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Bad Manners and Brimstone
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#Post#: 49684--------------------------------------------------
Re: When the Bride and Groom can't afford to pay for Everyone's
Dinner
By: MiriamCatriona Date: April 5, 2020, 9:22 am
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"Hey, come to my party! By the way, you're the host."
There's no nice way to say something that is inherently rude.
Your friend can cut the guest list to what she can afford or she
can change the venue to a public park where she serves ham
sandwiches and baked beans. Substitute parents' backyard with
hamburgers or church basement with cake (not at a mealtime) as
appropriate.
#Post#: 49690--------------------------------------------------
Re: When the Bride and Groom can't afford to pay for Everyone's
Dinner
By: Wanaca Date: April 5, 2020, 11:10 am
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[quote author=holly firestorm link=topic=1670.msg49673#msg49673
date=1586068411]
Apparently, according to the information I have attached, this
is actually a very controversial subject:
HTML https://sendomatic.com/blog/invitation-wording-guests-pay-no-host-dutch/
[/quote]
That is a site trying to sell something. It has nothing to do
with etiquette. I would be very surprised for any reputable
etiquette book/site to advocate a no host wedding reception at a
restaurant. The idea of inviting customers to her wedding
reception is terrible. It's almost as bad as charging an
entrance fee/cover charge.
#Post#: 49692--------------------------------------------------
Re: When the Bride and Groom can't afford to pay for Everyone's
Dinner
By: TootsNYC Date: April 5, 2020, 11:49 am
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I suppose you could have a wedding at 2pm and cake-and-punch
reception immediately after. Then spread the word by
word-of-mouth that the immediate family is going to gather for
dinner a restaurant or hotel, and that people are welcome to
join you there.
But the official time of mingling with people and feeding them
(which needn’t be expensive, and needn’t be a meal) must be
hosted by the couple or their families (or someone else close to
them) and not paid for by the guests.
That’s what I did–I had the traditional cake-and-punch church
reception (wedding at 2, reception immediately after with plenty
of time for us to speak with people). But because my family was
all in from out of town, we decided to feed them supper–we got a
caterer to make a buffet dinner to serve in my mother’s living
room. And there were a few guests who had come from afar, so we
included them. It wasn’t the official reception; it was the
family gathering.
HOWEVER, we hosted that. If we hadn’t had the capability or
inclination to do it at home and had gone to a restaurant, I
suppose we would have done what I suggested–made solid plans for
us, parents & siblings, and then just let other people know
casually that we were going to be there.
My uncle did something similar for the rehearsal dinner for my
cousin’s wedding. There wasn’t a formal invitation sent out, but
by email, he let us know that her rehearsal dinner, hosted by
the groom’s family, was going to be held at X restaurant and
that they’d all hang around in the bar afterward if people
wanted to come over and hang out. (He ended up picking up the
bar tab for our family, but none of us expected him to).
One HUGE difference: We all did NOT expect to be included in
the rehearsal dinner, because we weren’t in the wedding party,
nor were we immediate family. (he also brought it up because
we’d already been emailing in the group email, “we should all
get together that evening.”)
But for your friend’s situation, all those guests ARE going to
thing that they should be included as guests during that dinner,
and they are going to be taken aback.
There will be some people who don’t much care, who figure that
it’s fine, after all weddings are expensive.
But is it worth offending the people who will be offended? Or
even just making them less enthusiastic?
#Post#: 49709--------------------------------------------------
Re: When the Bride and Groom can't afford to pay for Everyone's
Dinner
By: HenrysMom Date: April 5, 2020, 7:40 pm
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I think it’s going to leave a bad taste in people’s mouths if
the B&G tell 100+ people to pay for their own meals, especially
since the hotel will insist on a fixed menu. It’s just tacky to
expect people to pay for something that they may or may not have
wanted to order on their own bat. There’s just no good way to
say this or to pull it off without appearing as cheap and tacky.
They could go the option of forgetting about a hotel dinner, and
sound out their immediate families to have a “potluck” dinner at
the church hall. By “potluck” I mean dishes prepared by the
bride and groom and their immediate families, and not to ask
those outside the families or those coming from hour(s) away.
Years ago, that’s how weddings were done at the church I grew up
at, and no one thought anything of it. There were also punch
and cake receptions there as well, but not scheduled at
mealtimes.
#Post#: 49712--------------------------------------------------
Re: When the Bride and Groom can't afford to pay for Everyone's
Dinner
By: Gellchom Date: April 5, 2020, 8:16 pm
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I absolutely, 100%, agree with all the others: there is no way
to word it politely, because it's completely impolite, and the
bride and groom need to change their plans, pronto.
But.
That wasn't the question. Poor holly firestorm is stuck in an
impossible position. She knows this is wrong -- that's why she
can't think of how to help the bride and groom do it. She
didn't ask us what they could do instead -- she probably thought
of all these things herself anyway.
So maybe we can help her deal with THAT problem: how to get out
of having to come up with some wording, and perhaps also how to
tell the HC that there just is no nice way to word that
invitation and urge them to reconsider. It's almost as tricky
as trying to word that invitation, though!
I think it was very unfair of the bride to task her MOH with
this problem. Since when is writing the invitation the job of
the MOH in the first place?
I wonder if it's because at some level she knows there's no
polite way to do it, so she is scraping off the impossible job
-- and perhaps the blame for the probable blowback -- on her
MOH.
OP, you know your friends. Maybe they just have no inkling that
this is a big no-no, and would actually appreciate someone
stopping them from making a big mistake. Or do you think that
they do know, but (perhaps having read something stupid like the
blog linked above) are digging in their heels and insisting on
doing it anyway? Is there any chance that their parents or
someone else will set them straight, and this whole problem will
go away? If they really don't know, do you feel like you are
the one in the best position to explain it to them, or should
you talk it over with whoever is?
Perhaps your best course is simply to tell the bride you don't
feel comfortable wording her invitation for her. If she says
she just wants you to help her figure out how to word that one
part, I guess just tell her that you can't think of anything
that will do. After all, that's the truth.
#Post#: 49724--------------------------------------------------
Re: When the Bride and Groom can't afford to pay for Everyone's
Dinner
By: Aleko Date: April 6, 2020, 8:30 am
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Gellchom's right: the question is not whether this is a rude,
tacky, cheapskate thing to do but how OP should reply to her BFF
who asked for advice on wording the invitations to be 'clear,
but in a nice way'. Here's a suggestion:
"Dear Mandy,
Your're right that the invitation must make it crystal clear
that you're asking them to pay for their own dinner; would-be
'tactful' or 'tasteful' hints like 'No host', or giving a link
to the hotel menu prices, won't be understood or even noticed by
everyone. It must say how much it will cost them and what is and
isn't included in that price: e.g. '$60, not including drinks'.
If it doesn't, there are bound to be people who don't get the
message and arrive not expecting and not equipped to pay, and
then there will be some painful episodes.
It must also ask people to state when they RSVP whether or not
they are staying for the dinner - there will for sure be some
people who want to come but can't afford or don't want to shell
out that much on a hotel meal, and if you don't know they aren't
staying for it you'll end up paying for the meals they didn't
eat.
I hope the above helps a bit with the clarity aspect. But I'm
afraid I don't know, any more than you, how to make it sound
nice."
That way OP has shown willing by doing her best to be helpful
with one part of the request, even though she has had to say
'Can't help you, Sundance' to the part her BFF really wanted
solved for her.
#Post#: 49726--------------------------------------------------
Re: When the Bride and Groom can't afford to pay for Everyone's
Dinner
By: DaDancingPsych Date: April 6, 2020, 9:00 am
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If my BFF asked for my help with this, I would level with her in
the loving way that we do. "I have put some thought into this
and I cannot come up with any polite wording. I think the
problem is not the wording, but rather the fact that the plan is
not considered polite. I would be happy to throw around various
options that would be considered more polite, if you would like
to do that."
If I really felt that I had to help with the wording, then I
would make suggestions that were crystal clear of what is going
on. "The wedding party is gathering at X Hotel Restaurant and
everyone is welcome to join us. Meals run between $Y and $Z." I
still would not be thrilled to receive this invitation, but at
least I wouldn't feel like the couple was trying to hide this. I
will say that I would likely choose not to attend the meal
portion (maybe not even the wedding) and it could very well
effect the gift that give. To me, the wording doesn't change the
sentiment... that the couple is having a wedding beyond their
means and asking me to pay for it. I would share this with my
BFF.
#Post#: 49738--------------------------------------------------
Re: When the Bride and Groom can't afford to pay for Everyone's
Dinner
By: lakey Date: April 6, 2020, 11:35 am
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[quote]how to get out of having to come up with some wording,
and perhaps also how to tell the HC that there just is no nice
way to word that invitation and urge them to reconsider.[/quote]
"Sorry, I can't come up with anything." When someone asks you to
do something, that they shouldn't really ask you to do, the more
lengthy your excuse, the more likely they are to come up with a
counter argument. I think short and direct is the way to go.
Frankly it's not the bridesmaid's job to word the invitations,
even when the invitation isn't asking the guests to pay for
their own meal. We need to figure out the difference between
being nice, and letting people take advantage of us. As long as
we make sure our wording and tone are not harsh, there is
nothing wrong with refusing a request. If the person making the
request gets mad because you won't do the favor, they are the
problem, not you.
#Post#: 49742--------------------------------------------------
Re: When the Bride and Groom can't afford to pay for Everyone's
Dinner
By: TootsNYC Date: April 6, 2020, 12:11 pm
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[quote author=DaDancingPsych link=topic=1670.msg49726#msg49726
date=1586181655]
If my BFF asked for my help with this, I would level with her in
the loving way that we do. "I have put some thought into this
and I cannot come up with any polite wording. I think the
problem is not the wording, but rather the fact that the plan is
not considered polite. I would be happy to throw around various
options that would be considered more polite, if you would like
to do that."
[/quote]
when you struggle to come up with a polite way to say it, it's
probably because it isn't polite
(I'm a copyeditor, and one of my maxims is: if you can't figure
out the punctuation easily, that's a sign that the entire
sentence has major grammatical and syntactical problems, and you
need to fix those instead of trying to figure out the
punctuation.)
#Post#: 49743--------------------------------------------------
Re: When the Bride and Groom can't afford to pay for Everyone's
Dinner
By: DaDancingPsych Date: April 6, 2020, 12:32 pm
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[quote author=TootsNYC link=topic=1670.msg49742#msg49742
date=1586193089]
[quote author=DaDancingPsych link=topic=1670.msg49726#msg49726
date=1586181655]
If my BFF asked for my help with this, I would level with her in
the loving way that we do. "I have put some thought into this
and I cannot come up with any polite wording. I think the
problem is not the wording, but rather the fact that the plan is
not considered polite. I would be happy to throw around various
options that would be considered more polite, if you would like
to do that."
[/quote]
when you struggle to come up with a polite way to say it, it's
probably because it isn't polite
(I'm a copyeditor, and one of my maxims is: if you can't figure
out the punctuation easily, that's a sign that the entire
sentence has major grammatical and syntactical problems, and you
need to fix those instead of trying to figure out the
punctuation.)
[/quote]
This is much worded much more eloquently than mine. That's
probably why you are the copyeditor and I am... just a
Brimstoner! ;D
I would still level with my BFF. My guess is that her gut is
already telling her that this isn't polite, but sometimes we
need someone to help us get our head out of the clouds!
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