00:00:00 --- log: started retro/06.08.06 01:55:47 --- join: virl (n=virl@chello062178085149.1.12.vie.surfer.at) joined #retro 02:15:17 --- join: Cheery (n=Cheery@a81-197-20-242.elisa-laajakaista.fi) joined #retro 03:21:08 --- join: neceve (n=claudiu@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #retro 05:55:48 Praise be! I woke up. 06:53:35 woah, big surprise :) 07:39:47 :) I'm up against that missing g2 pawn when any of pieces rRnNbBqQkK are pawn-promoted into the board using just the destination square 07:40:27 It's particularly nasty and takes much concentration moving thru the code. 07:40:32 Time to simplify. 07:41:01 I have work arounds... 08:43:08 --- quit: nighty_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08:43:48 --- join: nighty_ (n=nighty@CPE00119576a9c5-CM0012c90d36fc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #retro 08:55:21 fixed ! 08:55:27 cleaning up 08:57:15 reads in save-game.txt with out error and in combination with 'cb' clear board you can pre-set a board. 09:02:44 * Raystm2 is considering calling a graphical version of this game "MOVE!" 09:39:28 http://retroforth.org/projects/RxChess/ far as I can tell, everything works. 10:08:10 good afternoon 10:08:20 * crc pulls in the latest RxChess.... 10:10:53 crc: Hi. 10:11:24 Do you know how could I possibly get multiple dynamically resized contiguous chunks of memory? 10:12:12 no 10:19:09 with a garbage collector of your own invention, maybe? 10:19:55 I don't know, it should be virtually contiguous, it is code to be executed. 10:22:36 crc: i think i got a pretty good handle on updating to and from darcs and editing the index.html. 10:23:13 I checked out a couple darcs tutorials. 10:23:50 I like darcs. Wish I used it for all kinds of documents. 10:38:58 I use darcs for most of my stuff 10:47:20 I'm documenting and thinking about the PGN translator. What are you doing? 10:51:50 considering how to proceed on the manual 10:56:30 * Raystm2 nods* 10:58:14 documentation is my least favorite part of programming :) 11:04:03 I'm finding it hard to keep up with changes. 11:04:16 I keep updating before fixing the docs completely. 11:04:36 they get out of sync with the code quickly. 11:04:59 Have to develope a good documenting habit. 11:29:05 * crc should look into setting up a rdml-based documentation for the projects.... 11:29:52 not quite live, as with the retro handbook, but still easy to keep up to date... 11:30:06 * crc will try to see if he can pull it off cleanly 11:46:37 I basically have it :) 11:54:45 done 11:55:33 Raystm2: after you edit the handbook.rdml (in the repository now), switch to the directory containing the index.html and run: 11:55:35 ./book 11:55:47 to generate the html, postscript, and text formats from it 12:29:11 * crc is adding uninstall and help to the getretro script 12:41:29 --- join: snoopy_1711 (i=snoopy_1@dslb-084-058-186-187.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #retro 12:44:39 done: http://retroforth.org/projects/getretro/ 12:45:33 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 12:45:50 --- nick: snoopy_1711 -> Snoopy42 13:54:47 --- quit: crc (Remote closed the connection) 13:55:35 --- join: crc (n=crc@pool-70-110-183-96.phil.east.verizon.net) joined #retro 13:55:57 --- mode: ChanServ set +o crc 14:21:57 * Raystm2 realizes now that i'm the only one that doesn't darcs pull. 14:52:23 --- quit: Cheery ("Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/") 14:53:45 --- quit: neceve ("Leaving") 14:56:23 http://retroforth.org/projects/RDML/ now has the documentation for RDML on it 15:31:01 it's interesting... I thought about implementing while loops in xell, but then I saw that's quiet ugly. such while loops. 15:32:51 crc, do you know what's with giref? 15:34:19 crc, did rabbinwhite gave you also the sources of glypher? 15:39:14 glyper has been discontinued, and I don't believe that he has the original source anymore 15:39:32 the forth part can all be recovered, since that's embedded in the .exe 15:39:44 the assembly changes (if any) will have been lost though 15:40:05 * crc notes that a most of glypher is still forth source 15:40:27 yeah, youre right. I forgot completly it's retro. 15:40:37 that's 15:41:02 he changed some of the ffi stuff, and optimized a few things for speed 15:42:05 other than that, he said it's still mostly retro inside 15:42:54 * crc is trying to rebuild his ipod library.... (I had the ipod near a magnet; some songs became slightly corrupt [hissing and pops]) 15:42:55 but it's amazing imho. 15:43:16 yeah 15:43:37 I was glad he let me repackage it for release for those who want it 15:50:11 I liked glypher. 15:50:32 It automatically tracked your updates, if you worked it properly. 15:50:56 it was fast to work in. 15:52:18 You know, that was quite convenient. The save code would take the first token in block 0 and name the file that. 15:52:31 native retro used to save changes in the background when you used the editor :) 15:52:31 Normally you would work in the template file. 15:52:35 yeah 15:52:41 haha... I wrote a little source dumper.. 15:53:21 cool. 15:55:17 so.. I have now 214 lines of glypher source in dump file.. lets try to get the rest. 15:55:35 :) 15:56:26 I'm now sitting here and scroll through the glypher binary viewed in a hexeditor, to find useful areas for a dump. 15:56:43 so that I can modify my little C program I wrote for it. 15:58:15 what's it do? 15:59:29 it increases a counter and prints the readed byte when it's a specific offset range into the file. 15:59:35 so really simple. 16:00:14 well, it looks this 214 lines are the only ones which are useable ASCII information in the glypher binary. the rest seems to be binary. 16:02:01 there's also glypher_O3.otl and template 16:02:11 how does one go about disassembling something like that. 16:02:11 though template may only be readable in glypher... 16:02:39 it's a pita that it only runs on windows. 16:03:12 template should be token so unpacking them and striping off the colorbits may make them readable. 16:03:38 ofcourse, glypher itself can be used to do that. 16:04:57 well. who has windows? and would do that? 16:05:27 rename any token file as template and start glypher in the same file. OR you can load a token file into glypher source using restore provided you name the file xfer 16:05:53 :) 16:05:58 I do. 16:06:55 heathen :) 16:07:21 :) 16:07:25 windows is evil 16:07:44 is it? 16:07:51 has that been proved? 16:07:56 well, if you have to code under it...... 16:08:03 Raystm2: I speak from my experience only 16:08:16 :) i'm sure you're correct. 16:09:01 :-) 16:09:06 years ago i learned some c and python. I realized that the os is so vast as to encompass a universe. too much to know. 16:09:50 * crc sticks with his linux/bsd installs until the day that he perfects the idea of an OS written in and based on his own tools 16:09:52 I got pretty good at windows 3.1 and dos 16:10:17 OSRx! 16:10:27 RxOS!? 16:10:59 Rune :) 16:11:03 Rune! 16:11:07 skip the "OS" suffix 16:11:11 sure 16:11:16 and the *x suffix too 16:11:19 sure. 16:11:55 actually, I could probably achieve it using the Linux kernel and my own set of tools above that (no GNU stuff, conventional userland, etc) 16:12:05 RetroForth Unified Natural Environment! 16:12:21 ya i'm sure you could. 16:12:56 * crc wonders if he should try to do that.... 16:13:05 RetroForth Unified Native Environment. 16:14:52 actually, the forth wouldn't be as visible as you might think 16:15:21 RetroForth Unvisible Native Environment. /me stops now. 16:16:05 Retro Universal (or Unified) New Environment :) 16:16:18 excellent. 16:19:41 Rune sounds cool, particularly if it's graphical 16:22:32 maybe Retroforth Unified Linux Environment 16:22:50 RULe Rules! 16:23:03 Rune is a very retro idea tho. 16:29:10 rule sounds good too... 16:29:20 Retro Unified Environment 16:29:27 Native, Linux, BSD 16:29:29 all work :) 16:29:46 the ipod is fixed, thankfully 16:31:05 RUBE hehehe 16:31:27 hey that's it. I get it now. 16:32:02 a consistent environment across different kernels :) 16:32:05 ofcourse RUWE is out of the RUE 16:32:36 or is it? 16:32:55 For now 16:34:47 the big question is: how would such an environment look and feel 16:35:51 As pretty as your wife after good sex, as easy to handle as a fine sports car, and as smooth as a babies bottom. 16:36:23 We're not asking much. 16:37:18 heh 16:37:26 lots of things to contemplate.... 16:37:36 * crc will report back when he has a better idea how to proceed 16:41:22 I think you provide a very simple interface and then have a bunch of developers that provide tons of examples of how to personalize it all. 16:41:54 Vectoring is a powerful idea. 16:42:11 so is local namespaces and vocabularies. 16:42:27 it's all MVC 16:48:52 infact, I might not worry so much about early implementations. Just get something up and announce. The world will tell you what it needs. 16:49:07 Just ask Linus. 16:50:55 Be cool to have one of those Sun's ( i think) with the forth bios built in. 16:52:18 or powerpc mac's 16:54:02 oh yeah? 16:54:03 cool 16:54:43 * Raystm2 watching "Learning to transform time series with a few examples" from some guy at intel. 16:54:59 this is for tracking stuff. 16:55:33 this guy said that there are tons of projects at Intel and not enough reserarchers. 16:56:02 I wonder if Intel would be interested in a wholy forth os? 16:57:06 the problem with a forth os is that all the functionality is in the lack of imagination of the user. 16:58:08 All of these CompSci programs I've been watching use the Bayes model for proving much of what they do. 16:58:17 * Raystm2 googles Bayes. 16:59:20 okay this is probability theory. I didn't know that. 17:02:28 oooh Computer programing one. from the university of washington. 17:02:48 Arrays and data structures program course 14 17:06:01 With boring Dr. Martin Dicky. 17:42:09 crc: cool, when did you ad the manual to RxChess? 17:42:26 and are there things I must know to use it, or is it just normal html? 17:42:56 i see it uses rdml.css 17:43:05 * Raystm2 looks for where to learn about the markup 17:43:27 http://retroforth.org/projects/RDML 17:43:59 run ./book in the folder containing index.html to update the text, html, and postscript versions of it 17:44:09 * crc added it this afternoon 17:44:25 easy enough to find :) 17:44:40 no kidding wow. 17:45:04 I still don't think i've found a Postscript viewer for windows. do you know of one. /me googles this 17:52:00 http://www.seas.ucla.edu/~ee5cta/ghostView/ 18:03:42 Reading ps. thank you :) 18:03:52 np 18:09:55 cool I think there may be a cool little bug on the /projects/RDML index page. 18:10:21 trying to click on the link postscript makes it first go to the nl. 18:10:45 ? 18:10:57 doesn't do that for you? 18:11:07 nope 18:12:00 oh cool, when i refresh I can put it back to the same line as the others, click on anything in that box and the link postscript goes to the next line. 18:12:36 what browser? 18:13:52 firefox. 18:14:08 there are 35000 windows XP device drivers. 18:14:38 linux device drivers have on average 7 times more bugs then the kernel. 18:14:58 I've never had any problem with drivers on linux 18:15:37 70% of linux kernel code is device drivers. 18:15:39 Raystm2: this is interesting.... 18:15:57 what's that? 18:16:09 the problem in firefox 18:16:27 85% of XP crashes are device drivers. 18:17:05 linux you don't get a crash cus the system doesn't put up a box everytime a device crashes. 18:19:32 "How to isolate and recover from driver crashes in the kernel" this is cool. 18:20:45 --- quit: timlarson (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 18:27:12 new linux driver design is called Nooks. 18:28:27 adds a virtual memory lightweight kernel protection domains and several other features includeing shadow drivers which are responsible for fixing the driver. it's all invisible to the user. 18:30:19 I think that display bug is fixed now 18:30:27 testing... 18:30:51 yes, indeed. 18:30:53 good 18:31:01 * crc updated all the project pages with the fix 18:31:08 cool. 18:31:36 are links handled gracefully in the rdml ? 18:31:45 rdml does not yet handle links or images 18:32:00 or end/footnotes 18:32:05 Okay, so text it is. 18:32:10 these are planned for addition this week though 18:32:23 oh excellent. 18:33:36 I was thinking of using links to show things like your original version in the pastebin and maybe even some screenshots and the colorforth and b18Chess versions that inspired all of this. 18:34:20 with out cluttering up all of the RxChess manual. 18:34:39 yeah 18:34:59 link descriptions will be limited to one word..... 18:35:25 I'm sure that's okay. 18:35:32 ok, good 18:35:38 * crc can add that quickly then 18:38:45 added 18:38:52 \link url description 18:40:36 cool. 18:41:07 any of that gets put in quotes? 18:41:11 nope 18:41:14 cool. 18:41:18 You can do something like 18:41:44 see the \link http://retroforth.net/paste/?id=1000 original for reference 18:41:55 and "original" will be a link 18:42:06 in the text/postscript it will show as: 18:42:19 see the original [http://retroforth.net/paste/?id=1000] for reference 18:42:33 excellent 18:42:35 I'll do images tomorrow 18:42:48 cool. images even. 18:45:02 how does this work, now. Just edit the dot.rdml file? 18:45:04 in nano? 18:45:44 dot.rdml? 18:45:50 edit the handbook.rdml in nano 18:46:03 and that's it? 18:46:04 and then run ./book in the projects/RxChess directory 18:46:10 oh. 18:46:18 ./book will create the html, text, and postscript formats 18:46:22 neat. 18:46:30 * crc will have that automated in a day or two 18:47:06 should these updates be handled by darcs as well.? 18:47:18 the updates to the handbook.rdml will 18:47:33 the other formats are not, as they can be rebuilt from that source file easily 18:51:03 I see. I'll look forward to that. 18:51:26 as for now, I think i'll spend the next hour or so writing the begining of the manual. 18:51:54 * Raystm2 is getting excited. One week and two days till departure time. 18:52:18 We are gonna have some time on the way up. 18:52:46 Turns out the party is a suprise party and we don't need to be in Ma till Saterday. 18:52:51 * crc may have the automated update done today :) 18:53:33 I'll know in 8 minutes when the first test run is performed 18:53:35 We plan to spend a day or so in DC, Philly and New York, being sure to go over the Hersey plant bridge . :) 18:53:45 way cool. 18:54:00 You could easily spend more than a day in DC 18:54:08 DC has lots of stuff to see :) 18:54:14 oh yes, i'm certain of that. 18:54:32 DC = 20 hours from here. 18:54:45 Nashville is half of that. 18:54:49 that's not too bad of a drive 18:55:02 DC to home-town = 7 or so hours. 18:56:00 Ya, we could leave tuesday night ( 8pm maybe) and be in Washington about the same time on Wednesday. 18:57:09 might even try to find a place to stay north of DC on wednesday night, sleep, go back to washington on thursday and spend friday in Philly and New York. 18:57:41 We wanna atleast see the bell and the Hall. 18:58:02 and The Statue of Liberty and Ground zero. 18:58:21 to see the bell and the hall will take a few hours at least 18:58:30 ya the lines. :( 18:58:35 security :) 18:58:57 * Raystm2 makes note to leave small arms at home. 18:58:58 the statue of liberty and ellis island will take a good part of the day to see 18:59:07 or at least in the car, locked away safely 18:59:20 that's true, but we ... ya that's what we thought :) 18:59:46 We really just wanna breeze thru New York as fast as it will let us. 19:01:09 ok, handbooks will be updated at midnight each day 19:02:03 cool, just edit handbook.rdml in nano and this will automatically update, but you can run ./book as well. ? 19:02:15 yes 19:02:19 midnight GMT or your local? 19:02:25 run ./book for more than once per day updates 19:02:48 EST 19:02:52 okay 19:02:52 GMT-5 19:02:56 ya 19:03:25 does that already handle the darcs update? 19:03:36 not yet 19:03:42 noted. 19:03:50 I'm still looking into how to have darcs do an update automatically 19:03:58 when I do, I'll let you know :) 19:04:07 some sort of cron? 19:04:14 yeah 19:04:31 but working out the command line arguments, and testing safely takes time 19:04:40 sure. 19:04:52 * crc tries to test locally, in a nice vmware'd instance before taking too much of this stuff live 19:09:28 anyway, I'm off to bed 19:09:30 goodnight 19:13:42 goodnight and thanks for another producive day. 20:11:35 --- join: timlarson (n=timlarso@user-12l320v.cable.mindspring.com) joined #retro 20:49:09 --- join: nighty- (n=nighty@CPE00119576a9c5-CM0012c90d36fc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #retro 21:07:41 --- quit: nighty_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 21:34:51 --- join: nighty_ (n=nighty@CPE00119576a9c5-CM0012c90d36fc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #retro 21:52:48 --- quit: nighty- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 21:53:05 --- quit: ChanServ (Shutting Down) 21:54:04 --- join: ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) joined #retro 21:54:04 --- mode: irc.freenode.net set +o ChanServ 22:33:02 --- join: nighty- (n=nighty@CPE00119576a9c5-CM0012c90d36fc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #retro 22:51:19 --- quit: nighty_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 23:20:43 --- join: Cheery (n=Cheery@a81-197-20-242.elisa-laajakaista.fi) joined #retro 23:44:21 --- quit: nighty- (Client Quit) 23:59:59 --- log: ended retro/06.08.06