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#Post#: 3--------------------------------------------------
Benchmarks, predecessors, anticipatory plagiarists.
DIR By: azuliani
Date: May 31, 2020, 2:09 pm
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Jean-Luc Godard, Filme Socialisme
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLuWoz9OpqU(2010)
Like that it’s set on a cruise ship, and is
“about” cruise ships, but seems very aesthetically
and narratively distinct from other such things. Though
there’s basically no narrative at all, and we’d
never be able to successfully write and pitch something this
abstract — maybe this functions best as a kind of
anti-cruise-ship-comedy-movie, and proof that we could do
something that looks and feels nothing like the normal bill of
fare.
“The Romanoffs,” S01, E02, “The Royal
We.”
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnSa1-WMk2M(the
link is to a
“making of,” I couldn’t find a clip)
This show is hit or miss, at least as far as I’ve seen,
but the narrative setup of this episode is pretty great —
basically someone is invited to go on a special cruise that is
for people who are (or claim to be) descendants of the Russian
Romanoff family. The protagonist is the spouse of a person whose
family claims to be from this aristocratic line; he’s an
asshole and she ends up going on the cruise by herself. So
she’s a non-Romanoff, which is especially funny because
basically no one there really could be one, for real, but
there’s much anxiety around and policing of this “in
group.” Suffice it to say that she experiences the whole
event at several layers of remove. Which I guess is a classic
“fish out of water” trope, but it just works so well
here. I never thought that a cruise ship could be more uncanny
or unsettlingly meta-festive, but it certainly is in this. Every
corner she turns there is a new, and newly bizarre, item of
pageantry. (Including a very uncomfortable and verboten
pantomime of Rasputin’s downfall where the titular role is
played by a person with dwarfism).
This is a good example to think through: what “kind”
of cruise ship is ours? Is it themed in a particular way, or
catering to a particular narrative desire on the part of its
clients? What are the passengers’ orientations towards the
cruise ship — is this a special, once-in-a-lifetime kind
of thing, or are there regulars? (It’s probably the case
that it would be a mix. And given that, how do we account for
the range of possible reasons for being on a cruise ship, and
the kind of social and, like, psychic demographics these index?)
Ship of Fools (1965)
HTML https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Fools_(film)
This would be more of a deep cut for us research-wise - an
ocean-liner film rather than a cruise ship film. Set in 1933 on
a liner travelling from Mexico to Germany, and featuring
upper-class passengers but also the presence of 600 migrant
workers being deported back to Spain. Critics at the time
compared it unfavorably to Grand Hotel (1932). Where I think
this brand of po-faced mid-century American film faltered was in
its refusal to be at least a little bit funny.
Which brings us by way of comparison to The Exterminating Angel
(1962) Buñuel’s film about posh Mexican people who
can’t leave a dinner party due to some hidden malevolence
they don’t understand. It’s a wonderful example of
uncanny magic afflicting out-of-touch bourgs, and it also has
the advantage of being funny. I believe we tried to watch this
once at Matt’s grandma’s theatre but there was a
problem with the disc. I do highly recommend it though.
[ A: Yes yes I was going to say, The Exterminating Angel is a
great reference point. In my head I picture a plot structure in
which we have a completely adequate narrative, of the sort of
upstairs-downstairs clients-and-crew variety, and then, the
island they’re sailing for just doesn’t appear, and
they’re suddenly faced with the possibility of spending
quite a bit of time on this ship — and the party becomes a
lot less fun when you can’t leave it. ]
Stephen King’s short novel “The Langoliers” (I
believe also adapted to film or TV) is in the same zone -
airline passengers who survive the plane’s passage through
a cosmic rift by virtue of having been asleep. Everybody else
vanishes, leaving their silver fillings, prostheses, and
pacemakers behind in the seats. A deadheading pilot also
sleeping during The Event lands the plane in Maine (of course)
where the survivors realize that they are literally behind the
times.
Maniac (2018)
HTML https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maniac_(miniseries)
There aren’t any boats in this show, I don’t think,
but what there is is a very idiosyncratic and somewhat
threatening environment (a kind of pharmaceutical trial spa)
that the cast of characters have to learn to inhabit,
understand, and subvert. I mention this show below as far as
possible aesthetics and world-building goes, specially around
technology — Maniac does an incredible job of setting a
narrative in a world that feels contemporary but has slight
uncanny tweaks in the techno-social fabric. And it does a really
impressive job at incorporating fantasy elements into an
otherwise quite “realist” framework.
#Post#: 9--------------------------------------------------
Re: Benchmarks, predecessors, anticipatory plagiarists.
DIR By: matthew
Date: May 31, 2020, 7:47 pm
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HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fv9b9vStELA
Oh snap. Someone working with the very same premise: a
conspiracy cruise that ends with an onboard conspiracy being
revealed.
As an amateurish short film, it's a bit of a playbook as to what
not to do. But for me, it's also a bit like finding your
dissertation.
Thoughts? This is normally where I'd swap out the boat and
reframe the story to gain new traction. But I'm good if we think
we can do something novel with the idea.
#Post#: 11--------------------------------------------------
Re: Benchmarks, predecessors, anticipatory plagiarists.
DIR By: azuliani
Date: May 31, 2020, 8:03 pm
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--- Quote from: matthew link ---
>
>
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fv9b9vStELA
>
> Oh snap. Someone working with the very same premise: a
conspiracy cruise that ends with an onboard conspiracy being
revealed.
>
> As an amateurish short film, it's a bit of a playbook as to
what not to do. But for me, it's also a bit like finding your
dissertation.
>
> Thoughts? This is normally where I'd swap out the boat and
reframe the story to gain new traction. But I'm good if we think
we can do something novel with the idea.
>
--- End Quote ---
I'm not too worried about it — honestly every show or movie I
like has a cluster of similar things around it; it's actually
useful to know what's been done, especially in a radically
different format, because this will steer us towards our own,
original thing.
#Post#: 19--------------------------------------------------
Re: Benchmarks, predecessors, anticipatory plagiarists.
DIR By: G
Date: June 1, 2020, 12:49 pm
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I do not think we need to worry. There are a grand total of like
64 ideas in the world. It's all about the specifics of the
execution.
#Post#: 20--------------------------------------------------
Re: Benchmarks, predecessors, anticipatory plagiarists.
DIR By: matthew
Date: June 1, 2020, 2:23 pm
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True, you couldn't pitch Family Guy without it sounding like The
Simpsons or Buffy without it sounding like Blade or Friends
without it sounding like Seinfeld. That said, there's something
about the particularity of the situation that makes it feel like
there's more overlap. And that's why I mentioned tweaking the
particulars, like the cruise ship itself. But at that point it's
a question of: what counts as particular?
#Post#: 26--------------------------------------------------
Re: Benchmarks, predecessors, anticipatory plagiarists.
DIR By: azuliani
Date: June 4, 2020, 5:24 pm
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--- Quote from: matthew link ---
>
> True, you couldn't pitch Family Guy without it sounding like
The Simpsons or Buffy without it sounding like Blade or Friends
without it sounding like Seinfeld. That said, there's something
about the particularity of the situation that makes it feel like
there's more overlap. And that's why I mentioned tweaking the
particulars, like the cruise ship itself. But at that point it's
a question of: what counts as particular?
>
--- End Quote ---
After a few days off, I think what might work really well is if
this cruise isn't on the surface a "conspiracy cruise" — if it's
just a 60s themed cruise, with a fun and light ain't-history-fun
facade that is slowly worn away by the fact that the cruise
company is run by, and largely staffed by, conspiracy theorists.
A historical themed cruise will always be, in some senses, a
conspiracy, since it's all a representation that will be greatly
skewed by whomever's "vision" of the time period we're in. So
like what if the cruise festivities appear at first brush to be
a fairly standard narrative of the 60s, but then slowly weird
alterations and tensions set in?
#Post#: 30--------------------------------------------------
Re: Benchmarks, predecessors, anticipatory plagiarists.
DIR By: matthew
Date: June 5, 2020, 12:12 pm
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I'm into a generic '60s themed cruise, but it doesn't help me
creatively in the same way that the conspiracy theme does -- I
guess because the constraint becomes a lot less constrained and
so there's not enough pressure in the cooker for me to
materialize anything. No doubt this is probably highly
particular to my own creative needs. But I need to zoom in a
little bit further before I can start to build momentum, which
is why I started looking at trying to develop a character
through this historical figure I mentioned.
Maybe you can help fill in the details a bit more so I can latch
on? Like, are we in 2020/1960? And is this going to be a family
cruise, then? And does that mean our passengers are going to be
a general cross-section of society?
I'm watching a bunch of vids of real '60s cruises and
contemporary '60s themed cruises. The throwback cruises ("Flower
Power Cruise," or "Malt Shop Memories Cruise" for example) are
deeply cringey and sad:
HTML https://youtu.be/zcwm5VG4xQo?t=698
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoNNQUUkhyw
Meanwhile, archival footage practically looks like Wes Anderson
shot it:
HTML https://youtu.be/Klb1q2uq-wg?t=528
I suppose the difference, then, is between a cruise that's like
a '60s cruise or a cruise that's just all-around '60s.
It's easy to imagine a fancy cocktails version of the '60s, but
this doesn't quite square with how gaudy the cruise industry is.
And I'm not sure I'd want to set a kind of "cringe-watching"
tone by having a kind of Harmony Korine thing where we have a
bunch of, like, totally opaque people with fake suntans and
adult diapers. That'd be super nihilistic. Haha.
#Post#: 31--------------------------------------------------
Re: Benchmarks, predecessors, anticipatory plagiarists.
DIR By: G
Date: June 5, 2020, 5:47 pm
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What if we make it a specifically Kennedy-themed cruise? Which
would attract plenty of conspiracy theorists but also boomer
nostalgists, Mad Men heads, college vocal club types, Boston
guys, throwback instagram ladies who love elegant pink suits,
and the queer subcultural spinoff of Grey Gardens lovers? (Jinx
Monsoon territory)
#Post#: 32--------------------------------------------------
Re: Benchmarks, predecessors, anticipatory plagiarists.
DIR By: matthew
Date: June 6, 2020, 9:40 am
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I feel like that's where we've been headed this whole time. It's
a weird theme to justify for a cruise (do people love Kennedy
that much or do they just love the assassination?). But I'm sure
we could pull it off.
#Post#: 33--------------------------------------------------
Re: Benchmarks, predecessors, anticipatory plagiarists.
DIR By: G
Date: June 6, 2020, 1:30 pm
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Buddy I know we can. Wait until we get started on RFK and Sirhan
Sirhan.
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