00:00:00 --- log: started forth/13.03.19 00:01:05 --- join: tgunr (~davec@cust-66-249-166-11.static.o1.com) joined #forth 00:08:39 --- join: ncv (~quassel@79.114.79.235) joined #forth 00:08:39 --- quit: ncv (Changing host) 00:08:39 --- join: ncv (~quassel@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #forth 00:19:06 --- join: epicmonkey (~epicmonke@188.134.41.112) joined #forth 00:57:32 --- quit: ncv (Remote host closed the connection) 01:38:47 --- quit: tgunr (Quit: I'm outta here) 01:41:39 --- part: sw2wolf left #forth 01:48:59 --- join: tgunr (~davec@cust-66-249-166-11.static.o1.com) joined #forth 01:52:07 --- quit: dto (Remote host closed the connection) 02:05:44 --- quit: epicmonkey (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 02:09:09 can you guys show me a sample to computing fibonacci N using recurse 02:48:27 ok i found that in wikipedia 03:08:40 --- join: epicmonkey (~epicmonke@host-224-58.dataart.net) joined #forth 03:19:53 --- quit: malyn (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 03:20:26 --- join: malyn_ (~malyn@server.strangegizmo.com) joined #forth 03:20:26 --- quit: malyn_ (Changing host) 03:20:26 --- join: malyn_ (~malyn@unaffiliated/malyn) joined #forth 03:20:28 --- nick: malyn_ -> malyn 03:26:23 why gforth-fast is slower than gforth? 03:31:27 --- join: obobo_ (~chatzilla@dyn-98-124-5-27.nexicom.net) joined #forth 03:33:22 --- quit: obobo (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 03:33:33 --- nick: obobo_ -> obobo 03:34:47 --- join: protist (~protist@8.225.69.111.dynamic.snap.net.nz) joined #forth 03:35:43 anyone working on anything interesting? 03:42:27 Your sist... never mind. :) 04:12:20 --- quit: cataska (Remote host closed the connection) 04:37:14 --- join: cataska (~user@210.64.6.233) joined #forth 04:47:15 ttmrichter: haha 05:45:02 --- join: foxes (~fox@111.161.77.229) joined #forth 06:10:54 --- quit: protist (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 06:30:13 --- quit: foxes (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 07:10:32 --- quit: lazyden (Quit: lazyden) 08:13:04 --- join: kumul (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 08:27:20 --- join: Tod-Work (~thansmann@50-202-143-210-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) joined #forth 09:36:06 --- join: malyn_ (~malyn@unaffiliated/malyn) joined #forth 09:36:43 --- quit: malyn (Remote host closed the connection) 09:37:00 --- nick: malyn_ -> malyn 09:47:32 --- join: dto (~user@pool-96-252-62-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) joined #forth 10:15:54 --- quit: DocPlatypus (Remote host closed the connection) 10:34:04 --- quit: epicmonkey (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 10:37:04 --- join: DocPlatypus (~skquinn@98.195.26.149) joined #forth 10:39:35 --- quit: dto (Remote host closed the connection) 11:01:17 --- join: ncv (~quassel@79.114.79.235) joined #forth 11:01:18 --- quit: ncv (Changing host) 11:01:18 --- join: ncv (~quassel@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #forth 11:02:16 --- quit: tangentstorm (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 11:25:57 --- quit: tgunr (Quit: I'm outta here) 11:26:47 --- join: tgunr (~davec@cust-66-249-166-11.static.o1.com) joined #forth 11:39:44 --- join: epicmonkey (~epicmonke@188.134.41.112) joined #forth 12:00:40 --- join: Tod-Work_ (~thansmann@50-202-143-210-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) joined #forth 12:00:44 --- quit: Tod-Work_ (Client Quit) 12:04:42 --- quit: Tod-Work (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 12:41:08 --- quit: kumul (Read error: Operation timed out) 12:47:36 --- join: kumul (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 12:57:33 --- join: Onionnion (~ryan@adsl-68-254-161-22.dsl.milwwi.ameritech.net) joined #forth 13:26:20 --- join: Tod-Work (~thansmann@50-202-143-210-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) joined #forth 13:32:23 --- join: Nisstyre (~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre) joined #forth 13:43:20 --- quit: Nisstyre (Quit: Leaving) 13:45:34 --- join: Nisstyre (~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre) joined #forth 14:07:23 --- quit: kumul (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 14:11:16 --- join: kumul (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 14:48:35 --- quit: tgunr (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 14:52:07 --- join: tgunr (~davec@cust-66-249-166-11.static.o1.com) joined #forth 15:18:27 --- join: dto (~user@pool-96-252-62-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) joined #forth 15:30:02 --- quit: ncv (Remote host closed the connection) 15:54:12 --- join: RodgerTheGreat (~rodger@71-13-215-142.dhcp.mrqt.mi.charter.com) joined #forth 15:57:26 --- quit: epicmonkey (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 16:05:09 --- quit: Tod-Work (Quit: Leaving) 16:07:09 RodgerTheGreat: hey. your Yars Revenge inspired me to make bosses with shields: http://blocky.io/2x0ng-alien.webm :) 16:07:11 how are you? 16:07:20 not very well 16:08:10 game looks pretty neat though 16:08:21 oh, i hope you're alright. 16:08:33 I'll survive 16:10:01 you might want to check out the classic arcade game "Star Castle". Yar's revenge was originally intended as a port of that game, but the programmer realized it would be incredibly difficult. YR is the result of trying to impressionistically adapt the mechanics of that game to the 2600's capabilities 16:10:50 interesting. i will look it up 16:10:54 a programmer with the full benefit of modern debugging and development tools did a mostly faithful Star Castle port to the 2600 a few years ago, which is a neat coda 16:17:18 wow! 16:17:44 the arcade version looks sooooooo awesome 16:17:52 it's quite fun 16:18:04 very interesting to contrast it with Yar's Revenge 16:21:39 yeah. btw RodgerTheGreat i don't know if i showed you this, speaking of contrasting two related games, i wrote up a detailed analysis of 2x0ng's game design as compared with Xong. http://www.indiedb.com/games/2x0ng/news/what-is-2x0ng-all-about 16:21:50 i'll look up the 2600 port... 16:22:04 btw i would love to do a highly restricted 2600esque remake of 2x0ng :) 16:22:07 or even xong. 16:22:16 called 1x0ng :) 16:22:21 I'll mark that to read later 16:22:56 anyway. RodgerTheGreat i mentioned your underwater game to someone the other day, in addition to the yar game 16:23:30 I read a blog post once about writing scheme macros which produced 6502 assembly for the purposes of targeting the NES. You could conceivably do that on the 2600 in which case you'd win the title of "highest-level language used to develop a 2600 game" 16:23:31 i bet people would really enjoy your stuff if you picked a couple of them to promote as an indie game pack of your own 16:23:34 like your own bundle. 16:23:42 oh interesting RodgerTheGreat . 16:23:54 hm. Most of my games are really small though. 16:24:29 thats why a multi-pack of 3 would be cool 16:24:39 if you say so 16:24:39 and once you pick the 3 you could add a little more to each, i bet 16:24:47 yeah I guess 16:25:03 and market it like a retro multicart: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triple_Action 16:25:06 anyway just a thought. 16:26:25 I could make an "existential dread" multipack and combine Webscape Webigator (the game about hitting f5 on an online forum), 5 Hours of Power and my lovecraftian fairy tale picture book 16:27:15 i think they'd love your graphics 16:27:35 my picks would be forth warrior and the deep :) 16:27:44 those two probably have the best gameplay 16:27:45 my only reservation about yar is if you get sued. 16:27:52 but i bet you could make a remixed version 16:27:59 I couldn't call it "Yar's Revenge" 16:28:01 that is somewhat yar somewhat your own starcastle thing 16:28:10 hm 16:28:14 could be interesting 16:29:58 did you ever play the Dreadnaught Factor? 16:30:05 no 16:30:50 cool Intellivision game that has some commonalities with 2x0ng in that you rove over a big map with stuff shooting at you 16:31:02 also, Raid on Bungeling Bay was a great nes game by the same people i think 16:31:12 now I'm familiar with THAT game 16:31:13 of course 16:31:22 it's the reason sim city exists 16:31:47 it was for the apple II originally if I recall correctly 16:35:15 really? 16:35:19 the reason simcity exists? 16:35:24 yeah 16:35:52 brb making coffee. 16:36:02 Raid on Bungeling Bay had a dynamic world with cities, supply lines and a fairly realistic underlying model for how everything linked together 16:36:21 you could cripple enemy production by taking out power, they would slowly rebuild things, etc 16:36:46 when Will Wright was developing the level editor for the game he found it was very satisfying to play with in its own right 16:37:03 so he went on to develop it into the first Sim City 16:38:54 wow! 16:39:34 Raid on Bungeling Bay is quite unlike most other games I have played 16:39:46 in a very abstract sense it reminds me of Warning Forever 16:39:59 but still, very unique 16:40:06 i should re-play the nes version again as an adult. that's the only version i playes 16:40:18 played, and i was probably too young to understand all the subtleties. my brother was great at it tho. 16:40:25 perhaps I should consider riffing on RoBB 16:42:17 dooo eeet 16:52:08 --- join: lazyden (~lazyden@58.185.121.38) joined #forth 17:40:52 --- join: sw2wolf (~czsq888@171.216.203.226) joined #forth 17:53:34 --- quit: kumul (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 17:56:20 --- join: kumul (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 18:13:56 --- join: tangentstorm (~michal@108-218-151-22.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net) joined #forth 18:22:46 --- quit: lazyden (Quit: lazyden) 18:25:27 --- join: lazyden (~lazyden@58.185.121.38) joined #forth 18:52:06 --- join: I440r (~zhiming@71-85-199-221.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com) joined #forth 18:52:06 --- mode: ChanServ set +o I440r 19:50:53 RodgerTheGreat: have you ever tried minecraft? 19:51:16 yes, I play sometimes. Do you bring this up in relation to "computercraft" or similar? 19:52:57 RodgerTheGreat: nope i just saw you talk simcity 19:53:06 oh 19:53:32 what I can tell you about minecraft is that it was based heavily on a game called "infiniminer" 19:53:51 --- quit: rixard (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 19:54:08 which was written by a guy who wrote one of my favorite educational games: http://www.zachtronicsindustries.com/play-kohctpyktop/ 19:54:17 yes i knew that 19:54:40 just wonder if it could be build with forth and GL 19:55:07 yeah, you could certainly make something minecraft-like with forth 19:55:29 I'm not aware of any complex games written in forth using OGL but then again I'm not aware of many games written in forth period 19:55:36 its just that i found its would like a vm 19:55:38 aside from MUD scripting and my games I guess 19:56:41 i am not meaning written in forth entirly 19:57:20 what i prefer is using other lang to implement the vm and the outside services 19:57:53 then using forth to wrote the logic on the vm for its small overhead 19:58:09 like a call back for player move 19:59:27 not having a type system makes using forth as a scripting language embedded in other languages a little awkward, although not impossible 20:01:27 seems factor has type system ? 20:01:59 sw2wolf: yeah, and there's also StrongForth which has a type system 20:02:05 (although that project may be dead) 20:02:32 yesterday a friend of mine just bought a license from forth.com for SwiftForth 20:02:42 you could *add* a type system to Forth but I think you pretty much need one for sufficiently convenient and high-level interop to be a good scripting language 20:02:45 how much ? 20:03:31 RodgerTheGreat: other scripting lang like lua also dont have type system, but many games used it 20:03:46 lua has a type system, just a simple one 20:03:46 sw2wolf: 399USD, notice, both us are chinese 20:03:58 lua has strings, numbers, tables, etc 20:04:02 or should i call it dynamic type 20:04:07 yes 20:04:23 you could do that in forth too, isnt it? 20:04:42 as I said, you COULD add that to forth 20:05:09 and what I'm saying is you'd very much want to do that if you wanted to use forth for that type of application 20:06:41 yunfan: 399USD is expensive 20:06:47 ok 20:07:14 sw2wolf: yes, but not too expensive compare to lisp's suites 20:07:20 and it has sourcecode 20:08:05 in my experience forth can be pretty good for writing video games. I think it would be a lot more convenient to just write the engine in forth AND use forth as a scripting language. Then you don't get the weird impedance mismatch of trying to make forth with C++ or whatever 20:11:00 * ttmrichter keeps looking at SwiftForth, but $400 for something I'm not likely to use for real is a bit much. 20:11:00 Kind of like the GA144 eval board. 20:11:07 i have heard that story, but those days there're so many machine type while nowaday so less 20:11:44 ttmrichter: there's a fpga forth which is cool 20:11:49 and cheap 20:16:01 FPGAs, unfortunately, are not cheap. :) 20:16:33 wait , will find that 20:18:37 http://www.excamera.com/sphinx/fpga-j1.html ttmrichter here it is 20:20:09 http://www.excamera.com/sphinx/gameduino/store ttmrichter 53USD which is not so expensive 20:21:42 I mean the actual chip won't be cheap. 20:21:50 well you could still bought an spartan-3e at taobao.com which is only 128RMB 20:22:38 The problem is that for the kind of stuff I want to do, I'd likely need a Spartan 6. 20:22:43 Full-blown CPUs, etc. 20:23:14 is it? 20:23:55 One thing I want to try, as an example, is an FPGA implementation of the BEAM abstract machine for Erlang. 20:23:56 An Erlang accelerator, in essence. 20:24:23 hmm that's your specific needs 20:27:23 i have a spartan6 and am wasting it :P 20:27:37 (well i use about 17-20% of the slices so i guess it is not a total waste considering i want to expand) 20:27:56 ttmrichter: that's a very interesting project 20:28:11 RodgerTheGreat: sorry if i missed it, but how is the status of forth warrior ? 20:28:29 should i hurry up and complete my vow's requirements so i can play video games again ? 20:29:06 yunfan: That $53 doesn't include the cost of an Arduino. 20:29:20 kulp: How much did your Spartan 6 set you back? 20:29:49 --- nick: sw2wolf -> sw2wolf{away} 20:30:08 kulp: I have been distracted by some other projects 20:30:23 I'm thinking about making a semi-sequel in the same vein 20:30:33 ttmrichter: well i bought the nexys3 http://digilentinc.com/Products/Detail.cfm?NavPath=2,400,897&Prod=NEXYS3 20:30:34 like another programming puzzle game but with slightly different mechanics 20:30:36 so i guess $200 20:30:47 maybe you are elegible for the student version at $120 ? 20:30:52 RodgerTheGreat: aha 20:30:59 ttmrichter: i have own an auduino board :] 20:31:26 but this idea for a riff on raid on bungeling bay is also intriguing 20:31:31 maybe I can fit those together somehow 20:32:19 kulp: I'm more likely these days to tap my designer to make a custom board. 20:32:31 It's much cheaper than buying someone else's board. 20:38:30 ttmrichter: yes since you are in china 20:48:34 --- quit: tangentstorm (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 20:50:21 ttmrichter: lucky 20:50:41 but really your designer must like you 20:50:43 :D 20:53:38 --- join: tangentstorm (~michal@108-218-151-22.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net) joined #forth 21:03:56 Rehoy all. 21:04:14 * ttmrichter is now on his own net link instead of stealing WiFi from his school. :) 21:04:49 Man! Spartan-6 chips by themselves are 260RMB or so. 21:05:10 (XC6SLX45) 21:05:21 They go cheaper, but these seem to have far smaller slices or something. 21:07:19 --- quit: kumul (Quit: Leaving) 21:09:24 ttmrichter: does your school's network is in the education network? 21:09:45 The network is, yes, but they haven't given me the WiFi access passwords. 21:09:48 So I had to crack them. 21:10:06 --- quit: Onionnion (Quit: Leaving) 21:10:23 then you got the high speed ipv6 network, isnt it 21:10:43 Not through IPv4 routers I don't. :) 21:10:56 The WAPs I crack are all cheap routers used in individual offices. 21:11:15 Then they do something stupid like make the WPA2 passphrase be "12345678" or the same as the router name or the like. 21:12:24 Man, XC6SLX150 chips are in the 6-700RMB range. :( 21:13:16 Or even higher! Wow! Almost a thousand RMB for the most convenient form factor. :( 21:14:12 Yeah, if my hardware sales project works out then I'll be able to afford to tinker with FPGAs. 21:14:18 As things stand right now, not a chance. 21:20:47 but i just say an article from HN which described cisco use weak password auth in their router 21:21:04 i guess this could help your cracking 21:21:12 HN? Going to HN for advice about computing is like going to the hair salon for advice about investing. 21:22:39 i just search information from their feeds 21:25:08 http://arstechnica.com/security/2013/03/cisco-switches-to-weaker-hashing-scheme-passwords-cracked-wide-open/ ttmrichter 21:29:06 --- nick: sw2wolf{away} -> sw2wolf 21:41:14 --- quit: Eth|cal (Ping timeout: 257 seconds) 21:59:44 --- quit: RodgerTheGreat (Quit: RodgerTheGreat) 22:52:28 --- join: Eth|cal (~sam@ppp59-167-172-238.static.internode.on.net) joined #forth 23:46:53 --- quit: I440r (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/13.03.19