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#Post#: 3800--------------------------------------------------
Re: As A Man Thinketh...
DIR By: guest43
Date: February 10, 2019, 2:53 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: patrick jane link ---
>
> I can see your line of thinking but consider this. God SPOKE
everything into existence so in the beginning was the Word with
a capital W = Jesus Christ is the Word. So right there you have
God and Christ together in the beginning.
--- End Quote ---
Ah, Thank You Lord, .. I love you Patrick Jane, you are actually
willing to talk more about this man made Doctrine.
OK, now re-read what you said brother, like; "In The Beginning".
Yes true, "in the beginning was the Word", but remember this
because this is very critical, it is that God has no beginning
because He Is Infinite! So this is strictly talking about Gods
son Word who not only was there "in the beginning", but is
called "the beginning and the End". So we can't really confuse
Gods son Word with Infinite/Eternal God even if we tried, ..
well not in truth, wouldn't you agree? One IS Infinite and
Eternal, and the other IS the beginning and the End.
Creation and the created have a beginning and an end, but
Infinite "I Am" does not.
So how would God define Himself if someone were to ask Him; who
He was? Let's go back in Exodus where a man actually does ask
Him?
Exodus 3:4 When the Lord saw that he had gone over to look, God
called to him from within the bush, “Moses! Moses!”
And Moses said, “Here I am.”
5 “Do not come any closer,” God said. “Take off your sandals,
for the place where you are standing is holy ground.” 6 Then he
said, “I am the God of your father, the God of Abraham, the God
of Isaac and the God of Jacob.” At this, Moses hid his face,
because he was afraid to look at God.
OK, so who was Moses "really" looking at, and talking to?
Well, this is what the Bible says:
Exodus 3:2 There the angel of the Lord appeared to him in flames
of fire from within a bush.
You notice that the Christian Scholars did not capitalize the
word "angel" here, yet it is God speaking. There is no way
around this, the Angel of the Lord Is God, do we agree? (Clue:
"Take off your sandals, for the place where you are standing is
holy ground.”)
Yet somehow the Trinity doctrine ignores the Angel of Fire, ..
why? Because like I said before that, then they would have to
deal with not just three, but millions of "God" selves,
including trees, because before the tree was created, it was
God. In other words we could say: "in the beginning was tree,
and the tree was with God, and the tree was God". We could
actually say this with EVERYTHING God created, because it is all
God. God is all in all, and all is God in the overall sense. But
God does not want us to confuse the created, with Himself, so we
shouldn't.
Exodus 3:13 Moses said to God, “Suppose I go to the Israelites
and say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you,’
and they ask me, ‘What is his name?’ Then what shall I tell
them?”
14 God said to Moses, “I am who I am. This is what you are to
say to the Israelites: ‘I am has sent me to you.’”
15 God also said to Moses, “Say to the Israelites, ‘The Lord,
the God of your fathers—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and
the God of Jacob—has sent me to you.’
“This is my name forever,
the name you shall call me
from generation to generation.
So what is Gods name? is it "The Lord, the God of your
fathers—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of
Jacob", or "I Am"?
It is: "I Am", .. who is the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac
and the God of Jacob. So God identified Himself by; "I Am" which
He says is His name.
How else could the Only Infinite and Eternal God identify
Himself other than "I Am"?
"I Am" is the Infinite and Eternal conscious Spirit/Mind. The
first Word He spoke he named it His son "Word".
I think of it like this: Imagine writing a book, and the book
takes on free will. Well that is who Gods son Word is, because
this book contains all of creation:
Hebrews 11:3 By faith we understand that the worlds were
prepared by the word of God, so that what is seen was NOT made
out of things which are visible. (I emphasized the word "not")
Everything God created is by, and for this book called "Word",
and the son/Word has free will, and through the son we come to
see God, like it says here, that through the created, starting
with His son Word, we can see/understand God:
Romans 1:20 For since the creation of the world His invisible
attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been
clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so
that they are without excuse.
Colossians 1:16 For by Him all things were created, both in the
heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or
dominions or rulers or authorities--all things have been created
through Him and for Him.
So now what?
2 Corinthians 4:18 So we fix our eyes not on what is seen, but
on what is unseen, since what is seen is temporary, but what is
unseen is eternal.
Who is both Infinite and Eternal? I don't mean like we shall
inherit eternal life, but who is He himself Infinite and
Eternal?
We know it's not the son Word, for when he became flesh as Jesus
he made it clear who he was: "I am the Beginning and the End,
the Alpha and omega", so there is only One who is both Infinite
and Eternal with no beginning nor end, and it is God.
In heaven we see Gods presence as Light, and on His right side
sits Jesus Christ, the Word of God. Where is the Holy Spirit
sitting, .. on Gods left? And think also, where is the Angel of
Fire-god, and all the other obvious God-selves? Even Hagar seen
God, and she said "I seen God and lived'.
--- Quote ---
> Patrick Jane said - The Holy Spirit is God's Spirit and God
CONSISTS of all three. We are IN Christ and Christ in us, the
hope of glory, which was a mystery among other mysteries, some
secret since the world began, others revealed to the prophets.
>
> The Word is God and the Word is Christ. As God said in the
beginning, "Let us, Let US make man in our image" - God's voice
and His Word created all things. Read some of Job concerning God
and creation and scriptures about God's voice and God speaking.
In real life the father gives way to the son who becomes equal
to or even greater than the father. Nothing is greater than the
Father, as we know yet Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost are equal
parts of God. To me, that's the only way the Bible makes sense.
--- End Quote ---
No my friend, God does not "consist of" the Holy Spirit, but God
IS "Holy and Spirit". But God is not His son Word.
And please don't say: "To me, that's the only way the Bible
makes sense", because what I see you doing is the only way you
trying to make this Trinity Doctrine makes sense. I mean we
just barely scratched the surface understanding God.
I mean come on, how would Gods spoken Word, His creation be
equal to, or even greater then God who spoke it, .. you know
what I mean?
The "let us" part is because God is about to create man in their
image, Adam in the image of God, and Eve in the image of His son
Word.
Just as God beget His son Word of Himself, God made Eve from
what He took out of Adam. I mean doesn't that make sense?
because that is what happened, I see a beautiful image of God
and His son Word (John 1:1-) here in Adam and Eves creation.
--- Quote ---
> Patrick said - Now, at the same time, going back to childhood
I have always thought in my mind somehow that God is greater
than Jesus and the HS. I can't force my mind to think that God
is not the greatest. Therefore, I do not condemn those who go
against the trinity doctrine because I don't think God will send
people to hell if the get the trinity wrong. They can't both be
right.
--- End Quote ---
You said it Brother: "They can't both be right"!
So either God is made up of three individual gods, one of which
is clearly His "begotten son Word", a created being, or
Infinite/Eternal conscious Spirit/Mind who defined Himself to
Moses as "I Am" Is God and there is "No Other gods Besides
Him"!? because the Bible is clear that we will see Jesus sitting
on the right hand side of God in Heaven. So if we went by the
gentile Roman created Trinity Doctrine, then most definitely God
would have at least one more god besides Him.
The Ten Commandments
20 And God spoke all these words:
2 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of
the land of slavery.
3 “You shall have no other gods before me.
4 “You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of
anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the
waters below.
5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the
Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the
sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those
who hate me, 6 but showing love to a thousand generations of
those who love me and keep my commandments.
Isaiah 45:5 (NIV)
5 I am the Lord, and there is no other;
apart from me there is no God.
Joshua 24:15 (NIV)
15 But if serving the Lord seems undesirable to you, then choose
for yourselves this day whom you will serve, whether the gods
your ancestors served beyond the Euphrates, or the gods of the
Amorites, in whose land you are living. But as for me and my
household, we will serve the Lord.”
God bless you my Brother.
#Post#: 3802--------------------------------------------------
Re: As A Man Thinketh...
DIR By: patrick jane
Date: February 10, 2019, 3:22 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I had to stop reading when you said that the angel of the Lord
is God. That right there takes a bigger leap of faith than the
trinity because the words are clear, It was an angel OF the Lord
- NOT The Lord
#Post#: 3811--------------------------------------------------
Re: As A Man Thinketh...
DIR By: guest43
Date: February 10, 2019, 7:01 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: patrick jane link ---
>
> I had to stop reading when you said that the angel of the Lord
is God. That right there takes a bigger leap of faith than the
trinity because the words are clear, It was an angel OF the Lord
- NOT The Lord
>
--- End Quote ---
I know, .. that's what I'm talking about, if Jesus is a god, the
Holy Spirit is another god, the Father is yet another, then why
not the Angel of the Lord?
When Moses went up the mountain, did he go see and talk to a
bush that was on fire, an Angel of the Lord, or did he come
before God Himself?
a) Moses spoke to God
b) Moses spoke to the Angel of the Lord
c) Moses spoke to a bush on fire that didn't burn up
All three are Biblically legitimate answers.
If you choose "a" above, then why do Trinitarians misunderstand
the verse 28 here in John?
John 20:26 A week later his disciples were in the house again,
and Thomas was with them.
Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them
and said, “Peace be with you!”
27 Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here; see my hands.
Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and
believe.”
28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”
29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have
believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have
believed.”
Love you all.
PS
Remember that;
I'm just a fool whose intentions are good
Oh Lord,
Please don't let me be misunderstood!
#Post#: 3815--------------------------------------------------
Re: As A Man Thinketh...
DIR By: guest8
Date: February 10, 2019, 8:58 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Arius link ---
>
> [quote author=patrick jane link=topic=317.msg3802#msg3802
date=1549833742]
> I had to stop reading when you said that the angel of the Lord
is God. That right there takes a bigger leap of faith than the
trinity because the words are clear, It was an angel OF the Lord
- NOT The Lord
>
--- End Quote ---
I know, .. that's what I'm talking about, if Jesus is a god, the
Holy Spirit is another god, the Father is yet another, then why
not the Angel of the Lord?
When Moses went up the mountain, did he go see and talk to a
bush that was on fire, an Angel of the Lord, or did he come
before God Himself?
a) Moses spoke to God
b) Moses spoke to the Angel of the Lord
c) Moses spoke to a bush on fire that didn't burn up
All three are Biblically legitimate answers.
If you choose "a" above, then why do Trinitarians misunderstand
the verse 28 here in John?
John 20:26 A week later his disciples were in the house again,
and Thomas was with them.
Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them
and said, “Peace be with you!”
27 Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here; see my hands.
Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and
believe.”
28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”
29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have
believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have
believed.”
Love you all.
PS
Remember that;
I'm just a fool whose intentions are good
Oh Lord,
Please don't let me be misunderstood!
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]
If you would read the Bible literally, you would find out Jesus
Christ has many names.
Blade[/shadow]
#Post#: 3819--------------------------------------------------
Re: As A Man Thinketh...
DIR By: guest43
Date: February 10, 2019, 10:30 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Bladerunner link ---
>
> [quote author=Arius link=topic=317.msg3811#msg3811
date=1549846900]
> [quote author=patrick jane link=topic=317.msg3802#msg3802
date=1549833742]
> I had to stop reading when you said that the angel of the Lord
is God. That right there takes a bigger leap of faith than the
trinity because the words are clear, It was an angel OF the Lord
- NOT The Lord
>
--- End Quote ---
I know, .. that's what I'm talking about, if Jesus is a god, the
Holy Spirit is another god, the Father is yet another, then why
not the Angel of the Lord?
When Moses went up the mountain, did he go see and talk to a
bush that was on fire, an Angel of the Lord, or did he come
before God Himself?
a) Moses spoke to God
b) Moses spoke to the Angel of the Lord
c) Moses spoke to a bush on fire that didn't burn up
All three are Biblically legitimate answers.
If you choose "a" above, then why do Trinitarians misunderstand
the verse 28 here in John?
John 20:26 A week later his disciples were in the house again,
and Thomas was with them.
Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them
and said, “Peace be with you!”
27 Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here; see my hands.
Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and
believe.”
28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”
29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have
believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have
believed.”
Love you all.
PS
Remember that;
I'm just a fool whose intentions are good
Oh Lord,
Please don't let me be misunderstood!
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]
If you would read the Bible literally, you would find out Jesus
Christ has many names.
Blade[/shadow]
[/quote]
I agree, something like 50 names, here is a few,
* Alpha and Omega – “I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and
the Last, the Beginning and the End.” Rev. 22:13
* Advocate – “My dear children, I write this to you so that you
will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have an advocate with
the Father--Jesus Christ, the Righteous One.” 1 John 2:1
* Author and Perfecter of Our Faith – “Fixing our eyes on Jesus,
the author and perfecter of faith, who for the joy set before
Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and has sat down at
the right hand of the throne of God.” Heb. 12:2
* Authority – “Jesus said, ‘All authority in heaven and on earth
has been given to me.” Matt. 28:18
* Bread of Life – “Then Jesus declared, ‘I am the bread of life.
Whoever comes to me will never go hungry, and whoever believes
in me will never be thirsty.’” John 6:35
* Beloved Son of God – “And behold, a voice from heaven said,
“This is my beloved Son, with whom I am well pleased.” Matt.
3:17
* Bridegroom – “And Jesus said to them, “Can the wedding guests
mourn as long as the bridegroom is with them? The days will come
when the bridegroom is taken away from them, and then they will
fast.” Matt. 9:15
* Chief Cornerstone – “The stone which the builders rejected has
become the chief corner stone.” Ps. 118:22
* Deliverer – “And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he
raised from the dead, Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to
come.” 1 Thess.1:10
* Immanuel – “…She will give birth to a son and will call him
Immanuel, which means 'God with us.’” Is. 7:14
* Indescribable Gift – “Thanks be to God for His indescribable
gift.” 2 Cor. 9:15
* Judge – “…he is the one whom God appointed as judge of the
living and the dead.” Acts 10:42
* King of Kings – “These will wage war against the Lamb, and the
Lamb will overcome them, because He is Lord of lords and King of
kings, and those who are with Him are the called and chosen and
faithful.” Rev. 17:14
* Lamb of God – “The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him
and said, "Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the
world!” John 1:29
* Light of the World – "I am the light of the world. Whoever
follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light
of life." John 8:12
* Lion of the Tribe of Judah – “Weep no more; behold, the Lion
of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has conquered, so that
he can open the scroll and its seven seals.” Rev. 5:5
* Lord of All – “For this reason also, God highly exalted Him,
and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, so that
at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in
heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue
will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the
Father.” Phil. 2:9-11
Here is what Jesus is not: God the Father, even though many
Bible versions put that in like in Revelations, and other NT
books, to keep the Trinity-gods alive.
* Christ is our Mediator – “For there is one God, and one
mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.” 1 Tim. 2:5
the above would make no sense through Trinity translation: For
there is one God, and mediator God between God and men, the
man-God Christ Jesus.
What I have noticed over the years is that even those who oppose
the Bible, even the ones who claim to be atheist have defended
the Trinity Doctrine!? Why is that?
God bless
Arius
#Post#: 3821--------------------------------------------------
Re: As A Man Thinketh...
DIR By: guest8
Date: February 10, 2019, 10:52 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Arius link ---
>
> [quote author=Bladerunner link=topic=317.msg3815#msg3815
date=1549853905]
> [quote author=Arius link=topic=317.msg3811#msg3811
date=1549846900]
> [quote author=patrick jane link=topic=317.msg3802#msg3802
date=1549833742]
> I had to stop reading when you said that the angel of the Lord
is God. That right there takes a bigger leap of faith than the
trinity because the words are clear, It was an angel OF the Lord
- NOT The Lord
>
--- End Quote ---
I know, .. that's what I'm talking about, if Jesus is a god, the
Holy Spirit is another god, the Father is yet another, then why
not the Angel of the Lord?
When Moses went up the mountain, did he go see and talk to a
bush that was on fire, an Angel of the Lord, or did he come
before God Himself?
a) Moses spoke to God
b) Moses spoke to the Angel of the Lord
c) Moses spoke to a bush on fire that didn't burn up
All three are Biblically legitimate answers.
If you choose "a" above, then why do Trinitarians misunderstand
the verse 28 here in John?
John 20:26 A week later his disciples were in the house again,
and Thomas was with them.
Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them
and said, “Peace be with you!”
27 Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here; see my hands.
Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and
believe.”
28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”
29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have
believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have
believed.”
Love you all.
PS
Remember that;
I'm just a fool whose intentions are good
Oh Lord,
Please don't let me be misunderstood!
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]
If you would read the Bible literally, you would find out Jesus
Christ has many names.
Blade[/shadow]
[/quote]
I agree, something like 50 names, here is a few,
* Alpha and Omega – “I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and
the Last, the Beginning and the End.” Rev. 22:13
* Advocate – “My dear children, I write this to you so that you
will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have an advocate with
the Father--Jesus Christ, the Righteous One.” 1 John 2:1
* Author and Perfecter of Our Faith – “Fixing our eyes on Jesus,
the author and perfecter of faith, who for the joy set before
Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and has sat down at
the right hand of the throne of God.” Heb. 12:2
* Authority – “Jesus said, ‘All authority in heaven and on earth
has been given to me.” Matt. 28:18
* Bread of Life – “Then Jesus declared, ‘I am the bread of life.
Whoever comes to me will never go hungry, and whoever believes
in me will never be thirsty.’” John 6:35
* Beloved Son of God – “And behold, a voice from heaven said,
“This is my beloved Son, with whom I am well pleased.” Matt.
3:17
* Bridegroom – “And Jesus said to them, “Can the wedding guests
mourn as long as the bridegroom is with them? The days will come
when the bridegroom is taken away from them, and then they will
fast.” Matt. 9:15
* Chief Cornerstone – “The stone which the builders rejected has
become the chief corner stone.” Ps. 118:22
* Deliverer – “And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he
raised from the dead, Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to
come.” 1 Thess.1:10
* Immanuel – “…She will give birth to a son and will call him
Immanuel, which means 'God with us.’” Is. 7:14
* Indescribable Gift – “Thanks be to God for His indescribable
gift.” 2 Cor. 9:15
* Judge – “…he is the one whom God appointed as judge of the
living and the dead.” Acts 10:42
* King of Kings – “These will wage war against the Lamb, and the
Lamb will overcome them, because He is Lord of lords and King of
kings, and those who are with Him are the called and chosen and
faithful.” Rev. 17:14
* Lamb of God – “The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him
and said, "Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the
world!” John 1:29
* Light of the World – "I am the light of the world. Whoever
follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light
of life." John 8:12
* Lion of the Tribe of Judah – “Weep no more; behold, the Lion
of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has conquered, so that
he can open the scroll and its seven seals.” Rev. 5:5
* Lord of All – “For this reason also, God highly exalted Him,
and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, so that
at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in
heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue
will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the
Father.” Phil. 2:9-11
Here is what Jesus is not: God the Father, even though many
Bible versions put that in like in Revelations, and other NT
books, to keep the Trinity-gods alive.
* Christ is our Mediator – “For there is one God, and one
mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.” 1 Tim. 2:5
the above would make no sense through Trinity translation: For
there is one God, and mediator God between God and men, the
man-God Christ Jesus.
What I have noticed over the years is that even those who oppose
the Bible, even the ones who claim to be atheist have defended
the Trinity Doctrine!? Why is that?
God bless
Arius
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]You left out something. No not a name but just
as important.
Isa 22:23..."And I will fasten him as a nail in a sure place;
and he shall be for a glorious throne to his father's house."
Blade[/shadow]
#Post#: 3862--------------------------------------------------
Re: As A Man Thinketh...
DIR By: guest43
Date: February 12, 2019, 5:57 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Bladerunner link ---
>
> [quote author=Arius link=topic=317.msg3819#msg3819
date=1549859451]
> [quote author=Bladerunner link=topic=317.msg3815#msg3815
date=1549853905]
> [quote author=Arius link=topic=317.msg3811#msg3811
date=1549846900]
> [quote author=patrick jane link=topic=317.msg3802#msg3802
date=1549833742]
> I had to stop reading when you said that the angel of the Lord
is God. That right there takes a bigger leap of faith than the
trinity because the words are clear, It was an angel OF the Lord
- NOT The Lord
>
--- End Quote ---
I know, .. that's what I'm talking about, if Jesus is a god, the
Holy Spirit is another god, the Father is yet another, then why
not the Angel of the Lord?
When Moses went up the mountain, did he go see and talk to a
bush that was on fire, an Angel of the Lord, or did he come
before God Himself?
a) Moses spoke to God
b) Moses spoke to the Angel of the Lord
c) Moses spoke to a bush on fire that didn't burn up
All three are Biblically legitimate answers.
If you choose "a" above, then why do Trinitarians misunderstand
the verse 28 here in John?
John 20:26 A week later his disciples were in the house again,
and Thomas was with them.
Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them
and said, “Peace be with you!”
27 Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here; see my hands.
Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and
believe.”
28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”
29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have
believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have
believed.”
Love you all.
PS
Remember that;
I'm just a fool whose intentions are good
Oh Lord,
Please don't let me be misunderstood!
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]
If you would read the Bible literally, you would find out Jesus
Christ has many names.
Blade[/shadow]
[/quote]
I agree, something like 50 names, here is a few,
* Alpha and Omega – “I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and
the Last, the Beginning and the End.” Rev. 22:13
* Advocate – “My dear children, I write this to you so that you
will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have an advocate with
the Father--Jesus Christ, the Righteous One.” 1 John 2:1
* Author and Perfecter of Our Faith – “Fixing our eyes on Jesus,
the author and perfecter of faith, who for the joy set before
Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and has sat down at
the right hand of the throne of God.” Heb. 12:2
* Authority – “Jesus said, ‘All authority in heaven and on earth
has been given to me.” Matt. 28:18
* Bread of Life – “Then Jesus declared, ‘I am the bread of life.
Whoever comes to me will never go hungry, and whoever believes
in me will never be thirsty.’” John 6:35
* Beloved Son of God – “And behold, a voice from heaven said,
“This is my beloved Son, with whom I am well pleased.” Matt.
3:17
* Bridegroom – “And Jesus said to them, “Can the wedding guests
mourn as long as the bridegroom is with them? The days will come
when the bridegroom is taken away from them, and then they will
fast.” Matt. 9:15
* Chief Cornerstone – “The stone which the builders rejected has
become the chief corner stone.” Ps. 118:22
* Deliverer – “And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he
raised from the dead, Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to
come.” 1 Thess.1:10
* Immanuel – “…She will give birth to a son and will call him
Immanuel, which means 'God with us.’” Is. 7:14
* Indescribable Gift – “Thanks be to God for His indescribable
gift.” 2 Cor. 9:15
* Judge – “…he is the one whom God appointed as judge of the
living and the dead.” Acts 10:42
* King of Kings – “These will wage war against the Lamb, and the
Lamb will overcome them, because He is Lord of lords and King of
kings, and those who are with Him are the called and chosen and
faithful.” Rev. 17:14
* Lamb of God – “The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him
and said, "Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the
world!” John 1:29
* Light of the World – "I am the light of the world. Whoever
follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light
of life." John 8:12
* Lion of the Tribe of Judah – “Weep no more; behold, the Lion
of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has conquered, so that
he can open the scroll and its seven seals.” Rev. 5:5
* Lord of All – “For this reason also, God highly exalted Him,
and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, so that
at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in
heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue
will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the
Father.” Phil. 2:9-11
Here is what Jesus is not: God the Father, even though many
Bible versions put that in like in Revelations, and other NT
books, to keep the Trinity-gods alive.
* Christ is our Mediator – “For there is one God, and one
mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.” 1 Tim. 2:5
the above would make no sense through Trinity translation: For
there is one God, and mediator God between God and men, the
man-God Christ Jesus.
What I have noticed over the years is that even those who oppose
the Bible, even the ones who claim to be atheist have defended
the Trinity Doctrine!? Why is that?
God bless
Arius
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]You left out something. No not a name but just
as important.
Isa 22:23..."And I will fasten him as a nail in a sure place;
and he shall be for a glorious throne to his father's house."
Blade[/shadow]
[/quote]
Yes, I guess I did leave "throne to his Fathers house" out,
thank you.
I guess that does make him God.
Can you answer my previous question?
--- Quote ---
> arius asked - When Moses went up the mountain, did he go see
and talk to a bush that was on fire, an Angel of the Lord, or
did he come before God Himself?
>
> a) Moses spoke to God
> b) Moses spoke to the Angel of the Lord
> c) Moses spoke to a bush on fire that didn't burn up
--- End Quote ---
#Post#: 3926--------------------------------------------------
Re: As A Man Thinketh...
DIR By: guest8
Date: February 15, 2019, 8:11 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Arius link ---
>
> [quote author=Bladerunner link=topic=317.msg3821#msg3821
date=1549860764]
> [quote author=Arius link=topic=317.msg3819#msg3819
date=1549859451]
> [quote author=Bladerunner link=topic=317.msg3815#msg3815
date=1549853905]
> [quote author=Arius link=topic=317.msg3811#msg3811
date=1549846900]
> [quote author=patrick jane link=topic=317.msg3802#msg3802
date=1549833742]
> I had to stop reading when you said that the angel of the Lord
is God. That right there takes a bigger leap of faith than the
trinity because the words are clear, It was an angel OF the Lord
- NOT The Lord
>
--- End Quote ---
I know, .. that's what I'm talking about, if Jesus is a god, the
Holy Spirit is another god, the Father is yet another, then why
not the Angel of the Lord?
When Moses went up the mountain, did he go see and talk to a
bush that was on fire, an Angel of the Lord, or did he come
before God Himself?
a) Moses spoke to God
b) Moses spoke to the Angel of the Lord
c) Moses spoke to a bush on fire that didn't burn up
All three are Biblically legitimate answers.
If you choose "a" above, then why do Trinitarians misunderstand
the verse 28 here in John?
John 20:26 A week later his disciples were in the house again,
and Thomas was with them.
Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them
and said, “Peace be with you!”
27 Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here; see my hands.
Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and
believe.”
28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”
29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have
believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have
believed.”
Love you all.
PS
Remember that;
I'm just a fool whose intentions are good
Oh Lord,
Please don't let me be misunderstood!
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]
If you would read the Bible literally, you would find out Jesus
Christ has many names.
Blade[/shadow]
[/quote]
I agree, something like 50 names, here is a few,
* Alpha and Omega – “I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and
the Last, the Beginning and the End.” Rev. 22:13
* Advocate – “My dear children, I write this to you so that you
will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have an advocate with
the Father--Jesus Christ, the Righteous One.” 1 John 2:1
* Author and Perfecter of Our Faith – “Fixing our eyes on Jesus,
the author and perfecter of faith, who for the joy set before
Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and has sat down at
the right hand of the throne of God.” Heb. 12:2
* Authority – “Jesus said, ‘All authority in heaven and on earth
has been given to me.” Matt. 28:18
* Bread of Life – “Then Jesus declared, ‘I am the bread of life.
Whoever comes to me will never go hungry, and whoever believes
in me will never be thirsty.’” John 6:35
* Beloved Son of God – “And behold, a voice from heaven said,
“This is my beloved Son, with whom I am well pleased.” Matt.
3:17
* Bridegroom – “And Jesus said to them, “Can the wedding guests
mourn as long as the bridegroom is with them? The days will come
when the bridegroom is taken away from them, and then they will
fast.” Matt. 9:15
* Chief Cornerstone – “The stone which the builders rejected has
become the chief corner stone.” Ps. 118:22
* Deliverer – “And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he
raised from the dead, Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to
come.” 1 Thess.1:10
* Immanuel – “…She will give birth to a son and will call him
Immanuel, which means 'God with us.’” Is. 7:14
* Indescribable Gift – “Thanks be to God for His indescribable
gift.” 2 Cor. 9:15
* Judge – “…he is the one whom God appointed as judge of the
living and the dead.” Acts 10:42
* King of Kings – “These will wage war against the Lamb, and the
Lamb will overcome them, because He is Lord of lords and King of
kings, and those who are with Him are the called and chosen and
faithful.” Rev. 17:14
* Lamb of God – “The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him
and said, "Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the
world!” John 1:29
* Light of the World – "I am the light of the world. Whoever
follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light
of life." John 8:12
* Lion of the Tribe of Judah – “Weep no more; behold, the Lion
of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has conquered, so that
he can open the scroll and its seven seals.” Rev. 5:5
* Lord of All – “For this reason also, God highly exalted Him,
and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, so that
at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in
heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue
will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the
Father.” Phil. 2:9-11
Here is what Jesus is not: God the Father, even though many
Bible versions put that in like in Revelations, and other NT
books, to keep the Trinity-gods alive.
* Christ is our Mediator – “For there is one God, and one
mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.” 1 Tim. 2:5
the above would make no sense through Trinity translation: For
there is one God, and mediator God between God and men, the
man-God Christ Jesus.
What I have noticed over the years is that even those who oppose
the Bible, even the ones who claim to be atheist have defended
the Trinity Doctrine!? Why is that?
God bless
Arius
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]You left out something. No not a name but just
as important.
Isa 22:23..."And I will fasten him as a nail in a sure place;
and he shall be for a glorious throne to his father's house."
Blade[/shadow]
[/quote]
Yes, I guess I did leave "throne to his Fathers house" out,
thank you.
I guess that does make him God.
Can you answer my previous question?
--- Quote ---
> arius asked - When Moses went up the mountain, did he go see
and talk to a bush that was on fire, an Angel of the Lord, or
did he come before God Himself?
>
> a) Moses spoke to God
> b) Moses spoke to the Angel of the Lord
> c) Moses spoke to a bush on fire that didn't burn up
--- End Quote ---
[/quote]
[shadow=blue,left]A trick question to be sure.
In Exodus 3:2.."And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a
flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and,
behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not
consumed."
In Exodus 3:3.."And Moses said, I will now turn aside, and see
this great sight, why the bush is not burnt."
In Exodus 3:4..."And when the LORD saw that he turned aside to
see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said,
Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I."
In Exodus 3:6.."Moreover he said, I am the God of thy father,
the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And
Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God."
So the answer to you question is all of the above>
Am going to wait and see where you are going to take this.
Blade[/shadow]
#Post#: 3935--------------------------------------------------
Re: As A Man Thinketh...
DIR By: guest43
Date: February 16, 2019, 3:12 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Bladerunner link ---
>
> [quote author=Arius link=topic=317.msg3862#msg3862
date=1550015863]
--- End Quote ---
Can you answer my previous question?
--- Quote ---
> arius asked - When Moses went up the mountain, did he go see
and talk to a bush that was on fire, an Angel of the Lord, or
did he come before God Himself?
>
> a) Moses spoke to God
> b) Moses spoke to the Angel of the Lord
> c) Moses spoke to a bush on fire that didn't burn up
--- End Quote ---
[/quote]
--- Quote ---
> [shadow=blue,left]A trick question to be sure.
>
> In Exodus 3:2.."And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in
a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and,
behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not
consumed."
>
> In Exodus 3:3.."And Moses said, I will now turn aside, and see
this great sight, why the bush is not burnt."
>
> In Exodus 3:4..."And when the LORD saw that he turned aside to
see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said,
Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I."
>
> In Exodus 3:6.."Moreover he said, I am the God of thy father,
the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And
Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God."
>
> So the answer to you question is all of the above>
--- End Quote ---
So why isn't the "Bush on Fire that didn't burn up, and the
Angel of the Lord are not included in the Trinity-gods as well
as all the other Angels/Thunder/Still Small Voice etc. that God
was speaking through?
Deuteronomy 4:14 And the Lord directed me at that time to teach
you the decrees and laws you are to follow in the land that you
are crossing the Jordan to possess.
Idolatry Forbidden
15 You saw no form of any kind the day the Lord spoke to you at
Horeb out of the fire. Therefore watch yourselves very
carefully, 16 so that you do not become corrupt and make for
yourselves an idol, an image of any shape, whether formed like a
man or a woman, 17 or like any animal on earth or any bird that
flies in the air, 18 or like any creature that moves along the
ground or any fish in the waters below. 19 And when you look up
to the sky and see the sun, the moon and the stars—all the
heavenly array—do not be enticed into bowing down to them and
worshiping things the Lord your God has apportioned to all the
nations under heaven.
--- Quote ---
> Am going to wait and see where you are going to take this.
>
> Blade[/shadow]
>
--- End Quote ---
Well, I was hoping that you see that in the Trinity-gods God is
a God, the son is a God, and the Holy Spirit is a God, and now
you say, the two others above are God also?
How about this; remember Jesus saying:
John 14:9 (NIV)
9 Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have
been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen
the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?
Now imagine Moses up on the Mountain of God as he is trembling
and kneeling before the Fiery Angel of the Lord in the Bush that
won't burn up asking the Angel: "Can you show me God, so I could
tell the Children of Israel back in Egypt that I have seen and
talked to their Heavenly Father God?"
What do you think the Angel of the Lord would tell Moses? Maybe
something like this?
"Don’t you know me, Moses, even after I have been talking to you
on this mountain for such a long time? Anyone who has seen me
has seen God. So how can you say, ‘Show me the Father so when I
go back to Egypt I could tell the Children of Israel I seen
Him’!?
Do you see it now my friend?
John 1:14 (NKJV)
14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld
His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full
of grace and truth.
… 18 No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who
is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.
So just as the Fiery Angel of the Lord declared/revealed God to
Moses, the son Word came down, became flesh and
declared/revealed God to us.
In both cases it was God speaking, but we don't make them God,
or parts that make up who God is, right?
I mean we hope when people see and talk to us, that they "see
God in us", .. right?
1 Corinthians 3:16 Do you not know that you are the temple of
God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you? 17 If anyone
defiles the temple of God, God will destroy him. For the temple
of God is holy, which temple you are.
Take care my friend!
in the spirit of
Arius
#Post#: 3939--------------------------------------------------
Re: As A Man Thinketh...
DIR By: guest8
Date: February 16, 2019, 10:17 am
---------------------------------------------------------
--- Quote from: Arius link ---
>
> [quote author=Bladerunner link=topic=317.msg3926#msg3926
date=1550283066]
> [quote author=Arius link=topic=317.msg3862#msg3862
date=1550015863]
--- End Quote ---
Can you answer my previous question?
--- Quote ---
> arius asked - When Moses went up the mountain, did he go see
and talk to a bush that was on fire, an Angel of the Lord, or
did he come before God Himself?
>
> a) Moses spoke to God
> b) Moses spoke to the Angel of the Lord
> c) Moses spoke to a bush on fire that didn't burn up
--- End Quote ---
[/quote]
--- Quote ---
> [shadow=blue,left]A trick question to be sure.
>
> In Exodus 3:2.."And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in
a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and,
behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not
consumed."
>
> In Exodus 3:3.."And Moses said, I will now turn aside, and see
this great sight, why the bush is not burnt."
>
> In Exodus 3:4..."And when the LORD saw that he turned aside to
see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said,
Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I."
>
> In Exodus 3:6.."Moreover he said, I am the God of thy father,
the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And
Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God."
>
> So the answer to you question is all of the above>
--- End Quote ---
So why isn't the "Bush on Fire that didn't burn up, and the
Angel of the Lord are not included in the Trinity-gods as well
as all the other Angels/Thunder/Still Small Voice etc. that God
was speaking through?
Deuteronomy 4:14 And the Lord directed me at that time to teach
you the decrees and laws you are to follow in the land that you
are crossing the Jordan to possess.
Idolatry Forbidden
15 You saw no form of any kind the day the Lord spoke to you at
Horeb out of the fire. Therefore watch yourselves very
carefully, 16 so that you do not become corrupt and make for
yourselves an idol, an image of any shape, whether formed like a
man or a woman, 17 or like any animal on earth or any bird that
flies in the air, 18 or like any creature that moves along the
ground or any fish in the waters below. 19 And when you look up
to the sky and see the sun, the moon and the stars—all the
heavenly array—do not be enticed into bowing down to them and
worshiping things the Lord your God has apportioned to all the
nations under heaven.
--- Quote ---
> Am going to wait and see where you are going to take this.
>
> Blade[/shadow]
>
--- End Quote ---
Well, I was hoping that you see that in the Trinity-gods God is
a God, the son is a God, and the Holy Spirit is a God, and now
you say, the two others above are God also?
How about this; remember Jesus saying:
John 14:9 (NIV)
9 Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have
been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen
the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?
Now imagine Moses up on the Mountain of God as he is trembling
and kneeling before the Fiery Angel of the Lord in the Bush that
won't burn up asking the Angel: "Can you show me God, so I could
tell the Children of Israel back in Egypt that I have seen and
talked to their Heavenly Father God?"
What do you think the Angel of the Lord would tell Moses? Maybe
something like this?
"Don’t you know me, Moses, even after I have been talking to you
on this mountain for such a long time? Anyone who has seen me
has seen God. So how can you say, ‘Show me the Father so when I
go back to Egypt I could tell the Children of Israel I seen
Him’!?
Do you see it now my friend?
John 1:14 (NKJV)
14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld
His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full
of grace and truth.
… 18 No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who
is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.
I mean we hope when people see and talk to us, that they "see
God in us", .. right?
1 Corinthians 3:16 Do you not know that you are the temple of
God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you? 17 If anyone
defiles the temple of God, God will destroy him. For the temple
of God is holy, which temple you are.
Take care my friend!
in the spirit of
Arius
[/quote]
Interesting Arius....you are now recognizing Jesus as GOD? BUT
then you try to turn it into ---> three are separate GODs!.
****
you said:" "Can you show me God, so I could tell the Children of
Israel back in Egypt that I have seen and talked to their
Heavenly Father God?""
Maybe you could contact those who write the NIV Version of the
Bible and sell them the above statement. It would fit right in
that book!
****
you said:"So just as the Fiery Angel of the Lord
declared/revealed God to Moses, the son Word came down, became
flesh and declared/revealed God to us.
In both cases it was God speaking, but we don't make them God,
or parts that make up who God is, right?"
According to you, I must call the "Angel of the Lord" another
GOD
John 14:7.."If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father
also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him."
If you will back up 2 verses of John 14, you will see what Jesus
is telling you. Then, if you back another verse, you can see
what Jesus is telling you, what you have to do to get Salvation?
John 14:6.."Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and
the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."
Here again, you are speaking in circles: "In both cases it was
God speaking" Yes, in both cases it was GOD speaking. I agree
to this!
"but we don't make them God, or parts that make up who God is,
right?""
Wrong!!! Jesus is GOD as is the Holy Spirit. In many places of
the NT, Jesus tells the apostles:
Mat 28:19.."Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing
them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy
Ghost:"
The bottom line is, you do not believe in GOD, The SON and the
HOLY Spirit. Yet, you claim salvation? Interesting
Blade
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