00:00:00 --- log: started forth/19.12.06 00:00:22 jsoft, you mean the hermetic sealing ? 00:00:38 ahh the wire bonding 00:01:07 yeah same kind of thing tho the neopixels probably have thicker wire due to the current drawn 00:01:37 they all get bonded with the 'wire bonder' knitting machine, clackety clack! 00:02:00 --- quit: ryke (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 00:13:33 ok. 00:13:34 so 00:13:39 i've got me wee f0 up 00:13:40 now then 00:13:52 leds . 17888 ok. 00:14:40 thats the memory address of the leds array base 00:14:55 0 cells leds + . 17888 ok. 00:15:04 best examined this way "leds hex." 00:15:07 and there ya go. 00:17:11 no 00:17:20 there ya dont go 00:17:39 how's that then 00:18:05 its the same address 00:18:20 for a start you want the value STORED at the address 00:18:32 not the address itself 00:18:43 i'm not trying to read it 00:19:02 I was saying, that writing to leds directly, is the same as writing to leds with in 'index' of 0 00:19:13 unless I am missing something captain obvious 00:19:41 ie, it writes a cell to the base address, which is the first element in the 'array' 00:19:49 X cells * array + @ hex. 00:20:13 yes, and 0 * anything is zero 00:20:35 your first clue was the Unhandled interrupt 00:21:02 thats Mecrisp-Stellaris telling you that youve screwed up :) 00:21:29 it's telling you that youre 'far, far away from OK" 00:21:30 so your saying your example there, should work, say if I replace X with 0, 1, 2 or 3, or whatever 00:21:46 yep, if youve saved per cell 00:21:51 so 1234 1 cells * array + ! 00:21:58 OR 00:22:01 note: cell = 4, thats all it means 00:22:07 so 1234 0 cells * array + ! which is just array 00:22:20 so 1234 0 cells * array + ! is the same as 1234 array ! 00:22:37 Or do I have proper up my backside 00:23:30 i dunno how to create it except this way "Create Array of Cells 00:23:30 create array $3f4f1234 , $06075678 , $5b558765 , $66664321 , 00:23:30 " 00:24:12 mm ok. 00:24:30 to access that array 00:24:35 And you have written to such an array before? 00:24:53 : =cells 4 * array + dup hex. @ hex. ; 00:24:59 sure 00:25:10 ok well it must be doing something different than the alloc stuff 00:25:14 I did a write up on it recently after we spoke about arrays 00:25:15 I will try it 00:25:42 so "0 =cells" returns $3f4f1234 00:26:09 actually that word returens both the memory address and the data 00:26:26 0 =cells 200003A4 3F4F1234 00:26:47 where 200003A4 is $200003A4 and is the address 00:27:44 sadly I cant show you my nice and neat array page because "Sourceforge Project Website Temporarily Offline" 00:27:59 --- quit: WickedShell (Remote host closed the connection) 00:28:50 the simple version that doesnt print the memory address is ": =cells 4 * array + @ hex. ; 00:29:14 ok 00:29:18 so how do I write to it 00:29:36 that I dont know, I'm a beginner myself 00:29:43 nya haaa 00:29:50 see, it does the same thing as my one 00:29:56 shame the SF website is offline 00:29:58 sorry, not my one, the alloc one 00:30:03 thats the ticket 00:30:19 test my version until youre sure it works 00:30:27 then switch in yours 00:30:40 it will be really simple Im sure 00:30:56 Forth has removed all the wichery from programming for me 00:31:06 leds hex . 45E0 ok. 00:31:07 array hex . 4720 ok. 00:31:07 potato hex . 20001E48 ok. 00:31:21 potato is made using the X buffer: potato thing 00:31:27 and I _can_ write to taht 00:31:32 and looks like a memory address to me 00:31:40 yes. 00:31:45 2000xxxx is in the RAM area 00:31:49 Yerp 00:32:12 And so that brings it back to the conclusion from 2 hours ago that its 'allocating' or wahtever you want to call it, an array in flash 00:32:18 i havent yet looked at buffers 00:32:45 And thats the reason its not working when under 'compiletoflash' and the unhandled interrupt 03 happens 00:32:45 "creating" 00:32:51 mm 00:32:57 You know what I mean though aye 00:33:09 no, I'm not sure you do either 00:33:15 :) 00:33:24 potato is foobar 00:33:58 and neither leds or array are a 'cell' were the meant to be ? 00:34:00 my understanding of it is that it is that it stores the name of leds, array, or whatever, in the dictionary, and then the next free address is the amount of bytes 'allocated' 00:34:15 and so the next thing stored in the directionary will be array address + array size 00:34:16 no 00:34:26 there is no auto indexing 00:34:53 the next word in the dictionary I mean 00:35:16 --- join: dys joined #forth 00:35:37 it allocates a name to a memory address, and marks the word length as the length of the reserved number of bytes etc 00:35:48 isnt that what I just said ? 00:35:55 in other words? 00:36:11 I'm not sure, Im confused 00:36:17 Hmm. 00:36:47 my understanding of it is that it is that it stores the name of leds, array, or whatever, in the dictionary, and then the next free address is the amount of bytes 'allocated' 00:37:09 perhaps the next free address is the amount of bytes 'allocated + 1 ? 00:37:25 or 4 or whatever alignment is used ? 00:37:37 no, because the size will have that + 1 in it.. zero based... 00:37:47 I think we agree in principle 00:38:01 so say the address is 0, and then I allocate 1 byte. the next byte's address will be 1 00:38:05 oh, ok, good point, you did maths 101, I was asleep that day 00:38:33 But yeah, anyway this whole thing was something I ran into last night 00:38:39 And fixed it with buffer: :) 00:39:40 i havent got around to buffers yet 00:40:02 I do use arrays tho 00:40:27 remember that pot replacement device I mentioned ? 00:40:32 yeah I was rocking mighty fine with 'arrays' in ram, but it just did not work in compiletoflash :) 00:40:40 tp, the pot replacement device? 00:40:43 it uses a lookup table which is a array 00:40:52 sorry, refresh my memory ? 00:41:03 hmm, I may have been speaking to someone else 00:41:36 i have a Forth device that replaces a unique and expensive pot with a industrial servopot 00:41:46 it does this using a digipot 00:42:31 and the relationship between the servopot and the digipot is controlled by an array, so yeah I do use arrays 00:42:32 Yeah I've used digipots before in a 4-20mA current sensor project 00:42:45 Is it just reading the array though ? 00:42:56 Like a lookup table essentially ? 00:42:57 this is much smarter than that, my design is worth at least 1 $billion 00:43:02 lol :D 00:43:08 --- join: mtsd joined #forth 00:43:17 sure, array is a perfect lookup table 00:43:34 Yeah, perhaps you have not run into the write into the array thing yet? 00:43:38 Hello everyone 00:43:42 o/ 00:43:44 mtsd, ahh yes, hello there! 00:43:59 mtsd, What have you been eating today ? 00:44:00 mine works perfectly in flash, it's self booting and fully tested 00:44:08 tp, writing to the array ? 00:44:10 hey mtsd and dys 00:45:03 jsoft, i create the array in the word before it's compiled to ram or flash 00:45:09 inc the data 00:45:13 ahh yeah 00:45:22 it works the same either way 00:45:25 So not writing to it during.. erm.. run time 00:45:27 so different to yours 00:45:59 So what is this digital pot business thingy anyway ? 00:46:05 no, but tell ya what, I'll look into it right now 00:46:18 i could tell you but then ... you know ... 00:46:24 tp, hah :D 00:46:25 Hi jsoft, just had breakfast so far. :) 00:46:35 Id have to grab the 92fs and do the deed 00:46:44 mtsd, what was that though ? 00:47:46 The usual. Oatmeal, bread and butter. Now at the office, having a cup of coffee 00:48:47 jsoft, everyone know it's a nice Scandinavian eel fried with butter and mushrooms stolen from their last raid to England ? 00:49:01 A Scandinavian eel 00:49:09 I have not heard of that before 00:49:23 that does sound interesting 00:49:41 hahaha, nice one tp 00:49:42 Well ate about a kg of meat and eggs and meat today 00:49:56 Its was glorious, in addition to glorious 00:49:59 in one of the "longboats" 00:50:21 tp, what is the typical australian breakfast? Lizard grilled on a stick over the fire? ;) 00:50:25 jsoft, same, tho only 400gm of rump, eggs and some vegies 00:50:38 tp, terrible. Ditch the vegies ya weirdo! :D 00:50:38 Like they show in crocodile dundee.. ;) 00:50:50 mtsd, usually a pie, sausage roll or Kentucky Fried Chicken ;-) 00:51:06 or may Macdonalda 00:51:06 Sounds great :) 00:51:11 Macdonalds 00:51:11 I love KFC 00:51:26 we are a nation of fatso's mtsd :( 00:51:36 We usually have oatmeal, or yoghurt, with sandwiches for breakfast here. 00:51:51 mtsd, I eat much like jsoft, steak and eggs mainly 00:52:10 Swedes only eat bacon and things like that for breakfast when we stay at a hotel, or go abroad 00:52:14 actually probably so do a lot of ausies, especially in winter 00:52:39 otameal and yoghurt would also be popular here 00:53:08 sandwiches, not so much for breakfast, perhaps lunch 00:53:19 Even though the traditional swedish foods are quite heavy. From a time where people worked the fields and forests, and had to think of ways to conserve food for the winter 00:53:28 mtsd, what is in the sandwich ? 00:54:16 My sandwiches are simple. Just butter and cheese. Hard cheese, not the soft stuff you can spread. Sometimes ham or a slice of sausage 00:54:45 sounds very healthy, sadly all Australian bread has a lot of sugar, so I dont eat it 00:55:18 I also only eat HARD cheese, that soft stuff is for girls and new zealanders 00:55:38 Good man, tp. 00:55:48 Hard cheese is the right type 00:55:51 Eh shuddup tp :P 00:56:00 yeah, and very tasty, no plastic 00:56:02 tp, actually my favourate cheese is tasty 00:56:14 whic is a crumbly bastard of a mess, but very... tasty. 00:56:48 yeah, I like it with lettuce and butter 00:56:56 (cause I dont eat bread) 00:57:22 Butter, cheese and ham is a nice combination. In my opinion 00:57:30 in fact Id go and have some right now but dont have any! off to the shops tommorow! 00:57:52 butter, cheese, tomato and ham is also very nice I think 00:58:47 hmm, our security guy isnt locking up tonight, probably because he lives rignt in the middle of the latest out of control fire! 00:59:41 jsoft, frid eggplant was YUM! 01:00:06 400g rump and 2 eggs, plus a couple of leaves of fresh spinach 01:00:26 This conversation is starting to make me hungry.. 01:00:35 if that meal was any nicer, theyd arrest me for eating too well 01:02:09 mtsd, salivating at the thought of fried eel and mushrooms ? 01:03:18 I can already hear mtsd's chef at his local lunch bar saying "you want WHAT for lunch?" 01:03:22 --- quit: mtsd (Remote host closed the connection) 01:04:38 --- join: mtsd joined #forth 01:05:11 jsoft, have a gander here ? https://mecrisp-stellaris-folkdoc.sourceforge.io/arrays.html#arrays 01:05:40 i demonstrate how to save and fetch cells, halfwords, and characters 01:06:17 Fried eel.. yum! 01:06:31 and I show how it all works in a nice logical easy to understand way. Please send minimum donations of 1 $billion dollars via paypal to show appreciation. 01:07:06 I have actually eaten eel. Smoked though, not fried. You can find it at traditional christmas dinners here 01:07:12 wow 01:07:50 Ive caught eels on a hand fishing line, very agro they are, with many ling sharp pointy teeth 01:07:55 long 01:08:25 You have to eat small pieces at a time and try to forget the fact that it looks like a snake 01:08:45 i guess they were objecting to the hook stuck in their throat from when they stole my bait that was clearly marked "snapper only" 01:09:15 mtsd, I love snake, octopus whatever 01:09:30 I dont mind it being long and thin 01:09:39 Never tried snake. Octopus is good though 01:09:48 I only object to eating Quail, a lot of work for almost no meat 01:10:21 Like smaller fish. Also much work for little meat 01:10:25 I havent either, tho I was nearly on a snakes lunch menu once or twice 01:10:39 yeah, agreed 01:11:04 octopus is awesome, shame theyre so smart tho, I almost feel guilty eating one 01:11:28 mtsd, I eat kangaroo regularly 01:11:35 and beef 01:11:51 hardly every bacon but I love it 01:12:01 -y 01:12:22 I like this talk of meat. 01:12:33 Yes, let's talk more about meat :) 01:12:35 Its seriously the business, the best food to be eating IMO. 01:13:07 --- join: rdrop-exit joined #forth 01:13:14 Bacon is common here. 01:13:21 Yeah bacon is glory 01:13:39 and here, but I try not to eat it too often as I love it too much 01:13:41 I like using bacon like butter, so I cook bacon in a frying pan, then use the fat to cook eggs 01:13:49 yum! 01:13:55 cant beat bacon fat! 01:14:09 Pigs have given us meat up here for ages. Even mentioned, and highly regarded, in the old Norse religion and legends 01:14:10 spread on crispy bread! 01:14:15 bread = carbs 01:14:18 cant be having carbs 01:14:29 mtsd, how old is the norse peoples ? 01:14:38 yeah, so I dont 01:14:45 but I still love bread 01:15:10 Well, the areas was christened around 800-900 AD. But there is a long tradition from before that time 01:15:26 jsoft, my vegies probably = 5 grams carbs, no potatoes etc 01:15:48 mtsd, I think... Hong Kong used to be among if not the highest consumer of meat, as in they smashed pork back a lot. Also correlated with very long lives apparently. Not so much now, as people are starting to eat non-animal based things 01:15:59 tp, why veggies at all ? 01:16:04 so my nation of australia is only about 2800 years behind yours ! 01:16:08 tp, taste ? 01:16:31 jsoft, I like vegies and have access to a local garden 01:16:42 Well fair enough then 01:16:44 yeah, I love spinach and so on 01:16:53 c[] Hello Knights of the Forth 01:17:08 greetings oh Zen Forth Guru! 01:17:09 rdrop-exit, hello there you wild beast of a person you 01:17:20 I think the oldest written material comes from the 13th century, somewhere 01:17:33 Hello rdrop-exit! 01:17:42 :) Hi guys! c[] 01:18:03 rdrop-exit, youre just the guru we have been looking for! 01:18:24 =8-O run away, runaway! 01:19:03 (the Knights of Forth are not very brave) 01:19:16 Rune stones are older than 13th century though 01:19:28 What even is a rune stone 01:19:29 we are but humble basket weavers seeking the path to Forth enlightenment ... 01:19:38 lol basket weavers 01:19:42 lol 01:19:43 :)) 01:20:03 That would kinda be thereputic I reckon, weaving a basket 01:20:15 Could use it for putting... I dunno.. meat in or something 01:20:18 I'm a lot braver when I'm holding my Beretta 92fs! 01:20:30 Very popular in asylums I hear (basket weaving) 01:20:31 hahahahaha 01:20:55 one of my most relaxing times was washing the laundry 01:21:46 I had a old 'wringer washer' of my mums and after washing, folding the wet laundry then feeding it thru the wringer was very peaceful 01:22:00 soap on, soap off 01:22:26 it was my favorite plave to meditate as I wrung and tried to keep my fingers out of the rollers 01:23:09 a good balance of peace and quiet, and possible ear splitting screaming as the rollers squished my fingers 01:23:14 tp, I loved those washing machines! I always tried to jam it up 01:23:17 tp, as a kid 01:23:20 hahah 01:23:29 tp, I'd like grab a massive clump of clothes, or anything, and shove it through it 01:23:33 and forced the roller latch to pop open ? 01:23:37 Yeah :D 01:23:48 Those were cool though 01:23:48 and your little sister too ill bet 01:23:57 All male siblings matey 01:24:22 oh, ok... and your 12 younger brothers too Ill bet ? 01:24:27 Nah 01:24:50 I was in an old as house 01:24:52 it had like a 01:25:06 like a big brick fireplace thing, and a copper tub in it, and that was for washing 01:25:17 we never used it for that, but yeah, old school as 01:25:38 i had my machine at age 35 after a divorce when I had to hang up the firearms and learn womanly things like washing, cleaning and cooking 01:26:30 yeah they'd put logs under the tub and make a fire, and while the water boiled stir the clothes around in the tub 01:26:36 Righ 01:26:38 Right 01:26:42 we had one whan I was young 01:26:45 I like old school stuff 01:27:06 my mum would grate soap to put in it, no laundry powder back then 01:27:19 Yeah people used to make their own soap too! 01:28:02 I remember seeing mum grating yummy cheese one day and knowing there was no way shed let me have any before the meal, I raced past and grabbed a handful and swallowed it ! 01:28:10 sadly .... 01:28:18 it wasnt cheese 01:28:25 soap :( 01:28:30 last time I did that 01:28:55 she must have had a fit of laughter 01:29:10 lol 01:29:30 anyone eaten soap ? it's really yummy, you should try it some time! 01:30:19 honestttttt ! 01:31:47 Said with your best honest face trying to hide a grin, I am sure :P 01:32:04 as he weaves another basket 01:32:11 hehe 01:32:27 ok, it sucks, like eating slime 01:32:27 --- quit: SysDsnEng (Quit: SysDsnEng) 01:33:24 think of it as eating swamp monster drool 01:33:45 yes, because we all have that reference to go off 01:33:48 :P 01:34:32 yes you do 01:35:27 ok imagine you have accidentally plunged your arm down a Dolphins blow hole, and it's all covered in slime ... 01:35:37 that's like eating soap 01:35:38 lol 01:35:49 Man you have outrageous frames of reference 01:36:15 i like to make my points relevant and meaningful 01:36:48 communication ... thats the name of the game! 01:37:16 and I dont even drink! 01:40:11 --- quit: tp (Remote host closed the connection) 01:40:12 --- join: SysDsnEng joined #forth 01:41:17 --- join: tp joined #forth 01:41:17 --- quit: tp (Changing host) 01:41:17 --- join: tp joined #forth 01:41:44 i think I discovered the 'die and vanish' hexchat hotkey 01:43:04 tp, the whatter ? 01:43:08 oh 01:47:23 is it firefox's 01:47:56 no 01:48:17 hexchat is a gtk widget irc client 01:49:02 you're a widget 01:49:18 --- quit: mtsd (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 01:49:31 no i mean is the key firefox's key 01:50:31 i dont use firefox 01:50:50 i use a firefox based browser called palemoon 01:51:13 is it palemoon's key ? I don't know 01:51:37 jsoft, I tend to fidget 01:51:52 jsoft, at least I'm no midget 01:51:57 Im a midget 01:52:01 Well, at least short 01:52:09 only 6'2 ? 01:52:19 Nah man, Im like 01:52:32 I dunno 165 or 170 or something like that 01:52:36 cm 01:52:48 what a shrimp! Im 178 or so 01:52:50 around the waist? 01:52:55 heheh 01:52:58 yeah 01:53:43 rdrop-exit, old pal, old mate ? 01:54:00 what the way to specify the data size in this array ? 01:54:03 create array 80 allot 01:54:23 say a cell where cell = 4 bytes 01:54:31 80 cells allot 01:54:55 and if characters ? 01:55:05 80 c, allot ? 01:55:19 80 allot is 80 bytes 01:55:24 yeah 01:55:43 so thats character size i get it 01:55:53 how about halfwords (4 bytes) 01:56:05 80 h, allot ? 01:56:07 not sure about character size with ANS stuff 01:56:16 80 2* allot 01:56:29 it's not 80 4* allot ? 01:56:37 ah ok, it's sinking in 01:56:50 sorry, if your halfwords are 4 bytes then 01:56:58 80 4* allot 01:57:12 but presumably you'd define a halfwords word 01:57:17 so you could do 01:57:18 I know all this stuff of course, Im asking it on jsoft's behalf 01:57:23 80 halfwords allot 01:57:44 I don't bother with halfwords and such 01:57:59 ahh i get it, very straightforward 01:58:19 we do becuse we are very efficiency oriented 01:58:36 and because we only have 500 bytes of flash 01:58:44 -) 01:58:46 ;-) 01:59:09 That's not what I meant 01:59:33 If I'm alotting 80 x 16-bits I just do 01:59:38 80 2* allot 02:00:41 tp, wait, whats this ? 02:00:42 you also need to make sure you align the dictionary to your needs before allotting 02:01:35 create normally aligns to a cell boundary 02:03:32 --- join: mtsd joined #forth 02:05:06 rdrop-exit, that whole thing you and tp helped me with has come to a success :) 02:05:24 kudos jsoft! 02:05:50 remember us in your will 02:06:10 :) 02:06:11 rdrop-exit, not the final thing, but https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BobbJYqroYw 02:07:10 it's alive!! 02:07:34 cool 02:07:43 Yeah thats kinda of not even the end thing 02:07:47 But its a clock now 02:07:53 With a cool metal logo on the front 02:08:02 awesome 02:08:11 My first forth project! :D 02:09:09 snoopy dance 02:15:56 --- quit: SysDsnEng (Quit: SysDsnEng) 02:39:32 --- join: iyzsong joined #forth 03:03:35 --- join: smokeink joined #forth 03:13:35 his will better have at least 1 $billion in it! 03:16:56 Quite right Dr. Evil, one biiiilion dollars, muahaha 03:17:38 all mineeeeee! 03:17:54 get yer own 1$billion I saw it first! 03:18:36 rdrop-exit, Forth keeps making concepts that I once thought complex, simple 03:18:57 Forth, the great simplifier 03:20:28 rdrop-exit, Im pretty sure that Mecrisp-Stellaris aligns the dictionary automatically anyway 03:21:00 I'm sure you're right 03:21:09 Mecrisp-Stellaris is like Gcc, it's so clever you don't even need to know anything ! 03:22:00 so it's like Arduino? 03:22:12 i can and will do some tests now that youve mentioned it :) 03:22:18 hahaha, gahhh 03:22:28 touch'e 03:22:37 I've been outclevered ... again! 03:22:50 muahaha 03:23:02 oh oh that evil cackle 03:24:12 sometimes you might want to manually align to a boundary greater than a cell 03:24:57 this whole cell alignment is a new concept to me 03:25:23 Forth has protected me from such dark places 03:26:16 In most Forths a cell just corresponds to a machine word 03:26:23 I've been storing and fetching stuff with Forth, blissfully ignorant of cell boundaries 03:26:34