00:00:00 --- log: started forth/16.08.08 00:08:59 --- join: probonono (~User@unaffiliated/probonono) joined #forth 00:09:10 --- join: mnemnion (~mnemnion@2601:643:8103:f9d0:adba:3105:ce8b:ea07) joined #forth 00:13:37 --- quit: mnemnion (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 01:40:20 --- join: gravicappa (~gravicapp@h62-133-162-148.static.bashtel.ru) joined #forth 01:40:32 --- quit: ASau` (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 02:53:22 --- quit: nighty (Quit: Disappears in a puff of smoke) 03:58:00 --- join: nighty (~nighty@s229123.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp) joined #forth 04:08:38 --- quit: dys (Remote host closed the connection) 04:20:36 --- quit: DGASAU (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 04:23:14 --- join: DGASAU (~user@lmpc.drb.insel.de) joined #forth 04:28:19 --- quit: wa5qjh (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 04:31:42 "autoshit" is exactly what you get when you want to use programming language that is very weak. 04:34:51 --- join: wa5qjh (~Thunderbi@121.54.58.129) joined #forth 04:58:00 --- quit: wa5qjh (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 05:49:17 --- join: byteflame (~byteflame@70-89-65-45-little-rock-ar.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) joined #forth 07:24:33 --- quit: nighty (Quit: Disappears in a puff of smoke) 07:24:51 --- join: nighty (~nighty@s229123.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp) joined #forth 07:30:29 --- quit: Gracana (Quit: WeeChat 1.2) 08:31:41 --- join: Zarutian (~zarutian@168-110-22-46.fiber.hringdu.is) joined #forth 10:25:12 --- join: bedah (~bedah@dyndsl-037-138-057-090.ewe-ip-backbone.de) joined #forth 11:00:46 --- join: proteusguy (~proteusgu@183.89.211.245) joined #forth 11:00:46 --- mode: ChanServ set +v proteusguy 11:13:58 --- quit: Zarutian (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 11:14:48 --- join: Zarutian (~zarutian@168-110-22-46.fiber.hringdu.is) joined #forth 11:16:31 --- quit: DGASAU (Remote host closed the connection) 11:16:37 --- join: DGASAU (~user@lmpc.drb.insel.de) joined #forth 11:23:37 --- quit: gravicappa (Remote host closed the connection) 11:24:44 --- join: dys (~dys@x5f71f739.dyn.telefonica.de) joined #forth 11:41:15 --- join: MickyW (~MickyW@p57A2FE26.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 11:43:16 Has anybody sourcecode of FD Vol. 2, Number 3? 11:46:59 hi, MickyW 11:47:11 the source is prolly in the pdf 11:47:15 Hi PoppaVic 11:47:21 I dunno what source it is 11:47:41 I spent a lovely day, yesterday discovering 2 more broken forths for the avr 11:47:56 Oh. How lovely. :-) 11:48:20 yeah.. I was all excited "Whee! They compiled!" - but uploading was unhappy. 11:48:47 Got a sunburn on saturday, standing on a fleamarket. Nearly as lovely. 11:48:54 heh 11:49:16 The source is not ocred, unlike the text. 11:49:24 I figured that. 11:49:39 Can't mark it with the mouse and copy it - unlike the text. Sh... 11:49:44 lovely 11:50:03 what code was it? (don't make me go run around to find my paper or pdf ;-) 11:50:22 The characters look so grainy(?) I am unsure if I will get them right, if I try to transcribe them using eyes and brain. 11:50:42 OK. Like a crossword puzzle. Hi hi 11:51:45 There are some articles about implementing CASE. They had a contest and in that number, the contestants (at least the winners) have been presented. 11:51:52 ah 11:51:57 I got that in paper ;-) 11:52:14 Nice. At least somebody on the world. Just come along ... 11:52:23 --- join: pdewacht_ (~repent@kulon.2k38.be) joined #forth 11:52:34 --- join: nighty-_ (~cp@www.taiyolabs.com) joined #forth 11:52:38 --- quit: pdewacht (*.net *.split) 11:52:38 --- quit: nighty- (*.net *.split) 11:53:05 :-) 11:53:20 you may do better with a lookup/index table, than cases 11:54:01 search table for value; use index to get pointer; execute 11:54:18 Oh. I dunno what I will implement yet. Was about to do some investigation to inspire myself. 11:55:19 But case looks better for me if the values are non-contigous. 11:55:40 And I have some 10 words where I would need that. 11:55:49 like? 11:56:26 {1,3,5,7,9,12} {do1,do3,...} sold. 11:56:32 Some timer aux words, which maps timer number to register addresses. Other which map prescaler values to the bit-combination 11:56:42 ah 11:57:02 Mostly simple mappings. But non-contiguous 11:58:18 Unfortunately not easily computed by arithmetics. OK. Say: I would need much time to write a script which computes a sequence of operations. 11:58:33 That was my first idea. But much effort needed. 11:59:08 PoppaVic: What did that mean: {1,2,3 ... 11:59:31 MickyW: I was just suggesting the two lists: values and XT's 11:59:42 Ah. I see. 11:59:51 search the one, index the other: execute 12:00:32 unless there is a LOT of cases, a simple seq-search is fine 12:01:00 However. I first wanted a survey. But can't partyl figure out how the propositions work, when I can't read some characters. 12:03:17 However. It is as it is. Maybe someone else here has the source. I have enough material for some hours. 12:04:30 At least I fixed my stack problem. Forgot to push in the machine code. Facepalm. :-) 12:04:46 ouch ;-) 12:05:20 --- join: Gracana (~Gracana@pnnk.org) joined #forth 12:05:50 Thought it was not necessary, because the TOS was allready saved. But forgot that the stack pointer was messed up that way. - Sh... happens. 12:06:26 * DGASAU has to point that this shit happens only in Forth, not a single other language lets this shit happen. 12:06:28 yes, TOS is just an element - not much use when you lose the stack itself ;-) 12:06:53 Alright, alright, there may exist shittier languages. 12:07:25 Now, I may use high level and low level words as interrupt service routines. And I may test them by calling them from console, before setting up the interrupt vector. Like it. 12:07:58 ah 12:08:53 I may give runtime parameters as well, which will transfered to the ISW on interrupt. So you may have generic ISWs which may be configured. Fine thing, I think. 12:09:01 From what I've seen, the vast majority of mcu-forths like to hit one single ISR routine, set a flag, reti, and then let NEXT notice it and process the flag before continuing to new code-words 12:10:21 Ah. A bit delayed then, until the previous word got to SEMIS/EXIT, right? Mine will interrupt as with native machine code. Immediately. (But some overhead due to saving registers). 12:11:23 yeah, what I described was documented as "the forth way" - which... Well, yeah.. It'd build in short delays. But then, NEXT is running very often, no? 12:11:25 RETI will then continue at any point whereever. Be it next, any low level or aux code. 12:11:41 In my variant. 12:11:44 I meant. 12:11:51 --- quit: dys (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 12:12:37 Sorry? The forth way? OK. Next IS executed very often. But - i must confess - I didn't had the idea. And I dont like it. :-{ Sorry. 12:12:45 I think it depends on your RAM availability, personally. The consistent comment I saw was that what I described didn't end up having to pig the stack with register-saves 12:13:50 --- join: dys (~dys@x5f71f739.dyn.telefonica.de) joined #forth 12:14:29 I see. But thats only choice between two ways which delay either. Either register saving or waiting until next is entered. 12:16:36 Maybe both are good. Anyway. I did it my way. :-) 12:16:53 "pig the stack" LOL. Funny expression. 12:17:27 yeah, as in 32 pushes and then 32 pops. Just.. OUCH. 12:17:41 Compared: That one needs less RAM. That true. 12:18:07 PoppaVic: Oh. No. I copy them by LD/ST except three which I need for using ST/LD. 12:18:20 yeah 12:20:51 That wasnt fully correct: I use LD/PUSH and POP/ST instructions. But maybe thats more than you wanted to know. 12:21:27 Yeah, I expected it. It's typical of c and forth 12:22:03 PoppaVic: And whats your decompiler doing? 12:22:44 hmm? oh. Nah, I saved the data - it's a way to generate a turnkey, but I am not fond of it for this situation 12:23:39 I read thru it again, and yeah: it's basically identical to SEE in gforth. (and I wonder when they will get SEE to work for code-words.. NEVER works) 12:24:29 Ah. I see. - I think one could add a disassembler. - By the way. Did you re-vector ABORT? Or how? 12:24:41 nope. 12:25:18 Gforth has a disassembler, and assembler, and see. However, in the last decade or so I have never once, in any version, gotten it to list code-words. 12:26:02 IIRC it works in 32-bit LuserLand. 12:26:16 Oh. So hard to do it? Hm. 12:26:52 not interested in even trying. It is included, it's part of the package, and it doesn't work. GPL - let the owners fix it. 12:27:22 Or YOU may make you a name, with fixing it. :-) 12:27:55 Sorry. Must care for my sunburn again. Hands will be greasy for some minutes. 12:28:04 ok 12:28:58 PoppaVic: Which are the 2 more broken forths for the AVR? 12:31:35 Too bad. Forecast said it will be cloudy. So I stood there with t-shirt. Luckily I had a hat. But my arms and my neck where burned rather seriously. 12:31:53 yeah, that happens. 12:31:56 OK. Nothing to bother anybody else. 12:32:44 OK. What about contributing to open source? 12:32:55 What about it? 12:33:34 I was joking, that you may make you a name by fixing that decompiling issue at Gforth. 12:34:03 --- join: impomatic (~impomatic@host81-129-217-145.range81-129.btcentralplus.com) joined #forth 12:34:28 I've thrown PD code to the world for over 30 years. I don't feel any further obligations. 12:35:03 Aha! Sorry? What's meant by "PD"? 12:35:10 Public Domain 12:35:35 as in: use it, abuse it, it could eat yer cat, I don't care - have fun. 12:36:28 Ah. So I may use some of yours. :-) But you never had any obligation. We're just thankfull for what you gave to us. 12:36:47 That's why it's a hobby. 12:36:57 Right 12:39:02 And - may I ask - at what are you working right now. For what did you need that decompiler thing? You intended to have some code externally, if I remember right? Do you want to do some home automation or likewise? 12:41:36 I'm working on trying to write a tethered/umbilical forth for some AVR's I have at hand: 328p and 1284p 12:43:12 And do you want that for a definite purpose, or just for fun? 12:44:35 nah, just to get one done, open, and keep all the text and work on the host.. Ain't much room in the 328p, so it's a tolerable idea. AFAIK, there are only 2 commercial forths that do tether/umbilical. 12:45:58 Ah. I think I understand. 12:50:54 Another contribution to PD, isnt it? I must look you up in the internet. :-) 12:51:55 don't bother. I don't run websites and such. I'll throw you a copy if I ever get it done 12:52:51 Will be very educative, I think. Thank you. 12:53:15 Ah. I love old science fiction. "Silent running" with Bruce Dern, tonight. 12:53:28 lovely. What channel is that on? 12:53:40 (I remember seeing that when it was brand-new) 12:55:50 I saw it as a teenager. Dont know when. US-Films had some delay to come to Germany - even 1972. - Its on "Arte" - German-French-Cooperation of public broadcasting services. 12:55:57 ah 12:55:59 ok 12:57:59 I remember that I was very eager to see science fiction on tv, but they where so seldom on German tv. So I read SF-Books. :-) 12:58:16 yep 12:58:30 And Star Trek with good old William Shatner. :-) 12:58:37 SF has always been treated like the red-haired stepchild. 12:58:55 You say it. 12:59:23 well, of course. Hell, I even watched old Buck Rogers and Flash Gordon b&w episodes with my old man.. Man, those were hilarious. 12:59:24 We where nerds before the word was invented. Lough. 13:00:17 Oh, yes. Flash Gordon. I saw it in the cinema. 13:01:02 Tarantula, and a thing about big ants, if remember right. 13:01:04 And, the Flash Gordon film from the 80's - with Queen music? - I loved that silly thing ;-) 13:01:11 "THEM" 13:01:31 Them and the original "The Thing" were also good. 13:01:44 well, "good" in that they were entertaining. 13:01:54 YES. That music from Queen was - super. 13:02:25 Dont know english superlatives very well. :-) But one of them must apply to Queen. 13:02:47 I love Queen.. Music died with freddy 13:03:26 And that "War of the worlds" - ooohhh and I forgot the "Time Machine". 13:03:37 both the originals, of course 13:03:53 Even the original Rollerball was excellent. Soylent green as well. 13:04:09 Of course. What else? Tom Cruise? Bäh. 13:04:47 he's ok in his Mission Impossible films, etc. Don't do remakes and change the whole plot and expect me to enjoy it. 13:04:55 I have them on DVD here. Admire them. 13:05:57 OK. I dont like him. Don't think he's a good actor. And there are other reasons. 13:08:42 But when I saw that "Samurai"-Film with him: That was really ... bad, in my opinion. OK. The script was not his, but I dont like that idea, that longnoses explain japanese culture. 13:09:28 But thats matter of opinion. Sorry, if I said something that could bother you. 13:09:39 No point listening to them explain themselves. You're fine. 13:11:17 Puh. :-) 13:12:36 Oh. I meant: !Phew!! 13:13:31 So. Its late (about 10PM) and I want to see Silent Running. So I leave now. 13:13:47 ooo, films 13:14:02 PoppaVic: Bye. See you. 13:14:16 laters 13:15:11 --- quit: MickyW (Quit: Verlassend/leaving) 13:20:28 --- quit: bedah (Quit: Ex-Chat) 15:58:49 --- log: started forth/16.08.08 15:58:49 --- join: clog (~nef@bespin.org) joined #forth 15:58:49 --- topic: 'Forth Programming | logged by clog at http://bit.ly/91toWN | http://projects.forthworks.com/standards/DPANS/ | www.greenarraychips.com' 15:58:49 --- topic: set by crc!sid2647@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-incoycbnpesmfspg on [Fri Nov 06 18:58:45 2015] 15:58:49 --- names: list (clog wa5qjh Mat4 impomatic dys Gracana nighty-_ pdewacht_ DGASAU Zarutian +proteusguy nighty probonono fiddlerwoaroof reepca Keshl PoppaVic jeremyheiler ggherdov` Uniju carc irsol beretta Vendan Skuzzzy gordonjcp bluekelp malyn phadthai segher backer diginet2 yunfan dograt ovf crc eatonphil DKordic cantstanya APic taij33n djinni_ dzho Quozl` eldre rprimus newcup _longines octo_ tangentstorm) 16:01:28 --- join: ASau (~user@netbsd/developers/asau) joined #forth 16:02:59 --- part: Mat4 left #forth 16:34:36 --- quit: nighty (Quit: Disappears in a puff of smoke) 16:59:45 --- join: karswell (~user@179.63.114.87.dyn.plus.net) joined #forth 17:08:52 --- join: nighty (~nighty@d246113.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp) joined #forth 17:43:48 --- join: blockzombie (~blockzomb@eth59-167-133-100.static.internode.on.net) joined #forth 17:54:03 --- quit: wa5qjh (Remote host closed the connection) 17:58:12 --- join: wa5qjh (~Thunderbi@203.111.224.63) joined #forth 18:03:43 --- quit: wa5qjh (Remote host closed the connection) 18:36:39 --- quit: ASau (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 19:11:20 hi i was thinking if there are small forth made for image processing and was embeding into tools like imagemagick 19:13:06 --- quit: PoppaVic (Remote host closed the connection) 19:17:02 --- join: PoppaVic (~PoppaVic@unaffiliated/poppavic) joined #forth 19:17:46 --- join: nal (~nal@adsl-72-50-87-80.prtc.net) joined #forth 19:35:57 --- quit: blockzombie (Remote host closed the connection) 19:36:44 --- join: blockzombie (~blockzomb@eth59-167-133-100.static.internode.on.net) joined #forth 20:54:13 --- quit: karswell (Remote host closed the connection) 20:55:24 --- join: karswell` (~user@179.63.114.87.dyn.plus.net) joined #forth 21:06:43 --- quit: Zarutian (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 21:08:32 --- join: Zarutian (~zarutian@168-110-22-46.fiber.hringdu.is) joined #forth 21:46:02 --- quit: Zarutian (Quit: Zarutian) 22:42:56 --- quit: nal (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 23:21:32 --- quit: proteusguy (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 23:33:10 --- join: the_cuckoo (~charlie@d51A50AE9.access.telenet.be) joined #forth 23:35:13 --- join: ASau (~user@netbsd/developers/asau) joined #forth 23:48:13 --- quit: ASau (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/16.08.08