00:00:00 --- log: started forth/07.01.20
00:43:56 --- join: blob_booter (n=charlie@d54C37EE9.access.telenet.be) joined #forth
00:44:38 --- nick: blob_booter -> grub_booter
00:47:39 * grub_booter sighs
00:48:01 <Amanita_Virosa> heh.
00:48:31 <grub_booter> there were a couple of wifi networks at the hospital... got an ip address and dns, but no routing
00:49:00 <grub_booter> very frustrating - esp. since i was up most of the night :-)
00:50:02 <Amanita_Virosa> i wrote a tiiiiny RTOS for the PIC16F :P
00:51:03 <grub_booter> cool :-) - i don't know the chip though (not a hardware guy)
00:52:13 <grub_booter> what are you planning to do with it?
00:52:30 <Amanita_Virosa> it's just something i tinker with sometimes
00:52:34 <Amanita_Virosa> it's a little 8-bit microcontroller
00:52:55 <Amanita_Virosa> and what i wrote really is a RTOS, even though it's less than a hundred instructions
00:53:10 <Amanita_Virosa> (it performs basic round-robin scheduling with thread blocking)
00:53:43 <grub_booter> sounds like a good base
00:54:45 <Amanita_Virosa> ya...  it's actually quite useful for a lot of really tiny embedded uses
00:54:49 <Amanita_Virosa> good base for various firmware
00:55:07 <Amanita_Virosa> the 16F is a little underpowered for it, there are a few limitations in context switching
00:55:20 <grub_booter> my area is a bit higher level - i'm working on video editing/playout components which use a bastardised forth syntax for filter graph generation and transport control
00:55:20 <Amanita_Virosa> i'll eventually port it to the 18F, which doesn't have those limitations
00:55:25 --- quit: JasonWoof ("off to bed")
00:55:31 <Amanita_Virosa> oooh forth syntax :)
00:55:44 <Amanita_Virosa> i wrote a bootable x86 protected-mode forth a while back
00:56:17 <Amanita_Virosa> heh, i must be tired.  or distracted with my crypto coding. i thought for a sec this was #osdev, not #forth
00:56:25 <Amanita_Virosa> probably because your nick is grub_booter lol
00:56:33 <grub_booter> heh
00:57:53 <grub_booter> as a kid, i wrote a z80 assembly version of forth (was, hmm, 22+ years ago now? can't recall..) - the principle stuck and i've been using it a lot over the past few years for video tasks
00:59:13 <grub_booter> mostly under the hood though - this current one takes the forth/rpn approach and slams it right in the face of the app developer (tee hee)
01:02:05 <grub_booter> been using the 24 tv series multi-clip scene transition as the primary goal - working pretty well now
01:02:18 <Amanita_Virosa> cool.
01:04:10 <grub_booter> http://users.pandora.be/acp/jbatch/16.jpg and http://users.pandora.be/acp/jbatch/jbatch-ui.jpg
01:04:50 <Amanita_Virosa> interesting
01:06:50 <grub_booter> the function definition stuff shown in 16 is good for custom tasks (and hides the underlying api) and it extends to the comms protocol (shown in the ui)
01:10:04 <grub_booter> and the beeb r&d dept liked it :-D (dunno if they'll use it, but i showed them a rough draft a couple of months back and got some good feedback from it)
01:42:38 --- join: Cheery (n=Cheery@a81-197-54-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi) joined #forth
02:12:36 --- join: azekeprofit (i=azekePro@82.200.252.37) joined #forth
04:00:15 <Amanita_Virosa> woot.
04:00:25 <Amanita_Virosa> my cryptoapi is working :)
04:00:42 <Amanita_Virosa> AES128-CBC-CTS is running smooth as butter.
04:19:26 --- quit: Amanita_Virosa ("Boomph.")
04:36:04 --- part: azekeprofit left #forth
04:44:04 --- join: zpg (n=user@user-54438354.lns4-c8.dsl.pol.co.uk) joined #forth
04:45:31 <zpg> Hi.
04:51:20 --- join: zpg` (n=user@user-54438354.lns4-c8.dsl.pol.co.uk) joined #forth
04:51:30 --- join: ygrek (i=user@gateway/tor/x-310f4d77037f489e) joined #forth
04:53:18 --- quit: zpg ("ERC Version 5.1.3 (IRC client for Emacs)")
04:53:18 --- quit: zpg` (Client Quit)
04:53:31 --- join: zpg (n=user@user-54438354.lns4-c8.dsl.pol.co.uk) joined #forth
05:08:41 --- join: tathi (n=josh@pdpc/supporter/bronze/tathi) joined #forth
05:08:41 --- mode: ChanServ set +o tathi
05:25:57 --- quit: tathi ("leaving")
05:31:10 --- join: Crest (n=crest@p548945A4.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth
05:51:33 --- join: frunobulax (n=mhx@f233149.upc-f.chello.nl) joined #forth
05:52:16 <zpg> hi frunobulax, Crest
05:52:39 <frunobulax> Hi, zpg.
05:53:57 <frunobulax> Any ideas on how to make the meteor benchmark faster for Forth?
05:55:05 --- quit: ygrek (Remote closed the connection)
05:56:19 --- join: ygrek (i=user@gateway/tor/x-e216165f80a1e735) joined #forth
06:01:36 <Quartus> what's slowing it down?
06:01:43 <zpg> (hey Q)
06:01:47 <Quartus> hey
06:02:41 <frunobulax> Best would be an algorithmic improvement. For the rest, is 32 bit shifting of 64-bit patterns.
06:03:28 <Quartus> I see lots of cells +, if some of those could be converted into constants, or the loop could increment by a cell instead, that might help
06:04:12 <Quartus> so  10 cells 0 do ... 1 cells +loop    and convert all the  i cells +  to i _
06:04:12 --- join: BirdReynolds (n=mhx@f233149.upc-f.chello.nl) joined #forth
06:04:13 <Quartus> oops
06:04:14 <Quartus> o+
06:04:15 <Quartus> gah
06:04:18 <Quartus> one more try
06:04:19 <Quartus> i + 
06:04:20 <Quartus> :)
06:04:43 <zpg> heh
06:04:44 <Quartus> 12 cells  can become a constant so the calculation isn't repeated inside the loop
06:04:48 <Quartus> don't know how much any of that will help
06:06:37 <Quartus> 'solve' does look a bit hairy, perhaps a better approach is available
06:07:26 <frunobulax> The word solve is executed about 10,000,000 times :-)
06:07:37 <Quartus> so any improvement there will help.
06:08:57 <frunobulax> Most of it is calls to dlshift32, but i don't see how to improve that. 
06:10:35 <frunobulax> I would have given up, were it not that C++ runs it 10 times faster than (big)Forth.
06:18:50 <frunobulax> Hmm, I retract that statement. The only important word is next-shift.
06:26:06 <frunobulax> I think it is: "How to find the first '0' in a 64 bit word, starting the search at offset <n1>."
06:42:01 --- quit: frunobulax ("a quit that really quits")
06:42:37 --- quit: BirdReynolds ("a quit that really quits")
06:56:58 --- quit: Jenn5 (Remote closed the connection)
07:02:17 --- quit: Crest ("Leaving")
07:03:02 --- join: tathi (n=josh@c-68-81-250-189.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) joined #forth
07:03:02 --- mode: ChanServ set +o tathi
07:12:14 --- join: Jenn5 (n=Jenn5@74-132-206-111.dhcp.insightbb.com) joined #forth
07:33:16 --- nick: richard__ -> snowrichard
07:42:20 <snowrichard> hello
08:37:03 --- join: frunobulax (n=mhx@f233149.upc-f.chello.nl) joined #forth
08:39:23 <frunobulax> I retract that statement also. A much better next-shift is only 40 ms smaller. An algorithmic improvement is clearly needed.
08:39:30 --- quit: frunobulax (Client Quit)
08:42:54 --- quit: Jenn5 (Remote closed the connection)
10:17:52 --- quit: zpg ("ERC Version 5.1.3 (IRC client for Emacs)")
10:26:41 --- join: zpg (n=user@user-54438354.lns4-c8.dsl.pol.co.uk) joined #forth
10:39:14 --- join: mark4_ (n=mark4@ip70-162-111-107.ph.ph.cox.net) joined #forth
10:56:49 --- quit: I440r (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
11:16:03 --- join: Crest (n=crest@p54894241.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth
11:47:15 --- quit: ygrek ()
11:59:25 --- join: arke_ (n=chris@pD9E06739.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth
12:16:43 --- quit: arke (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
12:16:55 <mark4_> did we have another flyby visit from MHX ? :)
12:16:58 <mark4_> lol and i was assleep :P
12:17:09 <mark4_> ok, time to go dig up old coins... if i can find em
12:21:38 --- quit: virsys (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
12:38:37 --- join: virsys (n=virsys@or-71-54-194-74.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) joined #forth
13:14:57 --- quit: grub_booter ("Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/")
13:17:14 --- join: grub_booter (n=charlie@d54C37EE9.access.telenet.be) joined #forth
13:50:48 --- quit: slava ()
14:03:53 --- join: JasonWoof (n=jason@c-71-192-30-169.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) joined #forth
14:03:53 --- mode: ChanServ set +o JasonWoof
14:11:57 --- quit: Zarutian ()
14:15:52 <Quartus> Hey.
14:16:28 --- join: Zarutian (n=Zarutian@194-144-84-110.du.xdsl.is) joined #forth
14:28:49 <JasonWoof> huh
14:28:56 <JasonWoof> I've got a TMBG song stuck in my head.
14:28:59 <JasonWoof> I wanted to hear it again
14:29:22 <JasonWoof> swear I heard it yesterday, but I don't appear to have the song
14:29:26 <JasonWoof> or even the album it's on
14:31:13 <JasonWoof> oh, I know, jenny has it
14:31:19 <JasonWoof> whew! thought I was going crazy there
14:31:41 <JasonWoof> I need to get that album though :)
14:36:57 <grub_booter> the only one of their's that ever hooked me was 'birdhouse in your soul' (from an album called flood)
14:43:24 --- quit: zpg ("ERC Version 5.1.3 (IRC client for Emacs)")
14:47:12 <JasonWoof> that's the album
14:47:15 <JasonWoof> but not the song
14:47:49 <JasonWoof> "I returned a bag of groceries accidentally taken off the shelf before the expiration date.
14:47:50 <grub_booter> ah - hmm - have the album somewhere...
14:48:05 <JasonWoof> I came back as a bag of groceries accidentally taken of the shelf before the date stamped on myself"
14:48:28 <grub_booter> rings a bell...
14:48:30 <Quartus> Catchy.
14:48:42 <JasonWoof> heh
14:49:02 <JasonWoof> "I didn't appologize for when I was eight and I made my younger brother have to be my personal slave."
14:49:15 <grub_booter> song is called 'dead'
14:49:19 <JasonWoof> yeah
14:49:27 <Quartus> "I returned an overdue library book three days before the fine went up to 15 cents." "I came back as a dog-eared copy of Time magazine from 1983, with a picture of Yul Brynner on the back."
14:49:40 <Quartus> Wow, I can write songs too!
14:50:00 <JasonWoof> heh
14:50:12 <grub_booter> birdhouse was the highlight of that album... why a long way
14:50:35 <JasonWoof> very popular song
14:50:44 <grub_booter> also surreal lyrics, but very catchy
14:51:10 <JasonWoof> :)
14:51:18 <JasonWoof> A lot of their lyrics are surreal
14:51:27 <Quartus> surreal can cross over into meaningless.
14:51:36 <JasonWoof> yeah, that happens a lot
14:52:10 <JasonWoof> I love a few of their songs that have really spunky up-beat music and morbid/surreal lyrics
14:52:45 <JasonWoof> especially "I was out by myself in the graveyard. I was doing and interpretive dance, when I felt something heavy and pointed
14:53:19 <JasonWoof> strike me in the back of my neck, and the ghost of my dance instructor threw me down into an open grave, and as dirt rained down she played a xilophone, and sang me this song
14:53:20 <grub_booter> you should check out half man half biscuit
14:53:33 <Quartus> By himself in the graveyard doing an interpretive dance, eh?
14:53:49 <Quartus> La dee dah. :)
14:54:22 <JasonWoof> "turn around, turn around, there's a thing there that can be found. turn around, turn around, it's a human skull on the ground. human skull, on the ground, turn around"
14:54:36 <Quartus> Prance and giggle.
14:54:56 <grub_booter> HMHB might only work for brits though - cool songs like 'the trumpton riots' and 'fucking hell, it's fred titmus'
14:55:43 <JasonWoof> not references I catch
14:56:12 <grub_booter> yeah - doesn't migrate out of britain
14:56:13 <Quartus> Those lyrics make Robert Smith and Steven Morrisey seem butch.
14:57:30 <grub_booter> early cure stuff was great, but yeah, a tad wimpy
14:57:40 <Quartus_> a tad? :)
14:57:44 <grub_booter> :-)
14:58:17 <Quartus_> And morrisey singing about reading Yates in the graveyard?  Sheesh.
14:58:54 --- quit: Cheery ("Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/")
14:58:55 <Quartus_> Queen wasn't that fruity. :)
14:59:50 <Quartus> at least it wasn't "look down there, look down there, human hair, sugar bear" or the like. :)
15:04:49 <grub_booter> well, i'd still rather listen to the smiths or the cure than almost everything that's being passed as music these days (franz ferdianand and the scissor sisters being about the only bands from this century which have made an impact on me)
15:05:39 <Quartus> Here, let me try.  "Look at me, look at me, I've got something you should see, bumble bee, on my knee, look at me, look at me."
15:06:36 <Quartus> "Tell me why, tell me why, here's a thing that you should try, loaf of bread, loaf of bread, tell me why, on my head."
15:06:39 <Quartus> How am I doing? :)
15:07:02 <grub_booter> not rushing out to buy the album...
15:08:01 <grub_booter> but, that doesn't mean much - given by what sells these days, you'd probably go platinum in a couple of days
15:08:40 * grub_booter became an 'old fogey' sometime around 1992
15:14:38 --- quit: Crest ("Leaving")
15:41:14 <JasonWoof>  http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Record_number_of_bicycles_sold_in_Australia_in_2006
16:14:39 --- join: neceve (n=Clau@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #forth
16:40:57 <nighty_> Quartus: being facetious again ? :)
16:41:13 <Quartus_> not me :)
17:08:43 <mark4_> therse only two real kinds of music in this workd. everything else is just BUNK. blues and classical. sometimes the distinction is blury for me :)
17:09:14 <mark4_> quartus's lyrics are a tad better than 99% of what passes for "popular" these days
17:09:41 <Quartus_> yeah, J.S. Bach's famous 'Mama done left me' fugue in G.
17:10:27 <mark4_> :)
17:10:50 <mark4_> i was thinking more along the lines of fernando sor or buddy guy :P
17:11:27 <Quartus_> Mozart's classic 'Wang dang doodle, all night long'.
17:11:41 <mark4_> i think that was howlin wolf actually :P
17:15:36 <JasonWoof> lol
17:29:53 --- join: TheBlueWizard (i=TheBlueW@ts001d0512.wdc-dc.xod.concentric.net) joined #forth
17:45:39 --- join: zpg (n=user@user-54438354.lns4-c8.dsl.pol.co.uk) joined #forth
17:46:02 <zpg> Darn, I missed all the high-brow music talk
17:46:49 <Raystm2> Ya, me too.
17:46:59 <Raystm2> And Hi. :)
17:47:11 <zpg> Hey Ray.
17:47:38 <Raystm2> How are you this early morning, Marc?
17:48:06 <zpg> Uneventful -- just taking a break from some reading.
17:48:11 <Raystm2> Doing any more of that natural language IF?
17:48:13 <zpg> Lacking in blues and classical too.
17:48:23 <Raystm2> I see. 
17:48:40 <zpg> No, I haven't been tinkering with IF for a while. The latest pastes were by way of example. Inspired by a usenet perusal.
17:48:54 * Raystm2 was a professional guitarist off and on over the course of a young life.
17:49:18 <zpg> re: Our discussion a few days back where Quartus mentioned that questionable natural language system etc.
17:49:26 <zpg> Oh really? What sort of style?
17:51:11 <Raystm2> Payed for popular and country and blues and rock. Love lots of stuff. More about the individual piece then a genera. Prob'ly could even ( hate to say this in public but I may die someday and it has to come out somewhere ) defend a pop group if I thought they had a good piece well executed.
17:51:56 <zpg> I've nothing against pop. With qualification.
17:56:29 <Raystm2> Recently, I've been building a 'set-list' of tabs from the web. I think I'd like to do home-made videos of myself playing these songs  and post them to a members only site. My take on original ways of approaching the piece.
17:57:57 <Raystm2> I'd also have a place for my own work, and a place for others to do the same as well.
17:57:57 <zpg> Not going to be yet-another-addition to youtube then? :)
17:58:32 <Raystm2> I hadn't thought of it that way, but I suppose you are correct. Bit copy-cat, yes?
17:58:47 <Raystm2> I hadn't searched for similar ideas yet.
17:59:15 <Raystm2> Wasn't worried about competition. More like this community, I was hoping to build something on the subject matter, you know?
17:59:41 <zpg> Oh, well there's a tonne of guys sitting in front of webcams mutilating various pieces. Most recently I hit upon some Cash impersonators. 
17:59:50 <Raystm2> Flock of Birds of a Feather, kinda thingy.
18:00:06 <zpg> Yeah a community project sounds like a nice idea.
18:00:45 <Raystm2> Hehe, Ya, I don't think I'd sing many of them. :) not a singer here. I usually can play the melodies with harmonies to make up for it.
18:01:00 * zpg nods
18:02:14 <Raystm2> Speaking of Cash... I'd love to gut a vid of my father doing "Folsom Prison" or maybe "Hey Porter". Fun to watch cuz he got a style all his own and it works.
18:03:06 <Raystm2> I think it's in the impresion you get of his confidence while performing. Carries and makes up for imperfection.
18:03:07 <zpg> "gut a vid"? sounds painful.
18:03:17 <Raystm2> OOh thanks :) 
18:03:22 <zpg> heh.
18:03:41 <zpg> "Perfection" in much of this material has nothing to do with playing with precision.
18:03:54 <zpg> Though I'd hesitate to use the term.
18:06:15 <Raystm2> I grew up loving the Beatles. They really did teach me the most of what I know about playing. 
18:06:35 --- quit: neceve (Remote closed the connection)
18:06:55 --- quit: snowrichard (Nick collision from services.)
18:07:12 --- join: richard_ (n=richard@12.18.108.130) joined #forth
18:09:15 <Raystm2> This Christmas, my wife found for me George Martin's newest cd. A mix of Beatles tapes ala John Lennon collage, done for a new Cirque du Soleil. 
18:09:30 <Raystm2> Fun to hear things anew.
18:09:42 <zpg> :)
18:11:49 <Raystm2> I spoke with my Doctor. My concern about the fact that the only programming I've done since starting meds is to defend cf. 
18:12:16 <Raystm2> He said he has a friend, a brain surgeon with my very condition.
18:12:36 <zpg> Does this friend also defend colorForth? :)
18:12:49 <Raystm2> She discontinues the meds during important operations because it affords her the kind of focus required.
18:13:48 <TheBlueWizard> cf = cystis fibrosis? (sp)
18:14:26 <Raystm2> cf=colorForth=systems fib-joke-us.
18:14:47 <TheBlueWizard> ok :)
18:14:50 <zpg> heh.
18:15:08 <TheBlueWizard> the other cf is a real serious and fatal disease
18:15:26 <zpg> TheBlueWizard: it's "Cystic fibrosis" for the record.
18:16:21 <TheBlueWizard> ah thanks
18:16:33 --- join: snoopy_1711 (i=snoopy_1@dslb-084-058-141-143.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth
18:16:48 <Raystm2> Yes, indeed. Serious. 
18:17:34 <Raystm2> I'm thinking that I should do research for my projects while on the med, then plan sprints of med-less codeing.
18:20:19 <Raystm2> TheBlueWizard. What have you been up to lately. Been a long time since we caught up.
18:20:42 <zpg> Off for a bit -- see the query Ray.
18:21:30 <Raystm2> ooh sorry, didn't know my nick is not logged in. I've answered and you didn't recieve thanks to Freenode.
18:21:34 <Raystm2> give a sec...
18:21:37 <TheBlueWizard> oh...been busy...but not busy coding at all...a lot of reading...and traveling
18:23:05 <Raystm2> Reading and traveling, okay. The farther one travels the less one knows, so those things go really good together. :)
18:23:33 <Raystm2> What focus, or where have you been, if you care to elaborate on either subject?
18:24:19 <TheBlueWizard> um...the traveling was holiday and birthday related, and I basically gained nothing knowledge-wise...just meeting a lot of people that I am likely not to meet again :)
18:25:34 <Raystm2> Ya. Life. Full of aquiantence. I get that at work where I serve a public of regulars and them that I'm sure our paths may never cross again.
18:26:35 <TheBlueWizard> and reading...well, I just finished the novel by R. A. Salvatore called "Promise of The Witch-King"
18:26:50 <Raystm2> ( btw, in shops like ours, regulars get much better deals then them that are not and we know who you are because we don't recognize you) :)
18:27:08 <TheBlueWizard> and I read other books...plus teaching myself some more Java (needed for work)
18:27:23 * TheBlueWizard smiles
18:29:11 <TheBlueWizard> what about you?
18:29:13 <Raystm2> I've been watching the James Burke series The Day the Universe Changed. 
18:29:43 <Raystm2> It's online now, and I've started ##Burke to host the links for my FreeNode pals.
18:29:43 <TheBlueWizard> ah I think I remember you mentioned that
18:30:01 * TheBlueWizard nods
18:30:29 --- quit: richard_ (Remote closed the connection)
18:31:24 <Raystm2> I enjoy the points of view of a few men who've made videos to spread their ideas and Burke is one of them. Now that I say that, I'm wondering "how much of that influence is due to the delivery medium?".
18:32:36 * TheBlueWizard smiles, and is tempted to shout "Marketing! Marketing!" ;)
18:33:37 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
18:33:50 --- nick: snoopy_1711 -> Snoopy42
19:13:07 <zpg> Hi.
19:15:05 --- quit: tathi ("leaving")
19:31:47 <Quartus> whazza?
19:32:08 <zpg> hrm?
19:32:31 <Quartus> what's up?
19:33:19 <zpg> readin'
19:33:22 <zpg> pondering sleep -- the usual.
19:33:23 <zpg> you?
19:34:00 <Quartus> Similar.
19:37:04 <TheBlueWizard> bye all
19:37:14 <zpg> cheerio TheBlueWizard
19:37:21 --- part: TheBlueWizard left #forth
19:53:42 --- join: molokai (i=molokai@205.Red-81-40-192.staticIP.rima-tde.net) joined #forth
19:59:34 --- quit: Zarutian (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
20:10:39 --- quit: segher (Nick collision from services.)
20:10:51 --- join: segher_ (n=segher@dslb-084-056-149-043.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth
20:18:13 <JasonWoof> our calendar is so weird
20:18:30 <JasonWoof> I made a spiffy little calendar thing for a client's website
20:18:38 <JasonWoof> shows all his public events
20:19:21 <JasonWoof> he noticed that some months need a 6th row to fit the end of the last week in, and asked that I make all months 6 rows
20:20:06 <JasonWoof> I clicked through a bunch of months to see how common it is to have a 6th row. and found that Feb 2009 only uses 4
20:20:19 <JasonWoof> (if you display sun..sat
20:20:29 <Quartus> Sure. 28 days.
20:21:37 <JasonWoof> guess it happens about 1 in every 10 years on average
20:22:39 <JasonWoof> I'm glad I noticed though, or I might have coded "if there aren't 6 rows, print a blank one" instead of "keep printing until there are 6 rows"
20:30:00 <Quartus> pacman
20:30:16 <zpg> tetris  ok
20:38:36 --- quit: zpg ("night")
20:54:25 <Raystm2> chuckBot
21:07:47 --- quit: molokai ()
21:16:56 --- quit: arke_ ("This is my quit message. There are many quit messages like it, but this is mine.")
23:06:58 <JasonWoof> anybody got ie for windows handy?
23:07:29 <JasonWoof> I'd really appreciate if someone could test this page for me: http://test.grooveparadise.com/contact.html
23:07:42 <JasonWoof> and tell me if you can see the navbar on the right
23:08:15 <JasonWoof> I'm trying a fix for transparent PNGs. It doesn't work under wine. but if it's only wine that it doesn't work with... it's fine
23:34:44 <crc> JasonWoof, http://browsershots.org/website/http://test.grooveparadise.com/contact.html
23:35:45 <crc> the IE6 screenshot looks like it renders properly; IE7 has support for transparent PNGs
23:36:23 <JasonWoof> wow
23:36:47 <JasonWoof> wish I knew about that site before
23:37:21 <crc> I discovered it a couple weeks ago, it's pretty handy
23:37:39 <JasonWoof> yeah!
23:37:54 <JasonWoof> A year ago I was biking to the library to check
23:38:18 <JasonWoof> then eventually I got an x86 laptop, and got ie6 running on that under wine
23:38:32 <JasonWoof> but wine doesn't support the "filter" thing that the pngfixes use
23:38:37 <JasonWoof> probably no directx
23:45:08 <crc> I never got transparent PNGs to work under wine
23:59:45 <JasonWoof> I just read up on it. apparently it's a known problem/limitation
23:59:59 <JasonWoof> they'll probably fix it eventually
23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/07.01.20