00:00:00 --- log: started forth/08.10.09
03:19:05 --- nick: Malfermi1aKodo -> Malfermitakodo
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09:08:48 <gogonkt> sould I lean factor?
09:08:58 <ASau> What for?
09:09:35 <gogonkt> write script for daily use
09:09:47 <ASau> What prevents doing it in Forth?
09:10:35 <gogonkt> dont know :(
09:10:47 <ASau> Better learn how to do it in Forth.
09:11:09 <gogonkt> hoho,it seem a big libs
09:11:16 <ASau> When you find easy way, you'll understand, that it doesn't differ in any way.
09:11:28 <ASau> You don't even need huge libs for that.
09:11:59 <ASau> Actually, writing your own bindings for Factor and for Forth hardly differs much.
09:12:29 <gogonkt> reading TF,it made me faint,Im leaning new thing
09:12:36 <gogonkt> oh
09:14:01 <gogonkt> Thx U for your words :)
09:15:32 <ASau> I have one-liner script in my ~/bin to simplify starting of Forth-written scripts:
09:15:54 <ASau> exec gforth init.fs "$@"
09:15:57 <ASau> Hm.
09:16:00 <ASau> That's a bug.
09:16:14 <ASau> It should be ${1:+"$@"}
09:16:20 <ASau> Obviously.
09:17:23 <gogonkt> ha!
09:18:02 <ASau> And, of course, I set GFORTHPATH appropriatly,
09:18:10 <ASau> this is done from .profile
09:18:20 <gogonkt> well
09:18:50 <gogonkt> how many years U use forth?
09:19:38 <ASau> I think, 5 or 6.
09:20:00 <gogonkt> WOW
09:20:46 <ASau> Take good advice, save your time.
09:21:14 <ASau> If you're going to continue using Forth, just start writing useful programs in it right now.
09:21:36 <ASau> Unfortunatly, nothing teaches you except experience.
09:21:42 <ASau> Especially in Forth.
09:22:00 <gogonkt> take that to my nots
09:22:07 <gogonkt> notes
09:22:20 <ASau> And you ought to write programs useful to _you_ personally.
09:23:02 <ASau> Otherwise you're losing time on shell, perl, and other crap.
09:24:13 <gogonkt> well,do that shell should do in Forth?
09:25:15 <ASau> Yes.
09:25:49 <ASau> Try writing you scripts, which you'd write in shell or perl, in Forth.
09:25:54 <gogonkt> Its hard,but made me think and learn :)
09:28:30 <gogonkt>  exec gforth init.fs  ${1:+"$@"}
09:28:37 <gogonkt> right?
09:30:09 <ASau> Yes.
09:30:22 <gogonkt> gogonkt@andLinux:~$ ./forth 
09:30:23 <gogonkt> *the terminal*:0: File I/O exception
09:30:23 <gogonkt> Backtrace:
09:30:23 <gogonkt> $B7A2F868 throw 
09:30:23 <gogonkt> $B7A2E1E8 required 
09:30:24 <gogonkt> $1 
09:30:27 <gogonkt> buggy
09:30:49 <ASau> Do you have that "init.fs" file?
09:31:02 <gogonkt> where it it?
09:31:18 <ASau> Somewhere in your GFORTHPATH.
09:31:31 <ASau> Read info how gforth starts.
09:31:42 <gogonkt> you write that?
09:31:49 <ASau> Yes.
09:31:54 <gogonkt> all right
09:32:49 <ASau> E.g. export GFORTHPATH=${HOME}/forth:`gforth -e "fpath .path bye" | sed "s/ $//;s/ /:/g"`
09:32:58 <ASau> Hm.
09:33:04 <ASau> I should rewrite it in Forth.
09:37:20 <gogonkt> init.fs for mine word?
09:38:27 <ASau> Yes.
09:40:48 <gogonkt> yes,in my ~/
09:41:01 <gogonkt> yes,in my ~/init.fs
09:43:03 <gogonkt> done :D
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10:16:54 <ASau> Pauli?
10:17:00 <ASau> Will we see Bohr here?
10:17:27 <gnomon> Always Pauli and Bohr. Everyone forgets about Rutherford.
10:17:39 <ASau> Nah.
10:17:48 <ASau> Rutherford did less. :p
10:20:26 <gogonkt> :)
10:20:45 <josef_pauli> ASau: some one had registered jp before I arrived; I came for help with gforth's general files words
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10:32:07 * josef_pauli greets forther : may be you have experience with gforth's general files wordset
10:35:03 * josef_pauli stumbles at gforth's file-fu: create-file, flush-file, write-file, close-file & such; 
10:35:07 <josef_pauli> using linux' follow: tail -f <follow'd_file>
10:35:09 <josef_pauli> ... after: ls >> <follow'd_file>
10:35:12 <josef_pauli> ... tail shows concatenation
10:35:14 <josef_pauli> gforth's write-file seems not to alert tail of its concatenation
10:35:17 <josef_pauli> ( even though I can read the file)
10:35:19 <josef_pauli> ... some times querying file-position awakens tail to write-file's work
10:35:22 <josef_pauli> ... 0 0 test-file resize-file ( almost) always gets tail's attention
10:36:43 <forther> do you have \n -s in your gforth output?
10:46:39 <josef_pauli> I type: s" some text" test-file write-file
10:46:39 <josef_pauli> ... I recognise /n as newline; I might use it instead of file-emitting 10 & 13
10:46:39 <josef_pauli> ... which I did not try, except after initial failure
10:46:39 <josef_pauli> please ?what is-s
10:49:38 <forther> multipple \n
11:07:20 * josef_pauli files -s ( thx)
11:07:43 <josef_pauli> now to try -- during next break
11:10:20 <ASau> see newline
11:10:24 <ASau> newline type
11:10:40 <ASau> This works across posix-canonical border.
11:11:19 <ASau> Use "flush-file" to flush buffers.
11:11:48 * josef_pauli notes downrightly struck slash before n
11:13:34 <josef_pauli> tail: "Print  the last 10 lines of each FILE to standard output."
11:13:34 <josef_pauli> ... how ever many lines, may be only completed lines
11:13:34 * josef_pauli hopes for a simple leap forward
11:13:34 <josef_pauli> ... thankful & hopeful I
11:14:10 <josef_pauli> ASau: I had tried flush-file, but I didn't see tail following
11:14:46 <ASau> I've lost the track then.
11:14:53 <ASau> Retransmit.
11:15:00 <ASau> Hrm.
11:15:05 <ASau> Elaborate. %]
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11:47:21 <josef_pauli> ASau: $JOB has most of my attention
11:47:24 <josef_pauli> I had tried using "tail -f <file_to_tail>" to record my use of:
11:47:24 <josef_pauli> s" some text" test-file write-file
11:47:24 <josef_pauli> ... even though "less test-file" showed the text I'd written
11:47:24 <josef_pauli> ... tail were not following
11:47:24 <josef_pauli> re-reading "man tail": I conclude that tail follows only completed lines
11:47:26 <josef_pauli> ... and that including "\n" to a string's end will let write-file alert tail
11:49:39 <ASau> Use "write-line".
11:49:45 <ASau> Then.
11:49:53 <ASau> ?
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11:55:26 * josef_pauli will try write-line, thanks
11:55:28 <josef_pauli> www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/forth/gforth/Docs-html/General-files.html#General%20files <-- may be there's a page like this with more commentary
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12:22:56 <ASau> josef_pauli: most of words there are described in the standard.
12:23:28 <ASau> josef_pauli: since the draft is publicly available, that's not needed.
12:23:55 <ASau> josef_pauli: upcoming standard is going to be MIT or BSD licensed, AFAIR.
12:31:21 <josef_pauli> http://www.bellevuelinux.org/mitlicense.html <-- permits privitization of value-added opensource
12:34:24 <ASau> AND THAT IS GOOD.
12:37:25 <josef_pauli> value connotes benefit
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13:11:21 <mark4> asau they are going to license the set of words that the standrd defines? therefor if your app uses ANY words defined in the standard YOU have to apply their license to your code?
13:11:53 <mark4> i call bs on that one lol
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15:47:55 <josef_pauli> http://www.taygeta.com/forth/dpans11.htm <-- optional file-handling words with commentary
15:55:33 <tathi> yup
15:56:15 <tathi> Did you solve your problem, then?
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16:23:52 <josef_pauli> tathi: to the extent that I can reliably write & read files, yes
16:23:52 <josef_pauli> ... I wanted, though, to drive irssi with a text-file
16:23:52 <josef_pauli> "irssi -c irc.freenode.net < test-file" would not start
16:23:52 <josef_pauli> ( in a channel on slashnet.org)
16:23:52 <josef_pauli> 23:59 <%Screwtape> jp: irssi might contain code that (deliberately) explodes if stdin is not a terminal.
16:23:55 <josef_pauli> 00:03 <%Screwtape> In fact, that code might just be ncurses (or slang, or whatever irssi uses)
16:23:58 <josef_pauli> ... boo-hoo
16:24:01 <josef_pauli> but I can reliably write & read files
16:24:04 <josef_pauli> ... a chat-bot might not come so cheaply interfaced as I'd hoped; but may be soon some thing other
16:26:17 <tathi> Ah.
16:26:24 <tathi> IRC is pretty easy to do.
16:26:35 <tathi> Have you seen Marcel Hendrix's minimal IRC client in Forth?
16:27:31 <Malfermitakodo> links?
16:28:32 <tathi> don't remember: googling...
16:29:13 <gnomon> Isn't that client still in occasional development?
16:29:44 <tathi> I dunno if he's doing anything new with it.
16:30:05 <tathi> He pops in here with it occasionally, though I don't think I've seen him for a while.
16:30:08 <tathi> http://home.iae.nl/users/mhx/pipes%26socks.html
16:30:10 <tathi> probably here
16:30:34 <tathi> He may have posted the code to c.l.f. also, I'm not sure.
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16:42:03 <josef_pauli> tathi: me follows link, and forsees a very many arguably simple steps... but thanks tathi for path-finding
16:45:14 <mark4> or you could look at the isforth irc bot lol
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16:48:48 <josef_pauli> http://www.wlug.org.nz/Forth <-- mark4 : "The next example is a utility word from the IRC bot in ISForth." -- steps, thanks
16:54:25 <josef_pauli> behind wanting ez-access to irssi ( on account of its ez-access to ssh), I wanted a game-bot that would
16:54:28 <josef_pauli> ... create & maintain a game-space
16:54:31 <josef_pauli> ... register players
16:54:33 <josef_pauli> ... interpret players chat as play
16:54:47 <josef_pauli> ... report on game
16:54:47 <josef_pauli> s/players/players'/
16:58:15 <tathi> mark4: oops, forgot about isforth. :)
16:58:40 <tathi> wait, have you put up a new site for isforth yet?
16:59:42 <tathi> oh, orangetide has it
17:01:07 <JasonWoof> irc is very easy
17:01:11 <JasonWoof> I did it in perl from scratch
17:01:55 <mark4> i have a friend who will host it and HIS machine is actually hosted by forth inc lol
17:02:28 <mark4> but ive not worked on a new site yet, was thinking of learning php and making a decent site for it....
17:04:20 <JasonWoof> josef_pauli: you want a chat room that is a game? or just private /msg with the bot?
17:13:04 <josef_pauli> JasonWoof: the bot might keep separate spaces in different rooms, or multiple games in a single room -- it would be the bot keeping score; chat's just an interface to the game
17:20:41 <JasonWoof> josef_pauli: have you seen #idlerpg ?
17:21:12 <tathi> heh
17:22:43 <JasonWoof> http://idlerpg.numist.net/newdlebot/
17:39:53 <josef_pauli> JasonWoof: years ago, when I had more-reliable access to internet, I rose to a single-digit rank
17:40:20 <josef_pauli> ... I want, though, a game that would reward "play"
17:50:07 <JasonWoof> hehe
17:56:11 * josef_pauli applies his laser-like focus to the game-end for a while ( manyana, may be back -- again, thanks)
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19:16:51 <gogonkt> mhx's irc client? whait...
19:25:29 <gogonkt> I had download it at http://home.planet.nl/~josv/msources.html
19:26:28 <gogonkt> itools2 at mhx site is more new I think
19:39:03 <gogonkt> http://home.iae.nl/users/mhx/pipes%26socks.html
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21:40:36 <LOOP-HOG> hi
21:42:32 <LOOP-HOG> anybody home?
21:42:40 <slava> yo
21:42:58 <LOOP-HOG> I am in a weird mood
21:43:30 <LOOP-HOG> what is going on with you?
21:44:16 <slava> eating a late dinner
21:45:03 <LOOP-HOG> I already ate
21:45:12 <LOOP-HOG> I am about ready to write a proposal for a website project
21:45:17 <LOOP-HOG> the thing is, this lady is nuts
21:45:44 <LOOP-HOG> What do you think about the economy?
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22:07:10 <LOOP-HOG> oh, the economy can't be doing too bad if we all still sitting on our butts infront of a computer and we still have food to eat.
22:07:11 <LOOP-HOG> lol
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23:26:34 <gogonkt> haha
23:26:44 <gogonkt> ate lunch
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