00:00:00 --- log: started forth/06.10.22 00:33:39 hi 00:33:41 --- nick: arke_ -> arke 03:32:30 --- join: Cheery (n=Cheery@a81-197-19-23.elisa-laajakaista.fi) joined #forth 03:48:06 --- join: zpg (n=user@user-5440eceb.wfd80a.dsl.pol.co.uk) joined #forth 03:55:17 --- quit: madgarden (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:17 --- quit: JasonWoof (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:17 --- quit: TreyB (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:17 --- quit: Quartus (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:17 --- quit: larsb (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:21 morning 03:55:36 --- join: JasonWoof (n=jason@unaffiliated/herkamire) joined #forth 03:55:36 --- join: madgarden (n=madgarde@London-HSE-ppp3546145.sympatico.ca) joined #forth 03:55:36 --- join: TreyB (n=trey@cpe-66-87-192-27.tx.sprintbbd.net) joined #forth 03:55:36 --- join: Quartus (n=trailer@CPE0001023f6e4f-CM013349902843.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 03:55:36 --- join: larsb (i=lars@1-1-14-10a.kt.gbg.bostream.se) joined #forth 03:55:36 --- mode: irc.freenode.net set +oo JasonWoof Quartus 03:55:45 --- quit: Crest (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:45 --- quit: Jim7J1AJH (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:45 --- quit: crc (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:46 --- quit: ccfg (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:46 --- quit: k4jcw (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:46 --- quit: ohub (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:46 --- quit: michaelw (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:46 --- quit: virl (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:46 --- quit: arke (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:47 --- quit: neceve (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:47 --- quit: Quartus_ (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:47 --- quit: I440r (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:47 --- quit: timlarson (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:47 --- quit: nighty (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:55:47 --- quit: Teratogen (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:56:09 --- join: Quartus_ (n=Quartus_@209.167.5.1) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: virl (n=virl@62.178.85.149) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: arke (n=Chris@pD9E079E0.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: k4jcw (n=jcw@adsl-065-006-151-062.sip.asm.bellsouth.net) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: neceve (n=claudiu@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: Crest (n=crest@p54894A93.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: Jim7J1AJH (n=jim@221x115x224x2.ap221.ftth.ucom.ne.jp) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: crc (n=crc@pool-70-110-179-85.phil.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: I440r (n=mark4@67.135.84.40) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: timlarson (n=timlarso@user-12l325b.cable.mindspring.com) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: ccfg (n=ccfg@dsl-roigw1-fe8ade00-21.dhcp.inet.fi) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: michaelw (n=michaelw@lambda.foldr.org) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: ohub (n=oherrala@sikw1.oulu.fi) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: nighty (n=nighty@66-163-28-100.ip.tor.radiant.net) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- join: Teratogen (i=leontopo@slashsnot.org) joined #forth 03:56:09 --- mode: irc.freenode.net set +oo Quartus_ I440r 03:57:01 --- join: vatic (n=chatzill@pool-162-84-156-148.ny5030.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 03:59:02 morning vatic 04:01:50 zpg: hey, morning! 04:04:35 how's it going? 04:12:12 zpg: fine, and yourself? 04:16:07 not bad thanks. 04:23:35 --- quit: Crest (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 04:23:56 --- join: Crest (n=crest@p54894C88.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 05:35:51 --- join: snowrichard (n=richard@12.18.108.162) joined #forth 05:40:22 hi 05:41:51 --- quit: snowrichard ("Leaving") 05:48:26 --- join: erider (n=erider@unaffiliated/erider) joined #forth 05:54:30 gm all 06:21:49 --- join: Astrobe (n=fred@82.67.86.119) joined #forth 06:25:18 hey 06:26:32 hi 06:32:23 --- quit: zpg ("reboot") 06:50:26 --- join: zpg (n=user@user-5440eceb.wfd80a.dsl.pol.co.uk) joined #forth 07:21:38 --- quit: erider (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 07:22:42 --- join: erider (n=erider@unaffiliated/erider) joined #forth 07:22:58 --- quit: virl (Remote closed the connection) 07:49:20 --- quit: zpg ("ERC Version 5.1.3 (IRC client for Emacs)") 08:19:24 --- join: nighty__ (n=nighty@sushi.rural-networks.com) joined #forth 08:29:39 --- quit: nighty_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08:43:21 --- quit: vatic (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09:04:02 hey 09:12:21 hi Quartus 09:17:36 Excuse me Quartus, is it you Neal Bridges on c.l.f.? Just curious 09:17:57 yes, that's me. 09:19:57 ok 09:20:10 why do you ask? 09:20:40 I just wasn't sure. 09:21:49 --- join: I440r__ (n=mark4@65.244.197.34) joined #forth 09:24:48 I was thinking the other day, one often asks 'what is Forth' and I saw less often the question "why Forth" 09:26:23 why does the on join "topic numeric" for this channel show a different topic than the chanserv spam message ? 09:29:15 dunno 09:29:58 :) 09:31:44 Was your question related to mine? (Oo) 09:32:51 no lol 09:32:56 but i did not yours 09:33:07 if what you say is true its a good thing :) 09:34:12 It depends on what is ellided between "why" and "Forth": 09:34:21 :) 09:34:38 "Why the hell should I use Forth" 09:34:41 as is why does forth do blah blah blah.. as opposed to why does anyone use forth 09:35:45 yes :) 09:36:25 --- join: snowrichard (n=richard@12.18.108.162) joined #forth 09:36:46 "As in" i mean bleh 09:38:55 Why would anyone use use Forth to program a desktop app or a web server, or why use a demanding language when other languages try to make your life easier. 09:39:59 why do mountaineers climb mountains ? 09:40:02 because they are there 09:41:33 So you say that Forthers are lost guys who have no choice or are just Forthing for the challenge of it? 09:43:38 heh 09:44:16 I can say why I do it, I do it because I know my Forth and because that's easier for me to use it than other languages. 09:45:37 forth is always easier to use than other languages 09:47:47 I think it would be interesting to ask around, "why are you using Forth". 09:51:59 Lets throw that on c.l.f. and see if it can burn :) 09:52:38 --- mode: ChanServ set +o crc 09:52:48 hi crc 09:52:53 hi erider 09:54:25 I'm have been googling around to find something on compiler theory and I can only find stuff on compiler theory using pascal :( 09:55:15 erider: do you "lets build a compiler" 09:56:01 thers lots of books out there in e form about compiler theory and they are all using c++ 09:56:02 ugh 09:56:27 ugh! 09:59:15 Astrobe: that the one I'm looking at and its in pascal 10:00:32 oh, I didn't remember that. 10:00:59 Pascal is not very different from C BTW 10:01:02 --- quit: snowrichard ("Leaving") 10:05:15 Maybe you can find something in online university courses? 10:05:47 * erider is looking for some C examples 10:08:17 by judging on the channels you're currently on, you're plotting something, ain't you? :) 10:08:41 nice "palette" 10:12:16 lol 10:12:28 why do you say that? 10:13:09 I'm not sure if pascal is as flexible as C 10:14:02 Astrobe: what are you up to today 10:14:33 I don't know... You look for compiler thery material, you're on an fp channel, a scripting language channel, you're here, you're on #lisp, the others channel I don't know, you're on #emacs (e-eew :) 10:16:34 pls rephrase "what are you up", I don't get it (not native speaker) 10:17:05 me either but I'm talking about is what are you doing today 10:18:24 we are pulling a lot of information for a lot of places 10:18:40 Well, to be honest I'm editing a file mamed "strof.c" right now. It's a VM. 10:19:02 reverse the letters, replace the 'S' with a 'H'... 10:20:09 interesting 10:21:50 This thing will look like Lisp or Scheme it seems. Maybe I'm re-inventing lisp. 10:22:39 Since it has no ((()()) currently, it will probably be a brain-damaged lisp. 10:24:23 Dinner time here. See you later maybe. 10:24:30 --- quit: Astrobe ("leaving") 10:43:07 --- quit: I440r (Nick collision from services.) 10:43:12 --- nick: I440r__ -> I440r 10:43:32 --- mode: ChanServ set +o I440r 10:45:16 --- join: I440r_ (n=mark4@67.135.84.40) joined #forth 10:46:49 --- join: vatic (n=chatzill@pool-162-84-156-148.ny5030.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 10:47:24 --- join: virl (n=virl@chello062178085149.1.12.vie.surfer.at) joined #forth 10:50:33 who has a good way to express a synonym? I'd like to have both "add-node" and "push-node" reference the same code... 10:51:07 is there anything better than : push-node add-node ; ? 10:53:05 vatic can i do an experiment on you? -- if it succeeds your going to be disconnected. 10:53:13 i think ive found a bug in the nickserv ghost command 10:55:12 ok someone volunteer to be killed please lol 10:58:22 --- nick: I440r -> I440r__ 11:00:22 --- join: I440r (n=mark4@65.244.197.34) joined #forth 11:03:09 --- quit: I440r (Nick collision from services.) 11:03:51 --- join: I440r (n=mark4@65.244.197.34) joined #forth 11:10:04 I440r__: feel free to try it on me. 11:10:39 it failed 11:10:45 but i can ghost myself with an incorrect pass 11:11:41 Perhaps it won't work against registered users. 11:13:22 im thinking that the bug is that the ghost command ignores the password if you are ghosting from a recognized location 11:13:36 when you log in it sometimes says "adding xxx.foo.com to known hosts" 11:23:56 --- nick: I440r__ -> temp_440r_ 11:24:12 hey 11:24:38 --- nick: temp_440r_ -> I440r__ 11:29:03 im working with an admin on the nickserv ghosting problem - sory for the nic changes heh 11:31:47 --- quit: I440r (Nick collision from services.) 11:32:29 --- join: I440r (n=mark4@65.244.197.34) joined #forth 12:07:33 I440r: hey, sorry I missed you... 12:07:39 Hi Quartus! 12:07:46 hey. 12:41:41 What's up? 13:30:25 Quartus: what's your feeling about UNLOOP EXIT? 13:30:51 Rarely used. Suggests to me that something isn't factored as it should be 13:31:19 Quartus: figured as much. thnx... 13:37:39 Quartus: although it's interesting: Aho's Data Structures book does just that for its "locate" function... 13:38:08 Perhaps it's appropriate there, I don't know it. 13:38:14 exits right out of the doloop on a match, or returns the index of the array + 1 as a flag for "not found" 13:40:57 Yuck. I don't like that method of returning not-found. 13:41:26 Quartus: I think I could return nil with little trouble... 13:43:00 --- quit: I440r__ (": sleep bed go tuck light off ; immediate") 13:46:36 Somehow I doubt Aho was using Forth and DO/LOOP, though. :) I have built COMPARE; for that I use begin/while/repeat. 13:46:50 And SEARCH. 13:51:18 Quartus: his example still represents multiple exits out of a function, right? So, if you use begin/while/repeat are you working with an array? 13:53:54 Not sure I follow, vatic. A string is an array of characters, and SEARCH works on two of 'em. 13:54:17 BEGIN WHILE WHILE REPEAT THEN gives you two exits (and two exit conditions) out of one loop. 13:55:07 --- quit: I440r (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 13:58:53 I've never used EXIT in building SEARCH. No need for it. 13:59:14 You *could*, nothing stopping you, but it's not conceptually any different. 13:59:29 --- quit: Cheery ("Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/") 14:11:51 Quartus: how do you maintain an index into the string(s)? on the data stack? return stack? 14:13:22 One string on the return stack, one on the data stack. 14:13:44 SEARCH is a loop built around COMPARE. 14:14:13 --- join: I440r (n=mark4@65.244.197.34) joined #forth 15:03:22 --- quit: virl (Remote closed the connection) 15:14:47 Quartus: What do you think of this? I search an array for a number and if it's found, I want to return the number and its address in the array. If no match is found, I return the number and nil instead of an address. 15:15:34 I think it's unimportant what you return with the failure indicator, unless there's some meaning to it, perhaps the nearest item, or something like that. 15:16:53 Quartus: so you think returning the address on success, or nil on failure is good style? 15:17:45 I'd argue in favour of returning the same number of stack elements regardless, with a flag on top. 15:19:55 Quartus: so ( goal -- goal address ) -or- ( goal -- goal address flag ) ? That is, return a flag for both success and failure? 15:20:01 As in SEARCH ( c-addr1 u1 c-addr2 u2 -- c-addr3 u3 flag ) 15:20:49 Or, in other words, don't make the address serve double duty as a flag? 15:20:55 Right. 15:21:35 Quartus: thanx! :-) 15:22:16 sure! 15:35:03 --- join: nighty_ (n=nighty@sushi.rural-networks.com) joined #forth 15:45:59 Hey Christophe. 15:47:18 Quartus: If I can bug you about one more thing :-) If I want an alias is it sufficient to say something like : push-node add-node ; ? 15:47:57 for a normal word with no special compilation semantics, that'll work. 15:49:38 --- quit: nighty__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 16:18:42 --- join: Snoopy42 (i=snoopy_1@dslb-084-058-134-116.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 16:19:42 --- join: slava (n=slava@CPE0080ad77a020-CM000e5cdfda14.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 16:19:42 --- mode: ChanServ set +o slava 16:29:27 --- join: EdLin (n=vim@as5300-6.216-194-21-252.nyc.ny.metconnect.net) joined #forth 16:46:17 --- quit: erider (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 16:46:43 --- join: erider (n=erider@unaffiliated/erider) joined #forth 16:49:42 --- quit: segher (Nick collision from services.) 16:49:55 --- join: segher (n=segher@dslb-084-056-131-029.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 16:59:36 --- quit: vatic ("*poof*") 18:30:35 oops. Hey slava 19:28:27 --- quit: erider ("I don't sleep because sleep is the cousin of death!") 22:04:01 --- quit: I440r (": sleep bed go tuck light off ; immediate") 22:12:24 --- join: arke_ (n=Chris@pD9E0653C.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 22:29:11 --- quit: arke (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 22:34:27 --- nick: arke_ -> arke 22:34:34 --- mode: ChanServ set +o arke 23:06:43 --- join: mark4 (n=mark4@67.135.84.40) joined #forth 23:21:44 --- quit: I440r_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 23:47:34 --- quit: crc (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 23:57:17 --- quit: slava () 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/06.10.22