00:00:00 --- log: started forth/06.12.08 00:32:34 slava - how do you go about generating an image for an unimaged arch? 00:32:55 what does that mean? 00:33:10 sorry, I don't know how to answer that question. 00:33:25 i can generate a ppc image on x86, for example 00:34:37 I was more interested in machines you don't have an image for already, but nevermind: I guess it's the usual metacompiler way. 00:36:22 i plan an arm port next year and probably no more ports after that 00:52:34 --- join: virl (n=virl@chello062178085149.1.12.vie.surfer.at) joined #forth 01:08:49 --- quit: slava () 02:12:27 --- quit: crc (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 02:30:07 --- join: Cheery (n=Cheery@a81-197-54-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi) joined #forth 02:54:14 --- join: crc (n=crc@pool-70-16-153-129.phil.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 02:54:33 --- mode: ChanServ set +o crc 02:59:07 --- quit: Zarutian (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 03:18:14 --- join: neceve (n=claudiu@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #forth 04:44:39 --- join: zpg (n=user@user-514d7663.l2.c2.dsl.pol.co.uk) joined #forth 05:09:39 Afternoon all. 05:10:20 --- join: tathi (n=josh@pdpc/supporter/bronze/tathi) joined #forth 05:10:20 --- mode: ChanServ set +o tathi 05:12:09 * zpg greets tathi 05:12:49 hi zpg 05:12:58 zpg - howdy. 05:14:47 hi chaps. 05:14:54 * zpg is looking at tathi's isForth port. 05:16:07 ah 05:16:34 * tathi has to stop spending time on pieces of software that he's not actually going to use. :) 05:16:41 heh 05:16:59 I gather this is Linux PPC (so I can't use it); has it been developed since 2004? 05:17:33 yeah, I don't have OS X, so I didn't make it work there. 05:17:42 And no, I haven't done any work on it in a while. 05:18:53 I was looking at it because I was curious how a (somewhat) traditional direct threaded forth worked. 05:19:06 Started translating the important bits to PPC just to see how they'd look. 05:19:25 Then I asked I440r a few questions, and he talked me into finishing it. :) 05:19:54 Heh 05:19:57 Good stuff. 05:20:55 it actually shouldn't be that hard to port it to OS X; Jason did it with herkforth. 05:21:07 * zpg nods 05:22:16 --- quit: neceve (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 05:26:34 --- join: JasonWoof (n=jason@c-71-192-26-248.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) joined #forth 05:26:34 --- mode: ChanServ set +o JasonWoof 05:26:52 hi Jason 05:26:55 you're up early :) 05:29:00 yeah :) 05:29:23 my schedule was getting stupid late 05:29:26 so I fixed it 05:29:57 much better to wake at 7:30 than to fall asleep then 05:30:24 2a-10a is probably my favorite sleep schedule 05:30:40 but I naturaly shift later, so that'll happen soon 05:33:46 weird thing happened though 05:33:59 didn't sleep much yestermorning 05:34:11 because I got up early, to start the shift 05:34:17 so I'm expecting not to have the best day 05:34:21 was a little sore and all that 05:34:37 mostly my upper back 05:35:14 but while I was at comedy night (just sitting there for a couple hours) the whole back of my body got sore. calves, thighs, and my whole back 05:35:27 I was walking really stiff 05:35:49 so weird that it came so quick, and that I had no soreness in the front 05:36:35 unfortunately I didn't think of taking arnica until night 05:37:35 --- quit: virl ("Verlassend") 05:37:50 weird 05:38:18 I'm waiting for the bathroom to open up so I can take a bath :) 05:40:59 --- join: vatic (n=chatzill@pool-162-84-178-20.ny5030.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 05:43:15 --- join: tattrdkat (n=virsys@or-71-53-65-55.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) joined #forth 05:43:56 --- quit: virsys (Nick collision from services.) 05:44:00 --- nick: tattrdkat -> virsys 05:44:51 --- quit: madgarden (Excess Flood) 05:46:05 --- join: jackokring (n=jackokri@static-195-248-105-144.adsl.hotchilli.net) joined #forth 05:47:57 --- quit: Cheery (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 05:48:40 --- join: Cheery (n=Cheery@a81-197-54-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi) joined #forth 05:56:00 --- join: timlarson_ (n=timlarso@65.116.199.19) joined #forth 06:08:28 --- join: Ray_work (n=Raystm2@199.227.227.26) joined #forth 06:11:12 Good morning! FRI........DAY! 06:15:36 woo 06:15:37 hoo 06:15:38 hi Ray_work 06:22:12 --- quit: tathi ("bbl") 06:25:39 hi zpg :) 06:25:51 Hoping you are well, today and everyday! 06:38:32 --- nick: tiff -> nanstm 06:44:07 Good here thanks. Gales have abated, which is promising. Trainee still there? 06:48:23 Yes. He will make a great addition to the staff. Good guy. 06:52:33 Glad to hear it. 06:56:41 --- quit: crc (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 06:58:52 I was just discussing ( in another chat) my recent colorForth mini-fiasco. 06:59:06 I suppose I will finish this work and then be done with it. 07:00:39 but when i'm done this time, it will be litterate programming, documentation and code as one thing and the webpages and the code will be the very same thing. 07:02:37 Now, more importantly, how are those sorts comming? 07:02:44 I can't wait to wade thru them. 07:02:58 I plan to start when I wake up about 4 am on saterday. 07:15:07 Heh. 07:15:19 The sort code was completed the other day. 07:18:50 Oh, cool. I've lost track, sorry. I've been wanting to participate but... 07:18:56 life. you know? :) 07:21:29 yep :) 07:21:37 the code's all on the pastebin 07:21:40 although my list code isn't 07:21:59 for lists: http://forth.pastebin.ca/269765 07:22:09 and internals: http://forth.pastebin.ca/269767 07:25:59 : array>list ( array -- list ) ... ; is damned ugly, really needs factoring 07:33:48 --- join: timlarson__ (n=timlarso@65.116.199.19) joined #forth 07:35:52 without looking into array-bounds, : array>list ( a - L ) ccount dup >r nil cdr! swap array-bounds 2cell+ ?do i @ over cdr! cdr cell +loop nil swap cdr! r> ; 07:37:32 using the common-for-me CCOUNT ( : ccount dup cell+ swap @ ; ) and something that seems OK, : 2CELL+ cell+ cell under+ ; , which might itself use: 1 cells constant cell 07:38:27 oh well, I see that you didn't actually ccount , there. 07:42:27 yeah, yours doesn't look that much less complex than mine 07:42:54 : array>list ( array -- list ) dup cell+ @ nil over dup >r cdr! swap array-bounds cell+ swap cell+ do i @ over cdr! cdr cell +loop nil swap cdr! r> ; 07:43:02 ugly as hell. 07:43:22 anyhow, i haven't looked at it since i wrote it, so i'll factor it out later on. 07:47:54 --- quit: ayrnieu (Connection reset by peer) 07:48:19 --- join: ayrnieu (n=julian@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/ayrnieu) joined #forth 07:50:42 --- quit: timlarson_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08:00:03 zpg, ty for links, saved for later consumption. :) 08:16:30 --- part: Crest left #forth 08:17:20 --- join: I440r (n=mark4@70.102.202.162) joined #forth 08:18:06 --- mode: ChanServ set +o I440r 08:23:36 --- join: Mitja (n=abcd@unaffiliated/mitja) joined #forth 08:23:54 hi 08:26:23 Mark! sup? 08:26:24 --- quit: timlarson__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08:26:38 not much, just got to work, waiting for coffee to brew 08:26:43 zzzzZZzz....zzzz 08:29:51 :) 08:30:00 WAKE UP! hope that helps :) 08:33:28 lol 08:33:31 not much 08:33:36 but thanks for trying lol 08:40:48 oh yeah, what do you do when your not sleeping at work, if you don't mind the question? 08:41:07 Besides playing the Ibanez :) 08:41:11 you mean what do i do at work when im not sleeping ? 08:41:13 lol 08:41:17 ya :) 08:41:24 i play online poker when im NOT at work heh 08:41:28 --- join: timlarson_ (n=timlarso@65.116.199.19) joined #forth 08:41:35 this contract is doing image processing 08:41:38 hehe :) I play IRC :) 08:41:41 oh neat. 08:42:09 actually its controlling an image processor and integrating the API's into the SOC 08:42:40 its an arm and an image sensor and image processor on the same piece of sand :) 08:43:04 --- join: timlarson__ (n=timlarso@65.116.199.19) joined #forth 08:43:05 --- quit: timlarson_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 08:43:20 arm configures the sensor and processor and collects statistics generated by teh processor to modify the configuration of the sensor etc 08:53:08 --- quit: ayrnieu (Connection reset by peer) 08:54:41 --- join: ayrnieu (n=julian@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/ayrnieu) joined #forth 09:03:42 --- join: jackokring[1] (n=jackokri@static-195-248-105-144.adsl.hotchilli.net) joined #forth 09:10:12 --- quit: jackokring (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 09:29:42 Heck that sounds like fun. 09:29:54 Wishin' I had a real job. 09:48:21 --- quit: ayrnieu (Connection timed out) 10:01:01 hey 10:12:27 hey back. 10:12:33 How is _work ? 10:12:37 Hoping you are well. :) 10:12:43 Surviving. 10:12:52 ah yes work, thanks, I forgot. :) 10:13:18 Actually, was busy this morn but tapererd off as the lunch hour approches. 10:13:51 Time compression when busy, iygmd. 10:15:00 Lunch is the best part. 10:18:47 It is. I'm hoping my supervisor gets back soon. Just shot insulin and I need to eat within the half hour. 10:19:17 --- join: timlarson_ (n=timlarso@65.116.199.19) joined #forth 10:19:19 * Ray_work keeps many snacks in desk for just such an emergency. 10:19:30 and speak of the devil . :) 10:28:39 --- quit: timlarson_ (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 10:29:05 --- join: timlarson_ (n=timlarso@65.116.199.19) joined #forth 10:32:40 --- join: tathi (n=josh@pdpc/supporter/bronze/tathi) joined #forth 10:32:40 --- mode: ChanServ set +o tathi 10:35:24 --- quit: timlarson__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 11:50:26 --- join: virl (n=virl@chello062178085149.1.12.vie.surfer.at) joined #forth 11:55:36 --- join: segher (n=segher@dslb-084-057-218-046.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 12:01:48 --- quit: jackokring[1] (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12:12:26 --- join: timlarson__ (n=timlarso@65.116.199.19) joined #forth 12:29:09 --- quit: timlarson_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12:33:07 --- join: Zarutian (n=Zarutian@194-144-84-110.du.xdsl.is) joined #forth 13:37:56 --- quit: timlarson__ ("Leaving") 13:42:23 --- join: jackokring (n=jackokri@static-195-248-105-144.adsl.hotchilli.net) joined #forth 13:55:48 --- quit: vatic ("*poof*") 14:03:18 hey hey 14:07:09 hi 14:07:49 * zpg sighs in relief 14:07:59 successfully extended my list code this afternoon, yielding some very nice results indeed. 14:10:19 neat-o. 14:10:39 yeah, wrote a word for removing a sublist (subseq) range. 14:11:00 fun fun 14:11:03 time to try on the palm pilot... 14:11:20 I would think, join the preceding and following nodes, then free the sublist. 14:11:39 I'm using both. 14:11:48 both? 14:11:56 remove and return a subsequence and keep the husk of the previous list 14:12:04 1 2 3 4 5 --> 3 4 and 1 2 5 14:12:06 for example 14:12:21 i already had a non-destructive one written for returning a cloned sublist 14:12:50 I was talking about removing (deleting) a sub-list. 14:13:18 oh, i see. yeah, 'remove' is the wrong choice of wording. 14:13:36 i quite like my factoring, though it need sowkrk. i had a very messy word written, split it into three 14:13:46 oh. Isolating the sequence into its own list would be a factor. 14:14:06 could then be deleted. 14:14:09 * zpg nods 14:18:21 --- join: Shine (n=Frank_Bu@xdsl-81-173-235-130.netcologne.de) joined #forth 14:18:50 any pattern-looking? 14:20:58 my version, I mean 14:22:31 not yet i'm afraid 14:22:39 hmm, no cmove in QF 14:22:57 use move 14:23:57 neat, thanks 14:24:17 okay, unfortunately "type" is non-wrapping in QF. is there a simple way around that? 14:24:57 in fact when 1 au = 1 chars (ie pretty much always), move is equivalent to cmove, if I recall the semantics correctly (mobile presently) 14:25:09 yes, false wrap drop 14:25:15 er sorry 14:25:39 true wrap drop -- but it's true by default. If you want character wrapping... Do you? 14:26:46 i do, yes. 14:27:04 the default wrapping is per-string. A character-wrapping type is : type bounds ?do i c@ type loop ; 14:27:16 dang. s/type/emit 14:27:40 oh neat, okay. 14:28:05 bounds is tucked away in another library. 14:31:42 TOOLKIT 14:31:46 all working beautifully now. 14:31:53 keen. 14:32:39 type is normally optimized to use the Palm OS string-displaying routine. 14:39:11 --- quit: Cheery ("Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/") 15:07:39 --- join: vatic (n=chatzill@pool-162-84-178-20.ny5030.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 15:14:34 --- quit: jackokring (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15:15:16 --- quit: Ray_work (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 16:06:27 --- quit: vatic (Remote closed the connection) 16:09:36 --- join: vatic (n=chatzill@pool-162-84-178-20.ny5030.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 16:10:55 hey vatic 16:11:20 Quartus: hey yo! 16:11:30 what's the news of the world? 16:12:56 Quartus: not much. been sick. gotta start dinner... 16:20:51 k 16:22:55 --- quit: madwork (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 16:30:24 quartus: cmove always copies forward, move doesn't 16:31:00 it's interesting btw that MOVE cannot be implemented using other ANS primitives only 16:31:15 It works with address units, so. 16:31:22 yeah 16:31:54 The goal of the Standard was not to make the CORE suitable for implementing Forth. 16:32:03 of course 16:32:37 it's just an observation -- move is the only word in ANS that operates on AUs at all 16:32:40 You're right about CMOVE. Unless relying on its particular directionality, MOVE should be an adequate replacement. 16:33:00 ERASE does, too. 16:33:08 some programs really rely on it :-( 16:33:16 oh it does? i can't remember :-) 16:33:21 and FILL? 16:33:26 FILL works on chars. 16:33:31 right 16:33:53 hrm, seems i have a bug in my "portable" erase then :-) 16:34:17 If I ran across source with CMOVE, I'd want to confirm that it wasn't using the peculiarity of it, and then expunge it, replace it with MOVE. CMOVE and CMOVE> are archaic. 16:34:30 yeah 16:34:57 they are useful for string stuff though 16:35:18 but you always can just use CHARS a bit etc. of course 16:35:53 I'd prefer that, rather than having to peer at the semantics and the code to figure out what clever nonsense was occurring at each CMOVE or CMOVE> 16:36:03 any idea why MOVE and ERASE work on AUs, while nothing else does? 16:36:30 sure, i don't disagree :-) 16:36:56 To provide an optimized move word that works on AUs -- CMOVE and CMOVE> work only on chars, and only in one direction. 16:37:17 well but _nothing else_ works on AUs 16:37:24 What else should? 16:37:52 an au@ and au! would be needed to makes this useful 16:38:10 Only if you want to write a portable implementation of MOVE and ERASE. 16:38:45 Oddball Forths all have specific memory-access words to get at address units. 16:38:57 i'm trying to say the use of MOVE on AUs is very limited if nothing else handles AUs 16:39:20 well, MOVE can be made to work with cells, chars, or any other multiplier. It's the most flexible possible move. 16:39:27 sure 16:39:37 i'm talking about the use on AUs only 16:39:49 I don't follow, I'm afraid. 16:39:59 It's the least limited possible MOVE instruction. 16:40:04 on "non-aligned" stuff 16:40:43 Right, it'll work aligned, non-aligned, on cells, chars, blocks of any size, and takes care of the direction of copy in overlapping blocks. It's the king of memory moves. 16:40:54 yes 16:41:51 oh well, it's bedtime for me, maybe i'll dream about it, and understand the "why" heh :-) 16:41:56 heh 16:42:02 cya 16:42:05 ciao 16:55:28 --- join: madgarden (n=madgarde@bas2-kitchener06-1096751791.dsl.bell.ca) joined #forth 16:56:47 --- join: Raystm2 (n=NanRay@adsl-69-149-55-21.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) joined #forth 17:02:31 --- quit: nanstm (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 17:20:18 --- join: Snoopy42_ (i=snoopy_1@dslb-084-058-157-062.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 17:27:59 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 17:28:23 --- nick: Snoopy42_ -> Snoopy42 17:33:52 --- join: glass (n=glass@cpc1-bolt6-0-0-cust18.manc.cable.ntl.com) joined #forth 17:53:57 --- quit: tathi ("leaving") 17:59:22 --- join: crc (n=crc@pool-70-110-193-28.phil.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 17:59:34 --- mode: ChanServ set +o crc 18:15:45 --- quit: vatic ("*poof*") 20:04:07 what's up? 20:06:58 --- quit: Shine (Nick collision from 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