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#Post#: 4957--------------------------------------------------
Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
DIR By: guest24
Date: April 15, 2019, 11:36 am
---------------------------------------------------------
So question I purposed we think about....I have something to
think on while I am gone...if we understand I Tim the way these
videos teach it, what does that tell the men about their
authority in the church? More when I return...it's an
interesting discussion.
As the Bride of Christ, the church is to take on the role of the
wife in Ephesians 5....so when we are talking about men and the
church, the men must (if the traditional understanding is
correct) stop trying to run the church and usurp their own
authority over that of Christ and be silent. IOW's the men who
claim to be in authority to run the local church have no excuse
to assert their decisions over that of Christ. In fact, in the
early church, they made decisions based on everyone being in one
accord, thus they were exercising the "silence" that men preach
woman are instructed to have....how many churches do that today?
How many churches require a 100% vote before making any
decisions? How many men are silent before the HEAD of the
CHURCH which is Christ? Please show me even one.....now, isn't
the head the example? So if men cannot be silent before Christ,
why are they so determined to force women or try to shame them
into being silent before them, mere human beings?
#Post#: 4967--------------------------------------------------
Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
DIR By: guest8
Date: April 15, 2019, 8:16 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Lori Bolinger link ---
>
> So question I purposed we think about....I have something to
think on while I am gone...if we understand I Tim the way these
videos teach it, what does that tell the men about their
authority in the church? More when I return...it's an
interesting discussion.
>
> As the Bride of Christ, the church is to take on the role of
the wife in Ephesians 5....so when we are talking about men and
the church, the men must (if the traditional understanding is
correct) stop trying to run the church and usurp their own
authority over that of Christ and be silent. IOW's the men who
claim to be in authority to run the local church have no excuse
to assert their decisions over that of Christ. In fact, in the
early church, they made decisions based on everyone being in one
accord, thus they were exercising the "silence" that men preach
woman are instructed to have....how many churches do that today?
How many churches require a 100% vote before making any
decisions? How many men are silent before the HEAD of the
CHURCH which is Christ? Please show me even one.....now, isn't
the head the example? So if men cannot be silent before Christ,
why are they so determined to force women or try to shame them
into being silent before them, mere human beings?
>
--- End Quote ---
[shadow=blue,left]Lori...it seems you cannot separate the (brick
and Mortar) Churches and the spiritual church (Body/Bride) of
Christ.
you said: "As the Bride of Christ, the church is to take on the
role of the wife in Ephesians 5...."
Not even close!
Blade[/shadow]
#Post#: 4988--------------------------------------------------
Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
DIR By: guest24
Date: April 16, 2019, 9:38 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Bladerunner link ---
>
> [quote author=Lori Bolinger link=topic=379.msg4957#msg4957
date=1555346197]
> So question I purposed we think about....I have something to
think on while I am gone...if we understand I Tim the way these
videos teach it, what does that tell the men about their
authority in the church? More when I return...it's an
interesting discussion.
>
> As the Bride of Christ, the church is to take on the role of
the wife in Ephesians 5....so when we are talking about men and
the church, the men must (if the traditional understanding is
correct) stop trying to run the church and usurp their own
authority over that of Christ and be silent. IOW's the men who
claim to be in authority to run the local church have no excuse
to assert their decisions over that of Christ. In fact, in the
early church, they made decisions based on everyone being in one
accord, thus they were exercising the "silence" that men preach
woman are instructed to have....how many churches do that today?
How many churches require a 100% vote before making any
decisions? How many men are silent before the HEAD of the
CHURCH which is Christ? Please show me even one.....now, isn't
the head the example? So if men cannot be silent before Christ,
why are they so determined to force women or try to shame them
into being silent before them, mere human beings?
>
--- End Quote ---
[shadow=blue,left]Lori...it seems you cannot separate the (brick
and Mortar) Churches and the spiritual church (Body/Bride) of
Christ.
you said: "As the Bride of Christ, the church is to take on the
role of the wife in Ephesians 5...."
Not even close!
Blade[/shadow]
[/quote]so you want to argue that Christ is NOT the head of the
Church....NOT the head of the man...how strange since scripture
clearly says He is.
Even in the brick and mortar church, Christ is to be the head,
not man...are you, a man, willing to accept that teaching? The
same teaching you preach to woman? How do you live out in the
brick and mortar church, "being silent and in full submission"?
Give me examples of how you live this out with Christ the head.
#Post#: 4998--------------------------------------------------
Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
DIR By: guest8
Date: April 16, 2019, 9:05 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Lori Bolinger link ---
>
> [quote author=Bladerunner link=topic=379.msg4967#msg4967
date=1555377414]
> [quote author=Lori Bolinger link=topic=379.msg4957#msg4957
date=1555346197]
> So question I purposed we think about....I have something to
think on while I am gone...if we understand I Tim the way these
videos teach it, what does that tell the men about their
authority in the church? More when I return...it's an
interesting discussion.
>
> As the Bride of Christ, the church is to take on the role of
the wife in Ephesians 5....so when we are talking about men and
the church, the men must (if the traditional understanding is
correct) stop trying to run the church and usurp their own
authority over that of Christ and be silent. IOW's the men who
claim to be in authority to run the local church have no excuse
to assert their decisions over that of Christ. In fact, in the
early church, they made decisions based on everyone being in one
accord, thus they were exercising the "silence" that men preach
woman are instructed to have....how many churches do that today?
How many churches require a 100% vote before making any
decisions? How many men are silent before the HEAD of the
CHURCH which is Christ? Please show me even one.....now, isn't
the head the example? So if men cannot be silent before Christ,
why are they so determined to force women or try to shame them
into being silent before them, mere human beings?
>
--- End Quote ---
[shadow=blue,left]Lori...it seems you cannot separate the (brick
and Mortar) Churches and the spiritual church (Body/Bride) of
Christ.
you said: "As the Bride of Christ, the church is to take on the
role of the wife in Ephesians 5...."
Not even close!
Blade[/shadow]
[/quote]so you want to argue that Christ is NOT the head of the
Church....NOT the head of the man...how strange since scripture
clearly says He is.
Even in the brick and mortar church, Christ is to be the head,
not man...are you, a man, willing to accept that teaching? The
same teaching you preach to woman? How do you live out in the
brick and mortar church, "being silent and in full submission"?
Give me examples of how you live this out with Christ the head.
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]Jesus Christ is always the head of any church
including his and I will assume you meant a Bride when you was
speaking about as you said: "As the Bride of Christ, the church
is to take on the role of the wife in Ephesians 5.." though not
really sure why you have tied this to Eph 5.
1 CO 11:3.."But I would have you know, that the head of every
man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the
head of Christ is God."
In the spiritual Church (body/Bride of Christ), Jesus is the
head of all for all are one. Both you and I are no different in
His church (Bride). However, in the (Brick and mortar) church we
have to (or NOT) follow His rules, the rules of 1 Tim 2-3 and
Titus.
Lori.... I am not pitting Men against women. I am just trying to
follow the lord's Laws for us without changing, adding to them
or removing from them anything.
If you cannot follow His laws, that is between you and Him. Good
luck!
Blade
[/shadow]
#Post#: 5019--------------------------------------------------
Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
DIR By: guest24
Date: April 17, 2019, 10:05 am
---------------------------------------------------------
Blade...I am talking about following the rules. If Christ is
the head of the Church and the head of man, and the brick and
mortar church is part of the Big C Church, then there is no
excuse, man must submit in silence to Christ just as they
command woman using the Tim. passage, either that, or the
interpretation they are preaching is wrong.
So, let's look once again at the totality of scripture and see
what it says....The Church is the Bride of Christ... Ephs. 5
What we know about this is that whatever instruction is given to
the wife is also given to the church....in fact, the husband is
to Love the wife as Christ Loved the Church. So Christ's Love
for the church is a picture of how the husband is to Love the
wife just as the wife who is in submission to her husband is a
picture of how the church is to react to Jesus Love for her.
We also know that as the head of the man, Christ is the head of
the church....it all goes back to Eph. again. Like the man is
the head of the woman, Christ is the head of the man and the
Father is the head of Christ.
So if we interpret I Tim. the way you are proposing, then, men
have no right to speak in church or to teach anyone for Christ
alone has that authority. IOW's men must be silent, learning in
quiet submission to the Head of man, that is to say Christ.
If on the other hand you interpret I Timothy as I found was
consistent with the totality of scripture, what we see is that
men are to work together with Christ with lives that are
peaceable and gentle, meek, so that all can see the power of God
in their lives...iow's not with flowery, convincing words but
with the power of the Living God.
#Post#: 5026--------------------------------------------------
Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
DIR By: Sherman
Date: April 17, 2019, 4:08 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[size=12pt]I am a Johnny come lately to this discussion but
there is somnething I have noticed about this verse:[size=12pt]1
Timothy 2:12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp
authority over the man, but to be in silence.[/size]
[color=#ff0000][size=12pt]Note the part I have bolded. It is
Paul that does not suffer these things. As such I do not think
this applies to the modern church.[/size]
#Post#: 5030--------------------------------------------------
Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
DIR By: guest8
Date: April 17, 2019, 7:00 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Sherman link ---
>
> I am a Johnny come lately to this discussion but there is
somnething I have noticed about this verse:1 Timothy 2:12 But I
suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the
man, but to be in silence.
>
> Note the part I have bolded. It is Paul that does not suffer
these things. As such I do not think this applies to the modern
church.
>
--- End Quote ---
[shadow=blue,left]
You do not think 1 tim 2 applies to the modern church? I think
that is what you meant.
Your Choice and you already know the consequences of being
wrong!
Blade[/shadow]
#Post#: 5050--------------------------------------------------
Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
DIR By: guest24
Date: April 18, 2019, 11:13 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Sherman link ---
>
> I am a Johnny come lately to this discussion but there is
somnething I have noticed about this verse:1 Timothy 2:12 But I
suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the
man, but to be in silence.
>
> Note the part I have bolded. It is Paul that does not suffer
these things. As such I do not think this applies to the modern
church.
>
--- End Quote ---
I have seen this teaching but I don't think I can buy it anymore
than I can buy the interpretation Blade is presenting
#Post#: 5063--------------------------------------------------
Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
DIR By: guest8
Date: April 18, 2019, 7:50 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Lori Bolinger link ---
>
> [quote author=Sherman link=topic=379.msg5026#msg5026
date=1555535323]
> I am a Johnny come lately to this discussion but there is
somnething I have noticed about this verse:1 Timothy 2:12 But I
suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the
man, but to be in silence.
>
> Note the part I have bolded. It is Paul that does not suffer
these things. As such I do not think this applies to the modern
church.
>
--- End Quote ---
I have seen this teaching but I don't think I can buy it anymore
than I can buy the interpretation Blade is presenting
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]Well at least my teaching is on authority of
GOD's WORD not mine. 1 TIM 2:12 "But I suffer not a woman to
teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in
silence."
Those are Jesus's Words not mine. There is only one
interpretation to it, HIS interpretation.
If you want to disagree with HIM fine as that a decision only
you can make.
The problem is, you are only going to get ONE Decision..... You
either believe the Bible is His WORD and He says what He means
and Means what He says or You do not!
Blade[/shadow]
#Post#: 5068--------------------------------------------------
Re: The dangers of woman keeping silent...
DIR By: guest24
Date: April 19, 2019, 7:46 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Bladerunner link ---
>
> [quote author=Lori Bolinger link=topic=379.msg5050#msg5050
date=1555604023]
> [quote author=Sherman link=topic=379.msg5026#msg5026
date=1555535323]
> I am a Johnny come lately to this discussion but there is
somnething I have noticed about this verse:1 Timothy 2:12 But I
suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the
man, but to be in silence.
>
> Note the part I have bolded. It is Paul that does not suffer
these things. As such I do not think this applies to the modern
church.
>
--- End Quote ---
I have seen this teaching but I don't think I can buy it anymore
than I can buy the interpretation Blade is presenting
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]Well at least my teaching is on authority of
GOD's WORD not mine. 1 TIM 2:12 "But I suffer not a woman to
teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in
silence."
Those are Jesus's Words not mine. There is only one
interpretation to it, HIS interpretation.
If you want to disagree with HIM fine as that a decision only
you can make.
The problem is, you are only going to get ONE Decision..... You
either believe the Bible is His WORD and He says what He means
and Means what He says or You do not!
Blade[/shadow]
[/quote]Blade...I presented the study I did where I allowed
scripture to interpret scripture for us and you didn't make any
comments at all to show where I missed what scripture is telling
us...why? If I am wrong and if scripture does NOT clarify God's
intended meaning, why do you refuse to show me where I missed
the mark?
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