DIR Return Create A Forum - Home
---------------------------------------------------------
<
form action=&amp
;amp;amp;quot;https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr&
amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot; method=&am
p;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;p
ost&
quot; target=&am
p;amp;amp;quot;_top&
amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;&am
p;amp;amp;amp;amp;gt; &a
mp;amp;amp;amp;amp;lt;input type=&am
p;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;hidden&am
p;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot; name=&am
p;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;cmd&a
mp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot; value=&
amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot
;_s-xclick&a
mp;amp;quot;&amp
;amp;amp;gt; &am
p;amp;amp;lt;input type=&amp
;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;hidden&amp
;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot; name=&amp
;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;hosted_button_id&a
mp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot; val
ue=&
quot;DKL7ADEKRVUBL&a
mp;amp;amp;amp;quot;&amp
;amp;amp;amp;amp;gt; &am
p;amp;amp;amp;amp;lt;input type=&amp
;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;image&
amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot; src=&a
mp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;https://www.payp
alobjects.com/en_US/i/btn/btn_donateCC_LG.gif&am
p;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot; border=&
amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;0&a
mp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot; nam
e=&q
uot;submit&a
mp;amp;quot; alt=&am
p;amp;amp;amp;quot;PayPal - The safer, easier way to pay online!
&quo
t;&g
t; &
lt;img alt=&
amp;amp;quot;&am
p;amp;amp;quot; border=&
amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;0&a
mp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot; src=&am
p;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;https://www.paypalobjects.com
/en_US/i/scr/pixel.gif&a
mp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot; width=&
amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;1&a
mp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot; height=&amp
;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;1&
amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;quot;&am
p;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;gt; &a
mp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;lt;/form&
amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;gt;
HTML https://3169.createaforum.com
---------------------------------------------------------
*****************************************************
DIR Return to: Biblical Pre-Conception Existence Theology (PCE)
*****************************************************
#Post#: 32554--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pre-Conception Existence - an intro
By: guest58 Date: June 29, 2021, 5:46 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Mr E link=topic=442.msg32545#msg32545
date=1624989866]
Does this sum up your view then, regarding those Calvinist
beliefs? This is how Arminians countered the Calvinist idea of
unconditional election (predestination) with something that
could be called "conditional election."[/quote]
[font=times new roman]I won’t read any further because I have no
iota of acceptance for conditional election. Both Calvin and
Arminius blasphemed the loving, righteous nature of GOD and HIS
justice. [/font]
Calvin’s claim that our election or reprobation was
unconditional is a blatant disrepute of GOD’s love. Arminius’
claim that GOD would have saved everyone if they would have just
repented in time ie, in their lifetime, also brings HIS love
into disrepute because HIS love is perfect and HIS perfect love
is perfectly patient so HE would wait patiently for aeons for
every person who could be saved to finally accept their
salvation!
The idea there are people in hell which could have been saved
but are not because He didn’t save them is ludicrous. The only
people who are not saved are those who CANNOT be saved because
they sinned the unforgivable sin of putting their faith in the
idea that YHWH was a liar and therefore a false god!
These so called teachers may have some instruction in theology
but they have no understanding nor experience of GOD’s love.
#Post#: 32559--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pre-Conception Existence - an intro
By: guest125 Date: June 29, 2021, 7:05 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Ted T. link=topic=442.msg32553#msg32553
date=1625005613]
[quote author=Mr E link=topic=442.msg32540#msg32540
date=1624987197]
Very.... umm.... Calvinist.
Do you have a Christian Reformed background for your beliefs? I
ask because they are the most likely to get hung up on
"election."
[/quote]
My goodness, what have you gone thru that the mere mention of
the word election triggers such a knee jerk response???
I have no Calvinist background. I deplore the obvious
inadequacies of Calvinist theology that led him into such
blasphemous doctrines as UNconditional election.
If you should ever get out of your memories and relook at
Calvinism again, you will quit equating me with them...you do
yourself no favours with such a blatant disregard for my true
pov.
Election is a fact. it has meaning. It affects our life.
Calvin botched it royally. I've spent 12 years dening Calvisit
election publically.
Others botched it too but at least they don't always delve into
blasphemy.
Dealing with your ad hominem disparagements is tiring...sigh.
[/quote]
lol.... okay Tedster... we can do it your way.
What I've "gone through" is some of your posts. Apparently with
the misconception that you might actually want to have a
conversation about some of the ideas you posted. I'm curious as
to what you think are 'ad hominen attacks.' How about you
post/quote those instances so I might apologize to you.
First- likely I wasn't clear, but I was thinking that it was
Calvinism you are railing against, not believing in. I wasn't
entirely sure, so I asked if perhaps you have had some sort of
background experience in dealing with Calvinists. Asked and
answered.
Since Calvinist thought concerning unconditional election where
God simply chooses whom He pleases is anathema to you, I
wondered if then perhaps you were a proponent of Armenian
theology and the idea of conditional election, where "God knows"
what it is you are going to choose at some future point in time
so He chooses you because you 'are going' to choose Him. It
seems you don't abide this idea either, so now maybe we can get
to the point where you might present what it is you hold to,
rather than discussing the things you dislike.... I was trying
to establish some kind of baseline for a conversation with
you...
But-
I'm actually becoming less and less interested in having that
conversation because I'm discovering you to be rather prickly
and unpleasant and quick to take some kind of offense at almost
anything I might ask. I'm happy to take the discussion of such
things elsewhere if you prefer (that means with other people
instead of you). Just say the word.
#Post#: 32594--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pre-Conception Existence - an intro
By: guest58 Date: June 30, 2021, 2:59 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Ted T. link=topic=442.msg32535#msg32535
date=1624984873][font=verdana]Mr. E, the description of my
thoughts on our fall after our election but before the creation
of the physical universe is forth
coming.[/font][/quote][font=verdana]
[font=Times New Roman]Verse supports are available for all
parts:[/font][/font]
ImCo:
GOD first created ALL the spirits in HIS image ie, capable of
being a suitable Bride for HIM, with a free will with an equal
ability and opportunity to choose to put their faith in HIM or
to reject HIM and HIS heavenly purpose.When this created society
matured, HE proclaimed to all HIS divinity and HIS purpose of
the heavenly marriage with them, including the heavenly rewards
and the dangers of hell and that salvation from sin was found
only in the Son by faith, an unproven hope, in Him.
HE promised anyone who put their faith, their unproven hope, in
HIM and the Son would be elected, chosen, to be HIS heavenly
Bride and saved from all sin and those who rejected HIM by
faith, ie, and unproven hope that HE was a liar and a false god,
would be damned forever.
The response to this proclamation separated all of creation into
three groups: the holy elect, the eternally sinful reprobate and
the sinful elect. The fall of some of the elect came about
because some only accepted HIM so they could be free from the
dangers of hell but were planning to then go their own way no
matter what HE wanted from them.
Since HE is a GOD who cannot abide evil and must destroy it as
soon as possible, HIS first command was to set up the judgement
day to come about. HE commanded all HIS elect to “come out from
among the reprobate,” that is, to repudiate their friendships or
even love for these who must be condemned because he knew some
were harbouring idolatrous thoughts about the reprobate that the
judgement was too harsh, too unloving and too unnecessary to be
accepted. Most complied, some didn’t, becoming enslaved to sin
themselves, HIS sheep gone astray into sin, needing redemption.
The next command was for HIS elect to then come out from among
their elect but now sinful friends and to leave them to HIS
mercy...which most accepted but some did not.
By repeated calls for those not yet sinful to come out for among
the sinners HE found the level of willingness to sin (ie, their
lack of willingness to be holy) in every person in creation from
Satan to the least sinful person in existence including the holy
elect angels who never sinned.
Then the physical universe was created which proof of HIS
divinity and power ended everyone’s free will decisions about
these choices, setting our self chosen fates into motion.
Satan, his demonic angels and the fallen elect were all flung
into Sheol in the centre of the earth to live together in the
world as the best method of bringing to holiness HIS sinful
elect, Matt 13:29-30, the parable of the sower, especially
considering Jesus’ explanation of the parable, Matt 13:36-39.
#Post#: 32596--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pre-Conception Existence - an intro
By: guest125 Date: June 30, 2021, 4:05 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Got it.
Thanks
#Post#: 32599--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pre-Conception Existence - an intro
By: guest8 Date: June 30, 2021, 5:57 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Ted T. link=topic=442.msg32594#msg32594
date=1625083153]
[quote author=Ted T. link=topic=442.msg32535#msg32535
date=1624984873][font=verdana]Mr. E, the description of my
thoughts on our fall after our election but before the creation
of the physical universe is forth
coming.[/font][/quote][font=verdana]
[font=Times New Roman]Verse supports are available for all
parts:[/font][/font]
ImCo:
GOD first created ALL the spirits in HIS image ie, capable of
being a suitable Bride for HIM, with a free will with an equal
ability and opportunity to choose to put their faith in HIM or
to reject HIM and HIS heavenly purpose.When this created society
matured, HE proclaimed to all HIS divinity and HIS purpose of
the heavenly marriage with them, including the heavenly rewards
and the dangers of hell and that salvation from sin was found
only in the Son by faith, an unproven hope, in Him.
HE promised anyone who put their faith, their unproven hope, in
HIM and the Son would be elected, chosen, to be HIS heavenly
Bride and saved from all sin and those who rejected HIM by
faith, ie, and unproven hope that HE was a liar and a false god,
would be damned forever.
The response to this proclamation separated all of creation into
three groups: the holy elect, the eternally sinful reprobate and
the sinful elect. The fall of some of the elect came about
because some only accepted HIM so they could be free from the
dangers of hell but were planning to then go their own way no
matter what HE wanted from them.
Since HE is a GOD who cannot abide evil and must destroy it as
soon as possible, HIS first command was to set up the judgement
day to come about. HE commanded all HIS elect to “come out from
among the reprobate,” that is, to repudiate their friendships or
even love for these who must be condemned because he knew some
were harbouring idolatrous thoughts about the reprobate that the
judgement was too harsh, too unloving and too unnecessary to be
accepted. Most complied, some didn’t, becoming enslaved to sin
themselves, HIS sheep gone astray into sin, needing redemption.
The next command was for HIS elect to then come out from among
their elect but now sinful friends and to leave them to HIS
mercy...which most accepted but some did not.
By repeated calls for those not yet sinful to come out for among
the sinners HE found the level of willingness to sin (ie, their
lack of willingness to be holy) in every person in creation from
Satan to the least sinful person in existence including the holy
elect angels who never sinned.
Then the physical universe was created which proof of HIS
divinity and power ended everyone’s free will decisions about
these choices, setting our self chosen fates into motion.
Satan, his demonic angels and the fallen elect were all flung
into Sheol in the centre of the earth to live together in the
world as the best method of bringing to holiness HIS sinful
elect, Matt 13:29-30, the parable of the sower, especially
considering Jesus’ explanation of the parable, Matt 13:36-39.
[/quote]
You said:"HE promised anyone who put their faith, their unproven
hope, in HIM and the Son would be elected, chosen, to be HIS
heavenly Bride and saved from all sin and those who rejected HIM
by faith, ie, and unproven hope that HE was a liar and a false
god, would be damned forever. "
This would make Him a reactionary GOD....Plus this is
unbiblical....
Blade
#Post#: 42457--------------------------------------------------
Re: Pre-Conception Existence - an intro
By: patrick jane Date: February 10, 2024, 7:42 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Ted please come back to this forum. Bladerunner please come
back. truth journey please come back. You are all also welcome
back to White Horse Theology but I'm focusing more on this forum
for now. PCE makes sense to me and is supported Biblically.
*****************************************************
DIR Previous Page
DIR Next Page