00:00:00 --- log: started forth/20.09.21 00:06:49 --- join: crab1 joined #forth 00:07:04 what's happening in #forth land lately? 00:09:02 types! types are happening in #forth land ! ;-) 00:10:25 types and forth! you fithy blasphemes! 00:13:37 I'm curious about people who write in dynamically typed languages, in what instance what you need to write a program that isn't well-typed? 00:13:44 s/what/do 00:16:07 well-typed = type-safe? 00:17:22 A well-typed program is one that can be assigned a type and whose type remains so under evaluation. 00:20:08 I don't see why all programs in a dynamically typed language shouldn't be well typed 00:20:21 I can't think of an instance where it would be necessary at least 00:20:26 crab1, haha I know but we're not talking about targeting tiny embedded systems. 00:21:16 right, so my thinking is that if you're going to not write ill-typed programs in the first place, might as well have the compiler tell you at compile time than throwing an exception at runtime 00:21:28 rather than( 00:22:32 Actually FORTH is a strongly typed language. You get a cell type and do whatever you can with it. ;-) 00:27:40 do you often get type errors at runtime with dynamically typed languages? 00:28:23 crab1, we don't because we have quite strong unit test coverage. But most people do with a project of any complexity. Javascript apps are an extremely common example. 00:29:20 I feel like a lot of unit tests I write in say Python merely exist to serve as a typecheck of sorts. 00:29:38 javascript is bunk 00:30:05 siraben, I'd say at least half of our unit tests would be covered by a strong type system, yes. 00:30:11 Right. 00:30:55 --- quit: Zarutian_HTC1 (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 00:37:14 Given how so many forth'ers write the stack impact for every word - they're kinda already paying the coding cost for strong type declarations anyway but not getting the benefit. I've always thought this way even before I knew how type systems worked. I just remember wondering in 1986, "wouldn't it be nice if these stack effects were enforced?" :-) So here it comes. 00:38:03 1986 00:38:05 In fact I stopped using them because they weren't enforced and just refactored the hell out of my words. 00:38:16 that's a while ago 00:38:20 --- join: xek joined #forth 00:39:48 proteusguy: hah, I felt the same way, it forces you to refactor 00:41:14 crab1, indeed it was an elegant language for a more civilized age. ;-) haha 00:41:52 --- quit: proteus-guy (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 00:44:11 I was almost 16 years pre-birth in 1986 00:44:52 I guess that makes you the youngest in #forth then, heh. 00:45:32 --- join: proteus-guy joined #forth 00:46:10 siraben, when's your birthday? :-) 00:46:56 * proteusguy suspects it's a close call. 00:47:20 heh, that would be doxxing myself, it doesn't seem that close 00:47:49 crab1, you're born in 2001 I take it? 00:52:46 siraben, this Thursday is the meetup where we demo the working local node stack and also ActorForth parsing BCH transactions. Sign up and join! 00:53:21 proteusguy: I'll be in Phuket during that time, unfortunately! 00:53:32 oh dude - you're gonna miss it. 00:59:48 proteusguy: will it be recorded? 01:00:34 Not sure. We'll try. We got moved upstairs cause of construction on 2nd floor so not sure it's good for recording. 01:15:25 born in october of 2000 01:19:24 * proteusguy was born in Feb 1968. But I suspect most of the #forth'ers are even older than I. 01:19:48 crab1 is older than me then, heh 01:20:16 siraben, hahaha I guessed as much! 01:21:15 is siraben school age or working age 01:23:50 the world needs more young forth programmers 01:25:44 teach forth in elementary 01:26:19 crab1: given the ubiquity of graphing calculators in western education, that seems to bring young people in to embedded programming 01:26:44 unfortunately TI has been clamping down on the ability to run ASM programs as of late, so the newer OS updates prevent that 01:26:57 TI is bad 01:27:18 I mean specifically in regards to calculators 01:27:22 huge monopoly, ugh. 01:27:23 Right 01:27:43 Also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_Instruments_signing_key_controversy 01:28:46 I love plan9 01:30:01 plumbing is wonderful 01:46:55 --- quit: xek (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 01:55:18 --- join: mtsd joined #forth 02:09:38 do most of you use gnu/linux? 02:15:20 crab1: I do, NixOS here. 02:15:39 Also macOS user 02:16:30 poo 02:21:20 I used NixOS a couple years ago 02:21:46 but it was too much work and I hated the nix language 02:32:41 crab1: You didn't like the language? I think it's quite straightforward 02:37:42 I was impressioned oppositely 02:38:52 guix felt much better than nix in that respect, but it still failed to fix the 'too much work' complaint 02:47:12 Interesting. I tried guix first but failing to get wifi to work I had to look for an alternative. 02:47:29 Since Guix has a free software-only policy with their package repository. 02:48:22 It's quite easy to switch out to the nonfree kernel in order to get wifi working 02:50:51 but it is a bit demanding as a first hurdle if you're not yet familiar with guix 03:46:13 --- join: dave0 joined #forth 03:54:43 --- quit: mtsd (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 03:57:03 --- join: mtsd joined #forth 04:43:05 --- join: xek joined #forth 04:56:17 --- quit: xek (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 05:23:23 --- join: Zarutian_HTC joined #forth 05:49:02 --- join: xek joined #forth 05:59:54 --- quit: xek (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 06:23:24 --- quit: mtsd (Quit: Leaving) 06:51:32 --- join: xek joined #forth 07:02:04 --- quit: dave0 (Quit: dave's not here) 07:16:28 --- quit: crab1 (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 07:41:57 siraben: I seem to be coming to an agreement with Matthias to have him license his code in zeptoforth 07:42:11 I now just need it in writing 07:42:21 Ah, good news. 07:42:44 I have to go to work now though 07:42:58 see ya 08:01:53 --- quit: xek (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 08:13:53 --- quit: Zarutian_HTC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 08:41:57 --- join: DKordic joined #forth 08:51:05 --- join: Zarutian_HTC joined #forth 09:01:37 --- join: crab1 joined #forth 09:01:42 hello forth friends 09:47:08 --- quit: crab1 (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 09:52:36 --- join: crab1 joined #forth 10:08:19 --- join: WickedShell joined #forth 11:03:44 --- quit: crab1 (Read error: No route to host) 11:57:02 --- join: xek joined #forth 12:12:46 --- quit: gravicappa (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 12:13:31 --- join: gravicappa joined #forth 12:33:35 --- quit: Zarutian_HTC (Remote host closed the connection) 13:55:10 --- quit: xek (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 13:59:52 --- quit: gravicappa (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 14:06:13 --- join: Zarutian_HTC joined #forth 14:06:40 --- quit: Zarutian_HTC (Remote host closed the connection) 14:40:44 --- join: dave0 joined #forth 15:17:43 --- join: TCZ joined #forth 15:19:42 --- part: TCZ left #forth 15:29:32 --- join: Zarutian_HTC joined #forth 16:06:48 --- quit: Zarutian_HTC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 16:07:08 --- join: Zarutian_HTC joined #forth 18:21:39 --- quit: dave0 (Quit: dave's not here) 18:56:31 --- join: boru` joined #forth 18:56:33 --- quit: boru (Disconnected by services) 18:56:36 --- nick: boru` -> boru 19:21:28 --- quit: lonjil (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.) 19:24:47 --- join: lonjil joined #forth 19:29:04 hi 20:00:05 --- join: [1]MrMobius joined #forth 20:02:06 --- quit: MrMobius (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 20:02:07 --- nick: [1]MrMobius -> MrMobius 20:48:18 --- join: jsoft joined #forth 20:59:04 --- join: gravicappa joined #forth 22:44:38 --- join: xek joined #forth 23:38:29 --- quit: xek (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 23:43:45 --- quit: WickedShell (Remote host closed the connection) 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/20.09.21