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DIR Return to: Words of God - Christian Theology w/Bladerunner
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#Post#: 4225--------------------------------------------------
Re: From a Calvinist perspective
By: guest8 Date: March 1, 2019, 8:51 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=patrick jane link=topic=347.msg4224#msg4224
date=1551459754]
[quote author=Ted T. link=topic=347.msg4223#msg4223
date=1551459462]
[quote]TED, I did not get past this phrase...You said: "cannot
refer to everyone He created as there are others whom He cast
out because He did NOT know them,"
It is obvious you have decide NOT to take Jesus Christ up on His
GRACE Gift Package. For GOD LOVES you so much, He will abide by
your free-will decision. Yes, He loves you, and he will not make
you live with Him when it is evident, You do not want to. Of
course there are only one choice that is the right
choice.[/quote]
First, I can barely navigate this site -it is just too busy and
confusing.
Second, I cannot find the reply with quote feature so there is
no link back link, sigh.
Third, you make a lot of assumptions about why I quoted a verse
that you stated you do not understand why I quoted it... Do you
often have knee jerk opposition to other's non-Calvinist
approach?
So let's try something new...Put the phrase you have difficulty
with in context of the verse I used to introduce the concept,
Romans 8:29-30..."For whom he did foreknow... ie "cannot refer
to everyone He created as there are others whom He cast out
because He did NOT know them,"
the concept being that foreknown cannot refer to everyone
because some HE never knew ! Matthew 7:23... It's too bad you
stopped there because the rest of the essay developes of the
concept.
Instead of maligning me with false accusations, will you deal
with the contention I made, exegete the verse as I did and tell
me how you believe I missed the mark like a good debater does?
[/quote]Ted, sorry the quote feature is ABOVE the post at the
top right. Most forums have them at the bottom right. I hope you
get used to it here brother.
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]Hi Ted..mind if I step into this debate?
I see you are doubting GOD's WORD. I agree that the verses in
the Bible are sometimes hard to read.
First we have Romans 8:29 that tell us HE foreknew us and then
the verse you quoted: YET!
Mat 7:23..."And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you:
depart from me, ye that work iniquity."
But then what is the content...Lets go back a verse or two and
see.
Mat 7:21-22."Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall
enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of
my Father which is in heaven. "
We find out that the Lord is speaking to the Jews about how to
get into heaven, the good works has to be of the Father's will?
Mat 7:22...Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we
not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out
devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?"
In the Mat.7:22....many will tell Him what they have done for
Him (Jesus) but is it really what He wants?
Mat 7:23... Jesus tells them He does not even know them. I ask
you Ted:
'Did you did you ever know someone but because of something
they have done, You did not know them? Would you be like Peter
and deny you did not know them?'
God gives you a Gift and all one has to do is believe and accept
Jesus Christ as You Lord and Savior. (1 Cor 15:1-4). If you
turn away from GOD as you are doing, What do you REALLY expect
GOD to do with you.
Luke 21:18..."But there shall not an hair of your head perish."
How does He know how many hairs are on your head and if one of
them has perished? In other words, He knows what you are doing,
thinking, etc.
In Job 31:15 we find.."Did not he that made me in the womb make
him? and did not one fashion us in the womb?"
Did Jesus make you in the Womb? Did he give you that first
breath of life?
In Rom 9:12..we find God speaking to Rebecca and tell her the
two babies within her Esau and Jacob..
"It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger."
How would He know that, but it really happened.
Mat 6:8.."“Therefore do not be like them. For your Father knows
the things you have need of before you ask Him."
In Jer 1:5, we find God already knew him....as He has said He
knows you and me and everyone else!
“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you;[/b] (He made us,
YES)
Before you were born I sanctified you;
I ordained you a prophet to the nations.”"
And you have doubts for your sins, lifestyle, worldview, etc.
will not let you see the truth in front of you.
We are not discussing if GOD lied, we are discussing His
omniscience or His ability to know everything.
There are some 108 prophecies from the OT that were fulfilled
completely about the first coming of Jesus Christ and His death
on the Cross..... Yet you say God does not know some.
Ted, GOD has the power, and foresight to see and know you before
you were born. It is really up to you whether GOD in your future
says to you "I never knew you" or NOT? YOUR CHOICE!
Have a good evening and please do a lot of soul searching.
This is not a game or trying to live life (here on earth) to the
fullest, it is about spending an Eternity...........
In The Lake of FIRE (eternal torment)
or
Heaven (eternal bliss)
Blade[/shadow]
#Post#: 4230--------------------------------------------------
Re: From a Calvinist perspective
By: guest58 Date: March 2, 2019, 11:23 am
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Bladerunner link=topic=347.msg4225#msg4225
date=1551495117]
[shadow=blue,left]Hi Ted..mind if I step into this debate?
I see you are doubting GOD's WORD. [/quote] Then you still see
wrongly!
I reject only the interpretation of man led astray...and your
hubris of implying that your interpretation is the only GOD's
word around dismays me...
#Post#: 4231--------------------------------------------------
Re: From a Calvinist perspective
By: guest58 Date: March 2, 2019, 11:49 am
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Bladerunner link=topic=347.msg4225#msg4225
date=1551495117]In Jer 1:5, we find God already knew him....as
He has said He knows you and me and everyone else!
“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you;[/b] (He made us,
YES)
Before you were born I sanctified you;
I ordained you a prophet to the nations.”"[/color][/quote]
I contend that in the light of other Biblical revelations that
your interpretation of this verse is wrong. IF you showed this
verse to anyone who had NO THEOLOGICAL AX TO GRIND, they would
all agree that the Creator knew the person as a person, before
HE had that person formed in an earthly womb.
This interpretation fits perfectly with the revelation of Matt
13:38-39 that the elect are sown (not created) in the world by
the Son of Man and the reprobate are sown, (not created) in the
world by the devil.
and yes, HE knew us all because ALL the sons of GOD were all
there in attendance at the creation of the physical universe and
sang HIS praises: Job 38:7!! ALL / EVERY ONE OF the Sons of GOD
must have included Adam, the son of GOD [Luke 3:38 the son of
Enosh, the son of Seth, the son of Adam, the son of God.] and
all the legitimate sons of GOD of Heb 12:8. Denial of this
constitutes an error...no matter how piously one accepts the
wrongfully decided bias in favour of our being created on earth.
#Post#: 4233--------------------------------------------------
Re: From a Calvinist perspective
By: guest8 Date: March 2, 2019, 6:10 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Ted T. link=topic=347.msg4230#msg4230
date=1551547414]
[quote author=Bladerunner link=topic=347.msg4225#msg4225
date=1551495117]
[shadow=blue,left]Hi Ted..mind if I step into this debate?
I see you are doubting GOD's WORD. [/quote] Then you still see
wrongly!
I reject only the interpretation of man led astray...and your
hubris of implying that your interpretation is the only GOD's
word around dismays me...
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]No, I simply follow the WORD of GOD.....I
showed you WORDS of GOD about whether He knew you or not. But it
seems you this post and the subsequent post, you ignored them
and attacked me. I am fine with that. To deny GOD's WORD and
what it says is not a good situation to be in.
Have a good day sir:
Blade[/shadow]
#Post#: 4412--------------------------------------------------
Re: From a Calvinist perspective
By: Billy Evmur Date: March 12, 2019, 2:43 am
---------------------------------------------------------
[font=georgia]I can never call myself a Calvinist, some of his
doctrine is truly awful ... never the less I am reformed, I
believe the Sovereign Grace theology, I do not believe in human
freewill.
Adam had freewill in the sense that he could obey or disobey but
he gave even this limited ability to choose away.
He exchanged it for bondage, apart from Christ we do not have
that ability to choose, we can't choose not to be sinners, we
can't choose not to die for our sins...in fact apart from Christ
we are dead even while we live.
There is no hope for man .... only if God will have mercy upon
us.
All the time we's preaching up freewill we are giving mankind a
false hope, a false perspective of what their true position is.
How often have you heard it said "if God didn't want me to sin
He shouldn't have given me freewill...." how often have you
heard it said "oh if I have freewill I will repent when I am old
or on my deathbed" ?
Think of the young man who enters the school yard and starts
shooting. You say it was his own freewill, what hope does that
young man have, for nobody gives up their precious freewill,
even though it doesn't exist.
What we should be saying is you are in the grip of a wicked
murderous spirit which will carry you down to hell...FLEE to the
one hope God has given us , even Jesus...cry to Him for
mercy.[/font]
#Post#: 4413--------------------------------------------------
Re: From a Calvinist perspective
By: Billy Evmur Date: March 12, 2019, 3:05 am
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=patrick jane link=topic=347.msg3707#msg3707
date=1549428749]
Great post Bladerunner, and I too agree with much of the
Calvinist doctrine except the free will part. I also find it
hard to accept that some people were born to go straight to hell
and God knows it ahead of time. Why bring them into the world? I
have see some good Calvinist VS Open Theist debates. Maybe we
could post a good one here and comment as we watch?
[/quote]
No-one is predestined to go to hell, sin was not predestined.
God never created man a sinner.
But God foreknew and does know and foreknow.
So foreknowing that man would sin God predestined man's
redemption.
You have to ask "if God foreknew that His beautiful creature
would sin and utterly wreck His creation, should He therefore
resign Himself to not creating at all?"
Where would you and I be?
People never really get to grips with predestination because
they shun it out of hand, predestiny is grained into every
aspect of life and nature. For example the prodigal son MUST
return to his father or die a starving and ignominious death
because man is created with the need to renew his strength by
food, this characteristic is part of predestiny.
#Post#: 4565--------------------------------------------------
Re: From a Calvinist perspective
By: guest8 Date: March 23, 2019, 2:13 am
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Billy Evmur link=topic=347.msg4413#msg4413
date=1552377934]
[quote author=patrick jane link=topic=347.msg3707#msg3707
date=1549428749]
Great post Bladerunner, and I too agree with much of the
Calvinist doctrine except the free will part. I also find it
hard to accept that some people were born to go straight to hell
and God knows it ahead of time. Why bring them into the world? I
have see some good Calvinist VS Open Theist debates. Maybe we
could post a good one here and comment as we watch?
[/quote]
No-one is predestined to go to hell, sin was not predestined.
God never created man a sinner.
But God foreknew and does know and foreknow.
So foreknowing that man would sin God predestined man's
redemption.
You have to ask "if God foreknew that His beautiful creature
would sin and utterly wreck His creation, should He therefore
resign Himself to not creating at all?"
Where would you and I be?
People never really get to grips with predestination because
they shun it out of hand, predestiny is grained into every
aspect of life and nature. For example the prodigal son MUST
return to his father or die a starving and ignominious death
because man is created with the need to renew his strength by
food, this characteristic is part of predestiny.
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]Yes, there is fact are people around the world
that will never rise up out of their sin as God will not have
called them thereby conditioning their heart to seek and accept
Jesus Christ. These whom He calls will He justify, sanctify and
glorify.
Why God has done it this way, I do not know ? He created us from
the dust of the earth, we are his and he has sovereignty over us
at all times.
Blade[/shadow]
#Post#: 5114--------------------------------------------------
Re: From a Calvinist perspective
By: patrick jane Date: April 21, 2019, 10:40 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I'm going to do some more studying with John MacArthur for sure.
#Post#: 5203--------------------------------------------------
Re: From a Calvinist perspective
By: patrick jane Date: April 26, 2019, 2:43 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
Why I'm not a Calvinist | Why I disagree with Reformed Theology
In this video I will discuss why I disagree with Reformed
Theology (briefly) and why I'm not a Calvinist. Please do not
comment or send me hate unless you watched the entire video ;)
As I explain how I feel in detail near the ending.
14 minutes
HTML https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efDlBnxZsHA
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#Post#: 5221--------------------------------------------------
Re: From a Calvinist perspective
By: Billy Evmur Date: April 27, 2019, 7:50 am
---------------------------------------------------------
The BIBLE balance is the judgement, we are predestined and
elected to be the church, the people of God, sons, predestiny
and election are not said to be unto salvation … that is what
people suppose, naturally we must be saved in order to be
conformed to Christ.
But that says NOTHING about others who are not so chosen … they
will be judged and God has promised to judge with equity.
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