
book was difficult to find, it might cost more than it did when
new. That whoever cut the pages had now prevented anyone at the
university from accessing that information, ever. I was angry
and I let that show.
A librarian told me a few weeks later that one of the chapters
had been returned through the book drop.
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