00:00:00 --- log: started forth/20.01.28 00:02:39 --- join: dave0 joined #forth 00:10:36 --- join: mtsd joined #forth 00:21:18 --- quit: iyzsong (Quit: ZNC 1.7.1 - https://znc.in) 00:21:44 --- join: iyzsong joined #forth 00:31:08 --- quit: dave0 (Quit: dave's not here) 01:35:44 --- join: rdrop-exit joined #forth 01:35:44 --- join: dave0 joined #forth 01:46:03 --- join: dys joined #forth 01:47:31 --- quit: WickedShell (Remote host closed the connection) 01:54:46 c[] good evening Forth connoisseurs :) 01:58:23 Hello rdrop-exit! 01:59:24 hi mtsd! 01:59:51 Everything allright? 02:00:29 --- quit: dys (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 02:00:35 down with a flu, not doing anything that requires brain cells, mainly watching videos 02:00:38 hi rdrop-exit and mtsd! 02:00:46 hi tpbsd! 02:01:07 hey mtsd, how goes the Scandinavian eels ? 02:01:36 rdrop-exit, Zen Forth Master, get well soon! 02:01:41 Just fine tpbsd, perhaps suffering from the unusually warm winter. 02:01:57 But, I think they will do just fine :) 02:02:13 tpbsd, thank you Master Forth Technician (tm)! 02:02:21 mtsd, we have been having very warm weather also, it was 39.9C at this desk last tuesday 02:02:41 Must be the famed climate change... ;) 02:02:54 30,06 C / 86,22 F here right now at 9pm 02:03:02 After all, 16 year olds are telling us the truth... ;) 02:03:51 29C/85F 18:03 02:04:21 haven't been out of the house in 2 days 02:04:26 mtsd, yes, Im amazed that they know everything! I always thought it was only my oldest sister that knew everything! 02:04:45 rdrop-exit, bummer dude! 02:06:06 mtsd, I do believe in climate change. Based in Greenland ice cores I believe the earth has been thru 4 ice ages in the last 500,000 years, so the climate definitely changes ;-) 02:07:23 Volcano emissions are slowing down, they've reduced to Alert Level 3, meaning that they don't expected to explode into tiny pieces anymore 02:07:41 * don't expect it to 02:08:02 rdrop-exit, will it follow historical behaviour do you think ? 02:09:05 no idea 02:09:24 we kind of expect things like that to do so 02:09:55 we've got 23 active volcanoes in country, hopefully none of the others gets itchy 02:09:58 in the same way the earth seems to go thru iceages every 120,000 years 02:10:05 wow, thats a lot 02:10:18 are your islands all the result of volcanoism ? 02:10:34 maybe youll get some new islands ? 02:11:28 We've got enough 7,641 islands 02:12:40 We're on the "Ring of Fire" 02:13:36 not as many as Sweden - 221,800 02:13:45 not THATS a lot oif islands 02:14:04 now THAT'S a lot of islands 02:16:00 I guess it depends on what you count as an island 02:16:25 true 02:18:30 I always thought the Philippines was second after Indonesia which has over 18k islands. 02:18:53 hey rdrop-exit I was wondering, Im making a word that receives 1 or 0 as a results of a number of tests but I only want a single 1 or zero on the stack at the end 02:19:35 there a a number` of ways to do it (as usual) but I was wondering if you had any tips ? 02:20:33 I was just going to receive the test output, check the stack, if it's 1 already, drop the new number 02:20:41 Sorry, was away for a while. 02:20:58 We do have a lot of islands :) 02:21:14 mtsd, eating breakfast of bread and hard chese ? 02:21:30 Yes, had some this morning 02:21:40 what does the single 1 at the end represent, all passed, any passed? 02:22:03 Which Country Has the Most Islands? 1. Sweden - 221,800. 2. Finland - 188,000. 3. Norway - 55,000. 4. Canada - 52,455. 5. Indonesia - 17,508. 6. Australia - 8,222. 7. The Philippines - 7,107. 8. Japan - 6,853. 9. United Kingdom - 6,289. 10. Greece - ~6,000. 11. Estonia - 2,355. 02:22:32 any passed 02:23:12 OR the results as they come in 02:23:21 ahh! 02:23:30 thats why youre a Zen Master! 02:23:39 and why I'm a lowly Forth grub 02:24:56 rdrop-exit, and now I understand the reasoning behind your question 02:25:20 If it's any passed probably better to just add them together so you end up with a count of how many passed 02:26:56 e.g. 46 out of 67 tests passed 02:27:01 the actual number is not important 02:27:17 it's a freebie 02:27:38 I may be doing the whole thing the wrong way, of course there are so many ways 02:28:47 long coastline here, and quite a few lakes. Not as many as Finland though 02:29:14 bacically Im examining a 8 digits (32 bits) to see if any of the digits are hexadecimal 02:29:36 mtsd, youre in Norway ? 02:30:23 I've been to all the Nordic countries a few times, but that was almost 30 years ago. 02:30:28 mtsd so Ive split up each digit and tested it for greater than 9 02:31:09 you mean 64 bits? 02:31:27 rdrop-exit, was that before you started on your tethered Forth ? ;-) 02:31:43 rdrop-exit, no, each digit is 4 bits 02:32:08 Sweden, tpbsd 02:32:30 each nibble has 4 bits, but a hex digit is a byte 02:33:27 i.e. the character represents a 4 bit value as a byte-sized character 02:33:42 mtsd, but the data I pasted above claims that finland has less islands than sweden ? 02:33:57 mtsd, I had thought you were in Sweden 02:34:02 maybe they count rocks in puddles 02:34:09 --- join: f-a joined #forth 02:34:14 Could be, not sure 02:34:46 rdrop-exit, your flu must be bad, 4 bits = 0 - 15 decimal or 0 - F hex 02:35:38 187,888 lakes in Finland. 97,500 lakes here. 02:35:38 rdrop-exit, so 8 bits allows two digits 02:35:43 https://github.com/KnightOS/kernel/blob/e257f54e021ee743306a2a4a5a152860728fb3f8/src/00/restarts.asm#L129-L130 this is what the perfect forth looks like 02:35:48 According to wikipedia :) 02:36:19 either way mtsd thats a incredible number of islands 02:36:58 I wonder where our Australia - 8,222 islands are ? 02:37:22 I think we're talking past each other, you're conflating digits (which are ASCII characters) and nibbles which are 4-bit values 02:38:49 A hexadecimal digit is an ASCII character, '0'..'9','a'...'f' 02:39:03 some use 'A'..'F' 02:39:52 f-a, I have a working ti-34 I bought new a long time ago! 02:39:56 i.e. a byte used to represent a 4-bit value, a nibble 02:40:01 --- quit: karswell (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 02:40:10 tpbsd: shipment took so long? 02:40:18 rdrop-exit, oops! 02:42:15 f-a, hahah, no I bought it around 1987 I think 02:42:26 rdrop-exit, apologies 02:42:34 np :) 02:42:56 I've always prefered HP calculators 02:43:00 rdrop-exit, would 'numbers' have sufficed ? 02:43:19 I still have two of them 02:43:20 rdrop-exit, me too, but alas, TI was always cheaper 02:43:54 hp calculator keys were the keys of my dreams 02:44:34 The Voyager series had the best calculator keys ever 02:46:11 My favorite calculator is the HP-16C Computer Scientist 02:46:35 then use knightOS 02:46:56 I still have an HP-16C and a HP-48GX 02:47:25 f-a, hmm, have you been reading my rant about hackaday by any chance ? 02:48:01 tpbsd: no where was it published? if it was on something syndacated via rss, it will foru sure pop up in my rss 02:49:18 f-a I aske because in it i mention their last Forth article on January 25, 2019 titled “pocket-forth-invades-your-ti-calculator” https://hackaday.com/2019/01/25/pocket-forth-invades-your-ti-calculator/ 02:49:36 3haha 02:49:54 which is about a Forth for the TI-84 02:50:03 I also had a HP-18C clamshell Financial Consultant calculator but it got crunched 02:50:22 f-a, https://mecrisp-stellaris-folkdoc.sourceforge.io/rants.html#hackerspaces-or-salesplaces 02:50:46 rdrop-exit, under a car ? 02:51:36 between my ass and a chair :) :( 02:51:46 almost the same thing 02:52:06 lol, and you being 6'12 and 400 lbs of solid muscle ... 02:52:08 that's a pretty tame rant 02:52:35 f-a, yeah, Im only a beginner with minimal rant qualities 02:53:14 f-a, my highest aspiration is to reach 50% of the rant capability of ttmrichter 02:53:26 You should add a picture of you snarling 02:53:29 vagueposting, obscure references, shaky grammar are a must 02:54:18 f-a, I can manage the latter pretty well, tho many may assume it's just a lack of education, and they'd be right 02:54:34 rdrop-exit, I've never been one to snarl 02:54:52 rdrop-exit, Ive never lost my temper either 02:54:55 also due to machine limitations, rants should be served in 140chars size 02:55:02 hahahah 02:55:28 @$%#$@^!! hackerspace %^&*(!@$#$!!! 02:55:42 perhaps I should rename my rants to 'mild mentions' ? 02:55:57 mild protestations 02:56:13 'tame tantrums' ? 02:56:23 snarks 02:56:32 articulated complaints 02:56:32 boojums 02:57:02 "that was no snark" said the Boojum 02:57:55 problem is I'm Australian, and we never open our mouths long enuf to rant because ..... flies 02:58:18 unlike f-a's countrymen who specialise in the fine art of ranting :) 02:58:34 oops! 02:58:40 f-a isnt Italian! 02:58:47 I am! 02:58:51 f-a is Portugese ? 02:58:58 nope, Italian 02:58:59 oh, then I was right :) 02:59:10 bongiorno 02:59:12 do flies attack your open mouth? 02:59:26 f-a, sure, anywhere thats moist 02:59:33 buongiorno rdrop-exit (almost buon pomeriggio) 02:59:35 TMI 02:59:40 mouth, nose, eyes 02:59:47 hehe 02:59:53 where in Italy? 02:59:56 moths are most amazing to me 03:00:06 Udine, small town near Venice, now I live in Milan 03:00:40 moths seems to be attracted by light, which in turn seems to be not a good trait to have in industrial societies 03:00:45 yet they are thrive 03:00:50 My grand-daughter lives in Padua 03:01:19 the love of my life was made in Italy 03:01:19 excellent city with a lovely botanical garden 03:01:34 A Moto Guzzi Griso 03:01:35 I suspect it refers to a motorbike :P 03:01:37 haha yeah 03:01:41 My mother's family came from Liguria 03:01:55 another lovely place 03:02:56 They later settled in Nice, but still kept the ancestral house in Liguria 03:03:00 Moto Guzzi Griso, V twin, 110 HP, 215 kph 03:03:57 In a small village in the hills behind Alassio 03:05:31 * f-a checks the map 03:05:56 Alassio is in Savona, Liguria 03:06:38 (on the water) 03:07:11 I mean on the coastline 03:07:27 this is a picture of a later model than my Griso but almost identical : https://tinyurl.com/tu9jfrd 03:13:43 --- quit: proteus-guy (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 03:15:47 --- quit: ryke (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 03:16:37 tpbsd, I really like Moto Guzzi. Great bikes 03:17:17 he also... uhhh, human-bikes 03:17:23 mtsd, mine is different to most, it's quite fast, not the traditional 'cruiser' 03:17:41 fast & without a safety net? 03:17:45 much like forth? 03:17:47 Powerful, torquey, v-twins 03:17:49 heheh 03:18:28 well anything under 200 HP these days is considered slow, but this is my last motorbike for sure 03:19:01 it's fantastic to ride, best bike Ive ever owned and Ive had about 20 bikes during my life 03:19:13 it's is unique like Forth in many ways 03:19:27 both give me great pleasure :) 03:20:21 wow, my Forth bootable binary is now up to 70 downloads! 03:21:15 about 2 a day on average 03:22:06 ... and there was much rejoicing 03:23:07 that little test I spoke of earlier is for the latest release of that program 03:24:00 after obtaining enough user feedback I can now decide what type of chip it is diagnosing 03:24:11 cool 03:24:26 basically this program helps test and identify Chinese clones of this chip 03:25:37 that I think will be the topic of my next rant 03:27:01 excellent utility 03:27:17 tho people might get depressed once they know the truth 03:27:33 it's a bit of a conundrum 03:27:54 Coincidently, I am just now reading some sample test code from one of FTDI's application notes, and it is truly atrocious. 03:28:00 the clones offer certain advantages and disadvantages 03:28:47 and FTDI was one of the chips that suffered wide cloning 03:29:21 --- join: dddddd joined #forth 03:29:28 I heard, and people got pissed at FTDI for their drivers not working with clones 03:29:30 are they detectable by outside detection? 03:29:40 and after FTDI retaliated they were widely attacked, and sued 03:29:47 yeha rdrop-exit that seems a nightmare of customer-support 03:30:17 f-a, it can be difficult, usually the chip is decapped to make sure 03:30:25 the world has become very strange 03:31:00 i REALLY recommend this site https://zeptobars.com 03:31:25 it's russian I think, but they have the most awesome chip decapping pics and details I have ever seen 03:31:38 I spent hours looking at every picture last week 03:31:42 cool 03:32:06 I was *astounded* by the sheer numbers of clones now 03:32:28 Did you see that video of the guy revere engineering a 6502 using an electron microscope 03:32:41 no but Ive seen similar 03:32:59 and I knew a guy online who used do do chip security 03:33:09 This guy really went through a lot of trouble 03:33:36 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWqBmmPQP40&t=455s 03:33:41 oops 03:33:51 he would use a tunneling electron microscope to bore a hole thru the protection layers then grow a contact in the hole, then read the chip data 03:33:54 here we go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWqBmmPQP40 03:34:21 IM guessing the cloners use similar methods 03:45:23 --- quit: iyzsong (Quit: ZNC 1.7.1 - https://znc.in) 03:51:20 --- quit: gravicappa (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 03:54:14 --- quit: jsoft (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 03:55:39 --- quit: f-a (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 04:02:37 --- join: proteusguy joined #forth 04:02:37 --- mode: ChanServ set +v proteusguy 04:43:15 --- join: dys joined #forth 05:49:28 --- quit: dave0 (Quit: dave's not here) 05:54:19 --- quit: mtsd (Quit: Leaving) 06:20:07 --- quit: rdrop-exit (Quit: Lost terminal) 06:26:42 --- join: crab1 joined #forth 06:43:17 --- join: ryke joined #forth 07:06:49 --- quit: ryke (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 07:37:31 --- quit: tabemann (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 07:57:02 is there an analog to pick that replaces a number at a specific depth? 09:03:49 ans forth has roll 09:03:59 6.2.2150 ROLL CORE EXT 09:03:59 ( xu xu-1 ... x0 u -- xu-1 ... x0 xu ) 09:03:59 Remove u. Rotate u+1 items on the top of the stack. An ambiguous condition exists if there are 09:03:59 less than u+2 items on the stack before ROLL is executed. 09:05:47 I have an implementation of ROLL in my forth (purely optional, as I don't like PICK or ROLL): http://forth.works/examples/ANS-PICK-ROLL.retro.html 09:27:21 --- quit: dys (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 09:31:14 --- join: gravicappa joined #forth 10:05:39 I know those are generally frowned upon but I was wondering if you could recognize some stack gymnastics and convert them to pick and roll at compile time 10:06:46 but shifting everything with ROLL is probably slower than just writing it to the address you just PICKed from 10:12:05 Im filtering this Forth code with a Python script to get multilline comments, shorten all the names, and replace constants so I have the opportunity to add a few other improvements 10:40:25 not all forths will have addressable stacks (e.g., mine does not), so both PICK and ROLL may be very costly in terms of performance on such 11:06:26 --- join: WickedShell joined #forth 12:11:00 --- join: dys joined #forth 13:24:23 --- quit: gravicappa (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 13:28:32 --- quit: crab1 (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 14:18:34 --- join: dave0 joined #forth 15:11:51 MrMobius: " SP@" or even better " SP @" and therefore " SP !"? 15:14:16 --- join: jsoft joined #forth 17:44:00 --- join: iyzsong joined #forth 17:57:00 --- quit: Keshl (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 17:57:25 --- join: CORDIC joined #forth 17:57:27 --- quit: DKordic (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 17:57:33 --- join: Keshl joined #forth 18:06:23 --- join: rdrop-exit joined #forth 18:56:11 --- join: boru` joined #forth 18:56:14 --- quit: boru (Disconnected by services) 18:56:17 --- nick: boru` -> boru 18:59:02 --- quit: dave0 (Quit: dave's not here) 19:53:16 --- quit: dddddd (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 20:51:57 --- join: gravicappa joined #forth 23:33:37 --- join: X-Scale` joined #forth 23:36:41 --- quit: X-Scale (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 23:36:42 --- nick: X-Scale` -> X-Scale 23:44:51 --- join: X-Scale` joined #forth 23:46:26 --- quit: X-Scale (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 23:46:27 --- nick: X-Scale` -> X-Scale 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/20.01.28