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joined #forth 09:07:07 --- quit: asie (Quit: I'll probably come back in either 20 minutes or 8 hours.) 09:26:43 --- join: asie (~textual@078088168214.elblag.vectranet.pl) joined #forth 09:33:23 --- nick: bstates_ -> bstates 09:37:06 --- quit: Zarutian (Quit: Zarutian) 10:07:21 --- join: impomatic (~john_metc@37.152.203.231) joined #forth 10:07:22 --- quit: john_metcalf (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 10:14:16 --- quit: joneshf-laptop (Remote host closed the connection) 10:14:55 --- join: Zarutian (~zarutian@194-144-84-110.du.xdsl.is) joined #forth 10:16:23 --- quit: pvt_petey () 10:28:35 --- quit: asie (Quit: I'll probably come back in either 20 minutes or 8 hours.) 10:32:07 --- quit: DGASAU (Remote host closed the connection) 10:33:54 --- join: DGASAU (~user@p50993595.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 10:45:21 --- join: karswell (~user@122.93.208.46.dyn.plus.net) joined #forth 10:49:17 --- join: asie (~textual@078088168214.elblag.vectranet.pl) joined #forth 11:09:52 --- quit: DGASAU (Remote host closed the connection) 11:11:04 --- join: DGASAU (~user@p50993595.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 11:21:18 --- quit: Zarutian (Quit: Zarutian) 11:25:01 --- part: xyh left #forth 11:29:14 --- join: kumul (~mool@adsl-72-50-86-39.prtc.net) joined #forth 11:39:30 --- quit: DGASAU (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 11:45:09 --- join: nisstyre (~yourstrul@oftn/member/Nisstyre) joined #forth 11:45:10 --- join: fantazo (~fantazo@089144209065.atnat0018.highway.a1.net) joined #forth 11:48:28 --- join: DGASAU (~user@p50993595.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 12:06:47 --- join: Zarutian (~zarutian@194-144-84-110.du.xdsl.is) joined #forth 12:16:48 --- quit: asie (Quit: I'll probably come back in either 20 minutes or 8 hours.) 12:32:07 --- join: asie (~textual@078088168214.elblag.vectranet.pl) joined #forth 12:34:07 --- quit: Zarutian (Quit: Zarutian) 12:44:54 --- join: xyh (~user@2001:250:3002:5550:5642:49ff:fe5f:39f7) joined #forth 12:56:12 the dependence relation of functions (or groups of functions) forms a tree, but if the interpreter reads code linearly, the parent-nodes of this tree will be downward, and the kid-nodes of this tree will be upward. 12:56:15 how should a text editor helps this ?? org-mode of emacs can not help ! 12:58:16 dunno 12:58:20 use hyperlinks ?? 12:58:29 --- join: joneshf-laptop (~joneshf@98.255.30.38) joined #forth 12:58:56 colorforth and oberon both have that rule (wel... not sure about colorforth) and have integrated editors. 13:00:13 do you use ``ranger'' (a file manager) ? 13:00:50 xyh: Just draw the flowchart :) 13:01:01 --- join: john_metcalf (~digital_w@37.152.203.231) joined #forth 13:02:31 true-grue: flowchart of function definitions ? 13:02:42 I think a ``ranger'' with opposite direction will help. 13:02:56 "Kid-nodes" just should appear before their parents. 13:03:40 yeah! 13:03:45 * tangentstorm agrees 100% with true-grue 13:03:46 --- quit: kumul (Quit: Leaving) 13:05:45 of course ! I mean a better text editor to edit these functions. there may be 100 functions above, but only 10 of them is your kids. 13:06:10 are your kids. 13:06:36 --- join: Zarutian (~zarutian@194-144-84-110.du.xdsl.is) joined #forth 13:07:28 --- join: dandersen (~user@unaffiliated/dandersen) joined #forth 13:08:00 well actually i don't really know what he means but, like... when you read an oberon file (or an old pascal file before everything got object oriented) you kind of have to go to the very end of the file to get the big picture. 13:08:11 same with forth 13:08:30 the highest-level, big picture code comes at the end. 13:09:03 (but it would be nice if it were the first thing you saw) 13:09:40 Well, I really like the idea of editor with two tied views. When you have both text and graphical views of your program and you can edit any of these views anytime. 13:09:54 --- quit: zephyrfa1con (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 13:10:10 --- quit: dkcl (Disconnected by services) 13:10:11 --- nick: dandersen -> dkcl 13:10:15 graphical like... raptor? 13:10:24 http://raptor.martincarlisle.com/ 13:10:40 hrm. 13:10:43 * tangentstorm looks for a screenshot. 13:11:23 hehe 13:11:40 http://programming-steps.blogspot.com/2013/10/raptor-flowchart-quick-start-for.html 13:11:59 --- join: zephyrfalcon (~hans@adsl-074-229-200-227.sip.gnv.bellsouth.net) joined #forth 13:12:33 tangentstorm: Ehm, no. It's too low-level. I was thinking about some dataflow visual language with subsystems/modules as building blocks. 13:13:18 --- join: ASau (~user@46.114.24.99) joined #forth 13:13:31 huh. maybe more like a uml diagram? 13:15:54 tangentstorm: Again, no. I think, I'll implement it someday and then will show you :) 13:18:24 --- join: kumul (~mool@adsl-72-50-87-103.prtc.net) joined #forth 13:19:52 about forth code, 13:19:57 when one wants to change a function's definition, 13:19:58 its all parent-functions(downward) maybe should be changed too. 13:20:03 but when one is watching a function's definition, try to understand it, 13:20:03 he maybe want to watch all its kid-functions(upward) too. 13:20:19 I just think a text editor should help me to do this. 13:20:19 like emacs org-mode helps me to watch and organize my text. 13:25:38 --- quit: asie (Quit: I'll probably come back in either 20 minutes or 8 hours.) 13:26:55 maybe look at reverse engineering tools, xyh ? 13:27:22 i think there's one called IDA 13:27:27 actually the structure is lattice, not tree, so ``kid'' and ``parent'' terms are wrong 13:30:21 tangentstorm: just text-editor, I am thinking about your hyperlink-text-editor ! 13:32:25 well it's a hypertext editor. 13:32:42 i mean it's going to be. 13:33:02 hyperlinks are part of that, but it's not all... 13:33:25 html is a very very crude and simplistic form of hypertext. 13:34:04 in real hypertext, you could have the same text in multiple places if you wanted. 13:34:20 not copy and paste, but the actual same text. 13:34:29 so if you edit one, the others change at the same time. 13:35:12 cool, this is why you need directed graph processing. 13:35:20 or maybe you could have your code expand like an outliner. 13:35:30 but like... each word. 13:35:57 so if you have a recursive function, you could keep expanding the same word over and over and driling down into it. 13:36:07 like playing portal. :) 13:37:49 forkbomb 13:47:22 --- join: asie (~textual@078088168214.elblag.vectranet.pl) joined #forth 13:51:15 tangentstorm: html is sexp with named-parentheses, which is tree. 13:51:15 but I think ``real hypertext'' is a directed-graph, 13:51:16 which in every node of it you can store some string or another directed-graph. isn't it? 13:54:04 yeah 14:01:49 as sexp, maybe we call whis kind of directed-graph ``gexp''. 14:02:02 actually, using gexp to denote both functions and data, maybe we can create a new computation model. this is what I try to do, by designe a directed-graph-processing language. 14:08:39 gexp :) i like that 14:09:06 i know there are graph query languages out there, and there's dot for describing graphs 14:09:36 or rdf 14:10:04 i can really only think of one graph-centric programming language though 14:10:15 well.. hrm. maybe some of the visual ones. 14:11:41 https://github.com/tinkerpop/gremlin/wiki 14:12:08 ^ this is what i was thinking about. i don't know much about it other than tinkerpop makes cool logos/mascots for everything they do. :) 14:12:11 i want to designe a syntax, which make good use of SPANNING-TREE to describe graph and functions which process graph. 14:12:11 this will be different from every existing languages. 14:13:09 cool. go for it :) 14:13:35 yeah 14:13:37 are you writing a thesis about this? i think you told me but i don't remember 14:14:53 yes, I will be. 14:16:35 when I finish, I will let you know ^_^ 14:19:10 :) 14:19:11 --- join: dandersen (~user@unaffiliated/dandersen) joined #forth 14:21:03 --- quit: dkcl (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 14:36:30 --- quit: nighty-_ (Quit: Disappears in a puff of smoke) 14:40:42 --- quit: true-grue (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 14:41:08 --- quit: ASau (Remote host closed the connection) 14:42:11 --- join: ASau (~user@46.114.24.99) joined #forth 14:55:17 --- quit: Zarutian (Quit: Zarutian) 15:02:31 --- quit: asie (Quit: I'll probably come back in either 20 minutes or 8 hours.) 15:04:18 --- join: dkcl (~user@unaffiliated/dandersen) joined #forth 15:04:56 --- quit: karswell (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 15:07:32 --- quit: dandersen (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 16:01:56 --- quit: mnemnion (Remote host closed the connection) 16:09:45 --- join: karswell (~user@122.93.208.46.dyn.plus.net) joined #forth 16:20:17 --- join: Zarutian (~zarutian@194-144-84-110.du.xdsl.is) joined #forth 16:36:47 --- part: xyh left #forth 16:51:00 --- join: backz (~Daniel@189.120.201.91) joined #forth 16:52:08 --- part: backz left #forth 16:54:43 --- quit: dkcl (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 17:43:06 --- quit: nisstyre (Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3) 18:02:49 --- join: mnemnion (~mnemnion@c-98-210-219-91.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) joined #forth 18:07:17 --- quit: mnemnion (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 18:14:17 --- join: mnemnion (~mnemnion@c-98-210-219-91.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) joined #forth 18:21:54 --- join: saml_ (~saml@pool-71-190-4-101.nycmny.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 18:53:53 --- quit: fantazo (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 19:10:31 --- quit: Zarutian (Quit: Zarutian) 19:26:35 --- quit: pdurbin (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 19:26:40 --- join: nisstyre (~yourstrul@oftn/member/Nisstyre) joined #forth 19:45:06 --- quit: karswell (Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)) 20:57:06 --- quit: saml_ (Quit: Leaving) 21:03:55 --- join: karswell (~user@122.93.208.46.dyn.plus.net) joined #forth 21:17:34 --- quit: crc (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 21:18:27 --- quit: aksatac (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 21:31:10 --- join: aksatac (uid12717@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mkkdoinehvhxhxkm) joined #forth 21:32:54 --- join: crc (sid2647@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lmspzeqgzwfzvgxe) joined #forth 21:36:57 --- quit: tangentstorm (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.2) 22:31:40 --- quit: nisstyre (Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3) 22:33:39 --- join: nisstyre (~yourstrul@oftn/member/Nisstyre) joined #forth 23:01:17 --- join: fantazo (~fantazo@089144197011.atnat0006.highway.a1.net) joined #forth 23:32:17 --- join: true-grue (~quassel@95-26-134-252.broadband.corbina.ru) joined #forth 23:39:31 --- quit: kludge` (Remote host closed the connection) 23:41:13 --- quit: kumul (Quit: Leaving) 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/14.05.02