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#Post#: 976--------------------------------------------------
O16 Target: Madrid
By: pilotofficerprune Date: January 19, 2019, 4:30 am
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New scenario thread for playtest of Target: Madrid. Please do
not create a new thread for this scenario.
#Post#: 2152--------------------------------------------------
Re: O16 Target: Madrid
By: chief2000 Date: March 19, 2019, 11:29 am
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Scenario: O16 Target Madrid
Version: v0.1
Playtesters: Chris Bryans (Solo)
Report: This is my first playtest of this scenario.
Set up: I’m assuming that the setup of the three I-15 squadrons
does not require it to be in Balbo formation as required in
9.5.6. Perhaps this predates Italo Balbo’s use of the formation
– I’m not sure.
Should I be using a height error since there is neither radar or
GCI involved in the vector? I didn’t.
Turn One
No tallies
Heavy flak direct fire vs. Ro37 nets straggler. Cohesion roll
good
Direct fire against CR 32 A no effect
Ro. 37 bomb run: no effect (roll 7)
Turn Two
I15 failed tally of CR 32 A
I 16 wing leader tallies CR 32 A. Orders wing to break up the
fighters CR 32 A and G. I16 A will go after A; B will go after
G
Heavy Flak direct fire vs. Ju52 W nets straggler, loss.
Cohesion good.
Heavy Flak direct fire vs. Ju52 X no effect
Bomb run Ju52 W no effect (roll 6)
Turn Three
I16 wing breaks tally on CR 32 A and tallies Ju52 W. Orders C
to attack Ju 52 X while Wing leader will focus on Ju 52 W
I15 wing fails tally on Jul 52 W
Heavy flak targets Ju52 X: no effect
Heavy flak targets Ju52 Z nets straggler. Cohesion good
Bomb run Ju52X no effect (rolled 8)
Bomb run Ju52 Z no effect (rolled 7)
He 51D rolls early reaction against I16 C
He51 E, F roll late reaction against I16 A
CR 32J and He 51D vs I16C. One Loss on CR32
Cohesion: Cr32 J breaks (snake eyes!)
He 51D and I16 C pass cohesion
He51E and F and Ju52X vs I16 A
No effect on any participant
Cohesion: He51 E and I16A disrupted; He51F and Ju52X pass
cohesion check
Turn Four
I15 wing successfully tallies Ju52W; I15 D and F will go after
Ju 52 W; I15 E will pursue Z.
I16 C tallies Ju52 W
He51 D maintains tally on I16C
Heavy flak direct fire vs SM81 – no effect
Heavy flak direct fire vs He51 E – no effect
SM 81 bomb run no effect (snake eyes)
He51D, Ju52W vs I16 C, I15 D and F. No effect on any
participant
Cohesion disrupts I15F and I16C. He51 D, I15D and Ju52W pass.
He51 E and F vs I16 A. Two losses on He51 (divided between E
and F)
Cohesion: Both He51s break but I16 passes.
Turn Five
I16 A drops tally on He51s and tallies SM81 U
I15 E tallies Ju52 X
Heavy flak direct fire vs He51 D no effect
I16 C and I15 D and F vs Ju52 W
One loss on Ju52 W
Cohesion disrupts Ju52 W and breaks I16 C. I 15 D and F pass
cohesion
I16A vs. SM81U One loss on SM 81 one straggler on I16 A
Cohesion disrupts SM 81 and bbreaks I16 A
I15E vs Ju52X nets two losses and straggler on Ju52 X.
Cohesion: both pass
Turn Six
I15E vs Ju52X nets three losses and straggler becomes loss on
Ju52X; One loss on I15 E
Cohesion: both disrupted
He51D and Ju52 W vs I15D and F nets one loss on He51D.
Cohesion breaks Ju52 W but He51D, both I15s pass
Turn Seven
I15 E vs Ju52 X nets a loss on Ju52X. Max losses attained on
Ju52 X
Ju52 W and He51 D vs I15 D and F: no effect on any
Cohesion: Ju52 W is already broken; He51 D breaks. Both I15s
pass
Turn eight
I15D and F break tally on Ju52 W and tally SM81 U
I15 DE, and F vs SM81: no effect on any
Cohesion: I15 D and E break; I15 F and SM81 U pass
Victory: Nationalists: 3 vp (one I16 and two 115)
Republicans: 1 vp for elimination of Ju52 X + 20
(nine Ju52 and one SM81) + 3 (one CR32 and two He51)= 24
3-24=-21 Republican victory
Recommendations: I clearly made one mistake early when I allowed
the RO37 and its escorts to wheel around and head home rather
than continuing toward the right side allowing the CR32s to
participate in the aerial combat. Won’t make that mistake
again.
It was almost impossible to achieve any kind of respectable
bombing results from the height directed in the scenario (5).
Perhaps this is due to established doctrine. Nevertheless, to
balance the scenario a little more, it may be necessary to move
the bombers down to a level where they may do some damage,
particularly the Ju52s. Rolling the black dice, I came up with
an average roll of 6.2 for ten total rolls (2,7,5,6,4,5,11,9,7,
6) with 7 and 6 the most frequent rolls. With a -3 bombsight
modifier, the chances of scoring is nil. Even the SM81 would
have difficulty with the -2 modifier.
1.
2.
two more veterans and require them to be assigned to the
bombers. Failing that, require two of the veterans already in
the scenario to be assigned to bombers.
#Post#: 2153--------------------------------------------------
Re: O16 Target: Madrid
By: pilotofficerprune Date: March 20, 2019, 7:52 am
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Balbo rules still apply, even given the date.
It sounds like we need an incentive to keep the bombers headed
to their targets.
It seems you want us to deal with the bombers' vulnerability.
#Post#: 2154--------------------------------------------------
Re: O16 Target: Madrid
By: chief2000 Date: March 20, 2019, 8:57 am
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I figured the Balbo rules still applied but that would change
the set up of the wings since it has each of the wings'
squadrons trailing (I15s: U7, V7, W7 and I16s: U9,V9). I think
that my suggestions would help balance the scenario as I said.
Next up: round three of Heavy Mob.
#Post#: 2187--------------------------------------------------
Re: O16 Target: Madrid
By: pilotofficerprune Date: March 23, 2019, 6:45 am
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Okay, I'm going to adjust the bomber and defender altitudes down
a level.
I'm not going to touch the aircrew quality marker assignments
yet, because I want to see what effect the set-up makes. But we
can consider that if we feel we ned it.
#Post#: 2190--------------------------------------------------
Re: O16 Target: Madrid
By: chief2000 Date: March 23, 2019, 8:12 am
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By adjusting the defenders, do you also mean that we also
changing the set up for the defenders reflecting Balbo rules?
#Post#: 2196--------------------------------------------------
Re: O16 Target: Madrid
By: pilotofficerprune Date: March 23, 2019, 11:29 am
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I don't understand the problem, Chris. Grupo Pumpur is a Balbo,
because it has three squadrons. Grupo Minare isn't, because it
only has two. Balbos are defined by the number of squadrons in
the fighter formation, not the shape of the formation.
#Post#: 2198--------------------------------------------------
Re: O16 Target: Madrid
By: chief2000 Date: March 23, 2019, 1:52 pm
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I am probably not expressing myself clearly. My apologies.
Current set up for Grupo Pumpur reads "Set up one each in U7,
V7, W7." The set up, as it reads now, is not a Balbo.
I suggest changing it to read something similar to O24 which
also has wing leaders as follows:
"Set up Wing Leader in U7"
#Post#: 2200--------------------------------------------------
Re: O16 Target: Madrid
By: pilotofficerprune Date: March 23, 2019, 2:21 pm
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[quote author=Chris Bryans link=topic=76.msg2198#msg2198
date=1553367154]
I am probably not expressing myself clearly. My apologies.
Current set up for Grupo Pumpur reads "Set up one each in U7,
V7, W7." The set up, as it reads now, is not a Balbo.[/quote]
It's three fighter squadrons in the same wing and in formation.
Why do you think it's not a Balbo?
#Post#: 2201--------------------------------------------------
Re: O16 Target: Madrid
By: chief2000 Date: March 23, 2019, 2:56 pm
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Guess I misinterpreted the setup pattern from the illustration
in the rule book where the squadrons are staggered by altitude.
I thought that they were supposed to be set up in this fashion
rather than having the option of line astern. Sometimes I just
feel like an idiot!
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