00:00:00 --- log: started forth/13.03.12 00:02:43 --- quit: epicmonkey (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 00:21:12 --- quit: obobo (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 00:21:24 --- quit: proteusguy (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 00:30:00 --- join: obobo (~chatzilla@dyn-dsl-pt-76-75-103-162.nexicom.net) joined #forth 00:33:40 --- join: proteusguy (~proteusgu@180.183.97.123) joined #forth 00:43:07 --- quit: obobo (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 00:58:10 --- join: obobo (~chatzilla@dyn-dsl-mb-98-124-28-159.nexicom.net) joined #forth 01:03:22 --- quit: obobo (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 01:10:28 --- join: epicmonkey (~epicmonke@195.206.224.58) joined #forth 01:12:14 --- join: obobo (~chatzilla@98.124.31.5) joined #forth 02:47:36 --- join: _spt_ (~steven@host-92-12-221-193.as43234.net) joined #forth 03:13:48 Anyone here played around with Forth on a 68HC11? 03:14:44 --- quit: _spt_ (Changing host) 03:14:44 --- join: _spt_ (~steven@unaffiliated/-spt-/x-5624824) joined #forth 03:19:41 <_spt_> no sorry 03:31:12 --- join: obobo_ (~chatzilla@dyn-98-124-5-14.nexicom.net) joined #forth 03:32:50 --- quit: obobo (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 03:32:50 --- nick: obobo_ -> obobo 03:53:25 rixard: even didnt heard of that, but assume from the name its a chip from PIC? 03:53:55 oops , i am wrong, its from freescale :[ 04:04:32 --- quit: _spt_ (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 04:10:35 Motorola, dammit! 04:10:38 * ttmrichter grumps. 04:10:48 rixard: Yes, I did, many, many, many moons ago. 04:42:23 yunfan: yeah it was a mcu from Motorola (and then the company was split into blabla and Freescale). It is somewhat compatible with the 6800-series as far as I know. 04:42:50 Well, I am looking for a nice CPU to start learning Forth in an embedded setting. 04:43:21 rixard: STM8, AVR, etc. etc. etc. 04:43:37 I'm actually in the (very slow) process of making a Forth for the STM8. 04:43:39 Which one would you recommend? 04:43:49 oh, I am not familiar with the STM8 though. 04:43:59 --- quit: newcup (*.net *.split) 04:44:00 Seriously? These days? Almost any one would be fine. 04:44:39 But the AVR gets around a lot. 04:45:07 For example the very popular Arduino is an AVR. 04:46:11 One thing you might want to do is get a selection of cheaper eval boards for a bunch of processors. 04:46:22 Wow, these small chips (AVR) has a lot of neat things in them: PWM output, D/A converters etc 04:46:36 Most modern MCUs do. 04:46:43 The STM8s are crammed to the gills too. 04:47:49 But if you get the cheap eval boards (the STM8L-Discovery, for example, is under $10) you can play with loads of fun things. 04:48:34 That is a very reasonable price to get my hands dirty. Uhm, how for along have you come with getting Forth up and running on the STM8? 04:49:53 Well, I only did the planning then got distracted by some other work (on an STM32F107). 04:50:13 So I haven't actually hit a line of code yet. 04:50:35 If I had an uninterrupted week I'd have it built. (Now that I have a USB/Serial bridge.) 04:50:59 What do you use Forth and mcu's for if I may ask? 04:51:23 Now? Nothing, though that may change in the near future. 04:51:49 But in the past I used, get this, an HC11 for the switching component of a telephony interface board. 04:52:05 using Forth? 04:52:09 Yes. 04:53:11 This is the eval board for the STM8 that I have, incidentally: http://www.st.com/web/catalog/tools/FM116/SC959/SS1673/PF250636 04:53:29 It's a fun little toy. 04:54:08 Ah, sorry. $11. 04:54:13 ;-) 04:54:40 Actually STMicroelectronics has a lot of cool eval boards in their *Discovery line. 04:54:49 All of them between $7 and $15. 04:55:47 what is a SWIM connector, i.e how do you connect it to a terminal (desktop machine) 04:56:11 the power seems to be drawn from USB, but is there serial data over USB too? 04:56:19 For debugging yes. 04:56:27 Speaking of discorevery boards... Did you decide to go for it with the GA144 chip, ttmrichter ? 04:56:37 tangentstorm: Still haven't decided. 04:56:41 Very probably, yes. 04:56:52 I have been looking at the GA144 too, but I suspect it is very hard to program? 04:57:18 I have no idea. No affordable kit for it yet. :( 04:57:25 * tangentstorm would love to program for it. 04:57:37 I took the course and messed around with the simulator in colorforth. 04:57:44 It seems neat. 04:58:20 And you can run the higher level polyforth thing on it if you want to abstract the low level crazyness away. 04:58:39 didn't they offer a board together with some manufacturer? 04:58:47 rixard: The board is $450. 04:58:55 I don't have that kind of cash to drop on a hobby. 04:59:04 it wasn't that expensive, do you did have to solder the surface mounted CPU yourself 04:59:13 hmm, let's see if I can dig up that link. 04:59:57 yeah. schmartboard, rixard 05:00:05 http://www.schmartboard.com/index.asp?page=products_csp&id=532 05:00:08 yeah :D I just found it. 05:00:40 Oh, the Schmarboard. 05:00:46 That's just a break-out board, isn't it? 05:00:49 ttmrichter's considering making a little pre-assembled thing 05:00:59 One that doesn't actually have any fun components? 05:01:08 it has holes ;) 05:01:10 that's it 05:01:12 I'm considering making something like the STM*-Discovery boards for the GA144. 05:01:17 Yeah, a break-out board. 05:01:22 Gives you access to the pins and nothing else. 05:01:30 and you have to solder it together yourself 05:01:45 like the chip and the board aren't even together 05:02:08 That's not much of a barrier from what I remember of the Schmartboard. 05:02:17 It's made to be seriously simple to solder. 05:02:34 I saw someone on youtube showing how it's done. 05:02:43 Not something for a beginner though. 05:02:56 it looked easy enough in the video, but iirc, the comments were all people saying how hard it was 05:04:20 I'm considering this GA144-Discovery board as a $35 or so eval board targeting the hobbyist. 05:04:32 I'd buy it ;-) 05:05:14 Have some onboard components for fun (LEDs, some kind of sensor, some kind of display, etc.) and have all the meaningful pins broken out on posts for easy access with jumpers. 05:05:41 how much does the GA144 cost? 05:05:48 Only the CPU (collection of CPUs) 05:05:48 $20 05:05:56 but you have to buy 10 so $200 05:06:12 yeah, well, such a eval board is what I am looking for. 05:06:26 If I can wrap my head around arrayforth 05:06:33 :) 05:06:46 I have used regular forth on desktop computers and emulated jupiter ace. That's it. No embedded Forth at all. 05:07:15 Embedded is where Forth shines IMO. 05:07:43 Yeah that makes total sense. 05:08:02 I have been playing around a little with LISP (Common LISP) and it seems so huge in comparison to Forth. 05:08:19 I also loved it on the older "Big Iron" machines (like the Interdata Model 70, etc.) as a way to explore the hardware in very small spaces. 05:08:42 I have read that systems like that supported multiple users right? 05:08:44 well.. to be fair, if you compared the original schemes to ANS Forth, you might have the opposite reaction :) 05:09:18 I haven't looked at any of the Schemes yet so, I might have to take that back later on ;-) 05:09:39 Too me, Lisp and Forth seem kinda similar. 05:09:46 In some ways. 05:10:22 I originally kind of dismissed forth because i just assumed it was a backwards lisp. 05:10:37 rixard: If you can have multi-user time sharing on a PDP-8, you can have multi-user time sharing on *ANY* modern CPU. :D 05:10:58 the PDP-8 was a 36-bit machine? 05:10:58 --- quit: goingretro (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 05:11:01 like the PDP-10? 05:11:03 12-bit. 05:11:07 I keep getting them mixed up, oh. 05:11:20 They're sort of mirror images of each other in a lot of ways i think, more than just syntax... 05:11:37 The Lisps are more elegant than Forth. 05:11:41 Forth is more fun. By far. 05:12:20 I'll think I'll keep learning Lisp on the side though, I hope Forth won't mind. 05:12:51 More languages you learn, the more and better ways you have to think. 05:13:23 Yeah, what I like about LISP is that I don't have to care about certain stuff, just (+ 1 33 54 65 1 2 3 8) 05:13:43 but I can see why the Forth way is a lot better suited to small and less powerful systems. 05:13:50 More like assembler. 05:14:03 so I find them both quite interesting 05:16:04 Anyway, sorry for the Lispy detour. Good luck with the GA144 eval board, looks like a very interesting project. 05:16:06 Well, IMO, any decent Forth has an assembler built int. :) 05:16:28 yeah 05:19:26 Well, I'm off for now, talk later. 05:20:46 Chat later. 05:21:54 --- join: Fox78 (~fox@125.39.68.42) joined #forth 05:24:22 --- join: foxes (~fox@111.161.77.250) joined #forth 05:27:41 --- quit: Fox78 (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 05:37:41 --- quit: foxes (Quit: 暂离) 05:37:49 --- quit: Bahman (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 05:39:30 --- quit: dTal (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 05:43:00 --- quit: proteusguy (Remote host closed the connection) 06:45:43 --- join: protist (~protist@192.224.69.111.dynamic.snap.net.nz) joined #forth 06:47:03 --- join: dto (~user@pool-96-252-62-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) joined #forth 06:47:09 HELLO! 06:52:25 Ahoy. 07:21:19 --- join: nighty^ (~nighty@static-68-179-124-161.ptr.terago.net) joined #forth 07:40:00 --- join: kumul (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 07:50:05 --- quit: dto (Remote host closed the connection) 08:00:46 --- join: proteusguy (~proteusgu@ppp-58-8-83-194.revip2.asianet.co.th) joined #forth 08:16:34 --- join: Tod-Work (~thansmann@50-202-143-210-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) joined #forth 08:17:12 --- join: Nisstyre-laptop (~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre) joined #forth 08:55:00 --- quit: nottwo (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 08:55:07 --- join: nottwo (~trannie@nottwo.org) joined #forth 08:59:47 --- quit: nighty- (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 09:12:55 --- quit: protist (Quit: Konversation terminated!) 09:13:02 --- quit: Nisstyre-laptop (Ping timeout: 257 seconds) 09:43:11 --- join: Onionnion (~ryan@adsl-68-254-161-22.dsl.milwwi.ameritech.net) joined #forth 09:50:11 --- quit: tangentstorm (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 10:25:45 --- quit: epicmonkey (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 10:33:48 --- join: _spt_ (~steven@unaffiliated/-spt-/x-5624824) joined #forth 10:37:12 I hope my daughter is asleep now, she's been tricky lately. Pretending to be asleep and then bursting out of her room... 10:38:14 tricky tricky 10:42:09 she did it again 10:42:14 --- join: goingretro (~goingretr@host86-155-215-196.range86-155.btcentralplus.com) joined #forth 10:42:37 Anyone used the Canon Cat btw? 10:42:56 <_spt_> velcro tape is waht you need 10:43:03 or duct tape ;-) 10:43:03 <_spt_> *what 11:13:12 I'd like to see a Canon Cat emulator! 11:13:44 Yeah, I've never used it, but it looks like a nice system. I found out about it just because of Forth. 11:14:09 likewise here 11:18:35 <_spt_> Canon Cat a USA machine only? not seen one in the UK 11:19:13 It sold poorly, and was out of the market within 6 months or something like that. Not sure if it was even released over here in Europe. 11:28:57 --- quit: proteusguy (Quit: Leaving) 11:54:22 --- join: epicmonkey (~epicmonke@188.134.41.112) joined #forth 12:20:05 huh, I wonder if I ever heard of those. 12:23:07 --- part: _spt_ left #forth 12:29:38 --- join: Nisstyre-laptop (~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre) joined #forth 12:32:28 --- join: ncv (~quassel@92.83.227.80) joined #forth 12:32:28 --- quit: ncv (Changing host) 12:32:28 --- join: ncv (~quassel@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #forth 12:59:02 --- quit: ncv (Remote host closed the connection) 13:19:25 --- quit: bjorkintosh (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 13:19:52 --- join: bjorkintosh (~bjork@ip68-13-229-200.ok.ok.cox.net) joined #forth 13:20:25 --- quit: Nisstyre-laptop (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 13:30:11 --- quit: goingretro (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 13:34:20 --- join: itsy (~digital_w@87.115.125.6) joined #forth 13:34:43 --- quit: impomatic (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 13:35:49 --- quit: itsy (Client Quit) 13:38:31 --- join: itsy (~digital_w@87.115.125.6) joined #forth 13:48:42 --- nick: itsy -> impomatic 14:11:14 --- quit: kumul (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 14:11:42 --- join: kumul (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 14:19:26 --- join: JDat (JDat@89.248.91.5) joined #forth 14:37:57 --- join: beretta (~beretta@cpe-107-8-120-203.columbus.res.rr.com) joined #forth 14:57:53 --- quit: beretta (Quit: Leaving) 15:35:39 --- quit: JDat (Quit: Remember! Big brother still watchin You!) 15:36:34 --- join: kumool (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 15:39:14 --- join: dto (~user@pool-96-252-62-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) joined #forth 15:39:18 --- quit: kumul (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 15:43:24 --- join: ncv (~quassel@92.83.227.80) joined #forth 15:43:24 --- quit: ncv (Changing host) 15:43:24 --- join: ncv (~quassel@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #forth 15:45:18 --- join: kumul (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 15:47:28 --- quit: kumool (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 15:55:52 --- quit: epicmonkey (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 15:56:33 --- quit: Tod-Work (Quit: Leaving) 16:18:27 --- join: kumool (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 16:20:42 --- quit: kumul (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 16:32:04 --- join: kumul (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 16:34:35 --- quit: kumool (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 16:38:59 --- quit: nighty^ (Remote host closed the connection) 16:40:12 --- join: dto2 (~user@pool-96-252-62-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) joined #forth 16:41:05 --- quit: dto2 (Remote host closed the connection) 16:41:11 --- quit: dto (Remote host closed the connection) 16:41:53 --- join: dto (~user@pool-96-252-62-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) joined #forth 16:47:52 --- join: scott0070 (~scott@c-50-149-186-8.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) joined #forth 16:54:57 --- quit: ncv (Remote host closed the connection) 16:57:10 --- join: kumool (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 16:57:43 --- quit: segher (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 16:59:53 --- quit: kumul (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 17:04:56 --- join: segher (~segher@5ED3C8DF.cm-7-4d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) joined #forth 17:11:41 --- quit: dto (Remote host closed the connection) 17:31:54 --- join: nighty^ (~nighty@static-68-179-124-161.ptr.terago.net) joined #forth 17:52:08 --- join: mark4 (~mark4@211.sub-70-195-70.myvzw.com) joined #forth 17:52:08 --- mode: ChanServ set +o mark4 17:53:23 --- join: RodgerTheGreat (~rodger@71-13-215-142.dhcp.mrqt.mi.charter.com) joined #forth 19:12:40 --- quit: scott0070 (Quit: Leaving) 19:32:52 --- quit: Onionnion (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 20:03:22 --- join: Nisstyre-laptop (~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre) joined #forth 20:21:30 --- quit: nighty^ (Remote host closed the connection) 20:21:56 --- quit: impomatic (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 20:39:03 --- join: kumul (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 20:41:49 --- quit: kumool (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 20:47:09 --- join: tangentstorm (~michal@108-218-151-22.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net) joined #forth 21:01:44 --- join: dto (~user@pool-96-252-62-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) joined #forth 21:06:28 --- quit: RodgerTheGreat (Quit: RodgerTheGreat) 21:29:48 --- quit: Nisstyre-laptop (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 21:44:44 --- join: kumool (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 21:46:36 --- quit: kumul (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 22:08:28 --- join: Nisstyre-laptop (~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre) joined #forth 22:16:31 --- quit: dto (Remote host closed the connection) 22:39:28 --- join: kumul (~mool@c-76-26-237-95.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 22:41:48 --- quit: kumool (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 22:42:26 --- quit: kumul (Client Quit) 23:09:31 --- quit: mark4 (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 23:37:28 --- join: epicmonkey (~epicmonke@188.134.41.112) joined #forth 23:49:22 tangentstorm: are you there? 23:50:45 有个奇怪的问题 redis好像没有用libev 23:53:20 sorry, wrong channel 23:56:47 I hate it when I do that 23:57:17 DocPlatypus: you mean send msg to the wrong channel? 23:57:41 yeah 23:57:50 especially when it's not the channel's normal language. 23:59:27 well i am sorry :] its chinese characters which i think ttmrichter might could read 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/13.03.12