00:00:00 --- log: started retro/06.09.17 00:09:02 --- quit: airbrush ("Leaving") 01:12:27 --- join: swsch (n=stefan@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/swsch) joined #retro 01:12:27 --- mode: ChanServ set +o swsch 01:13:06 --- part: swsch left #retro 02:06:38 --- quit: virl (Remote closed the connection) 02:06:45 --- join: neceve (n=claudiu@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #retro 03:16:42 crc: I see you implemented FFI for linux already. how did you do it? :) 03:16:54 I thought you didn't implement ELF reader/writer. 03:29:11 FFI is handled by using libdl.so (dlopen/dlsym) 03:48:10 I've currently done a chunk of code with rxforth which is able to read the header of ELF file. 03:48:22 It's the small part, but something already. :) 03:49:34 cool 03:50:55 btw. your implementation of forth is starting to really rock over C. 03:51:43 When I've been working moment with C and moment with retroforth, retroforth is the more preferable platform. 04:33:18 --- quit: neceve ("Leaving") 04:56:49 --- join: neceve (n=claudiu@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #retro 05:32:13 --- quit: neceve (Remote closed the connection) 05:32:46 --- join: neceve (n=claudiu@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #retro 05:50:16 --- join: Raystm2- (n=NanRay@adsl-69-149-58-83.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) joined #retro 06:07:34 --- quit: Raystm2 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 06:16:01 --- join: virl (n=virl@chello062178085149.1.12.vie.surfer.at) joined #retro 06:39:14 crc: I think I'd need one tool you forgot from stream functions you provided... those which moves the file pointer. 08:07:28 crc: Could you explain what which is used for? 08:07:36 the retro word called 'which' 08:48:17 --- join: nighty_ (n=nighty@CPE00119576a9c5-CM0012c90d36fc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #retro 10:30:16 http://retroforth.net/paste/?id=180 11:26:12 --- nick: Raystm2- -> Raystm2 11:26:26 --- mode: ChanServ set +o Raystm2 11:55:07 Crc, is that new code a new retroforth as well? 11:55:17 --- join: snoopy_1711 (i=snoopy_1@dslb-084-058-128-228.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #retro 12:07:46 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 12:07:55 --- nick: snoopy_1711 -> Snoopy42 12:14:09 Quartus: no 12:14:28 Cheery: I'll add those functions sometime today 12:15:25 Quartus: this is a forth, based on my rx core, but with I/O and other functionality written in C 12:16:14 it bears a lot of similarity, but should be considered a different project at this point 12:40:03 ok. 12:45:16 this is somehow funny: 320 240 sdl-go ' sdl-update sdl-rept ;) 12:45:30 I didn't thought about that at the beginning. 12:45:35 It just turned out like that... 12:48:28 I have file.seek, file.rewind, and file.pos now 12:49:12 file.seek takes the fid, offset, and a mode of either: START CURRENT or END 12:49:23 file.rewind sets the stream to the beginning of the file 12:49:30 file.pos gives the current offset into the file 12:49:49 anything else before I package up RxForth 0M? 12:51:09 ooh, cool. :) 12:51:54 I don't know. 12:52:29 I did not notice anything which I or somebody else would possibly miss... 12:52:44 command line arguments are the last thing on my list :) 12:53:02 what did you think about the idea of using ELF files to provide binary distributions about libraries? 12:53:14 it looks promising 12:54:20 I'm just wondering, the ELF format looks quite complex. I wonder how does it fit... Possibly it fits properly. 12:55:13 I did a runtime elf linker with tcn years ago; it wasn't anywhere near as bad as I expected 12:55:48 yeh. but it is quite intresting because information is shattered all around. :/ 12:56:15 It looks almost like bad but it doesn't look so bad after all because there seems to be reasons why it is such weird. 12:56:37 it's not as bizarre as the PE format used by Windows :) 12:57:42 The weird thing is that it is such big format. Kind of, when you finish reading about one thing, you'll find stuff about other. 12:57:53 It's almost as weird as intel instruction format itself. :D 12:58:28 the intel encodings are tolerable (at least through 386/486) if you use octal... 12:58:39 true. 12:59:43 One thing I'm wondering very much is that C. I've still not very good with it... 12:59:49 *I'm 13:00:05 I relearned C while working on RxForth and Maunga 13:01:08 Because I've unlearnt how to filter nonsense. but I wouldn't want to learn back that skill because it troubles other things which I consider better. 13:01:19 yeah 13:01:53 I have to deal with C enough to make understanding it worthwhile 13:02:03 I'd actually love to remove names about programming as well. 13:02:18 ? 13:02:49 kind of, removing dictionaries and identification numbers from code, then doing things with the code bits itself. 13:03:08 ahh 13:03:22 would require that you turn code into models first, because models are easier to handle this way. :) 13:03:33 nicer to read, neater to put together, etc. 13:04:01 It'd also mean that one removes the concept of a function. 13:04:43 because functions are, after all, very similar to those names. 13:05:34 you know, how much neater is this: y [[ xx ]] t 13:05:34 ...than: : z xx ; y ' z t 13:07:00 in forth you see it quite clearly. :) but already with lisp, I think, the bottom form starts looking as good as the upper. 13:07:12 yeah 13:32:06 If xx is a useful factor, you may well want to reuse it. Naming it is without cost and can (should) be self-documenting; if you really call it z, of course, then there's room for improvement :) 13:38:00 Quartus__: the problem is: name never tells what code does completely. 13:38:43 while you seem to be correct in your logical thinking. 13:40:50 I do think, whether you give it a name: superman, bob, or >entry it still contains the cryptic factor. 13:41:11 eventually you forget how the names interact. 13:41:20 then you forget how you program structured. 13:42:20 thus, having names loses the universality thinking and following a program has. 13:46:22 what benefits names seemingly gives is the multiple dimensional structuring on one dimensional array. 13:46:30 but is that a benefit? 13:47:09 you tend to consider only the relationships you actually see from your program. 13:47:39 then you forget the rest, which are possibly capable to contain even beefier chances than what you see now. 13:48:03 I think It's time for me to go sleep :) Lets talk tomorrow about this thing more if you wish. 13:48:38 --- quit: Cheery ("Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/") 14:54:07 --- log: started retro/06.09.17 14:54:07 --- join: clog_ (n=nef@bespin.org) joined #retro 14:54:08 --- topic: 'RetroForth | Pastebin @ http://retroforth.net/paste | The editing key is 'despair'' 14:54:08 --- topic: set by crc on [Sat Aug 05 13:13:30 2006] 14:54:08 --- names: list (clog_ Snoopy42 nighty_ virl @Raystm2 neceve timlarson Quartus lukeparrish nighty Quartus__ @ChanServ @crc clog Shain) 14:59:40 --- quit: virl (Remote closed the connection) 15:09:09 --- quit: clog (Connection timed out) 15:09:09 --- nick: clog_ -> clog 16:33:54 --- join: jas2o (n=jas2o@144.138.54.231) joined #retro 17:02:43 --- join: snoopy_1711 (i=snoopy_1@dslb-084-058-158-158.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #retro 17:08:18 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 17:08:35 --- nick: snoopy_1711 -> Snoopy42 19:27:07 --- join: snoopy_1711 (i=snoopy_1@dslb-084-058-160-206.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #retro 19:37:26 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19:37:46 --- nick: snoopy_1711 -> Snoopy42 19:53:25 --- quit: Quartus (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 19:54:11 --- join: Quartus (n=trailer@CPE0001023f6e4f-CM013349902843.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #retro 19:59:08 --- quit: jas2o ("Chatzilla 0.9.74 [XULRunner 1.8.0.1/2006012608]") 20:44:35 --- quit: nighty_ ("Disappears in a puff of smoke") 21:25:14 --- join: snoopy_1711 (i=snoopy_1@dslb-084-058-147-025.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #retro 21:38:38 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 21:38:52 --- nick: snoopy_1711 -> Snoopy42 22:14:35 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 22:26:28 --- join: Snoopy42 (i=snoopy_1@dslb-084-058-174-248.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #retro 23:26:24 --- join: Cheery (n=Cheery@a81-197-19-23.elisa-laajakaista.fi) joined #retro 23:38:05 --- quit: neceve (Remote closed the connection) 23:59:59 --- log: ended retro/06.09.17