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#Post#: 1595--------------------------------------------------
Re: O26 Forgotten Planes
By: ScottKey Date: February 9, 2019, 11:04 pm
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Playtesters:
Scott Key, solitaire
Report:
This game lasted 4 turns. The Nationalists had set the vectors
for their Cr.32s at altitude 8 and there were no height errors.
Turn 1: No tallies
Turn 2: the I-16s and He-112s mutually tallied. The leading
I-15s mutually tallied with the leading Cr.32s. Both Republican
squadrons with tallies climbed. No combat.
Turn 3: the trailing I-15 tallies the leading Cr.32s and is in
it’s turn tallied by the trailing Cr.32 squadron. The trailing
I-15s reverse direction and climb hoping to gain some altitude
and avoid being bounced. 1 combat (I-15 vs C.32. veteran,
experte) results in an I-15 loss and disruption. The Cr.32s
maintain cohesion and successfully force a dogfight.
Turn4: The trailing I-15s drop their tally and then tally the
trailing Cr.32s which have already tallied them. 3 combats
occur: The Ishaks enter a Lufberry and are then dived upon by
the He-112s. No hits are scored. The dogfight begins with the
Republican I-15s as the attacker. They are, however disrupted
and the Nationalists are veteran so the dogfight is resolved as
-1/+1. The Republicans roll no hits and the. Nationalists roll 3
kills. [We are now at 4 total losses] the third combat involves
the previously unengaged Cr.32s andI-15s. The Nationalists dive
on the still climbing I-15s in a Hit & Run attack. The
Nationalists inflict 1 kill and 2 stragglers (= a kill) and the
Republicans fail to score a hit. Both squadrons become
disrupted. [Total casualties: 6] The broken I-16s and I-15s are
allowed to escape.
Turn 5: The He-112s tally and join the fight which has moved
closer to them. The now unengaged lead C.32 squadron also
tallies and moves toward the dogfight but climbs higher than it.
The Heinkels down one I-15 and the Republicans score no hits.
The He-112s break, The C.32s remain disrupted and the last I-15
squadron breaks. [Total casualties: 7]
The game ends in the administration phase by special rule.
Experte eliminated: None since the Republicans scored no hits
Nationalist:
+7 vps fighters killed (7x I-15)
Republican:
+0 vp no fighters killed
Victory: Nationalist
Recommendations: A hard fight for the Republicans since they are
all Sweep and cannot change altitude until they tally. The
Republicans should have been able to a do a bit better than this
if their rolls had been better (6,5,2,6,2 respectively) . I
hesitate to make recommendations until playing the scenario one
more time but starting the C.32s at altitude 5 or leftward a
square would give the Republicans a bit more time to maneuver.
#Post#: 1609--------------------------------------------------
Re: O26 Forgotten Planes
By: pilotofficerprune Date: February 10, 2019, 4:46 am
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Okay, I'll accommodate the set-up change to the CR.32 (one
column left) to give them that extra opportunity to gain some
height.
#Post#: 1610--------------------------------------------------
Re: O26 Forgotten Planes
By: Elias Nordling Date: February 10, 2019, 4:50 am
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Since the scenario is being revised, I'll redact my sign-off.
#Post#: 1611--------------------------------------------------
Re: O26 Forgotten Planes
By: pilotofficerprune Date: February 10, 2019, 4:52 am
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Roger that.
#Post#: 1614--------------------------------------------------
Re: O26 Forgotten Planes
By: Agm84ssm Date: February 10, 2019, 5:40 am
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FORGOTTEN PLANES
The rules applied are:
Republicans have 1 veteran
All units are squadrons.
Nationals 2 X6 CR32 + 1 X6 He112
Republicans 2X8 I15 + 1 X12 I16 / 10
When a unit loses half of its maximum losses, it becomes flight
When the nationals fight with the squad of I15-6 / 10 they
always apply a flight modifier. Republicans would outnumber them
by 2/1 at least
Turn 1 is approach as it is impossible to make tallies. In turn
2 the SuperMosca tally He112 and a Cr32 tally an I15. The planes
alerted climb to improve their chances of attack. In turn 3 all
the squadrons get tally and three air battles are generated. At
mid-height, a Cr32 attacks an I15 achieving 1 kill but suffering
a staggler and an I15 attacks a Cr32 but the result is 0 hits
for both (it is important who attacks because the defender
suffer Rigid Doctrine). In the upper level the He112 attacks the
SuperMosca but without results for both sides. 1 squadron of I15
and one squadron of Cr32 are Broken. The 2 remaining combats
become dogfiths. In the evolving battles of turn 4, 1 Cr32 is
knocked down (and there is no loss of Ace) and the I16 / 10
suffer 1 staggler. The 2 republican squadrons are Broken. At
this moment the losses threshold is 2 losses and 2 stagglers and
the Nationals are the masters of the sky with a squadron of CR32
dispersed but available and a squadron of He112 in top form but
the scenario is a draw at 1 VP. In turn 5 the Nationalists
harass the republicans. The Cr32 manage to kill 1 I15 but lose 1
Chirri (there is no loss of As) and the Italian biplane squad is
Broken. The He112 kill 1 Super fly without losses against. At
the end of turn 5 the level of losses is 5 losses and 2
stagglers. The scenario ends.
Final score: +1 for Nationalists
Nationalists: 2 I15 and 1 I16 = 3 VP
Republicans: 2 CR32 = 2VP
Nationalists victory
The scenario is not easy for the Republican but this time things
have been more equal. The veteran Republican has helped and the
large squadron rule for the I16 / 10 makes them an enemy to
respect. Whoever attains the position of attacker is key because
he applies a negative modifier to the defender by rigid
doctrine. The cohesion is a moment of maximum tension because
both sides are tremendously fragile because they do not have
radios. The squadrons will have on average only 2 oprtunities to
fight.
Suggestions
Maybe to even a little more things the conditions of victory
should be all or nothing. The Nationals win if they get more
points than the Republican but the Republican wins with the tie
and if he gets more points than the National.
In my last game, on turn 4 there was a draw.
I have doubts about to increase the separation with 1 more
square
Both sides get more opportunities to climb but the Nationalists
have the adventage in Tally because they are veteran. This rule
can benefit Nationalists more
#Post#: 1615--------------------------------------------------
Re: O26 Forgotten Planes
By: pilotofficerprune Date: February 10, 2019, 6:01 am
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Sorry, i completely missed Javier's first test and feedback for
some reason. I need to go back and review this again, with
Javier's latest AAR.
#Post#: 1619--------------------------------------------------
Re: O26 Forgotten Planes
By: ScottKey Date: February 10, 2019, 8:38 am
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[quote]I have doubts about to increase the separation with 1
more square
Both sides get more opportunities to climb but the Nationalists
have the adventage in Tally because they are veteran. This rule
can benefit Nationalists more
[/quote]
Actually I agree with this. I was really thinking more of
starting the, an altitude band lower so it would take them
longer to climb. In thinking it out I agree that a leftward
shift for the Cr.32s gives them the advantage.
#Post#: 1631--------------------------------------------------
Re: O26 Forgotten Planes
By: pilotofficerprune Date: February 10, 2019, 12:49 pm
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Sorry, I fouled up really badly and missed Javier’s first test.
I’ve looked over Javier’s proposal with the breakdown of
squadrons and flights based on max losses, and I would rather
not use it. I think it will only generate lots of rule queries.
It’s too radical a departure from the standard rules.
I’m not fond of the proposal for an all-or-nothing victory
condition, as it would encourage the Republican to run away as
soon as possible and avoid combat, so that they can win by not
engaging. These fighter-on-fighter encounters are really tricky
to make work without one side exploiting the system and winning
by not fighting. I think the existing system, based on Javier’s
original design, actually works.
I’m more than happy to reverse the CR.32 set-up change if this
is seen as a problem that gives the Nationalists an advantage.
#Post#: 1654--------------------------------------------------
Re: O26 Forgotten Planes
By: Okmed Date: February 11, 2019, 12:49 am
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Scenario: O26 Forgotten Planes
Version: v0.3
Player: Dave Demko (solo)
Narrative #1: I played through the scenario three times in a
row. I'll give three reports, with accumulating recommendations.
The CR.32s vector up to level 7 in hopes of grabbing an
initiative advantage, which is a big deal with Rigid doctrine on
both sides. On turn 2 only the He 112s make their tally roll,
against the I-16s. The attack kills 5 I-16s (good shooting,
whereas average luck would have yielded 2 kills). Both involved
squadrons break. The next turn the paired up I-15s and CR.32s
mutually tally. The Republicans, disadvantaged by altitude, go
into Lufberrys. Bad idea? Should they have run away? At least
the Lufberry modifier boosts their probabilities of hitting. In
the ensuing combats the Republicans lose 3 aircraft (with one
break and one disruption) while the Nationalists lose 2 aircraft
(with one disruption). There are ten kills total on the wing
displays, so it's game over. No Expertes were lost.
Victory: Nationalists 8 VP, Republicans 2 VP
net 6, a Nationalist blowout
Recommendations: With dice closer to the middle of the bell
curve, the first playing would have been 5 to 2 (close
Nationalist win) or 4 to 2 (draw). The Nationalists do have the
positional advantage, but the results will tend to swing with
the dice, especially the tally rolls.
#Post#: 1655--------------------------------------------------
Re: O26 Forgotten Planes
By: Okmed Date: February 11, 2019, 12:50 am
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Scenario: O26 Forgotten Planes
Version: v0.3
Player: Dave Demko (solo)
Narrative #2: I played through the scenario three times in a
row. I'll give three reports, with my recommendations rolled
together.
A similar opening: the CR.32s vector to J7, K7 and only the He
112s make their tally roll on Turn 2.The He 112s score 2 kills
on the I-16s at the cost of one straggler, with no Experte loss.
The I-16s break while the Nationalists maintain good cohesion.
The next turn the I-15s and CR.32s get easy mutual tallies, and
the Heinkels manage to tally one of the I-15s. This time the
Republicans try the run-away/RTB strategy. The Heinkels manage
to dive into one of the I-15 squadrons; the CR.32s pursue but
cannot overtake their tallies. The broken I-16 climbs away from
the battle; it's safe. One I-15 squadron will be able to run off
the map unscathed. The He 112s manage 2 kills on their
opponents. Despite being in cloud, both sides maintain cohesion,
and the Republicans force a dogfight. Why? There's always a
chance of killing an Experte. The dogfight yields 2 more kills
on the I-15s. Those He 112 guys have won the game
single-handedly.
Victory: Nationalists 6 VP, Republicans 0 VP
net 6, Nationalist win
Recommendations: I like how the possibility of bagging an
Experte for 2 VP makes staying and fighting a reasonable option
for the Republicans. Against these aircraft, an Experte with
Firepower 2 has a deathray, so a lot depends on the He 112s'
cohesion rolls. To equalize the game, the Republicans have to do
well on tallies, perhaps winning a chance to be attackers.
Altitude gives the Nationalists a strong advantage: Is there any
reason not to climb with the CR.32s on Turn 1?
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