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00:07:41 <andrewSC> how would i get access to the values typed before a word?
00:07:42 <andrewSC> ie
00:07:47 <andrewSC> 1 2 3 4 5 reverse
00:08:03 <andrewSC> the word reverse would then put the numbers in reverse order on the stack.
00:08:15 <andrewSC> i'm not sure how to get access to them..
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00:28:49 <andrewSC> nvm
00:28:50 <andrewSC> i got it
00:29:02 <andrewSC> kinda silly when you aren't looking at the big picture
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12:20:36 <andrewSC> hi
12:20:45 <andrewSC> is anyone active in this chan at the moment?
12:20:52 <gnomon> Just you, I think.
12:20:58 <andrewSC> haha well then..
12:21:28 <andrewSC> quick question, how could i move the last number in the stack to the front of the stack?
12:21:39 <andrewSC> say, with four numbers in the stack total?
12:21:51 <andrewSC> right now i have
12:21:53 <andrewSC> 1 4 3 2
12:22:00 <andrewSC> but i'm not sure how to move the 1
12:23:42 <tathi> You shouldn't be doing that. :)
12:24:00 <gnomon> DEPTH ROLL should do it, but tathi is right.
12:25:33 <tathi> Well, if you have some reason to do it in a specific circumstance...
12:26:12 <tathi> But in general treating the stack as a data structure is bad.
12:29:08 <gnomon> Hey, that's curious: gforth puts garbage on the TOS after: 1 4 3 2 depth roll .s
12:29:13 <andrewSC> yes
12:29:41 <tathi> depth roll is one too many
12:29:49 <tathi> I get a stack underflow exception here.
12:29:59 <andrewSC> same
12:30:05 <gnomon> Oh yeah.  Dur.
12:30:06 <andrewSC> well, it's actually a lab
12:30:12 <andrewSC> i'm working on
12:30:13 <gnomon> 1 4 3 2 depth 1 - roll .s
12:30:18 <andrewSC> but i got the reversal of 1 2 3 4
12:30:20 <gnomon> Or 1-, if you've got it.
12:30:23 <andrewSC> by useing 2swap
12:30:43 <tathi> so is the problem to reverse an arbitrary number of elements?
12:31:04 <andrewSC> yep
12:31:17 <gnomon> An arbitrary number of elements on the stack?
12:31:35 <andrewSC> i spent alot of time learning forth last night and i think doing this recursively with a variable would be the easiest thing todo
12:31:37 <andrewSC> yep
12:31:45 <andrewSC> ie: the call would be
12:31:52 <andrewSC> 1 2 3 4 5 6 reverse 
12:31:59 <tathi> hmm, possibly.
12:32:01 <andrewSC> theres no output
12:32:06 <andrewSC> then when you print the stack
12:32:12 <andrewSC> it should be something like
12:32:18 <andrewSC> .s <6> 6 5 4 3 2 1
12:32:29 <tathi> The trouble that I see is that ROLL will pull an element up from the depths, but there's no good way to put one back down.
12:32:45 <gnomon> tathi is right: you shouldn't be doing this, and your course shouldn't be teaching you that this is a good thing to do  :(
12:32:52 <andrewSC> : \
12:33:02 <tathi> Bah, whatever.
12:33:04 <andrewSC> i'll mention it to my prof. when i see him on monday
12:33:07 <andrewSC> :)
12:33:20 <tathi> If it's a problem they're setting you, you might as well have fun with it.
12:33:38 <andrewSC> anywho i must be going now.. Class at 4PM.. 
12:33:48 <andrewSC> :)
12:33:48 <andrewSC> afk
12:33:55 <tathi> It's just that doing that sort of thing has no place in good forth code. :)
12:34:03 <KipIngram> Sounds like an academic exercise to me for sure.  Even knowing how to do such a thing seems dangerous to me, though.
12:34:15 <KipIngram> If you know how to do it you might use it in a pinch. :-(
12:34:21 <tathi> hehe
12:34:47 <KipIngram> If you found yourself tempted to do such a thing then something probably went wrong much earlier in the planning of the application.
12:35:30 <gnomon> KipIngram, there's an argument to be made that the correct way of handling such a user request is not to attempt to forbid the knowledge, but merely to take advisory action when it is used.
12:35:56 <gnomon> Perhaps an electrified keyboard could be employed as a suitable tool for the output of the advice.
12:36:54 <tathi> Oops, I'm an idiot.  reverse is dead simple.
12:36:59 <KipIngram> ;-)  
12:37:50 <gnomon> Sssh!
12:38:06 <gnomon> If I'd known it was homework I wouldn't have piped up so quickly with code  :)
12:38:15 <tathi> Yeah, I wouldn't want to tempt KipIngram :)
12:38:25 <tathi> Oh, homework.  Yeah.
12:38:30 <tathi> I figured it had to be that.
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13:44:40 <andrewSC1> hi all 
13:44:42 <andrewSC1> :)
13:44:55 <andrewSC1> so is this really as easy as i think?
13:45:07 <andrewSC1> also, my apologies with the nick copy
13:45:23 <andrewSC1> i'm in class atm and my desktop back home is still logged in..
13:47:13 <andrewSC1> well actually
13:47:34 <andrewSC1> how could i swap more than six elements in the stack?
13:47:46 <andrewSC1> using 2swap limits me to six.. i think.
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13:55:51 <andrewSC1> yes
13:56:04 <andrewSC1> i've only been able to swap the first six elements in the stack..
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14:08:08 <andrewSC1> how would i grab the last element in the stack and put it on the top?
14:09:33 <gnomon> dup
14:10:58 <JasonPx> is there a way to reverse abcde to edcba without using variable?
14:12:28 <JasonPx> hmm seems like i can just tuck and drop
14:12:46 <andrewSC1> hahah
14:12:56 <andrewSC1> JasonPx...
14:13:01 <andrewSC1> again we meet..
14:13:05 <JasonPx> actually nvm
14:13:15 <andrewSC1> JasonPx, try doing more than six elements
14:13:20 <andrewSC1> tell me how it works out
14:13:25 <JasonPx> yea it wont work
14:13:27 <andrewSC1> haha
14:13:30 <JasonPx> i just notice
14:13:32 <andrewSC1> yep
14:13:39 <JasonPx> emmmmmm hmm
14:18:16 <JasonPx> andrewSC1: i dont think  it's possible with just plain loops of stack operation
14:18:31 <andrewSC1> it is
14:18:41 <andrewSC1> it has to be
14:18:54 <andrewSC1> and you can't use variables.
14:18:54 <andrewSC1> well you can but Steele will frown upon it
14:19:10 <andrewSC1> and recursion is possible but not reccomended
14:19:17 <andrewSC1> seeing as you can't really use variables
14:19:23 <andrewSC1> or shouldn't*
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15:03:01 <JasonPx> andrewSC: did you use PICK ?
15:03:12 <andrewSC> yes and no
15:03:15 <JasonPx> hahahaha
15:03:18 <andrewSC> mainly yes
15:03:20 <JasonPx> ok
15:03:26 <andrewSC> i think i need to use pick
15:03:33 <andrewSC> i haven't finished writing it yet though..
15:03:36 <JasonPx> because i cant think of anyway of doing it without pick
15:03:38 <andrewSC> just got back from class
15:03:41 <JasonPx> o i c
15:12:43 <tathi> there's ROLL also
15:15:19 <gnomon> Or you could check the length of the stack, dynmically construct a straight-line word that abuses the return stack... but that's crazy talk.
15:16:35 <andrewSC> how do you use roll?
15:16:46 <andrewSC> i've googled this and i don't get much...
15:17:15 <gnomon> It's homework, andrewSC!  You shouldn't be trying to get Google to do your homework for you.
15:17:20 <andrewSC> haha
15:17:38 <andrewSC> well, look at it this way.. I don't understand how to use a defined word in forth
15:17:47 <tathi> just type it in :)
15:17:51 <andrewSC> if it's something i might be able to use shouldn't i try and understand it
15:17:57 <andrewSC> i did i get a stack underflow..
15:17:57 <andrewSC> lol
15:18:09 <andrewSC> i also tried roll -1
15:18:14 <andrewSC> 1 roll -1
15:18:15 <andrewSC> etc
15:18:30 <tathi> nope.  Stack-based language -- put the parameters on the stack first
15:18:55 <andrewSC> mhmm
15:20:35 <tathi> play with it.  1 2 3 4  1 pick .s
15:20:40 <tathi> or 2 pick, 2 roll, 3 roll, whatever
15:20:45 <tathi> you'll get the idea
15:22:10 <gnomon> andrewSC, you may find this useful: http://forth.sourceforge.net/standard/fst83/  It's very dated, but it's a good demonstration of just how small a Forth really needs to be in order to merit the name.
15:23:47 <gnomon> Starting Forth is also an excellent tutorial: http://www.forth.com/starting-forth/
15:23:48 <andrewSC> intresting...
15:23:57 <gnomon> (though I can't find the swap dragon!)
15:26:05 <andrewSC> both links are very good!
15:26:10 <andrewSC> thank you for the share :)
15:36:23 <andrewSC> awesome
15:36:26 <andrewSC> got it working...
15:36:34 <andrewSC> super easy once i figured out the iteration
15:36:38 <andrewSC> thanks guys
16:06:33 <andrewSC> hmmmm
16:06:55 <andrewSC> does .s return all the elements on the stack or just the first 9?
16:07:03 <andrewSC> wait
16:07:06 <andrewSC> stupid question nvm
16:08:11 <andrewSC> why does .s print 9 elements at a time?
16:09:44 <JasonPx> i guess they print at some limit.. and 9 was the magic #. you can define a word to print all the items in the stack :)
16:10:22 <andrewSC> great
16:10:24 <andrewSC> lol
16:10:24 <JasonPx> i guess they want to print the # of items at a certain limit*
16:10:30 <andrewSC> mhmm
16:10:39 <andrewSC> btw gnomon, http://www.forth.com/starting-forth/sf2/sf2.html
16:10:42 <andrewSC> swap dragons!
16:10:42 <andrewSC> lol
16:19:04 <tathi> gforth only prints the first 9
16:19:20 <tathi> Other systems do differently
16:20:51 <andrewSC> i see
16:21:04 <JasonPx> can you redefine the word bye?
16:21:05 <andrewSC> thanks for the clarification tathi 
16:21:08 <JasonPx> "bye" ?
16:21:44 <ehird> ":noname ... ; is bye" works in gforth for m
16:21:44 <ehird> e
16:34:46 <gnomon> Oh nice!  Thanks, andrewSC!  For some reason I thought he appeared earlier than chapter 2.
16:43:20 <tathi> ehird: it does?
16:43:28 <ehird> For me, yes.
16:43:55 <tathi> Huh.  I get some sort of error if I try executing bye after doing that.
16:44:02 <tathi> Seems like it's not always even the same one.
16:44:05 <tathi> Interesting
16:48:01 <ehird> tathi: what error?
16:48:20 <ehird> hmm
16:48:22 <ehird> invalid memory address
16:48:24 <ehird> interesting
16:48:25 <ehird> me too
17:06:29 <tathi> I got illegal instruction once also
17:06:38 <tathi> Makes sense, since bye isn't deferred
17:06:59 <tathi> Presumably `is`, like most things in Forth, just doesn't check.
17:07:00 <ehird> well
17:07:04 <ehird> : bye 2 ; works in gforth :-P
17:07:12 <tathi> oh, sure, you can redefine it.
17:07:20 <ehird> 00:21 JasonPx: can you redefine the word bye? 
17:07:21 <ehird> was the q
17:07:44 <JasonPx> ehird: didn't bother.. was just asking :\
17:07:50 <ehird> :-)
17:07:51 <tathi> yeah.  I was just startled by you saying that `is bye` worked.
17:07:57 <ehird> I thought it did
17:08:04 <ehird> as I thought the error was in my redefined code
17:08:17 <ehird> but yeah -- : bye ." hello world" cr ; redefined bye   ok
17:08:18 <ehird> bye hello world
17:08:19 <ehird>  ok works fine.
17:20:54 <JasonPx> hey guys im working on vector execution and i try ' bye pointer ! based on http://home.iae.nl/users/mhx/sf9/sf9.html
17:20:58 <JasonPx> and it doesnt work - -
17:25:53 <JasonPx> andrewSC: for eval.fs, do we just create simple functions ?
17:31:45 <tathi> what does it do instead of working?
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19:19:29 <KipIngram> Anybody that's on right now ever done an FPGA-based Forth hardware processor?
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21:21:22 <andrewSC> hi everybody!
21:57:20 <andrewSC> :(
22:00:36 <slava> hi
22:01:34 <andrewSC> is it possible to create an array of functions?
22:01:37 <andrewSC> like say i have
22:01:43 <andrewSC> : a ." a " ;
22:01:46 <andrewSC> oops
22:01:59 <andrewSC> : a ( -- ) ." a " ;
22:02:00 <andrewSC> yes
22:02:05 <andrewSC> and then before that
22:02:16 <andrewSC> create alpha a ,
22:03:47 <andrewSC> i'm not too sure how to store the functions in an array..
22:05:55 <madgarden> You just did
22:06:06 <slava> pretty much
22:06:16 <madgarden> An array of 1 cell containing an XT for the word you want to execute
22:06:18 <slava> except maybe you meant ' a ,
22:06:26 <andrewSC> hmmm
22:06:28 <madgarden> Yeah
22:06:34 <andrewSC> let me try that
22:06:38 <madgarden> So... create alpha ' a , ' b , ' c ,
22:06:41 <madgarden> There, array of 3 words
22:06:46 <andrewSC> ahh i was forgetting the ticks
22:08:59 <andrewSC> that and i placed the array at the top of the file
22:09:11 <andrewSC> instead of after all the little functions i wrote
22:16:22 <madgarden> Forth is rad, eh? RAD!
22:16:49 <andrewSC> it's excellent.
22:16:54 <andrewSC> =>
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22:17:15 <madgarden> :D
22:26:13 <andrewSC> how about this.
22:26:20 <andrewSC> i have one integer on the stack
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22:26:28 <andrewSC> i want to do two comparisons
22:26:30 <andrewSC> ie:
22:26:38 <andrewSC> -1 > 
22:26:48 <andrewSC> 24 <
22:26:54 <andrewSC> i can't use and can i?
22:27:00 <andrewSC> perhaps dup?
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22:29:15 <andrewSC> great.
22:34:49 <slava> dup -1 > swap 24 < and
22:42:07 <andrewSC> yes yes
22:42:13 <andrewSC> thanks slava 
22:42:21 <andrewSC> :)
22:42:26 <andrewSC> how about this one..
22:42:33 <andrewSC> i have 26 values in my array
22:42:41 <andrewSC> i want to access the 23rd one
22:42:53 <andrewSC> the array name is alphabet
22:42:59 <andrewSC> right now im at
22:43:18 <andrewSC> alphabet cell+ @
22:43:26 <andrewSC> which stores the address to the function on the stack
22:43:33 <andrewSC> then i call execute 
22:43:40 <andrewSC> which executes the function
22:43:50 <andrewSC> however, i'm not sure how to get to the 23rd one .. lol
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23:04:05 <andrewSC> nvm got it
23:04:13 <andrewSC> cells
23:04:17 <andrewSC> is the key word here ;)
23:08:11 <andrewSC> I must say forth is quite unreal.
23:08:32 <andrewSC> doesn't take much to understand it and at the same time it's hella powerful
23:08:32 <gogonkt> :D
23:09:01 <gogonkt> forth quit diferent than others
23:09:09 <andrewSC> Definitely preferred over scheme ;)
23:09:14 <andrewSC> indeed
23:09:43 <gogonkt> more closely to hardware
23:10:36 <andrewSC> oh yeah...
23:10:53 <andrewSC> i'm currently writing MIPS ASM so i know all about that hardware level....
23:10:54 <andrewSC> haha
23:11:29 <gogonkt> nice
23:12:15 <andrewSC> yep
23:14:26 <andrewSC> how many bytes are in a cell?
23:14:58 <andrewSC> or is the size of a cell of arbitrary value (ie: whatever is in it determines the size)
23:15:41 <gogonkt> 8bit/16bit/32bit/64bit
23:15:55 <andrewSC> mhmm
23:16:15 <gogonkt> x2 for double cell
23:17:05 <gogonkt> which one u used?
23:17:47 <andrewSC> 32bit
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23:39:50 <andrewSC> “Knock, knock.”
23:39:50 <andrewSC> “Who’s there?”
23:39:50 <andrewSC> very long pause….
23:39:50 <andrewSC> “Java.”
23:39:53 <andrewSC> hahah
23:39:58 <andrewSC> thought i would share..
23:42:10 <gogonkt> ....
23:43:54 <andrewSC> hahah
23:44:09 <andrewSC> makes me chuckle
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