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#Post#: 2824--------------------------------------------------
A Journey Thru Genesis
By: Olde Tymer Date: December 17, 2018, 11:26 am
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.
[font=arial]Back around 2000 or 2001; I got the daring idea to
begin composing a daily, bite-size commentary on the book of
Genesis. It was a clumsy effort at first but I stuck with it and
as time went by, it got pretty good. On some forums where I've
survived opposition long enough to complete the whole fifty
chapters, Genesis has attracted quite a few views; several
thousand in fact.
As of today's date, I'm 74 years old; and an on-going student of
the Bible since 1968 via sermons, seminars, lectures, Sunday
school classes, radio Bible programs, and various authors of a
number of Bible-related books. Fifty years of Bible under my
belt hasn't made me an authority; but they've at least made me
competent enough to tackle Genesis.
Barring emergencies, accidents, vacations, unforeseen
circumstances, and/or insurmountable distractions, database
errors, computer crashes, black outs, brown outs, deaths in the
family, Wall Street Armageddon, thread hijackers, tangents,
excessive quarrelling and debating, the dog ate my homework,
visiting relatives, ISIS, car repairs, Black Friday, Cyber
Monday, student walk-outs, Carrington events, gasoline prices,
medical issues, and/or hard luck and the forces of nature; I'm
making an effort to post something every day including Sundays
and holidays.
Some really good stuff is in Genesis: the origin of the cosmos,
Adam and Eve, Cain and Abel, the Flood, tower of Babel, and the
origin of the Jews.
Big-name celebrities like Noah, Abraham, Sarah, Isaac and
Ishmael, Rebecca, Jacob and Esau, and Joseph are here.
Not here are Moses vs. Pharaoh and the parting of the Red Sea.
That story is in Exodus; Samson and Delilah are in Judges, David
and Goliath are in 1Samuel; and Ruth and Esther are in books of
the Bible named after them.
Buen Camino
_[/font]
#Post#: 2825--------------------------------------------------
Re: A Journey Thru Genesis
By: Olde Tymer Date: December 17, 2018, 11:35 am
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.
[font=arial]Genesis 1:1
The author of Genesis is currently unknown; but commonly
attributed to Moses. Seeing as he penned Exodus (Mark 12:26)
it's conceivable that Moses also penned Genesis; but in reality,
nobody really knows.
Scholars have estimated the date of its writing at around
1450-1410 BC; which is pretty recent in the grand scheme of
Earth's geological history-- a mere 3,400 years ago.
Genesis may in fact be the result of several contributors
beginning as far back as Adam himself; who would certainly know
more about the creation than anybody, and who entertained no
doubts whatsoever about the existence of an intelligent designer
since he knew the creator Himself like a next door neighbor.
As time went by, others like Seth and Noah would add their own
experiences to the record, and then Abraham his, Isaac his,
Jacob his, and finally Judah or one of his descendants
completing the record with Joseph's burial.
Genesis is quoted more than sixty times in the New Testament;
and Christ authenticated its Divine inspiration by referring to
it in his own teachings. (e.g. Matt 19:4-6, Matt 24:37-39, Mk
10:4-9, Luke 11:49-51, Luke 17:26 29 & 32, John 7:21-23, John
8:44 and John 8:56)
Genesis doesn't waste words with an apologetic argument to
convince scientific minds that a supreme being exists; rather,
it starts off by claiming that the existence of the cosmos is
due to intelligent design. I mean: if the complexity of the
cosmos-- its extent, its objects, and all of its forms of life,
matter, and energy --isn't enough to convince the skeptics; then
they're pretty much beyond reach.
The creation story wasn't written for the scientific community,
nor was it written for people who indulge in debating and
perpetual bull sessions that never get to the bottom of
anything; rather, the creation story was written for the
religious community.
"By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God's
command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was
visible." (Heb 11:3)
There's quite a bit of debate related to origins; viz: the
origin of species, the origin of the universe, and the origin of
life; but not much debate about the origin of matter; defined by
Webster's as 1) the substance of which a physical object is
composed and 2) material substance that occupies space, has
mass, and is composed predominantly of atoms consisting of
protons, neutrons, and electrons, that constitutes the
observable universe, and that is interconvertible with energy.
Without matter there could be no Big Bang, there could be no
universe, there could be no life, and there could be no
evolution. The origin of matter then is where we have to begin.
● Gen 1:1a . . In the beginning God
The Hebrew word for "God" is 'elohiym (el-o-heem') which isn't
the creator's personal moniker, rather, a nondescript label that
pertains to all sorts of deities both the true and the false
and/or the real and the imagined. The noun is grammatically
plural but doesn't necessarily indicate creation's God is a
plural being. Sheep, fish, and deer are plural too but don't
always indicate more than one of each. There are other gods in
the Bible, such as Baal and Dagon, to whom the word 'elohiym is
applied and those gods aren't composite entities; e.g. 1Kgs
18:25-29 and Jgs 16:23.
NOTE: the plurality of 'elohiym works to the advantage of some
religions; e.g. Jehovah's Witnesses. In their theology; no less
than two creators were involved in the origin of the cosmos; so
that in their thinking, Gen 1:1 reads like this:
"In the beginning, gods created the heavens and earth"
The word for "heavens" is from the Hebrew word shamayim
(shaw-mah'-yim) and means: to be lofty; i.e. the sky; perhaps
alluding to the visible arch in which the clouds move, as well
as to the higher void where the celestial bodies reside, i.e.
interstellar space. Even in English, the sky is commonly
referred to in the plural; i.e. heavens instead of heaven; which
is biblically correct since according to 2Cor 12:2 there's at
least three.
The Hebrew word for "earth" is 'erets (eh'-rets) which is yet
another of the Bible's many ambiguous words. It can indicate dry
land, a country, and/or even the whole planet.
_[/font]
#Post#: 2826--------------------------------------------------
Re: A Journey Thru Genesis
By: guest24 Date: December 17, 2018, 12:45 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
I find the book of Genesis especially the account of creation to
be a polemic rather than a scientific treatise...any thoughts or
comments about that?
#Post#: 2827--------------------------------------------------
Re: A Journey Thru Genesis
By: patrick jane Date: December 17, 2018, 1:04 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=Lori Bolinger link=topic=282.msg2826#msg2826
date=1545072324]
I find the book of Genesis especially the account of creation to
be a polemic rather than a scientific treatise...any thoughts or
comments about that?
[/quote]I believe Genesis is mostly literal and describes
creation in detail just exactly as God tells us. There are
waters above the heavens and the gates of heavened were opened
for the great flood as well as the fountains of the deep, the
waters below. The sun moon and stars were created later than day
one. Much later. The Bible can be very scientific if allowed to
be interpreted correctly.
#Post#: 2829--------------------------------------------------
Re: A Journey Thru Genesis
By: Olde Tymer Date: December 17, 2018, 3:48 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
.
[quote author=Lori Bolinger link=topic=282.msg2826#msg2826
date=1545072324] [font=arial]I find the book of Genesis
especially the account of creation to be a polemic rather than a
scientific treatise...any thoughts or comments about that?
[/font][/quote]
[font=arial]The creation story wasn't written for the scientific
community, nor was it written for people who indulge in debating
and perpetual bull sessions that never get to the bottom of
anything; rather, the creation story was written for the
religious community.
"By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God's
command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was
visible." (Heb 11:3)
_[/font]
#Post#: 2836--------------------------------------------------
Re: A Journey Thru Genesis
By: Olde Tymer Date: December 17, 2018, 7:39 pm
---------------------------------------------------------
.
[font=arial]● Gen 1:2a . . the Earth being unformed and
void
That statement reveals the earth's condition prior to the
creation of an energy that would make it possible for
particulate matter to coalesce into something coherent.
● Gen 1:2b . . and darkness was over the surface of the
deep
This deep is a curiosity because 2Pet 3:5 says the earth was
formed out of water and by water. So I think it's safe to
conclude that every atomic element that God needed to construct
the Earth was in suspension in this deep; viz: it was more than
just H[sub]2[/sub]O; it was a colossal chemical soup, and
apparently God created enough of it to put together everything
else in the cosmos too.
● Gen 1:2c . . and Spirit of God was moving over the
surface of the waters.
The Hebrew word here for "waters" is another plural noun like
'elohiym; which means it can be translated water instead of
waters. Plural nouns are pretty much at the discretion of
translators whether to make them plural or singular in a
particular context.
The Hebrew word for "moving" is located in only three places in
the entire Bible. One is here, and the others are at Deut 32:11
and Jer 23:9. The meaning is ambiguous. It can refer to
brooding; i.e. a mother hen using her wings to keep her chicks
together, and it can refer to incubation and/or quaking,
shaking, and fluttering. Take your pick. I'd guess that the
Spirit's movement was sort of like the hen keeping the colossal
chemical soup from running rampant and spreading itself all over
the place before God began putting it to use because up to this
point, gravity didn't exist yet.
● Gen 1:3 . . Then God said "Let there be light" and there
was light.
The creation of light was an intricate process. First God had to
create particulate matter, and along with those particles their
specific properties, including mass; if any. Then He had to
invent the laws of nature to govern how matter behaves in
combination with and/or in the presence of, other kinds of
matter in order to generate electromagnetic radiation.
Light's properties are curious. It propagates as waves in a
variety of lengths and frequencies, and also as quantum bits
called photons. And though light has no mass; it's influenced by
gravity. Light is also quite invisible to the naked eye. For
example: you can see the Sun when you look at it, and you can
see the Moon when sunlight reflects from its surface. But none
of the Sun's light is visible to you in the void between them
and that's because light isn't matter; it's energy; and there is
really a lot of it.
Space was at one time thought to contain absolutely nothing
until radio astronomers discovered something called cosmic
microwave background. In a nutshell: CMB fills the universe with
light that apparently radiates from no detectable source. The
popular notion is that CMB is energy left over from the Big
Bang.
The same laws that make it possible for matter to generate
electromagnetic radiation also make other conditions possible
too; e.g. fire, wind, water, ice, soil, rain, life, centrifugal
force, thermodynamics, fusion, dark energy, gravity, atoms,
organic molecules, magnetism, color, radiation, refraction,
reflection, high energy X-rays and gamma rays, temperature,
pressure, force, inertia, sound, friction, and electricity; et
al. So the creation of light was a pretty big deal; yet Genesis
scarcely gives it passing mention. That's no doubt because
Genesis is mostly about origins rather than mechanics.
2Cor 4:6 verifies that light wasn't introduced into the cosmos
from outside in order to dispel the darkness and brighten things
up a bit; but rather, it radiated out of the cosmos from
inside-- from itself --indicating that the cosmos was created to
be self-illuminating by means of the various interactions of the
matter that God made for it; including, but not limited to, the
Higgs boson.
● Gen 1:4a . . And God saw the light, that it was good
God didn't see the light until He said let there be light;
meaning of course that natural light didn't exist until God made
it.
God declared that light is good; but He didn't declare that
darkness is good. In point of fact, darkness typically
represents bad things in the Bible; while light typically
represents good things. It's been a rule of thumb from the very
beginning.
NOTE: It's curious to me that most Bible students have no
trouble readily conceding that everything else in the first
chapter of Genesis is natural, e.g. the cosmos, the earth, the
atmosphere, water, dry land, the Sun, the Moon, the stars, aqua
life, winged life, terra life, flora life, and human life.
But when it comes to light they choke; finding it impossible
within themselves to believe that Genesis just might be
consistent in its description of the creative process. I mean,
if all those other things are natural, why wouldn't the light be
natural too? In point of fact, without natural light, planet
Earth would become a cold dead world right quick.
_[/font]
#Post#: 2841--------------------------------------------------
Re: A Journey Thru Genesis
By: Olde Tymer Date: December 18, 2018, 7:55 am
---------------------------------------------------------
.
[font=arial]● Gen 1:4b-5a . . and God separated the light
from the darkness. God called the light Day, and the darkness He
called Night.
Defining the properties of day and night may seem like a
superfluous detail, but comes in very handy for organizing the
three days and nights related to Christ's crucifixion and
resurrection per Matt 12:40.
● Gen 1:5b . . And there was evening and there was
morning, a first Day.
When you think about it; a strict chronology of evening and
morning doesn't define day, it defines overnight; viz: darkness.
In order to obtain a full 24-hour day, you'd have to define
creation's first Day as a day and a night rather than an evening
and a morning.
Well; thus far Genesis defines Day as a time of light rather
than a 24-hour amalgam of light and dark; plus there was no Sun
to cause physical evenings and mornings till creation's fourth
Day so we have to come at this issue from another angle apart
from physical properties.
According to Gen 1:24-31, God created humans and all terra
critters on the sixth Day; which has to include dinosaurs
because on no other Day did God create beasts but the sixth.
However; the sciences of geology and paleontology, in
combination with radiometric dating, strongly suggest that
dinosaurs preceded humans by several million years. So then, in
my estimation, the Days of creation should be taken to represent
epochs rather than 24-hour events. That's not an unreasonable
estimation; for example:
"These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when
they were created, in the day that Jehovah God made earth and
heaven." (Gen 2:4)
The Hebrew word for "day" in that verse is yowm (yome) which is
the very same word for each of the six Days of God's creation
labors. Since yowm in Gen 2:4 refers to a period of time
obviously much longer than a 24-hour calendar day; it justifies
suggesting that each of the six Days of creation were longer
than 24 hours apiece too. In other words: yowm is ambiguous and
not all that easy to interpret sometimes.
Anyway; this "day" thing has been a stone in the shoe for just
about everybody who takes Genesis seriously. It's typically
assumed that the Days of creation consisted of twenty-four hours
apiece; so Bible students end up stumped when trying to figure
out how to cope with the 4.5 billion-year age of the earth, and
factor in the various eras, e.g. Triassic, Jurassic, Mesozoic,
Cenozoic, Cretaceous, etc, plus the ice ages and the mass
extinction events.
NOTE: Galileo believed that science and religion are allies
rather than enemies-- two different languages telling the same
story. He believed that science and religion compliment each
other-- science answers questions that religion doesn't bother
to answer, and religion answers questions that science cannot
answer.
For example: theoretical physicist Stephen Hawking understood
pretty well how the universe works; but could never
scientifically explain why it should exist at all. Well the only
possible answer to the "why" is found in intelligent design;
which is a religious explanation rather than scientific.
_[/font]
#Post#: 2842--------------------------------------------------
Re: A Journey Thru Genesis
By: guest24 Date: December 18, 2018, 9:11 am
---------------------------------------------------------
[quote author=patrick jane link=topic=282.msg2827#msg2827
date=1545073477]
[quote author=Lori Bolinger link=topic=282.msg2826#msg2826
date=1545072324]
I find the book of Genesis especially the account of creation to
be a polemic rather than a scientific treatise...any thoughts or
comments about that?
[/quote]I believe Genesis is mostly literal and describes
creation in detail just exactly as God tells us. There are
waters above the heavens and the gates of heavened were opened
for the great flood as well as the fountains of the deep, the
waters below. The sun moon and stars were created later than day
one. Much later. The Bible can be very scientific if allowed to
be interpreted correctly.
[/quote]I don't disagree with it as per what it says about
creation I just don't believe it is written as a scientific
treatise and thus should not be used as such. That doesn't mean
it is wrong scientifically.
#Post#: 2862--------------------------------------------------
Re: A Journey Thru Genesis
By: Olde Tymer Date: December 19, 2018, 9:57 am
---------------------------------------------------------
.
[font=arial]● Gen 1:6-8 . . And God said, Let there be a
firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the
waters from the waters. And God made the firmament, and divided
the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which
were above the firmament: and it was so. And God called the
firmament Heaven.
In this case the word for "heaven" is singular probably because
we're only looking at the Earth's atmosphere.
We can easily guess what is meant by water that's below the sky.
But is there really water that's above it? Yes, and it's a lot!
According to an article in the Sept 2013 issue of National
Geographic magazine, Earth's atmosphere holds roughly 3,095
cubic miles of water in the form of vapor. That may seem like a
preposterous number of cubic miles of water; but not really when
it's considered that Lake Superior's volume alone is estimated
at nearly 3,000.
Our home planet is really big; a whole lot bigger than people
sometimes realize. It's surface area, in square miles, is
196,940,000. To give an idea of just how many square miles that
is: if somebody were to wrap a belt around the equator made of
one-mile squares; it would only take 24,902 squares to complete
the distance; which is a mere .00012644 the surface area.
Some of the more familiar global warming gases are carbon
dioxide, fluorocarbons, methane, and ozone. But as popular as
those gases are with the media, they're bit players in
comparison to the role that ordinary water vapor plays in global
warming. By some estimates; atmospheric water vapor accounts for
more than 90% of global warming; which is not a bad thing
because without atmospheric water vapor, the earth would be so
cold that the only life that could exist here would be
extremophiles.
How much water is below the sky? Well; according to the same
National Geographic article; the amount contained in swamp
water, lakes and rivers, ground water, and oceans, seas, and
bays adds up to something like 326.6 million cubic miles; and
that's not counting the 5.85 million cubic miles tied up in
living organisms, soil moisture, ground ice and permafrost, ice
sheets, glaciers, and permanent snow.
To put that in perspective: a tower 326.6 million miles high
would exceed the Sun's distance better than 3½ times. It
would've exceeded the distance between Mars and Earth on July
27, 2018 by 5 times.
● Gen 1:8b . . And the evening and the morning were the
second day.
At this point, there was no Sun to cause physical evenings and
mornings; so we can safely assume that the terms are merely
place-cards indicating the completion of one of creation's
six-step processes and the beginning of another.
● Gen 1:9 . . And God said, Let the waters under the
heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land
appear: and it was so.
At this point, God initiated the on-going titanic forces that
keep the Earth's surface in a perpetual state of alteration.
"He set the earth on its foundations, so that it should never be
moved. You covered it with the deep as with a garment; the
waters stood above the mountains. At your rebuke they fled; at
the sound of your thunder they took to flight. The mountains
rose, the valleys sank down to the place that you appointed for
them. You set a boundary that they may not pass, so that they
might not again cover the earth." (Ps 104:5-9)
Psalm 104 is stunning; and clearly way ahead of its time.
Mountains rising, and valleys sinking speaks of magma pressure
and tectonic plate subduction.
It's doubtful the Psalmist knew about those particular fields of
science but he was clearly somehow aware that the Earth's crust
is malleable. And that's true. With just the right combination
of time, temperature, and pressure; solid rock can be made to
fracture, buckle, and give way; and also to bend, even forced to
hairpin back upon itself like taffy.
Now, it's right about here that young-earth theorists have a
problem because it's obvious from physical evidence that much of
the Earth's dry land was inundated for a very, very long time.
Take for example Mount Everest. Today its tippy top is something
like 29,029 feet above sea level. The discovery of fossilized
sea lilies near its summit proves that the Himalayan land mass
has not always been mountainous; but at one time was the floor
of an ancient sea bed. This is confirmed by the "yellow band"
below Everest's summit consisting of limestone: a type of rock
made from calcite sediments containing the skeletal remains of
countless trillions of organisms who lived, not on dry land, but
in an ocean.
● Gen 1:10 . . And God called the dry land earth; and the
gathering together of the waters He called seas: and God saw
that it was good.
"good" meaning not that the dry ground and seas are morally
acceptable, but rather, perfectly suitable for the purposes that
God had in mind for them.
NOTE: There are Hebrew words in the Bible for marshes, rivers,
and streams; but I've yet to encounter one for lakes and ponds.
In other words "seas" suffices not only for oceans; but also for
smaller accumulations. (A rather curious sea is located at
1Kings 7:23-26)
_[/font]
#Post#: 2874--------------------------------------------------
Re: A Journey Thru Genesis
By: Olde Tymer Date: December 20, 2018, 8:25 am
---------------------------------------------------------
.
[font=arial]● Gen 1:11a . .Then God said: Let the land
produce vegetation
This is the very first mention of life on Earth; and what's
interesting about it is that life on Earth wasn't created from
nothing, rather, by means of ingredients taken from the earth
itself; e.g. aqua life and winged life were made from water and
terra life was made from land.
● Gen 1:11b-12 . . seed-bearing plants, fruit trees of
every kind on earth that bear fruit with the seed in it. And it
was so. The earth brought forth vegetation: seed-bearing plants
of every kind, and trees of every kind bearing fruit with the
seed in it. And God saw that this was good.
According to Gen 2:4-5, the land's plant life was dormant in the
beginning; it didn't actually flourish until the atmosphere
began producing precipitation.
NOTE: It's believed by science that there was an era in Earth's
youth called the Carboniferous period when it was blanketed by
dense jungles and forests. As those plants and trees died, and
were buried beneath layers of sediment; their unique chemical
structure caused them to be "cooked" into solid coal; and there
is really a lot of it.
Why isn't the Earth currently blanketed by dense jungles and
forests? Well; the earth's conditions today cannot produce
enough humidity, nor enough rain, nor enough global warming to
sustain the kinds of heavy vegetation that once existed in the
Carboniferous era. In other words: the earth, over time, has
managed to give itself a remarkable make-over; and at least one
element of its make-over are the mountains.
The ranges now in existence; e.g. the Andes, the Himalayas, the
Rockies, the Urals, the Appalachians, the Cascades, the Brooks
Range, the Alps, etc; and the various minor inland and coastal
ranges didn't always exist. Those were shoved up over time by
the forces of tectonic subduction, volcanism, and magma
pressure. Even Yosemite's massive granite monoliths haven't
always been there. They were formed deep underground and then
somehow shoved up to where they are now.
Anyway, point being; those ranges have a very great deal to do
with the earth's current weather systems.
● Gen 1:13 . . And there was evening and there was
morning, a third day.
_[/font]
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