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Bad Manners and Brimstone
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#Post#: 69625--------------------------------------------------
Re: “Formal” wedding - UPDATE at #17
By: TootsNYC Date: August 27, 2021, 1:19 pm
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I'd go for a plain little black dress and tights, with some sort
of secure flat shoes. Like Mary Janes.
Or a dressy pantsuit type of thing.
#Post#: 69649--------------------------------------------------
Re: “Formal” wedding - UPDATE at #17
By: Gellchom Date: August 29, 2021, 12:34 pm
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This wedding was originally to be held in late June 2020, when
the weather presumably would have been substantially warmer.
Having the ceremony and reception outdoors would have probably
worked out just fine then, and it probably still will, but the
weather is going to be chillier and the risk of rain greater in
November than in late June.
#Post#: 71041--------------------------------------------------
Re: “Formal” wedding - UPDATE at #17
By: Gellchom Date: October 20, 2021, 3:16 am
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I am struggling to keep a positive attitude about this wedding!
Here is the latest.
Last week all the guests received an email from the bride and
groom including links to two waivers that the venue requires
everyone to sign. The first one is a waiver of liability for
anything relating to COVID-19; OK, whatever. But the other one
is a general waiver for all liability for any kind of injury or
damage, even if it is caused by the venue’s own negligence!
I’ve been a lawyer for 35 years, and I’ve never heard of such a
thing. Well, who knows, California is a funny jurisdiction. So
I asked my brother, who will also be attending, and who has been
practicing law for even longer than that, mostly in California,
and he said he never had, either. He asked the bride, our
cousin, to run it by her father, who is also a lawyer, which I
think was smart because this will affect everyone, not just us.
We are waiting to hear what he says.
This is really annoying. I don’t think anyone should ever sign a
waiver like that, let alone for nighttime outdoor events in
November up in the California hills. I don’t want to miss the
wedding, and I would not be happy about losing all the
nonrefundable money we had to spend on expensive accommodations
nearby for three nights.
I don’t know whether the bride and groom just found out about
this, or if it’s a new policy, or what. But we were all just
notified about it for the first time last week, and the wedding
is the first weekend in November.
What would you do?
#Post#: 71043--------------------------------------------------
Re: “Formal” wedding - UPDATE at #17
By: oogyda Date: October 20, 2021, 6:41 am
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Well, that's a new twist.
Personally, I might attend without signing the waivers. I would
be fully prepared to be denied entry, but one of the things I
would be checking into (or having Uncle FOB check into) would be
how the venue intends to enforce this.
Seriously though. I think a bunch of attorneys could point out
that this requirement was not disclosed at the time of
negotiating the contract and therefore cannot be enforced at
this late notice.
#Post#: 71048--------------------------------------------------
Re: “Formal” wedding - UPDATE at #17
By: Hmmm Date: October 20, 2021, 7:58 am
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I've heard that some places are requiring Covid waivers but I've
never heard of an over reaching liability waiver for a generic
event venue. I know lots of venues require the hosting couple to
acquire liability insurance. I wonder if they are balking at
that and instead of suggesting all guests sign a waiver. Very
odd.
I only say generic because we have hosted kids bday parties at
paintball or go carts where parents had to sign a waiver. So if
this was a place where the guests all had to zip line to the
ceremony location ;), I could see a waiver being required.
#Post#: 71054--------------------------------------------------
Re: “Formal” wedding - UPDATE at #17
By: Gellchom Date: October 20, 2021, 10:22 am
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[quote author=Hmmm link=topic=2113.msg71048#msg71048
date=1634734731]
I've heard that some places are requiring Covid waivers but I've
never heard of an over reaching liability waiver for a generic
event venue. I know lots of venues require the hosting couple to
acquire liability insurance. I wonder if they are balking at
that and instead of suggesting all guests sign a waiver. Very
odd.
I only say generic because we have hosted kids bday parties at
paintball or go carts where parents had to sign a waiver. So if
this was a place where the guests all had to zip line to the
ceremony location ;), I could see a waiver being required.
[/quote]
Yes, I wouldn’t be surprised by a waiver or assumption of risk
for specific activities or hazards. But a blanket waiver for
anything at all, including the venue’s own negligence? That is
just preposterous, and I think it puts the guests in a really
awful position this late in the game, with airline tickets and
nonrefundable hotel rooms bought. (The Covid waiver, fine.)
Oogyda, I don’t know whether this requirement was disclosed when
they made the contract for the wedding, or if it even existed
then. It certainly is the first question I would ask! But I have
no contractual relationship with the venue; the hosts
(presumably the bride and groom, but I really don’t know) do.
#Post#: 71058--------------------------------------------------
Re: “Formal” wedding - UPDATE at #17
By: IWish Date: October 20, 2021, 11:21 am
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Not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV, however I always heard
that those blanket type waivers were unenforceable anyway. Not
that I'd sign it in the first place. What a way to leave a bad
taste in the guest's mouths before the event!
#Post#: 71060--------------------------------------------------
Re: “Formal” wedding - UPDATE at #17
By: Aleko Date: October 20, 2021, 11:26 am
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I find it very hard to imagine a jurisdiction which allowed a
business to legally disclaim liability for any or all injury or
damage caused to clients / customers by their own negligence, no
matter what they had got these people to sign. That would give
businesses carte blanche to serve tainted food, provide
carbon-monoxide-emitting heaters in hotel rooms. hire out leaky
boats, leave patrons' cars in unsecured parking areas with the
keys in the ignition, and so on and so forth, without a care in
the world. Tell me it ain't so!
#Post#: 71061--------------------------------------------------
Re: “Formal” wedding - UPDATE at #17
By: oogyda Date: October 20, 2021, 11:32 am
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[quote author=gellchom link=topic=2113.msg71054#msg71054
date=1634743362]
Oogyda, I don’t know whether this requirement was disclosed when
they made the contract for the wedding, or if it even existed
then. It certainly is the first question I would ask! But I have
no contractual relationship with the venue; the hosts
(presumably the bride and groom, but I really don’t know) do.
[/quote]
If the bride and groom knew about it beforehand and waited until
now to present it to their guests, I would be very upset at
them. Sometimes people don't stop to think about what their
guests invest (time and money) to attend their events. This
puts them in a situation where they feel like they have to
comply, or (as you metioned) lose money.
#Post#: 71080--------------------------------------------------
Re: “Formal” wedding - UPDATE at #17
By: Gellchom Date: October 21, 2021, 12:33 am
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I think such waivers might be enforceable in CA as to ordinary
negligence, but not gross negligence, recklessness, or
intentional harm.
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