DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
Airbattle Games
HTML https://airbattle.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: IGNORE: Wing Leader Playtest Archive
*****************************************************
#Post#: 6339--------------------------------------------------
S34 Counterblow
By: pilotofficerprune Date: August 2, 2020, 5:20 am
---------------------------------------------------------
This is a thread stub.
#Post#: 6471--------------------------------------------------
Re: S34 Counterblow
By: Gordon Christie Date: August 22, 2020, 6:12 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Andrew (LW) & I have now had 2 runs through this & are happy
that it works straight out of the box, unmodified.
First run:
Note: II/JG1 have no radio net
RAF 13 Halifaxes lost 3 Mustangs but only 1 disrupted bomber sqn
LW 12 fighters losses
LW definitely had the better of the combat & cohesion rolls,
compensated to some degree by unusually good bomber cohesion in
the face of heavy losses. Mustang combat rolls were dreadful.
Comfortable LW victory-which it felt like, though asymmetrical
dice rolls drove the outcome. Consequently we ran it again
unmodified.
VP
LW +42 kills---> +42
RAF 33 exit +12 kills---> +45
Run 2:
RAF 7 bombers lost 6 Mustangs lost 1 disrupted , 1 broken bomber
on exit +27
LW 24 losses
Exit +27
RAF +51
LW +27
Nett +24
Draw-felt right.
Overall LW slightly better luck with dice but tight up to the
end. Without some skilful manoeuvring against the trailing
bomber squadron by the last unbroken LW fighter squadron (with
Alan at the helm, having an uncharacteristically good day) which
netted 2 Halifax kills & a broken result against only 1 Fw190
loss for an 8VP swing this would just have gone the RAF's way.
The VP threshold is (probably) about right. We felt this one
works at alpha unchanged. Like Bomber Command it gets RAF
heavies into the game & gives Mustang IIIs another outing. It is
an interesting contrast to Bomber command with plenty of high
firepower 190s at an altitude where they are comfortable (unlike
some of the 8th AF scenarios where the 190s are getting slightly
unhappy higher up) so fits the meta narrative well.
Cheers
Gordon
#Post#: 6535--------------------------------------------------
Re: S34 Counterblow
By: pilotofficerprune Date: August 30, 2020, 3:18 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Elias, when you are ready to pass Tip and Run to Gordon and
Andrew, can you please do a pass on this?
#Post#: 6552--------------------------------------------------
Re: S34 Counterblow
By: Elias Nordling Date: September 4, 2020, 2:04 am
---------------------------------------------------------
v0.2
Player: Elias Nordling (solo)
The tally rolls of the first two turns were low on both sides.
This had the effect that two veteran FW190 flights were able to
slip into the bomber stream unmolested. This became a pattern of
the game, where the British had trouble parrying the German
attacks on the bombers. There was some real bad British luck,
like extremely low escort reaction rolls and lots of 1s on the
kill rolls, but I'm not certain they were enough to qualify as
an outlier. The result, anyway, was that the Germans got in a
lot of attacks on the bombers with some real results to show for
it. In the end, British and German fighters ran out at about the
same time. I put heavy guns on a Green BF109, but that turned
out to not be such a good idea, as it was unable to hit
anything.
Final score:
British: Exit 24, 17 German fighters: 41
German: 11 bombers, 4 Mustangs: 37
TOTAL 4 MASSIVE GERMAN WIN
Felt like: British disaster.
Comment: I need to play this one again to see if this was an
outlier. On one hand, it was a fun, tense game. On the other
hand, it felt a bit like alt-history, with the Germans scoring a
massive win in this way. I know we shouldn't stare ourselves
blind at the historical outcome, but the difference here between
game and aftermath was especially jarring. After all, we're
talking about a disaster of a kind that the British didn't
suffer at all during the war.
#Post#: 6553--------------------------------------------------
Re: S34 Counterblow
By: pilotofficerprune Date: September 4, 2020, 2:41 am
---------------------------------------------------------
I don’t mind about the losses so much. But yes, if this is not
an outlier I’d be concerned.
#Post#: 6555--------------------------------------------------
Re: S34 Counterblow
By: Elias Nordling Date: September 4, 2020, 1:09 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
v0.2
Player: Elias Nordling (solo)
This game swung the other direction. Partly because the Mustangs
were able to intercept the Luftwaffe veterans before they had a
chance to split. Since they didn't have tactical flexibility,
that means they never got the chance later.
Still, the Luftwaffe got through to the bombers and got a decent
number of attacks in, 7 total, before being chased away.
Final score:
British: Exit 33, 18 fighters: 51
Germans: 6 bombers, 5 fighters: 23
TOTAL: 28
British victory
Felt like: British win
Comment: This one felt it wen't the British way, though not by
as much as the previous game went the German way. I feel the
British might need a small boost. The easiest way to do that
would be to add another veteran, though I'm not sure how much
that helps. Combined with increased split limit, it would make a
real difference, but that would att 2 more Mustang Flights to
the counters needed. My recommendation is to add a British
veteran and let the beta players decide if more fine calibration
is needed. It sure is good fun as it is.
#Post#: 6556--------------------------------------------------
Re: S34 Counterblow
By: pilotofficerprune Date: September 4, 2020, 2:35 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Roger that. I'll add a British veteran and call it Alpha.
#Post#: 6582--------------------------------------------------
Re: S34 Counterblow
By: Okmed Date: September 13, 2020, 10:52 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Scenario: S34 Counterblow
Version: v0.2
Players: Dave Demko (solo)
Narrative: The Bf 109s stayed clean (no gun pods) with the task
of tying up the Mustangs, while the Fw 190s went for the
bombers. They did not carry AAR, though I'll try that next
runthrough. One Focke Wulf wing went for the bombers from below.
Maybe they should have settled for a head-on run, because the
escorts both made successful reactions. The lead bombers were
beat up (4 losses and broken), but otherwise the British were
effective in keeping the interceptors away. Air combat was
bloody, with five instances of a natural 11 or 12 on the Air
Combat Table rolls. The British split one squadron, and both of
those flights eventually broke. One Green German squadron broke
without taking losses. The Brits blew one flight of Fw 190s out
of the sky completely before it had a chance to fail a cohesion
check.
Results: bombers exited 31 + German fighters killed 19 = Brit
total 50
bombers killed 12 + British fighters killed 7 = German total 19
Net +31 comfortable British victory
Recommendations: The outcome, a non-blowout British victory, is
appropriate: Except for the lead squadron, the British did a
good job of defending the bombers. Too early to say anything
about balance, but the question I'll be looking at is how well
the Germans can do against the bombers. Clobbering one bomber
squadron was good work, but insufficient. I have some ideas for
German tactics (AAR, head-on attacks, and keeping the Fw 190s
back a bit).
#Post#: 6592--------------------------------------------------
Re: S34 Counterblow
By: pilotofficerprune Date: September 14, 2020, 2:22 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Is it too early to have any thoughts on victory levels?
#Post#: 6593--------------------------------------------------
Re: S34 Counterblow
By: Okmed Date: September 14, 2020, 8:47 am
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Lee Brimmicombe-Wood
link=topic=176.msg6592#msg6592 date=1600068171]
Is it too early to have any thoughts on victory levels?
[/quote]
The British win at net +31 seemed right. In my playing, the
British did very well at their objective, protecting the
bombers, while the Germans had mixed results pursuing their
objectives.
I'm in the middle of another go-through which may show better
German results. At one point some Fw 190s got a stand-off AAR
shot at some unaccompanied bombers. The actual result, thanks to
a couple natural 1 rolls, was one bomber loss (3 VP). But it
should have been 3 losses (9 VP). Once I get through this one,
we'll be on our way to seeing how well the Germans need to
perform to win. Let's be on the watch for swingy results. A good
attack on a bomber squadron can have a big payoff. Then again, a
successful escort reaction against might send a Green German
squadron home after one turn. Both sides are motivated to
attempt dogfights in different circumstances. So overall, a few
key dice rolls can have major effects on how this one plays out.
*****************************************************
DIR Next Page