00:00:00 --- log: started forth/16.10.24 00:14:51 --- nick: ASau`` -> ASau 00:20:29 --- join: mnemnion (~mnemnion@2601:643:8102:7c95:580a:faee:c3db:97c0) joined #forth 00:45:41 --- quit: nerfur` (Quit: Coyote finally caught me) 00:45:54 --- join: nerfur (~nerfur@mail.freeside.ru) joined #forth 00:57:56 --- join: Indecipherable (~Howl@41.162.59.11) joined #forth 01:00:47 so backlog. much time. :-D 01:16:22 --- join: ASau` (~user@x2f7fce1.dyn.telefonica.de) joined #forth 01:18:15 --- quit: ASau (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 01:22:22 --- quit: mnemnion (Remote host closed the connection) 01:37:19 --- nick: ASau` -> ASau 01:40:45 --- join: ASau` (~user@176.5.104.4) joined #forth 01:43:19 --- quit: ASau (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 01:52:34 --- join: ASau`` (~user@176.5.104.4) joined #forth 01:52:43 --- quit: ASau` (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 02:46:50 --- quit: nighty (Quit: Disappears in a puff of smoke) 03:10:28 --- nick: ASau`` -> ASau 03:58:17 --- join: nighty (~nighty@s229123.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp) joined #forth 04:42:51 --- quit: ASau (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 05:09:25 --- join: ASau (~user@netbsd/developers/asau) joined #forth 05:31:40 --- join: rgrinberg (~rgrinberg@blk-212-79-74.eastlink.ca) joined #forth 05:37:26 --- join: reepca` (~user@std-001.cune.edu) joined #forth 05:38:16 --- join: djinni_ (~djinni@68.ip-149-56-14.net) joined #forth 05:38:51 --- join: Quozl` (~quozl@activation.laptop.org) joined #forth 05:39:56 --- join: diginet2_ (~diginet@107.170.146.29) joined #forth 05:40:47 --- join: phadthai_ (mmondor@ginseng.pulsar-zone.net) joined #forth 05:40:52 --- join: rprimus (~micro@a9.lence.net) joined #forth 05:41:06 --- join: hexagon51n (~elliot@162.243.71.143) joined #forth 05:41:39 --- nick: rprimus -> Guest87240 05:45:43 --- quit: djinni (*.net *.split) 05:45:43 --- quit: lucasaiu (*.net *.split) 05:45:43 --- quit: Quozl`_ (*.net *.split) 05:45:43 --- quit: reepca (*.net *.split) 05:45:44 --- quit: rprimus_ (*.net *.split) 05:45:44 --- quit: hexagon5un (*.net *.split) 05:45:47 --- quit: diginet2 (*.net *.split) 05:45:47 --- quit: malyn (*.net *.split) 05:45:47 --- quit: yunfan (*.net *.split) 05:45:47 --- quit: phadthai (*.net *.split) 05:45:53 --- nick: diginet2_ -> diginet2 05:46:40 --- quit: ASau (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 05:51:23 --- join: malyn (~malyn@54.201.34.233) joined #forth 05:51:27 --- join: lucasaiu (~user@fsf/member/lucasaiu) joined #forth 05:52:27 --- join: true-grue (~true-grue@176.14.222.10) joined #forth 05:53:11 --- join: yunfan (~roooot@unaffiliated/yunfan) joined #forth 08:14:38 --- quit: Indecipherable (Quit: http://i.imgur.com/rWAnqP3.jpg) 08:22:24 --- quit: hexagon51n (Remote host closed the connection) 08:50:59 --- nick: Guest87240 -> rprimus 09:12:26 --- join: mnemnion (~mnemnion@71.198.73.193) joined #forth 09:46:09 --- quit: rgrinberg (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 09:51:24 --- quit: mnemnion (Remote host closed the connection) 10:03:46 --- join: ASau (~user@netbsd/developers/asau) joined #forth 10:10:31 --- join: mnemnion (~mnemnion@152.179.131.166) joined #forth 10:11:32 --- join: mnemnia (~mnemnion@152.179.131.166) joined #forth 10:14:34 --- quit: mnemnion (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 10:15:51 --- quit: mnemnia (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 10:17:49 --- join: mnemnion (~mnemnion@152.179.131.166) joined #forth 10:25:21 --- join: ASau` (~user@176.5.54.184) joined #forth 10:25:44 --- quit: ASau (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 10:34:57 --- quit: true-grue (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 10:39:23 --- join: colab (~moby@177-177-183-251.user.veloxzone.com.br) joined #forth 10:48:58 --- quit: ASau` (Remote host closed the connection) 11:12:23 --- join: karswell` (~user@144.67.198.146.dyn.plus.net) joined #forth 11:16:05 --- join: rgrinberg (~rgrinberg@blk-212-79-74.eastlink.ca) joined #forth 11:17:47 --- join: true-grue (~true-grue@176.14.222.10) joined #forth 11:17:55 --- nick: karswell` -> karswell 11:34:12 --- quit: colab (Quit: Leaving) 12:32:00 --- join: JDat (JDat@89.248.91.5) joined #forth 13:09:13 --- join: nal (~nal@adsl-64-237-235-251.prtc.net) joined #forth 13:24:28 --- join: Keshl (~Purple@24.115.181.94.res-cmts.gld.ptd.net) joined #forth 13:40:33 --- nick: phadthai_ -> phadthai 13:44:17 what I really like about vi is it is everywhere and it is probably just as extensible as vim 13:48:22 I mean basically with termux on android I've got busybox which has got vi awk and perl 13:48:33 and with those three things I can quickly start doing systems programming 13:48:44 But that's not really "linux" 13:49:15 On the other hand what forth has taught me is a way to plop a very minimal unix-like environment wherever I want. If you put me on an alien computer and I could figure out a few primitives of the computer I could put forth on it 13:49:38 and it would be silly to ask the aliens to give me a linux shell, the goal would be to interface with their builtin programs 13:50:05 John[Lisbeth]: have you come across varaq before? 13:50:10 no never 13:50:13 --- join: ASau (~user@netbsd/developers/asau) joined #forth 13:50:45 oh the klingon thing? 13:50:48 sounds interesting 13:51:31 I have loops and I have evaluate and I have print 13:51:35 but to get a repl I need read 13:52:01 busybox does not include read 13:52:14 that I know of 13:53:10 repl isn't important 13:53:17 rpl is the most important thing to me 13:53:20 it's convenient, and it falls out of the way that Forth works nicely 13:53:36 there's a reasons the lispers invented it 13:55:26 My sort of idea of things is to have the ultimate shell 13:55:43 I figure there is room out there in the developer community for someone who is really good with shells 13:56:00 and that is all I look at forth as. A shell which has scripting capabilities 13:56:07 that is all I viewed lisp and haskell as 13:56:16 John[Lisbeth]: what's probably more important is that you understand why the repl is there 13:56:21 and why it's so easy to implement 13:56:33 I know why it's so easy to implement. IT's just read eval print and loop 13:56:53 the repl exists to type one line of code at a time 13:57:47 no 13:58:14 do you understand why it is easy to implement? 13:58:20 like, how it actually works internally? 13:58:27 I understand exactly how it works internally 13:58:34 first you read characters from user input 13:58:38 then you evaluate those characters 13:58:45 if that evaluation has an ouput you print it to the screen 13:58:46 you loop 13:58:49 now you are reading again 13:58:51 no 13:58:58 enlighten me then 13:59:16 okay, do you understand how the dictionary works? 13:59:28 As far as I understand its like key value storage 13:59:36 well, it's more of a linked list 13:59:41 although 13:59:47 key-value storage, that's not a bad idea 13:59:55 key-value using linked lists 14:00:02 seems like the best way to do it 14:00:05 no, there's no key-value in it 14:00:15 alright well go on 14:00:23 but given how there are any number of decent key-value stores these days 14:00:28 John[Lisbeth]: that idea has legs 14:00:36 anyway 14:00:45 so you read in a line of text *from somewhere* 14:00:54 the key here is that it's not necessarily the terminal 14:01:25 --- join: Zarutian (~zarutian@168-110-22-46.fiber.hringdu.is) joined #forth 14:01:25 sure 14:01:29 you parse it into words, if it's not a word you could try seeing if it's a number 14:01:42 you mean evaluate? 14:01:48 you do it that way round because that way you can define a word that is a literal number 14:01:50 sounds like you are gonna describe an interpreter to me 14:01:56 no, this is just a parser 14:02:00 no evaluation is going on 14:02:08 at no point is there evaluation 14:02:31 the real trick is that *it doesn't matter where the line comes from 14:02:39 sure it could be a file or a json object or what have you 14:02:44 bingo 14:03:01 so really the clever bit is in "key" 14:03:09 or depending on how you implement things, "expect" 14:03:45 right, food time 14:03:49 later 14:04:01 lol well that was alot of buildup for nothing 14:04:17 don't focus on the repl, is what I'm saying 14:04:22 get ssh on your phone then you can use irc all the time 14:04:26 I use ssh while I eat 14:04:29 learn what immediate and compile mode are for 14:04:40 and why [ and ] are useful 14:04:47 I carry around a little bluetooth keyboard and a phone stand and type away at my server 14:05:03 I think repls are great 14:05:08 especially when they have JIT compilers 14:05:22 I find the keypad on my phone is perfectly adequate 14:05:26 Forth isn't JIT 14:05:40 you can get an android device that will run ssh very cheaply now. Probaly 40 USD 14:05:58 if you get a pay as you go plan you can easily afford the bill for the text ssh sends around 14:05:59 it's not great when I'm driving, but if I need to read or answer an email when I can't actually look at my phone I just use morse 14:06:13 I don't think I've ever had pay-as-you-go 14:06:29 Well maybe you could use tasker to read the text to you outloud and then write a tasker plugin to be able to talk back into ssh 14:06:45 that wouldn't work 14:06:50 it wouldn't work well 14:07:03 well, I wouldn't be able to understand what it says, so it wouldn't work at all 14:07:17 go eat 14:07:40 I find it just about impossible to pick speech out of background noise, unless the noise is really quiet 14:07:48 it's a kind of auditory dyslexia thing 14:07:58 it's why I'm not so big on phones, or voice comms in general 14:08:02 morse is easy though 14:08:10 and you don't need to look at anything 14:14:47 Yeah you can put a morse device in your toes 14:14:57 It probably wouldn't be wise to put it in your pedal foot 14:15:27 I really like repls and I am not afraid to say it. 14:15:42 I think rpls are really amazing and I have never had more fun programming than when I was in a repl 14:16:14 because I just start doing compute tasks manually and over time I write the patterns of what I am typing into functions and over time those functions form patterns and I write functions out of those functions and so on 14:27:50 --- quit: rgrinberg (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 14:32:51 --- quit: karswell (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 14:33:27 --- join: karswell` (~user@144.67.198.146.dyn.plus.net) joined #forth 15:04:44 --- nick: karswell` -> karswell 15:08:11 --- quit: JDat () 15:19:55 --- quit: nal (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 15:30:30 --- join: ASau` (~user@x2f7fd9e.dyn.telefonica.de) joined #forth 15:31:13 --- quit: Zarutian (Quit: Zarutian) 15:32:15 --- quit: ASau (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 15:38:12 --- quit: nighty (Quit: Disappears in a puff of smoke) 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seconds) 23:03:28 Off topic but thought some of you might be interested. My company was just features in an online new magazine in Thailand. Entire language is Thai but you can see our new office space and some of my team. They're talking about work-life balance at technical startups and are featuring us because of our four day work week. http://shows.voicetv.co.th/global-village/422523.html 23:11:45 --- quit: systemsgotyou (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 23:12:33 --- quit: karswell (Remote host closed the connection) 23:13:44 --- join: systemsgotyou (~User@71.91.8.13) joined #forth 23:14:01 --- join: karswell (~user@144.67.198.146.dyn.plus.net) joined #forth 23:24:31 --- quit: karswell (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 23:41:03 --- join: Quozl`_ (~quozl@download.laptop.org) joined #forth 23:43:04 --- quit: Quozl` (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 23:43:04 --- quit: proteusguy (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 23:43:04 --- quit: systemsgotyou (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 23:46:09 4-day work wee? wow! 23:46:44 cool! 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/16.10.24