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#Post#: 75630--------------------------------------------------
Re: In Law Interactions
By: chigger Date: May 24, 2022, 12:36 pm
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I'm feeling ill right now.
#Post#: 75631--------------------------------------------------
Re: In Law Interactions
By: Rose Red Date: May 24, 2022, 1:11 pm
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And they have two children under 6. That's a difficult job
enough without 2 mothers demanding her attention.
I don't blame her for going "shopping." And if she can't vacuum
or do other chores while taking care of children, plus one or
both mothers are taking up her time, when can she? In her sleep?
#Post#: 75639--------------------------------------------------
Re: In Law Interactions
By: Hmmm Date: May 25, 2022, 8:38 am
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So what I'm getting is that no one found D's action of leaving
for 2 hours rude. That was my primary question.
To address a few other comments:
My sister has never brought up her concern about D not wanting
her there to D or to my nephew. She doesn't "demand" attention.
When she visits, she spends most of the time with the kids
upstairs, even going to bed around 8 with them.
Someone asked if D returned from her 2 hour errand and cooked
dinner. No, D does not cook. My nephew does most of the cooking.
Don't pity D. She grew up in a very tight family extended
family. Their close ties to their family's is one thing that
brought D & M together. Her sister and cousins are her best
friends and extended family gatherings at her grandmother's home
was a weekly event. D loves having her family around. After the
first summer of having a pool, M had to request she stop
inviting her parents, siblings and cousins over every weekend
because he was tired of cooking for a large group every weekend.
Her mom is over engaged in their business. But like M tells her,
if she didn't share so much, her mother wouldn't always be
trying to give so much input.
D has a job she loves and travels frequently for both work and
with her sister/cousin for long weekends. She does do school
drop off in the mornings. Her father picks up the kids from
school 3 days a week and takes care of them till she or M picks
them up after work and M picks them up the other 2 days. If M is
traveling for work, her Mom or her sister usually brings dinner
by for he and the kids. I remember how much juggling it took to
have a two career family and kids. But they have a great
network. In 2019, D & M took 10 day vacation. We split taking
care of the kids with my sister taking vacation time and staying
with them during the week, the other grand parents took them
over the weekends and I even took a day off from work to cover
for the Monday of their return.
#Post#: 75640--------------------------------------------------
Re: In Law Interactions
By: oogyda Date: May 25, 2022, 10:21 am
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Okay...I'll be a little blunt.
It sounds like A may be jealous. It sounds like D's family is
much more involved in their lives and the children's lives.
They are very much a part of the intricate juggling act that
modern family's face. Simple logistics and distance dictate the
limited extent A can participate and she might be feeling like
she's not as involved. Rightly so.
This isn't a fair playing field with A being further away, so
she should stop with the comparisons and simply enjoy the family
interactions.
As far as being upset that D didn't hang around????? She really
didn't visit to see D, did she?
#Post#: 75647--------------------------------------------------
Re: In Law Interactions
By: Hmmm Date: May 26, 2022, 8:20 am
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[quote author=oogyda link=topic=2352.msg75640#msg75640
date=1653492097]
Okay...I'll be a little blunt.
It sounds like A may be jealous. It sounds like D's family is
much more involved in their lives and the children's lives.
They are very much a part of the intricate juggling act that
modern family's face. Simple logistics and distance dictate the
limited extent A can participate and she might be feeling like
she's not as involved. Rightly so.
This isn't a fair playing field with A being further away, so
she should stop with the comparisons and simply enjoy the family
interactions.
As far as being upset that D didn't hang around????? She really
didn't visit to see D, did she?
[/quote]
Oh, that's not being blunt at all. A readily admits that she
gets jealous that the other grandparents spend more time with
the kids. She has a good relationship with D's family and they
frequently include her in their family celebrations or they come
over to visit her when she is in town. But I don't think that
coloring how she feels about D's lack of engagement. I think she
would find it odd or hurtful if she arrived to visit me and my
husband left to run errands soon after she arrived.
A would like to have a closer relationship with M so yes part of
her visiting is wanting to visit with D too.
I told A I didn't think it was wrong of D to leave upon her
arrival. But I wanted the groups opinion. I thought others might
also find it rude to leave so soon after a guest arrives, even
if it is your MIL who is staying for a couple of days.
#Post#: 75649--------------------------------------------------
Re: In Law Interactions
By: sms Date: May 26, 2022, 9:51 am
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I don't think it's necessarily rude to do errands or take a
break from socializing especially with close family that visit
for a few days. Stuff still has to get done after all and
people still get tired. Especially with socializing.
But something is definitely wrong if your sister is feeling
unwelcome. You know your sister and we don't, if she isn't the
hypersensitive type who feels slighted easily then maybe D is
being kinda rude.
There seemed to be a narrative forming that D was a beleaguered,
put upon wife and mother with a really overbearing mother in law
but that doesn't seem to be the case.
And to be fair to your sister it's hurtful if it's made obvious
how much closer and more welcome D's family is. Agreed that
it's logistics to a point but it's not nice to feel that someone
is avoiding you or makes you feel like you're intruding.
Especially if the welcome wagon is rolled out for everyone else.
No, D shouldn't be expected to spend every waking moment engaged
with A. But D might be mindful of making sure A isn't getting
all the dregs.
#Post#: 75671--------------------------------------------------
Re: In Law Interactions
By: Hmmm Date: May 27, 2022, 8:23 am
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[quote author=Rose Red link=topic=2352.msg75631#msg75631
date=1653415860]
And they have two children under 6. That's a difficult job
enough without 2 mothers demanding her attention.
I don't blame her for going "shopping." And if she can't vacuum
or do other chores while taking care of children, plus one or
both mothers are taking up her time, when can she? In her sleep?
[/quote]
This tickled me this morning. D doesn't do housework. I mean
she'll wash cloths and empty the dishwasher some of the time.
For most of the pandemic, they both worked from home and they
hired a nanny/housekeeper to help out while they worked. Nephew
said that once the kids were back in daycare/school, he had to
hire a weekly house cleaner because he couldn't keep up anymore
with work, kids activities and his volunteer activities. D
happily admits she hasn't cleaned a bathtub or a toilet since
her college years.
#Post#: 75672--------------------------------------------------
Re: In Law Interactions
By: lakey Date: May 27, 2022, 10:18 am
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[quote]There seemed to be a narrative forming that D was a
beleaguered, put upon wife and mother with a really overbearing
mother in law but that doesn't seem to be the case. [/quote]
I think it's more likely that these are simply two people with
completely different personality types. I have a sister who is
an extrovert who loves to socialize. I am an introvert who loves
to be left alone. Our visits go best when they are of limited
duration. For my sister and I, 3 days and two nights is too
much. Two days and one night is doable. Laying blame on one
party for being overbearing, or on the other party for being
unfriendly, isn't going to make things better. I think it would
be more constructive to accept reality and have shorter visits
so that the people don't get on each others nerves so much.
#Post#: 75674--------------------------------------------------
Re: In Law Interactions
By: Aleko Date: May 27, 2022, 10:37 am
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[quote]Don't pity D. She grew up in a very tight family extended
family. Their close ties to their family's is one thing that
brought D & M together. Her sister and cousins are her best
friends and extended family gatherings at her grandmother's home
was a weekly event. D loves having her family around. After the
first summer of having a pool, M had to request she stop
inviting her parents, siblings and cousins over every weekend
because he was tired of cooking for a large group every weekend.
Her mom is over engaged in their business. But like M tells her,
if she didn't share so much, her mother wouldn't always be
trying to give so much input.[/quote]
On that basis I still do pity D. When somebody has grown up in
such a completely enmeshed family with a massively controlling
parent, it's really not justifiable to say that they love it and
are staying closely-meshed within it of their own free will:
because it's the only way they know how to be, and they may not
feel entitled to break loose from it. It's perfectly possible
that she feels 100% obligated to invite the whole mob over every
weekend, and would feel disloyal if she didn't tell her mother
everything. (As for 'Her sister and cousins are her best
friends': does she even have any close friends outside her
family? When would she get to hang out with them if she had?)
There's no telling why she isn't throwing herself into intimacy
with A. Maybe because although M is now a member of her own
family by adoption, A is not, and she just doesn't know how to
be on intimate terms with anyone who stays outside that magic
circle? Maybe because when she doesn't feel that compulsive
family togetherness, she has no impulse to socialise at all?
Maybe she finds something daunting or offputting about A?
Whatever the reason, nobody can force another person to like
them, and making emotional or social demands on them that they
don't spontaneously want to offer only ever makes matters worse.
I think A should just chill about the whole thing, stop checking
D's behaviour for 'rudeness', be kind and friendly without
pushing for more than D has to give, and see if things warm up
over time.
#Post#: 75683--------------------------------------------------
Re: In Law Interactions
By: Hmmm Date: May 27, 2022, 4:26 pm
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[quote author=Aleko link=topic=2352.msg75674#msg75674
date=1653665837]
[quote]Don't pity D. She grew up in a very tight family extended
family. Their close ties to their family's is one thing that
brought D & M together. Her sister and cousins are her best
friends and extended family gatherings at her grandmother's home
was a weekly event. D loves having her family around. After the
first summer of having a pool, M had to request she stop
inviting her parents, siblings and cousins over every weekend
because he was tired of cooking for a large group every weekend.
Her mom is over engaged in their business. But like M tells her,
if she didn't share so much, her mother wouldn't always be
trying to give so much input.[/quote]
On that basis I still do pity D. When somebody has grown up in
such a completely enmeshed family with a massively controlling
parent, it's really not justifiable to say that they love it and
are staying closely-meshed within it of their own free will:
because it's the only way they know how to be, and they may not
feel entitled to break loose from it. It's perfectly possible
that she feels 100% obligated to invite the whole mob over every
weekend, and would feel disloyal if she didn't tell her mother
everything. (As for 'Her sister and cousins are her best
friends': does she even have any close friends outside her
family? When would she get to hang out with them if she had?)
There's no telling why she isn't throwing herself into intimacy
with A. Maybe because although M is now a member of her own
family by adoption, A is not, and she just doesn't know how to
be on intimate terms with anyone who stays outside that magic
circle? Maybe because when she doesn't feel that compulsive
family togetherness, she has no impulse to socialise at all?
Maybe she finds something daunting or offputting about A?
Whatever the reason, nobody can force another person to like
them, and making emotional or social demands on them that they
don't spontaneously want to offer only ever makes matters worse.
I think A should just chill about the whole thing, stop checking
D's behaviour for 'rudeness', be kind and friendly without
pushing for more than D has to give, and see if things warm up
over time.
[/quote]
But you are pitying her based on you would feel about growing up
in such a close family. I can empathize with how difficult it
can be to have such a controlling mother but I don't feel pity
for her. She grew up in a home with two very loving parents who
wanted the best for her, two siblings with whom she is very
close, extended family that she loves and trusts, and had
parents who financially supported her through college and now go
out of there way to try and help out as much as they can. But
your use of the word could be semantically different than mine.
I think of pitying someone as a more negative like the below
description.
[quote]Pity means feeling for others, particularly feelings of
sadness or sorrow. In a positive sense it means "sympathy" and
"empathy". More commonly Pity is a negative judgement of others
and their situation. An example of pity is how most people feel
about the homeless.[/quote]
I don't know a ton of her friends but I do know of two women she
is very close with and they and their husbands are part of M &
D's social circle. They are often in attendance at the "family"
get togethers at M & Ds. One was around so much prior to their
marriage that I thought she was another of D's cousins. She also
often mentions a couple of women she works with she seems close
to.
As I was thinking about the word "pity" I also thought about
"controlling" vs "intrusive". When D was younger, yes I think
her mom was controlling. Since her parents were paying for the
wedding, D's mom exerted a lot more control than I would have
been willing to relinquish. But D wanted the great bit wedding
without her and M going into debt. D is now financially
independent and has a super supportive husband who is willing to
tell his MIL to butt out when he decides he's tired of hearing
her opinions. But D does recognize that her parent's do a lot of
things for her so does try to be considerate of their feelings.
I think the controlling mother is now more "opinionated &
intrusive". She'll give her opinion often and frequently but D &
M ignore it when they want.
At times, I have more empathy for M always being surrounded by
so many inlaws. But he knew that D wanted to raise her family in
much the same manner as she was raised with her kids spending a
lot of time with grandparents and cousins. He was just as
excited about buying the "entertaining" house with the pool,
outdoor kitchen, and garage converted to a game room. And they
put in a big jungle gym in a sectioned area so the little ones
have a safe place to play. Our family was spread out so he
really didn't have the "cousins" experience and all but one of
his grandparents were deceased by the time he was 5. He's close
to my two kids but they are 12 & 14 years younger than him. He
does speak up when it's something important. For example, one
year he decided he wanted to host Xmas Eve with just his side of
the family. All previous years, it was always celebrated at D's
grandmother's house. D seemed very happy to comply.
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