00:00:00 --- log: started forth/08.08.14 00:08:38 --- join: mathrick (n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk) joined #forth 00:09:05 --- join: ramkrsna (n=ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna) joined #forth 01:01:25 --- quit: craigoz ("Leaving.") 01:49:04 --- quit: TreyB (Remote closed the connection) 01:49:08 --- join: TreyB (n=trey@74.203.168.157) joined #forth 01:59:10 --- join: qFox (i=C00K13S@234pc222.sshunet.nl) joined #forth 02:00:44 --- quit: TreyB (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 02:02:27 --- join: TreyB (n=trey@74.203.168.157) joined #forth 02:08:03 --- join: Malfermi1aKodo (n=kansu@xdsl-78-34-146-130.netcologne.de) joined #forth 02:18:29 --- quit: MalfermitaKodo (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 02:22:54 --- quit: TreyB (Remote closed the connection) 02:22:58 --- join: TreyB (n=trey@74.203.168.157) joined #forth 03:06:48 --- quit: TreyB (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 03:08:46 --- join: TreyB (n=trey@74.203.168.157) joined #forth 03:23:30 --- join: aum (n=aum@60-234-243-247.bitstream.orcon.net.nz) joined #forth 03:30:12 --- quit: TreyB (Remote closed the connection) 03:30:15 --- join: TreyB (n=trey@74.203.168.157) joined #forth 04:40:49 --- quit: proteusguy (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04:41:42 --- join: proteusguy (n=proteusg@ppp-124-121-210-22.revip2.asianet.co.th) joined #forth 04:42:56 --- join: vixey (n=nono@amcant.demon.co.uk) joined #forth 05:56:39 --- quit: qFox ("Time for cookies!") 06:05:27 --- join: qFox (i=C00K13S@234pc222.sshunet.nl) joined #forth 06:41:15 --- quit: proteusguy (Connection timed out) 06:42:19 --- join: proteusguy (n=proteusg@61.7.144.97) joined #forth 07:39:30 --- nick: Malfermi1aKodo -> MalfermitaKodo 09:05:25 --- quit: vixey ("Leaving") 09:13:16 --- join: vixey (n=nono@amcant.demon.co.uk) joined #forth 09:37:13 --- quit: vixey ("Leaving") 09:43:59 --- join: vixey (n=nono@amcant.demon.co.uk) joined #forth 09:56:05 --- join: Quartus` (n=Quartus`@205.205.50.1) joined #forth 09:58:43 --- join: Maki_ (n=Maki@adsl-224-84.eunet.yu) joined #forth 10:04:11 --- join: forther (n=forther@207.47.34.100.static.nextweb.net) joined #forth 10:07:47 --- quit: ASau` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 10:07:52 --- join: BobFunk (n=mathiasc@145.pool85-54-186.dynamic.orange.es) joined #forth 11:12:24 --- quit: BobFunk () 11:12:24 --- quit: Quartus` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 11:17:33 --- join: craigoz (n=craigo@202.63.56.72) joined #forth 11:23:45 --- join: BobFunk (n=mathiasc@145.pool85-54-186.dynamic.orange.es) joined #forth 11:56:53 --- quit: BobFunk () 11:59:40 --- join: BobFunk (n=mathiasc@145.pool85-54-186.dynamic.orange.es) joined #forth 12:23:11 --- quit: vixey (No route to host) 12:24:59 --- join: ASau` (n=user@79.111.10.98) joined #forth 12:33:59 --- quit: ramkrsna ("Leaving") 12:53:49 --- join: vixey (n=nono@amcant.demon.co.uk) joined #forth 13:48:02 --- join: nighty^ (n=nighty@217.37.109.17) joined #forth 13:55:07 --- quit: BobFunk () 13:56:17 --- join: BobFunk (n=mathiasc@145.pool85-54-186.dynamic.orange.es) joined #forth 14:06:03 --- quit: madwork (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 14:25:04 --- quit: forther ("Leaving") 14:28:02 --- join: Malfermi1aKodo (n=kansu@xdsl-78-34-133-209.netcologne.de) joined #forth 14:38:35 --- quit: Maki_ ("Leaving") 14:40:24 --- quit: MalfermitaKodo (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15:51:48 --- quit: BobFunk () 16:16:22 --- join: tathi (n=josh@pdpc/supporter/bronze/tathi) joined #forth 16:16:22 --- mode: ChanServ set +o tathi 16:26:06 --- join: Pb (n=Pb@75.139.142.168) joined #forth 16:39:55 is anyone here experienced in colorforth willing to help out a newbie? 16:51:05 Don't ask abstract questions. 16:51:13 And don't ask for help. 16:51:37 If you have some particular problem, tell about it. 16:52:37 does colorforth have users apart from charles moore? 16:52:48 ASau`: alright 16:52:49 aum: yes. 16:52:51 apparently 16:53:14 i have trouble believing that :) 16:53:16 there's at least one actual company using it, from what I've read, apart from that just hobbyists 16:53:21 colorforth is crazy 16:53:39 slava: so are forth and factor. 16:54:35 ASau`: and neither one has many users :) 16:54:49 Right. 16:55:04 but developing anything in colorforth is quite a challenge, since it has no libraries, no file system, etc 16:55:11 so i'd be quite surprised to learn of any production usage of colorforth 17:00:07 --- join: BobFunk (n=mathiasc@145.pool85-54-186.dynamic.orange.es) joined #forth 17:00:43 seems lots of forth users aren't interested in production usage 17:01:34 'language as a means to an end' can quickly sail down the slippery slope to 'language as an end in itself' 17:04:15 we've both sailed down that slope, aum 17:04:24 slava: lol 17:04:52 aum: your view is skewed -- you simply don't see the 'serious" forth users 17:05:42 segher: are you talking about forth users who develop actual commercial production apps? 17:05:43 one only has to look around at the number of forth libraries and applications available to see taht there aren't that many 17:06:08 aum: s/commercial //; but yes 17:06:20 to be expected with a language whose principal feature is the ability to change its own syntax and semantics 17:06:31 yeah 17:06:32 standardising forth is like herding cats 17:06:53 well, and no implementation has enough momentum by itself 17:07:01 oh, it is useful to standardise the _basics_. 17:07:15 if aumforth became popular, you would see a large number of aumforth libraries and apps emerge 17:07:25 despite the fact that they won't run on gforth 17:07:33 i see it maybe reaching a niche, but i can't see it getting really big 17:07:48 aum: do you see that as a problem? 17:07:54 not at all 17:07:54 if you play your cards right it will be more popular than gforth, iforth and swiftforth 17:08:02 yeah, me neither 17:08:04 because all of those three have serious issues 17:09:25 in aumforth i'm being very careful to manage couplings, to keep it as modular as possible - the minimal interpreter is 7.5k 17:09:42 hell, to be better than gforth, all you need to do is maintain it 17:09:46 and make regular releases 17:09:49 hehe 17:09:51 hehe 17:10:06 I don't understand their obsession with not making releases. 17:10:19 i totally have to write a doxygen-like doc generator 17:10:37 a major part of forth usability is ease of navigating the documentation 17:10:44 you should have integrated help in the environment 17:10:48 like in factor, \ foo help 17:11:02 once i have the doc extractor working, that will be easy 17:11:13 load-extension help 17:11:15 help dup 17:12:04 tathi: from what I heard, I can tell that they don't understand engineering. 17:12:21 That's my opinion. 17:28:36 --- join: Raystm2 (i=Ray@unaffiliated/raystm2) joined #forth 17:40:44 --- part: craigoz left #forth 18:23:44 --- join: madgarden_ (n=madgarde@CPE001d7e527f89-CM00159a65a870.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 19:02:57 --- quit: BobFunk () 19:03:53 --- quit: tathi ("leaving") 19:16:31 --- quit: qFox ("Time for cookies!") 20:18:41 --- join: craigoz (n=craigo@202.63.56.72) joined #forth 20:18:55 --- part: craigoz left #forth 20:40:22 --- join: craigoz (n=craigo@202.63.56.72) joined #forth 20:40:35 --- part: craigoz left #forth 21:14:04 --- quit: Pb ("This computer has gone to sleep") 21:20:55 --- join: ygrek_away (i=user@gateway/tor/x-98bf2c775684f914) joined #forth 21:46:21 --- join: Pb (n=Pb@75.139.142.168) joined #forth 21:52:54 --- quit: Pb ("Leaving") 23:29:48 --- quit: ASau` (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 23:36:46 --- quit: ygrek_away (Remote closed the connection) 23:37:14 --- quit: nighty^ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 23:59:06 --- join: ygrek_away (i=user@gateway/tor/x-657bbd6c81c31eea) joined #forth 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/08.08.14