00:00:00 --- log: started forth/19.12.12
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10:11:21 * DKordic hides in https://hack.chat/?Forth
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11:17:32 <FatalNIX> doing a review of starting forth on forth.com just to remind myself of something
11:17:45 <FatalNIX> I don't see how quit can be tib 80 accept #tib ! interpret
11:17:50 <FatalNIX> or contain that
11:18:20 <FatalNIX> the size of the tib and the count of accepted characters will be on the stack, ! will be useless... wouldn't it?
11:18:50 <FatalNIX> I'm trying to implement my own forth like for something, which is why I care.
11:21:04 <FatalNIX> quit should from what I gather be resetting the return stack pointer then resetting what it needs for an interpret
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12:39:33 <crc> FatalNIX: starting forth predates ANS; the implementation details are likely not going to match many current Forths
12:42:15 <FatalNIX> not too too worried about that
12:42:29 <FatalNIX> I mean I will adjust things to make them work for my environment anyhow
12:42:35 <FatalNIX> but it was just kind of weird to read it that way
12:43:09 <FatalNIX> By the way, ever thought about what it would be like to operate a telephone switch with a Forthlike?
12:43:36 <FatalNIX> http://paste.pc-logix.com/gabudonodo.txt
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15:19:42 <jsoft> And hello there 
15:21:33 <jackdaniel> general kenobi
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15:38:20 <tp> and hello from me
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16:48:41 <jsoft> So what news from the front, anyways ?
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17:18:27 <rdrop-exit> c[] (-_-)zzz
17:19:42 <rdrop-exit> good morning Forthwrights
17:32:09 <jsoft> Ahh hello there Mr rdrop-exit, what have you eaten today?
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17:52:51 <rdrop-exit> hi jsoft, nothing yet, just espresso
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19:30:09 <jsoft> rdrop-exit, terrible.
19:30:48 <rdrop-exit> c[]c[]
19:32:29 <jsoft> What even does c[]c[] do
19:33:00 <rdrop-exit> wakes me up
19:33:22 <rdrop-exit> I need to be fully awake by lunch time
19:34:32 <jsoft> but what is c[]c[]
19:35:02 <rdrop-exit> espresso coffee cups
19:35:09 <jsoft> oh
19:35:14 <jsoft> oh I see :)
19:35:19 <rdrop-exit> :)
19:35:28 <jsoft> Well for me right now its [] [] [] [] [] []
19:35:34 <jsoft> +/1 1 []
19:35:41 <jsoft> +/- I mean
19:35:58 <jsoft> Where [] == bourbon :)
19:36:10 <rdrop-exit> cool :)
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19:37:03 <jsoft> Mostly cool, approaching within I am guessing 8 degrees of room temperature
19:37:13 <rdrop-exit> eek
19:37:46 <tabemann> hey guys
19:37:48 <rdrop-exit> it's a pleasant 31C here today
19:37:52 <rdrop-exit> hi tabemann
19:38:03 <jsoft> oooh thats nasty
19:38:15 <jsoft> its a pleasant something something around 15 degrees atm
19:38:26 <jsoft> Ahh hello tabemann 
19:38:34 <jsoft> tabemann, how's ya fridge?
19:38:49 <tabemann> well zeptoforth does assemble now - but it is very incomplete
19:39:01 <rdrop-exit> kudos
19:39:11 <jsoft> tabemann, great success!
19:40:10 <tabemann> as for fridge, it was more freezer-like than fridge-like outside yesterday, but it was more fridge-like today
19:41:57 <f-a> keep your skin tight and young
19:43:39 <tabemann> this time of the year is not good for my skin
19:44:06 <tabemann> it inevitably gets all cracked up like clockwork at this time of the year
19:44:42 <f-a> skincare!
19:44:47 <jsoft> What is skincare
19:44:52 <f-a> =D
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19:45:03 <rdrop-exit> I'm digging through my algorithms shelf
19:45:24 <tabemann> I forgot to buy new skin products (what I have is all expired) when I was at the pharmacy earlier today
19:45:31 <jsoft> What skin products
19:45:33 <jsoft> What is all this
19:45:58 <tabemann> like stuff to keep my skin from cracking up so bad
19:46:20 <jsoft> What makes it not do that
19:46:26 <jsoft> And why is it doing that in the first place?
19:46:39 <tabemann> because my skin sucks
19:47:19 <jsoft> Clearly you are having to many vegetables, and far too little fatty meat
19:47:54 <tabemann> it's called moisture in the air or lack thereof
19:48:07 <tabemann> and I've always had this every winter
19:48:45 <jsoft> Nah nah nah its called not enough fatty meat :D
19:49:05 <tabemann> I doubt that helps
19:49:17 <jsoft> Meat is glorious, and solves a myriad of problems
19:50:01 <jsoft> It might sound outrageous, but a true story
19:58:31 <jsoft> tabemann, check out meatrx :)
19:58:35 <jsoft> meatrx.com even
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20:20:48 <f-a> it's snowing here!
20:21:11 <rdrop-exit> brrrr
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20:53:26 <tp> rdrop-exit, g'day Zen Forth Guru!
20:53:43 <tp> tabemann, hey awesome, zappaforth compiles ?
20:54:14 <tp> jsoft, still eating that NZ girls meat called sheep ?
20:54:59 <tp> f-a, how is the fishing at the Ice holes today ?
20:56:23 <jsoft> tp, I don't eat lamb very often at all, thank you very much
20:57:29 <f-a>  Lamb Association likes this
20:57:57 <tp> hahah
20:57:59 <jsoft> lol
20:58:10 <jsoft> Nah beef is where it is at
20:58:13 <jsoft> And fush
20:58:23 <jsoft> Also pigs, bacon is awesome
20:58:24 <tp> jsoft, then how come your mates call you "mutton head" ?
20:58:42 <jsoft> tp, thats a generic term for a strong person, from all the awesome beef I eat
20:58:48 <tp> LOL
20:59:00 <f-a> I started doing pullups again today
20:59:03 <f-a> I suck badly
20:59:11 <f-a> only cranked 3 good-form ones
20:59:14 <jsoft> f-a, Gotta start somewhere
20:59:19 * f-a nods
20:59:48 <tp> f-a, thats excellent, it will give you strength to manhandle those Scandinavian Eels out of the ice holes for breakfast!
20:59:55 <jsoft> f-a, we done a thing today where one of the stations was 4-6 pull ups, 14 or so mountain climbs, and... I think 14 leg raises
21:00:23 <jsoft> For I think it was 8 sets
21:00:35 <f-a> pretty awesome jsoft 
21:00:35 <tp> yowies
21:00:43 <jsoft> 4 stations total
21:00:53 <jsoft> on the minute every minute
21:01:14 <jsoft> so, I guess 32 minutes of pain in the ass exercises
21:02:13 <tp> I cycled 11 km
21:02:21 <jsoft> f-a, make sure you eat lots of meat after your exercises! :)
21:02:24 <tp> in my old unfit, sedentary way
21:02:36 <jsoft> f-a, your muscles will not grow if you dont give em the means to :)
21:02:42 <tp> exactly
21:02:43 <jsoft> 11 km is all good
21:02:54 <tp> yeah, a few small hills, I do it every day
21:02:55 <f-a> I actually eat no meat to be honest
21:03:03 <f-a> cycling is awesome tp 
21:03:11 <tp> at 0530
21:03:12 <jsoft> f-a, well you will not get much better very easily
21:03:35 <f-a> jsoft: I mean I still eat cheese milk etc
21:03:40 <jsoft> I am moving to a new flat which will allow me to bike about 10-15km each way to work 
21:03:41 <tp> f-a, verry hard to grow muscles with no meat, they only want protein
21:03:47 <f-a> tho I need to make a decision soon
21:03:47 <jsoft> f-a, smash some meat
21:03:56 <f-a> I am low on iron *and* a blood donor
21:04:05 <jsoft> f-a, meat is the business
21:04:08 <f-a> which puts me in a though spot =D
21:04:10 <jsoft> especially fatty beef
21:04:17 <tp> jsoft, I think 20km each way is a minimum requirement for exercise myself
21:04:56 <jsoft> tp, I dunno. I think cycling is pretty awesome, even 5 km with some hills and what not is awesome for 99% of people
21:04:56 <f-a> how long does it take?
21:05:02 <jsoft> f-a, take to do what?
21:05:14 <f-a> to bike 20km
21:05:19 <f-a> on a reasonably plain track
21:05:25 <tp> I used to cycle 17km each way in city traffic and I loved it, I used to overtake cars downhill on a 90km/hr hill 
21:05:31 <f-a> I know 5km is ~30min jogging
21:05:51 <jsoft> f-a, if you are a geezer :D
21:06:06 <jsoft> f-a, nah I suppose 30 minutes is reasonable
21:06:17 <tp> f-a, my best time for that 17km trip was 40 minutes I think
21:06:35 <tp> a lot depends on hills
21:06:42 <jsoft> The thing with cycling is how quick your muscles grow, being legs
21:06:49 <jsoft> Just like with squats
21:06:58 <jsoft> Such a large muscle group
21:07:40 <tp> yeah, look at the world champion types, they can maintain 750 watts for 7 minutes on a pushbike, their leg muscles are GIGANTIC
21:07:53 <jsoft>  Yerp
21:08:08 <tp> at the end of that 7 minutes they are utterly gutted tho
21:08:12 <jsoft> And squats are practical as a.. as a.. a hammer, or a spanner, or a screw driver
21:08:22 <tp> thats one horespower
21:08:29 <jsoft> Squatting to pick things up is such a boss move
21:08:52 <tp> I always squat to pick up my M60 ;-)
21:09:06 <jsoft> What are you doing picking up M60's tp?
21:09:41 <tp> kidding, Ive never even seen one, saw a Bren once tho
21:10:00 <jsoft> Yeah not enough ammo for them to be practical tho
21:10:10 <jsoft> Ya want a GPMG ( gimpy ) or some such
21:10:36 <tp> yeah, even if we could buy full autos, Id never get one, ammos too expensive as it is
21:11:16 <jsoft> I really need to get my gun license, and get a .22, and run a suppressor, and sub sonic ammo, so I can shoot tin cans or whatever 
21:11:19 <tp> I'm happy with semi auto or even lever action being a civie
21:11:23 <jsoft> I love shooting things from ages away 
21:11:36 <tp> sniper!
21:11:40 <jsoft> GPMG's are awesome for shooting things 
21:11:59 <tp> Im not interested in long distance, too many variables
21:12:03 <jsoft> If you grip them really hard, with anger, you can hold them on target and shoot it goodly
21:12:21 <jsoft> tp, nah but with cheap rounds its like a slug gun
21:12:26 <jsoft> tp, I love slug guns
21:12:28 <tp> ill remember not to make anyone with a gimpy angry then!
21:13:22 <tp> whats a 'slug gun' ?
21:13:27 <tp> a shotgun ?
21:14:10 <tp> jsoft, designed the new pcb with xtal yet ?
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21:15:42 <jsoft> tp, no my next project is writing firmware for 4 sensor boards
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21:15:53 <jsoft> tp, but it will come :)
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21:17:14 <tp> radar sensor boards ?
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21:17:23 <jsoft> No
21:17:26 <jsoft> Other things :)
21:17:33 <tp> ah, they have PIC's
21:17:41 <jsoft> They do
21:17:54 <jsoft> PIC16LF18877's even
21:18:07 <tp> I'm stuck atm on a flash testing Forth program
21:18:32 <jsoft> Sounds like a lack of meat problem
21:18:33 <tp> the flash fails at the same location on three chips
21:18:34 <jsoft> :D
21:18:44 <tp> nah, plenty of good meat here!
21:19:19 <tp> about 3kg of rump in the fridge
21:19:31 <jsoft> phhht
21:19:43 <rdrop-exit> hello tp :) c[]
21:19:50 <tp> I used to shoot,bone and eat roos, it's my fav neat
21:19:58 <jsoft> You and your coffee beverages 
21:20:01 <tp> hello rdrop-exit :)
21:20:38 <tp> rdrop-exit, I meant to update you on that weird dump format from the other day
21:20:45 <rdrop-exit> cool
21:21:29 <tp> rdrop-exit, turned out it was caused by a typo in a dependent word AND that it was causing a bug I hadnt been able to fix over about a week of trying
21:22:06 <rdrop-exit> wow
21:22:49 <tp> so that little 'pictured numerical output' typo was causing major problems for me elsewhere
21:24:20 <tp> the bug highlighted a design shortcoming in my system, so I'm changing it to prevent a reocurrence
21:25:43 <rdrop-exit> all's well that ends well
21:26:08 <tp> I learnt a lot from it as usual
21:27:17 <tp> confronting new problems is at least a sign of growth
21:27:35 <rdrop-exit> always, that's half the fun
21:28:13 <tp> yeah, be boring otherwise!
21:30:04 <tp> I'm looking for`ward to hearing from tabermann regarding his zeptoforth workings
21:30:07 <rdrop-exit> Forth is like assembler, everything is so interdepent that bugs usually surface quickly and loudly
21:30:36 <rdrop-exit> * interdependent
21:30:50 <tp> it sure surfaced quickly but I couldnt find it in this case
21:31:07 <tp> one typo, a space caused so much chaos
21:32:25 <rdrop-exit> interesting
21:33:18 <tp> the application involved dumping 90kB of iHex into the terminal and then processing on the PC, so each attempted fix was painfully slow, even at 460800 baud
21:35:26 <rdrop-exit> I prefer to avoid hex files altogether
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21:36:25 <tp> at least I'm a dab hand at iHex now, just like XML
21:36:34 <tp> they no longer bother me
21:40:13 <rdrop-exit> I loathe XML
21:42:21 <tp> everyone seems to, but I had to learn it to make all my CMSIS-SVD stuff and eventually I learned to appreciate it
21:42:35 <tp> I wouldnt be using Forth without XML
21:43:55 <rdrop-exit> cantankerous collection of clattering clunk
21:45:02 <tp> like Jaz ? "a discordant cacophony of irrelevant noises" ?
21:45:50 <rdrop-exit> Whenever I've had to deal with XML, the first thing I do is convert to something else, anything else
21:46:02 <jsoft> xml can suck a dick
21:46:20 <jsoft> absolute pain in the ass, it is
21:46:39 <jsoft> In my humble opinion
21:46:42 <jsoft> .conf
21:47:08 <rdrop-exit> cantankerous collection of clattering clunk was Dr Smith insulting the robot in the original Lost in Space
21:47:09 <tp> I'm cool with XML now, I like it, read it easier than Python
21:47:17 <tp> ahh!
21:47:29 <tp> it sounded like a "smithism"
21:47:44 <rdrop-exit> ;)
21:48:33 <rdrop-exit> So you're saying XML has done irreperable brain damage
21:48:52 <rdrop-exit> I still haven't read a line of Python
21:49:22 <tp> probably, but people with brain damage dont know they have it ;-)
21:49:34 <tp> you havent missed much
21:50:00 <rdrop-exit> I'll watch a youtube video one of these days to see what the fuss is bout
21:50:04 <rdrop-exit> * about
21:50:30 <tp> it's just 'fashion' there is *nothing* special about Python
21:50:51 <tp> Python is just this decades fashion statement
21:51:03 <rdrop-exit> I usually tune out as soon as a language is described as either Object-Oriented or Functional
21:51:06 <tp> next decade it will be Go or Rust
21:51:15 <tp> or some new thing
21:51:30 <tp> anything but the truested, proven old thing
21:52:23 <rdrop-exit> yup, we're showing our age
21:53:29 <tp> I guess
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