00:00:00 --- log: started forth/09.11.11 00:06:07 --- join: H4ns1 (n=Hans@p57BBAE98.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 00:06:07 --- join: foxes (i=flash@222.131.172.47) joined #forth 00:06:40 --- quit: kar8nga (Remote closed the connection) 00:54:40 --- quit: ASau (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 01:00:01 --- join: ASau (n=user@host116-231-msk.microtest.ru) joined #forth 01:21:51 --- join: GeDaMo (n=gedamo@212.225.108.57) joined #forth 01:34:59 --- quit: GeDaMo ("Leaving.") 02:02:19 --- join: kar8nga (n=kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net) joined #forth 02:25:20 --- quit: nighty__ (Client Quit) 03:41:03 --- quit: kar8nga (Remote closed the connection) 04:18:07 --- join: DrunkTomato (n=DEDULO@ext-gw.wellcom.tomsk.ru) joined #forth 04:32:05 --- quit: H4ns1 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 04:32:17 --- join: H4ns (n=Hans@p57BBAE98.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 04:32:33 --- quit: H4ns (Remote closed the connection) 04:45:38 --- quit: gogonkt (Remote closed the connection) 04:45:54 --- join: gogonkt (n=info@218.13.52.113) joined #forth 05:07:46 --- join: kar8nga (n=kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net) joined #forth 05:50:57 --- join: tathi (n=josh@216.227.91.166) joined #forth 05:58:47 --- join: Quartus` (n=Quartus`@74.198.8.57) joined #forth 06:27:51 --- join: GeDaMo (n=gedamo@212.225.108.57) joined #forth 07:17:40 --- join: gogonkt_ (n=info@218.13.61.206) joined #forth 07:35:02 As everyone knows, there are only 10 kinds of people: those that understand binary and those that don't. 07:38:15 --- quit: gogonkt (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 07:57:33 --- join: xjrn (n=jim@astound-69-42-10-25.ca.astound.net) joined #forth 08:06:59 --- quit: ASau ("off") 08:23:32 --- quit: Quartus` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08:46:22 --- join: qFox (n=C00K13S@5356B263.cable.casema.nl) joined #forth 09:21:51 --- join: kleinjt (n=kleinjt@tarsonis.dhcp.rose-hulman.edu) joined #forth 09:36:44 --- quit: kar8nga (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09:43:14 --- join: ASau (n=user@83.69.227.32) joined #forth 09:45:49 --- join: kar8nga (n=kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net) joined #forth 09:47:55 --- quit: Raiford_ (Client Quit) 09:47:58 --- join: Raiford_ (n=Raiford@234.157-62-69.ftth.swbr.surewest.net) joined #forth 09:48:27 --- quit: ASau (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 09:54:49 --- join: ASau (n=user@83.69.227.32) joined #forth 10:10:36 --- quit: ASau (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 11:08:10 --- quit: GeDaMo (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:08:10 --- quit: malyn (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:08:10 --- quit: nottwo (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:08:11 --- quit: yiyus (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:08:11 --- quit: maht (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:08:11 --- quit: kar8nga (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:08:11 --- quit: KipIngram (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:08:11 --- quit: nighty___ (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:08:11 --- quit: probonono (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:08:12 --- quit: madgarden (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:08:12 --- quit: saper (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:37:02 --- join: ygrek (i=user@gateway/gpg-tor/key-0x708D5A0C) joined #forth 11:47:32 --- join: saper (i=saper@wikipedia/saper) joined #forth 11:47:32 --- join: madgarden (n=madgarde@CPE001d7e527f89-CM00159a65a870.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 11:47:32 --- join: nighty___ (n=nighty@x122091.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp) joined #forth 11:47:32 --- join: KipIngram (n=kip@173-11-138-177-houston.txt.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) joined #forth 11:47:32 --- join: probonono (n=User@unaffiliated/probonono) joined #forth 11:48:02 --- join: GeDaMo (n=gedamo@212.225.108.57) joined #forth 11:48:02 --- join: malyn (n=malyn@unaffiliated/malyn) joined #forth 11:48:02 --- join: nottwo (n=trannie@designvox-gw.iserv.net) joined #forth 11:48:02 --- join: yiyus (i=12427124@je.je.je) joined #forth 11:54:06 --- quit: cce891ed (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:54:07 --- quit: aguaithegeek (sendak.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 11:54:07 --- join: cce891ed_ (n=chtr@freya.dhcp.rose-hulman.edu) joined #forth 11:54:35 --- join: aguaithegeek (n=aguai@98.142.211.123) joined #forth 12:14:13 --- join: Raiford__ (n=Raiford@234.157-62-69.ftth.swbr.surewest.net) joined #forth 12:25:29 --- quit: GeDaMo ("Leaving.") 12:27:00 --- join: GeDaMo (n=gedamo@212.225.108.57) joined #forth 12:32:23 --- quit: Raiford_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12:36:50 Wow; it's quiet around here today. ;-) 12:37:31 Maybe everyone's off looking at Go :P 12:39:09 Go the game? I'm a chess / backgammon / hold 'em man myself. 12:39:25 Go, Google's new language 12:40:33 KipIngram: are you on fibs? 12:40:49 (first internet backgammon server, yes) 12:41:09 KipIngram: Or, preferably, on ladbrokes. I'm up for some backgammon money game. 12:41:16 KipIngram: easy money ;) 12:42:13 ;-) I'm at work now; couldn't concentrate. Maybe soon, though. No, I'm not on either of those but I'll look into it. 12:42:41 I do play chess online through an organization called IECG. Haven't been doing that long, but it's fun. 12:42:53 I play via email, so I don't have to commit blocks of time. 12:43:05 oh ok. never tried that. 12:43:30 I occassionaly play on fibs.. but my client is malfunctioning at the moment. So just ladbrokes. which is better because it allows money games, and the rake is quite ok. 12:43:38 and what fun is backgammon without the money anyway, eh? 12:43:48 I luuuuuuv backgammon. 12:43:52 I dream of doubling cubes :) 12:43:59 The moves are exchanged in pgn notation, so you need some sort of software to handle your board visuals for you. 12:44:32 you should be able to do that in bigforth ;) 12:44:58 Yeah, backgammon is great. I've played since high school. I kept getting beaten, then one weekend I bought a book called "BAckgammon for Blood." Went back to school the following Monday and started winning more often than not. 12:45:18 I run Ubuntu and just installed a package called scid. Works great. 12:45:30 backgammon for blood is terrible. 12:45:44 But it does work against complete noobs :) 12:45:50 It was good for me at the time, though. I was a ninth grader I guess. 12:45:55 yeah 12:45:56 it's a classic. 12:46:00 Yes, we were all noobs. 12:46:21 If you want something that is actually good there's Magriel's "Backgammon" which is pretty much the bible, albeit a bit out of date in some positions. 12:46:25 I've still got it - pages are all yellow and crackly. 12:46:42 Sentimental value. 12:46:43 so that there bible + Backgammon Boot Camp by Trice. 12:47:03 niice (: 12:47:38 Sounds fun. I haven't actually *studied* backgammon in decades. Maybe it's time for a refresher. Especially if I intend to take your money. ;-) 12:47:57 playing 'blood' style seems to have one actually *aim* for backgames. Which is.. just.. very strange. 12:48:03 By the way, thanks for mentioning bigForth - now we can claim we're topical. 12:48:18 problem with online backgammon at moneysites is all the bots and cheating :( 12:48:29 Yeah, I do remember that aspect. 12:49:33 fibs kinda does not have it, but that's just rank play. :) I need to get my client working again and get back on there. 12:50:00 I'm a backgammon addict. My wife, otoh, does not want to play nonstop. And the darned local backgammon club only has meetings once / week. 12:50:06 oh the horror :D 12:50:10 Cheating -- I assume you mean unfair dice? 12:51:02 naaah.. by using like gnubg to tell one what move to make. 12:51:14 and gnubg is *very* good :) 12:51:26 backgammon? 12:51:31 Oh, ok. That's almost like a bot. 12:51:32 the king of games, yes 12:51:58 Yes, no one was talking about Forth and we just sort of fell into it. :-) 12:52:14 oh, find in dict 12:52:27 KipIngram: some sites, like dailygammon, has the nice feature of letting one export played games to a format readable by gnubg so one can let it analyze it for ya. very nice. 12:52:57 That'd be interesting .. writing a fibs client for bigforth or some such. 12:53:06 bigforth seems a good candidate. with the gfx being there 12:54:36 I think I need to go play some right now 12:54:39 I saw some gforth code today that hooked into gtk using ffi. 12:54:54 schme: you do have it bad, don't you? 12:55:05 KipIngram: You have noooo idea :) 12:55:09 * schme goes off to rl 12:55:22 :-) Later on. 12:58:13 BKG 9.8 13:00:30 How did Google overlook the chance to call it's new language Goo instead of Go??? 13:00:45 its 13:00:52 TD-Gammon's play was at or above the level of the top human players in the world. 0_0 13:02:06 --- nick: gogonkt_ -> gogonkt 13:02:18 I remember reading a Scientific American article way back in the '70s about a computer program for backgammon that was very good. I can't remember the details well enough to be sure, but I've always wondered if the techniques it used were forerunners of fuzzy logic. 13:02:39 darnit damn client crashed again. 13:02:46 The article used terminology like "warping" the parameter space based on other parameters, and so forth. 13:02:59 gogonkt: Yes, the software backgammon players tend to be very good. 13:03:13 KipIngram: backgammon software these days use neural networks 13:04:21 Makes sense. 13:04:28 I looking at Tamarin Tracing today 13:05:01 and google go too :) 13:05:08 gnubg, for example, is very good. General idea is to calculate which move is the best, and it learns... bots tend to have problems with backgames though. 13:06:13 well it looks like time for hacking some code to get this backgammon client working without crashing (: 13:06:17 Hmm. Just googled tamarin tracing. Looks like it'd be complicated to implement. 13:07:04 I spent the day thinking about an FPGA-based Forth processor I've been wanting to design for quite some time. 13:07:31 do it! 13:07:59 I think I will - I'm just fretting over my instruction fetching logic. 13:09:28 I'm going to 16-bit align the instruction memory. Each 16-bit word can contain either a 15-bit address (if the msb is 0) or three 5-bit primitive opcodes (if the msb is 1). 13:09:56 Sounds like Chuck's designs 13:10:15 Plus if some (largish) number of address most significant bits are all zero then it will fetch the next word from fast ram blocks in the FPGA. Otherwise it will go to main memory. 13:10:37 I guess so. I've read most everything of his I can get my hands on. He never tells it all, though. ;-) 13:10:46 :D 13:10:57 Have you been reading about his new ones? 13:11:31 Depends on how new you mean. I don't know that I've seen anything newer than three years or so. 13:12:19 Newer than that 13:12:32 What's he got going? 13:12:32 You know about the problems he had with the licensing of his chips? 13:12:39 Yes. 13:12:56 He's formed a new company 13:13:01 At least some things about it. 13:13:52 More details on http://www.colorforth.com/ 13:13:53 I remember having the impression that he got tangled up with patent trolls somehow. Honestly I never took the time to really dig into it. 13:16:20 Chuck designs at the transistor level. I want to really suck the marrow out of my FPGA, so I'll have to sculpt my processor around what my particular FPGA choice does well. 13:17:26 The stack's easy, and can scream, but it's not exactly easy to arrange to keep it fed with primitive instructions fast enough to sustain that rate. 13:17:54 http://blog.mozilla.com/dmandelin/2008/05/16/tamarin-tracing-internals-part-i/ 13:18:06 I don't know enough about hardware design :/ 13:19:05 --- quit: DrunkTomato () 13:20:09 Go to www.xilinx.com and look up info on their Spartan III FPGAs. If you know the basics of digital logic then they have some pretty informative stuff. 13:20:29 And I can answer questions if you have any, but the doc would at least get you thinking. 13:20:52 I'm afraid my brain has limited capacity and is full - every new thing I learn pushes some old knowledge out :/ 13:21:01 :-) 13:21:15 :P 13:24:45 --- join: kar8nga (n=kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net) joined #forth 13:25:34 In "A Study in Scarlett" (I think) Watson told Holmes about the heliocentric solar system theory. Holmes thought it was very interesting, and then stated he'd try to forget it as soon as possible. Same theory of brain capacity as yours. 13:26:00 So consider yourself in good company. :-) 13:27:15 If only I was as smart as Holmes :P 13:28:05 Actually, I'd be happy if I was as smart as Watson :P 13:28:27 :-) No doubt. I loved those stories. 13:55:14 --- join: asdfasd (n=email@89.180.172.244) joined #forth 13:55:29 --- join: ASau (n=user@83.69.227.32) joined #forth 13:56:23 --- quit: ygrek (Remote closed the connection) 14:01:10 --- quit: TR2N (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 14:12:27 --- quit: qFox ("Time for cookies!") 14:25:43 --- quit: kar8nga (Remote closed the connection) 14:51:56 --- quit: Raiford__ ("Leaving") 14:51:59 --- join: Raiford__ (n=Raiford@234.157-62-69.ftth.swbr.surewest.net) joined #forth 14:52:42 --- quit: Raiford__ (Client Quit) 15:24:27 --- quit: ASau (Remote closed the connection) 15:24:58 --- join: ASau (n=user@83.69.227.32) joined #forth 15:58:42 --- quit: nottwo (Client Quit) 16:37:53 --- quit: GeDaMo ("Leaving.") 16:47:52 --- join: nighty__ (n=nighty@210.188.173.245) joined #forth 17:18:44 --- join: ASau` (n=user@83.69.227.32) joined #forth 17:18:54 --- quit: ASau (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 17:47:57 --- part: cce891ed_ left #forth 18:11:49 --- part: asdfasd left #forth 18:26:56 --- quit: tathi ("leaving") 21:56:26 --- join: PoppaVic (n=pops@adsl-99-88-83-150.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net) joined #forth 22:20:39 --- join: Raystm2 (i=rastm2@c-24-8-232-212.hsd1.co.comcast.net) joined #forth 22:24:36 --- quit: ASau` ("off") 22:40:48 --- quit: xjrn (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 23:00:19 --- join: crink (n=crink@unaffiliated/crink) joined #forth 23:00:44 hi 23:01:00 what happened in colorforth? 23:11:37 crink: ? 23:14:34 yes? 23:14:45 schme? 23:15:01 crink: What do you mean "what happened in colorforth?" 23:15:21 i mean what is going on 23:15:47 news of colorforth 23:16:44 oh 23:17:06 dunno. I guess people write some code :D 23:17:23 --- join: ygrek (i=user@gateway/gpg-tor/key-0x708D5A0C) joined #forth 23:17:29 ok 23:19:57 colorforth web page updated! 23:20:01 yeah 23:24:15 --- join: ASau (n=user@host183-231-msk.microtest.ru) joined #forth 23:38:37 http://www.colorforth.com/GA.htm 23:43:14 I think that happened some time ago. 23:44:01 ga144 seems crazy enough 23:51:41 --- part: PoppaVic left #forth 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/09.11.11