00:00:00 --- log: started forth/13.06.05 00:32:23 --- part: DocPlatypus left #forth 00:48:54 --- join: newcup (newcup@peruna.fi) joined #forth 00:59:23 --- quit: newcup (Read error: Operation timed out) 01:01:44 --- join: newcup (newcup@peruna.fi) joined #forth 01:16:10 --- join: nighty^ (~nighty@tin51-1-82-226-147-104.fbx.proxad.net) joined #forth 01:29:32 --- quit: dto (Remote host closed the connection) 02:22:11 --- quit: goingretro (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 02:26:54 --- quit: proteusguy (Remote host closed the connection) 02:32:10 --- join: goingretro (~kbmaniac@host31-51-149-124.range31-51.btcentralplus.com) joined #forth 02:49:16 --- nick: Vuokko_ -> Vuokko 03:03:56 --- quit: Anarch (Read error: Operation timed out) 05:15:03 --- join: RodgerTheGreat (~rodger@50-198-177-185-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) joined #forth 05:31:27 --- join: proteusguy (~proteusgu@ppp-115-87-203-54.revip4.asianet.co.th) joined #forth 05:54:33 --- quit: Eth|cal (Remote host closed the connection) 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seconds) 06:25:03 --- quit: yiyus_ (Ping timeout: 254 seconds) 06:25:05 --- join: segher (~segher@5ED3C8DF.cm-7-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) joined #forth 06:28:47 --- log: started forth/13.06.05 06:28:47 --- join: clog (~nef@bespin.org) joined #forth 06:28:47 --- topic: 'Forth Programming | logged by clog at http://bit.ly/91toWN | links: qr.net/gforth isforth.com forthfreak.net qr.net/ans_standard | Buy forth chips from www.greenarraychips.com' 06:28:47 --- topic: set by foucist!~foucist@ps14150.dreamhost.com on [Thu Apr 26 19:32:21 2012] 06:28:47 --- names: list (clog ttmrichter rixard Tod-Autojoined dessos_ segher yiyus proteusguy Eth|cal +tathi tangentstorm malyn_ RodgerTheGreat goingretro nighty^ newcup epicmonkey ASau cataska kulp Nisstyre djinni nighty-__ rprimus yunfan bluekelp sirdancealo2 KipIngram Backer jyf obobo__ Adeon c00kiemon5ter dzho Vuokko nottwo) 06:33:43 --- quit: ASau (Excess Flood) 06:33:56 --- join: rprimus_ (~micro@ec2-50-16-189-142.compute-1.amazonaws.com) joined #forth 06:34:08 --- quit: rprimus (Remote host closed the connection) 07:19:06 --- quit: tathi (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 07:20:10 --- quit: nighty^ (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 07:20:11 --- quit: Eth|cal (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 07:20:11 --- quit: clog (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 07:20:11 --- log: stopped forth/13.06.05 07:20:18 --- log: started forth/13.06.05 07:20:18 --- join: clog_ (~nef@bespin.org) joined #forth 07:20:18 --- topic: 'Forth Programming | logged by clog at http://bit.ly/91toWN | links: qr.net/gforth isforth.com forthfreak.net qr.net/ans_standard | Buy forth chips from www.greenarraychips.com' 07:20:18 --- topic: set by foucist!~foucist@ps14150.dreamhost.com on [Thu Apr 26 19:32:21 2012] 07:20:18 --- names: list (clog_ Ethical JoshGrams rprimus_ clog ttmrichter rixard Tod-Autojoined dessos_ segher yiyus proteusguy Eth|cal +tathi tangentstorm malyn_ RodgerTheGreat goingretro nighty^ newcup epicmonkey cataska kulp Nisstyre nottwo Vuokko dzho c00kiemon5ter Adeon obobo__ jyf Backer KipIngram sirdancealo2 bluekelp yunfan nighty-__ djinni) 07:20:59 --- quit: tathi (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 07:21:00 --- quit: nighty^ (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 07:21:00 --- quit: Eth|cal (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 07:21:00 --- quit: clog (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 07:21:18 --- join: nighty-_ (~nighty@tin51-1-82-226-147-104.fbx.proxad.net) joined #forth 07:27:03 --- quit: Ethical (*.net *.split) 07:27:04 --- quit: JoshGrams (*.net *.split) 07:34:13 --- join: Tod-Work (~thansmann@50-202-143-210-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) joined #forth 07:39:20 --- join: JoshGrams (~josh@dsl-216-227-91-75.fairpoint.net) joined #forth 07:43:32 --- join: Ethical (~sam@ppp59-167-172-238.static.internode.on.net) joined #forth 07:50:41 --- quit: sirdancealo2 (*.net *.split) 07:54:21 --- quit: kulp (K-Lined) 07:55:37 --- join: kulp (~kulp@unaffiliated/kulp) joined #forth 08:10:38 --- quit: Tod-Work (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 08:11:04 --- join: Tod-Work 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(~kbmaniac@host31-51-149-124.range31-51.btcentralplus.com) joined #forth 08:51:57 --- join: nighty-_ (~nighty@tin51-1-82-226-147-104.fbx.proxad.net) joined #forth 08:53:40 --- quit: Tod-Work (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 08:54:27 --- join: Tod-Work (~thansmann@50-202-143-210-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) joined #forth 08:56:30 --- quit: goingretro (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 09:00:59 --- join: ncv (~quassel@79.114.115.117) joined #forth 09:00:59 --- quit: ncv (Changing host) 09:00:59 --- join: ncv (~quassel@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #forth 09:02:41 --- log: started forth/13.06.05 09:02:41 --- join: clog (~nef@bespin.org) joined #forth 09:02:41 --- topic: 'Forth Programming | logged by clog at http://bit.ly/91toWN | links: qr.net/gforth isforth.com forthfreak.net qr.net/ans_standard | Buy forth chips from www.greenarraychips.com' 09:02:41 --- topic: set by foucist!~foucist@ps14150.dreamhost.com on [Thu Apr 26 19:32:21 2012] 09:02:41 --- names: list (clog Ethical ncv Tod-Work nighty-_ kulp dessos TodPunk ttmrichter jyf1987 dys sirdancealo2 JoshGrams rprimus_ Backer KipIngram bluekelp yunfan nighty-__ djinni obobo__ Adeon c00kiemon5ter dzho Vuokko nottwo Nisstyre cataska epicmonkey newcup RodgerTheGreat malyn_ tangentstorm proteusguy yiyus rixard) 09:02:42 --- join: segher (~segher@5ED3C8DF.cm-7-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) joined #forth 09:08:39 --- join: mtm (~mtm@c-76-102-52-34.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) joined #forth 09:40:21 --- quit: epicmonkey (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 09:51:21 --- quit: nottwo (*.net *.split) 09:51:23 --- quit: bluekelp (*.net *.split) 09:51:26 --- quit: dys (*.net *.split) 09:51:26 --- quit: sirdancealo2 (*.net *.split) 09:51:27 --- quit: mtm (*.net *.split) 09:51:27 --- quit: JoshGrams (*.net *.split) 09:51:32 --- quit: RodgerTheGreat (*.net *.split) 09:51:35 --- quit: rprimus_ (*.net *.split) 09:51:36 --- quit: tangentstorm (*.net *.split) 09:51:36 --- quit: malyn_ (*.net *.split) 09:51:36 --- quit: newcup (*.net *.split) 09:51:36 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(Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 12:23:31 --- join: nighty^ (~nighty@tin51-1-82-226-147-104.fbx.proxad.net) joined #forth 12:24:33 --- quit: nighty^ (Max SendQ exceeded) 12:25:16 --- join: nighty^ (~nighty@tin51-1-82-226-147-104.fbx.proxad.net) joined #forth 12:39:05 --- join: Mat2 (~claude@91-65-144-133-dynip.superkabel.de) joined #forth 12:39:08 hello 12:40:09 --- join: ullopirlo (~androirc@pD9E25017.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 12:40:57 --- nick: ullopirlo -> albertone 12:47:17 Someone there? 12:47:37 I think so 12:47:47 Tnx 12:53:16 --- quit: Tod-Work (*.net *.split) 12:57:47 --- join: goingretro (~kbmaniac@host31-51-149-124.range31-51.btcentralplus.com) joined #forth 12:58:44 --- join: Tod-Work (~thansmann@50-202-143-210-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) joined #forth 12:59:11 --- join: Tod-Work_ (~thansmann@50-202-143-210-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) joined #forth 13:00:25 --- quit: Tod-Work (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 13:04:52 --- quit: proteusguy (Remote host closed the connection) 13:12:35 --- quit: Mat2 (Quit: Verlassend) 13:14:58 nope ! 13:36:10 --- quit: albertone (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 13:44:33 --- join: Onionnion (~ryan@adsl-68-254-171-193.dsl.milwwi.ameritech.net) joined #forth 14:04:49 --- quit: segher (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) 14:06:18 --- join: segher (~segher@5ED3C8DF.cm-7-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) joined #forth 14:31:03 --- quit: Tod-Work_ (Quit: Leaving) 14:40:16 --- join: dto (~user@pool-96-252-62-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) joined #forth 15:10:37 --- quit: dto (Remote host closed the connection) 15:39:45 --- join: dto (~user@pool-96-252-62-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) joined #forth 15:41:09 --- quit: RodgerTheGreat (Quit: RodgerTheGreat) 15:45:09 --- join: kevinfish (~fish@2602:30a:2c92:c1b0:218:deff:feb0:e2ac) joined #forth 15:45:51 anyone have any routines to drive a DRAM off the i/o pins of a microcontroller? 15:52:13 --- quit: epicmonkey (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 15:55:14 --- join: RodgerTheGreat (~rodger@50-198-177-185-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) joined #forth 16:17:42 that code would probably be very application-dependent 16:18:13 e.g., in a lot of access patterns, you don't need to deal with refresh at all 16:30:58 --- quit: dto (Remote host closed the connection) 16:35:11 dys: true. Well, I'd have to make it pretty generic. building a ramdrive 17:26:11 --- join: dto (~user@pool-96-252-62-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) joined #forth 17:37:34 --- quit: mtm (Quit: Leaving...) 18:30:46 --- quit: nighty^ (Remote host closed the connection) 19:11:13 --- quit: dto (Remote host closed the connection) 19:39:58 --- quit: ncv (Remote host closed the connection) 19:42:51 --- quit: dys (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 19:46:06 --- join: zachk (~sudoku@unaffiliated/zachk) joined #forth 20:08:58 --- join: mtm (~mtm@c-24-130-130-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) joined #forth 20:19:05 --- quit: mtm (Quit: Leaving...) 20:20:41 --- quit: Onionnion (Quit: Leaving) 20:47:45 If you expect that drive to be taken seriously by anyone then the probability that it could spontaneously lose data (say, by failing to refresh even one location) has to be inhumanly close to zero. 20:47:56 I work in storage. Data integrity is paramount. 20:48:46 If I recall correctly, though, don't you refresh an entire row by reading any location of that row? 20:49:21 So a deterministic "for sure" refresh algorithm has very minimal performance impact. Just pay the ante and move on. 21:11:53 Let's say you have a 16M RAM, with 4K rows of 4K columns. The difference between reading *every* row, on schedule, and reading *none* of them because you somehow cleverly figure out you've already read them as part of the normal traffic, is just 0.0243% performance. 21:17:14 so they refresh alot ? 21:24:30 Not really. I'm not sure it's as cut and dried as my last comments may have suggested, but I do think that the real point is that they *don't* refresh a lot as compared to normal RAM traffic. 21:24:49 So you may as well just refresh automatically per the device spec - it's not going to cost much at all. 21:25:16 And that's a whole lot easier than trying to keep up with how much you have "fortuitously refreshed." 21:33:31 --- join: proteusguy (~proteusgu@ppp-61-90-41-110.revip.asianet.co.th) joined #forth 21:34:24 Especially if you keep track of your "fortuitous refreshing" in RAM. :D 21:47:03 --- join: albertone (~androirc@pD9E2694D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 22:11:49 --- join: dys (~user@2a01:1e8:e100:8296:21a:4dff:fe4e:273a) joined #forth 22:15:38 --- quit: segher (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) 22:16:52 --- join: segher (~segher@5ED3C8DF.cm-7-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) joined #forth 22:18:54 --- quit: Nisstyre (Quit: Leaving) 22:24:27 --- quit: albertone (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 22:24:32 --- quit: RodgerTheGreat (Quit: RodgerTheGreat) 23:03:30 --- join: ASau` (~user@p5797E28E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 23:06:46 --- quit: ASau (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 23:10:07 --- quit: proteusguy (Remote host closed the connection) 23:16:42 --- nick: ASau` -> ASau 23:22:40 --- join: Nisstyre-laptop (~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre) joined #forth 23:24:57 --- join: proteusguy (~proteusgu@180.183.48.210) joined #forth 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/13.06.05