00:00:00 --- log: started forth/07.04.13 00:02:07 --- quit: madgarden (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 00:22:06 --- quit: ygrek (Remote closed the connection) 00:23:23 --- join: ygrek (i=user@gateway/tor/x-dc1ef1ee6bb20263) joined #forth 00:28:07 --- join: crest__ (n=crest@p5489DA86.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 00:30:29 --- join: Crest (n=crest@p5489D958.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 00:40:05 --- quit: Crest (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 00:43:19 --- quit: crest_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00:45:19 --- quit: crest__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 02:05:50 --- quit: Baughn (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 02:14:52 --- join: Baughn (n=svein@084202037191.customer.alfanett.no) joined #forth 02:45:54 --- join: Crest (n=crest@p5489FF42.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 03:13:49 --- quit: Crest (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 03:42:16 --- join: vatic (n=chatzill@pool-162-83-233-103.ny5030.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 03:50:57 --- join: ASau (n=user@ggsn2inet1.beelinegprs.ru) joined #forth 04:11:48 --- quit: ASau ("ERC Version 5.0.1 $Revision: 1.726.2.3 $ (IRC client for Emacs)") 04:43:57 --- quit: Baughn ("NO! Not in the cable modem!") 04:45:00 --- join: Baughn (n=svein@084202037191.customer.alfanett.no) joined #forth 04:51:03 --- quit: Baughn (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)) 04:51:09 --- join: Baughn (n=svein@084202037191.customer.alfanett.no) joined #forth 05:00:19 --- quit: gnomon (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 05:24:40 --- join: Quartus__ (n=Quartus_@209.167.5.2) joined #forth 05:42:22 --- quit: ecraven ("bbl") 05:53:39 --- join: timlarson_ (n=timlarso@65.116.199.19) joined #forth 05:57:15 --- quit: timlarson_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 05:57:37 --- join: timlarson_ (n=timlarso@65.116.199.19) joined #forth 06:12:49 --- join: azekeprofit (n=azekepro@88.204.193.148) joined #forth 06:29:49 --- quit: vatic (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 06:33:33 --- join: timlarson__ (n=timlarso@65.116.199.19) joined #forth 06:51:41 --- quit: timlarson_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 07:23:36 --- quit: Quartus__ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 07:45:52 --- quit: azekeprofit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 08:26:01 --- quit: madwork (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 08:26:02 --- join: madwork_ (n=foo@204.138.110.15) joined #forth 08:36:08 --- join: Quartus__ (n=Quartus_@209.167.5.1) joined #forth 08:42:07 --- join: brx` (n=brx@p57a79705.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 08:49:58 --- quit: brx (Success) 09:07:13 Hi. 09:34:18 --- join: yumehito (n=yumehito@b-internet.87.103.254.70.snt.ru) joined #forth 09:41:29 --- join: iano (i=me@sub26-46.member.dsl-only.net) joined #forth 10:01:31 --- join: yumehito_ (n=yumehito@b-internet.87.103.254.70.snt.ru) joined #forth 10:12:10 --- join: edrx (n=Eduardo@fosforo.k8.com.br) joined #forth 10:13:58 --- quit: yumehito (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 10:16:37 --- join: segher__ (n=segher@dslb-084-056-199-028.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 10:19:53 --- join: brx (n=brx@p57A78D87.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 10:28:05 --- quit: segher_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 10:28:19 --- quit: brx` (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 10:33:25 --- join: yumehito (n=yumehito@b-internet.87.103.254.70.snt.ru) joined #forth 10:42:15 --- quit: edrx (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 10:45:56 --- quit: yumehito_ (Connection timed out) 11:03:46 --- join: Crest (n=crest@p5489D723.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 11:11:44 hmmm 11:13:12 * JasonWoof wonders how long it'd take his computer to handle 16384 sql queries 11:13:24 they are easy ones. 11:14:19 grabbing 8 int fields by a unique int key 11:48:33 why do you use sql for such a problem? 11:49:43 --- quit: Quartus__ ("used jmIrc") 11:49:59 --- join: Quartus__ (n=Quartus_@209.167.5.1) joined #forth 12:05:08 --- join: Baughn_ (n=svein@084202037191.customer.alfanett.no) joined #forth 12:05:08 --- quit: Baughn (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)) 12:15:45 crest: if you have a big hammer, every problem looks like a nail 12:17:36 --- join: vatic (n=chatzill@pool-162-83-233-103.ny5030.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 12:25:22 Perhaps he has the data in a database with a SQL engine. 12:39:33 --- quit: ygrek () 12:52:24 --- nick: segher__ -> segher 13:02:55 --- join: brx` (n=brx@p57a7a265.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 13:06:08 --- join: brx`` (n=brx@p57A7C765.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 13:06:45 --- join: yumehito_ (n=yumehito@b-internet.87.103.254.70.snt.ru) joined #forth 13:10:29 --- quit: brx (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 13:13:16 --- quit: brx` (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 13:15:02 --- join: edrx (n=Eduardo@fosforo.k8.com.br) joined #forth 13:18:09 --- quit: yumehito (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 13:18:55 --- join: brx (n=brx@p57a7b77f.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 13:26:51 --- quit: brx`` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 13:30:05 --- quit: timlarson__ ("Leaving") 13:31:08 --- join: brx` (n=brx@p57a79fef.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 13:33:49 --- join: gnomon (n=gnomon@CPE0050eb372bdb-CM001692f57b56.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 13:34:06 I'm using SQL because it's handy from PHP 13:34:20 and I know it's horribly ineffecient for this 13:34:34 php doesn't have good support for sql 13:34:42 I'll switch to berkelydb if I have to 13:34:44 poor database-independent abstractions and no parametrized queries 13:35:04 oh, I wrote my own db apy 13:35:06 api 13:35:12 php's is aweful 13:35:20 i hate php 13:35:25 php's mysql api that is 13:35:34 it's a straight port of the C api 13:35:42 but I expect php to manage memory for me 13:35:57 everything in PHP is a straight port of a C API 13:36:03 yeah, I've recently learned javascript, and was quite suprised to find that it's a much better language than PHP 13:36:06 at least so far 13:38:28 it's really fucked how in php, stuff like "false" == 0 evaluates to true 13:38:33 or "false" == 1, i forget 13:39:11 --- quit: brx (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 13:39:50 well, duh. JavaScript is like Lisp with a C syntax. PHP is hack and fail with a C syntax. 13:40:07 JS isn't great either 13:40:43 --- quit: edrx (Remote closed the connection) 13:40:49 these days the only high level language i enjoy using is factor :) 13:40:58 Cheater. 13:41:48 yeah JS has its own problems. Like x + 1 being either 2 or 11 depending on whether x=2 or x="2" 13:42:07 i don't like implicit type conversions 13:42:30 and generally dog slow, even compared to other scripting languages 13:42:46 which is a real problem for people doing fancy ajax stuff 13:43:19 I doubt JavaScripts original designers were thinking of AJAX. Amazing that it works at all. 13:43:20 iano, that's a characteristic of the implementation, not the language. 13:43:36 apparently mozilla will have a javascript JIT soon 13:43:43 Tamarin, yup. 13:43:48 I'm very excited about this. 13:43:53 --- quit: OrngeTide (Remote closed the connection) 13:43:55 oh, that will be nice! 13:44:20 Truly. 13:44:28 Then the jsforth will be nice and fast. :) 14:01:17 yeah, PHP is crap for many reasons 14:01:50 I've finally decided to stop whining about it and just use it 14:02:08 i've decided not to use it :) 14:02:12 nice :) 14:02:17 I support that 14:02:18 the jedit.org used php for simple templating. that aws enough for me 14:02:27 --- join: OrngeTide (n=orange@orangetide.com) joined #forth 14:02:37 well, my crazy db queries take less than a seccond on my 6.5 year-old computer 14:02:48 so it wouldn't kill my server 14:04:15 I just did my first "AJAX" thing today 14:04:18 no xml though 14:04:42 I looked up on quirksmode.com how to fetch data from the server with javascript 14:04:51 javascript is faster than I thought 14:05:00 it's fast enough for I/O bound tasks 14:05:48 on my old computer, under firefox (which is notoriously slow) it takes 8K of binary data (a 256x256 bitmap) and converts it scales it up 2x and converts it into 16 128x128 pixel pngs 14:05:53 Try writing a VM in JavaScript. 14:05:56 Herk. 14:05:59 Quirk city. 14:06:04 and sticks them in as the background images of 16 divs on the page 14:06:59 I should probably do isn't the result an absurdly slow Forth? 14:17:51 Good evening, Quartus. 14:18:59 hi 14:21:57 Quartus__: yes, of course :) 14:22:38 I'm excited that I can generate graphics in javascript 14:23:05 my computer makes that grid of pngs that form a 512x512 bitmap in under a second 14:23:28 took me all night to debug the zlib encoded part of the PNG 14:28:51 --- nick: brx` -> brx 14:40:17 JasonWoof, have you played around with using a as your output area? 14:52:35 I made several VMs in JS. All for minimal esoteric languages though 14:53:13 http://www.quirkster.com/js/ 14:54:29 made for some nice visual debuggers for 2D languages like Befunge 14:55:43 JasonWoof: got a URL for that? 15:01:44 --- join: crest_ (n=crest@p5489D1DD.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 15:02:06 --- quit: Crest (Nick collision from services.) 15:02:20 --- nick: crest_ -> Crest 15:07:50 vim to the rescue: :'<,'>s/^\(.*square_.\)\(.*\)$/\10\2^M\11\2^M\12\2^M\13\2^M\14\2^M\15\2^M\16\2^M\17\2^M\18\2^M\19\2^M\1a\2^M\1b\2^M\1c\2^M\1d\2^ 15:07:53 M\1e\2^M\1f\2/ 15:08:35 NO CARRIER 15:09:13 iano: I'm going to wait to share tihs code until I verify that I can share the bits I didn't write 15:09:40 gnomon: I played with a svg+javascript example that had a 15:09:46 gnomon: mostly I just learned how it worked 15:09:52 JasonWoof: ok (and that is some nasty VIM) 15:10:06 yeah 15:10:14 I still don't have a great way to do enumerations 15:10:30 the kind of vim you clean the sink with 15:10:36 I had it enumerated in one dimension, then I wanted to expand each box to 16 15:10:43 heh 15:18:42 I see Passaniti is schooling Doty over on clf 15:19:24 --- quit: iano () 15:20:33 Has anything useful come out of CLF lately? I've only skimmed and found noise and no signal. 15:27:47 in fact some interesting discussion. 15:28:15 Usual assortment of nutjobs, too. 15:28:55 --- join: iano (i=me@sub26-46.member.dsl-only.net) joined #forth 15:29:04 --- join: brx` (n=brx@p57A791C1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 15:37:08 --- quit: brx (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15:38:39 --- join: iano_ (i=me@sub26-46.member.dsl-only.net) joined #forth 15:46:33 --- quit: iano (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 15:47:11 Speaking of nutjobs: http://natrium42.com/blog/?p=39 and have a read through Thomas Scott's posts. Sound familiar? 15:48:28 familiar? 15:48:58 Wertylicious! 15:49:34 Dubbed in Spanish: http://alt.nntp2http.com/mexico/2007/02/82b283619b79dd1bfef264178370a54f.html 15:50:25 can't view that one from here 15:50:57 ademas , usted no puedes 15:50:59 manejar nada Files ni Folders ! 15:51:00 s.o. , es totalmente automatica ! 15:51:02 No usa Esp' ni Ingles ! Ni Texto , 15:51:03 es completamente G.U.I. . 15:51:11 I think that's under five lines... ;-) 15:51:17 Ni! 15:53:26 --- nick: brx` -> brx 16:00:19 so Thomas Scott as a second aliias to watch for. 16:00:28 was it difficult to find? 16:02:56 I keep up the search at times, 10 - 15 minutes a stretch and your nutjob comment set me to it again... 16:03:34 now find Thomas Scott in... Phoenix, was it? 16:03:49 It was a Google image search: "werty opsys" 16:04:38 Oh, Phoenix? I had forgotten. Don't really pay attention to his posts now that everyone is taking them seriously. ;-) 16:05:04 One hit 16:05:28 f 16:05:32 oops 16:05:38 http://www.google.com/maps?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&safe=off&q=thomas-scott&near=Phoenix,+AZ&radius=0.0&latlng=33448333,-112073333,5638477277336369763&sa=X&oi=local&ct=authority 16:06:52 He posts "L" (Lloyd) as his middle name... 16:07:15 "Overall, this is genuinely different. Most dealer training (programs) are laid out a little differently but always cover the same things over and over again. This proved to be truly different and helpful!" 16:07:17 Thomas L. Scott, Sales Representative - Bell Ford 16:07:31 Maybe he's a used car salesman?! ;-) 16:08:45 can't be the same guy, that's a whole sentence 16:08:51 Arizona Biltmore is a pretty ritzy address! 16:09:07 Yeah, way too literate... 16:12:57 bugger 16:13:18 I s plit my png thing into lots of little ones (16x16) so I could easily tell which one people click on 16:13:27 and now the javascript takes way too long 16:13:57 guess I'll have todo that weird stuff to figure out where mouse clicks are in javascrit 16:14:07 s/t$/pt/ 16:14:33 sounds painful. Why are you chasing this goose? No other road to Rome? 16:15:18 --- join: edrx (n=Eduardo@200.217.105.241) joined #forth 16:33:45 --- join: madgarden (n=madgarde@bas2-kitchener06-1096651787.dsl.bell.ca) joined #forth 17:02:45 the new werty is great 17:02:54 " Whats left ? run for Pres of USA ? 17:02:55 or State of Calif ? " 17:03:21 Is insanity a requirement for those jobs now? 17:04:33 wasn't it always? 17:04:41 Only if you want it done badly. 17:04:47 --- quit: edrx (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 17:23:19 --- join: brx` (n=brx@p57A794F0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 17:30:37 --- quit: brx (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 17:53:52 --- join: brx (n=brx@p57A794F0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 18:01:37 --- quit: brx` (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 18:13:45 --- join: brx` (n=brx@p57A7BAA4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 18:15:54 --- quit: brx (Nick collision from services.) 18:15:56 --- nick: brx` -> brx 18:29:04 --- quit: vatic (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 18:31:24 --- join: vatic (n=chatzill@pool-162-83-233-103.ny5030.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 18:31:25 --- quit: iano_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 18:31:35 --- join: iano (i=me@sub26-46.member.dsl-only.net) joined #forth 18:34:15 --- quit: vatic (Client Quit) 18:40:09 --- quit: madgarden (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 18:40:49 --- join: madgarden (n=madgarde@bas2-kitchener06-1096651787.dsl.bell.ca) joined #forth 19:20:38 --- join: brx` (n=brx@p57A79748.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #forth 19:29:23 --- quit: brx (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20:54:41 Quartus: factor looks to be working on windows mobile now. 20:54:56 Quartus: i was using an arm instruction that the older cpus don't support, naughty naughty, and it was crashing, but that's taken care of. 20:56:31 Good news. 20:57:17 i heard that palm is finally announcing plans to move to linux 20:57:49 Well, it's been the direction for some time. I'm not sure the report isn't confusing past & present and misquoting one or two people. 20:58:14 have you any concrete plans to port your product to linux? 20:58:21 i guess 'rewrite' rather than 'port' 20:58:25 since the underlying architecture is changing. 20:58:32 It's difficult to make concrete plans when the OS in question is still in the talking phase. :) 20:58:37 how closely is your kernel tied to 68k? 20:59:10 It's a native-code compiler, so it's 68K-specific. It will continue to run in emulation in the New World. What the best direction is from there remains to be seen. 20:59:19 well, minus the compiler. 20:59:41 if you decide to go to arm and maybe linux, will there be anything you can salvage? 21:00:10 Minus the compiler, it's bound to the Palm OS API as it currently is presented. How much or how little would require a rewrite will depend entirely on what the new OS looks like. 21:00:22 --- quit: Quartus__ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 21:02:47 The in-between bits are all in Forth, give or take. 21:03:28 well, i hope any action palm takes won't cut into your revenue stream. 21:04:16 Too many factors to gauge. I'll adapt as required. :) 21:08:01 One favourable point is that a traditional Palm 68K app is backward and forward compatible -- Palm OS5 already has a 68K VM, as will future variants of the OS. 21:50:53 --- join: foucist (n=wunderwa@bespin.org) joined #forth 21:51:00 --- mode: ChanServ set +o foucist 21:51:10 hey slava 21:51:45 hey a fellow op. 22:15:06 --- part: foucist left #forth 22:54:41 --- quit: Baughn_ (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 23:03:52 --- join: Baughn (n=svein@084202037191.customer.alfanett.no) joined #forth 23:06:16 --- quit: iano () 23:42:31 --- join: ecraven (i=nex@eutyche.swe.uni-linz.ac.at) joined #forth 23:57:01 --- join: ygrek (i=user@gateway/tor/x-bfd444642a756965) joined #forth 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/07.04.13