00:00:00 --- log: started forth/06.10.11 00:00:40 --- join: snowrichard (n=richard@12.18.108.162) joined #forth 00:16:14 --- quit: segher (Nick collision from services.) 00:16:26 --- join: segher (n=segher@dslb-084-056-156-037.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 00:18:17 --- nick: Raystm2 -> nanstm 00:18:25 --- join: Cheery (n=Cheery@a81-197-19-23.elisa-laajakaista.fi) joined #forth 00:19:42 --- join: crest_ (n=crest@p548965A9.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 00:20:18 --- quit: luptenschteiner ("Leaving") 00:20:27 --- quit: arke (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00:27:41 --- quit: Crest (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00:35:44 --- join: arke (n=arke@pD9E05F58.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 00:55:11 --- join: mark4 (n=foo@65.244.197.34) joined #forth 01:01:16 --- quit: snowrichard ("Leaving") 01:10:23 --- quit: nighty__ (Remote closed the connection) 01:13:53 --- quit: madwork_ (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 01:41:37 --- join: snowrichard (n=richard@12.18.108.162) joined #forth 01:41:58 hi 01:43:08 --- quit: mark4 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 02:02:27 --- quit: snowrichard ("Leaving") 02:28:48 --- join: snowrichard (n=richard@12.18.108.162) joined #forth 02:34:29 --- quit: snowrichard ("Leaving") 03:10:32 --- quit: TreyB_ (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 03:34:53 --- join: snowrichard (n=richard@12.18.108.162) joined #forth 03:35:37 hi 03:57:28 --- quit: snowrichard ("Leaving") 03:59:30 --- join: snowrichard (n=richard@12.18.108.162) joined #forth 04:08:47 --- quit: snowrichard ("Leaving") 04:13:11 --- join: snowrichard (n=richard@12.18.108.162) joined #forth 04:28:41 hi 04:46:39 --- join: TreyB (n=trey@cpe-66-87-192-27.tx.sprintbbd.net) joined #forth 04:50:15 hi TreyB 04:58:37 --- quit: snowrichard ("Leaving") 04:59:51 --- join: snowrichard (n=richard@12.18.108.162) joined #forth 05:22:23 --- quit: arke (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 05:22:33 --- join: arke (n=arke@pD9E05F58.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 05:24:51 hello arke 05:25:57 --- quit: snowrichard ("Leaving") 05:42:35 --- join: zpg (n=user@user-54434544.lns6-c7.dsl.pol.co.uk) joined #forth 05:42:48 hi 05:50:05 --- join: Bushmill1 (n=l@213-202-182-29.bas504.dsl.esat.net) joined #forth 05:53:57 --- join: timlarson_ (n=timlarso@65.116.199.19) joined #forth 06:15:46 got to leave in 5 mins, but i just hacked this up: 06:15:51 ": date time&date >r >r >r drop drop drop r> r> r> ;" 06:16:25 is that bad form? or is it okay. basically, i want to drop the time and leave the date. the time is under the top 3 date ints. 06:17:27 gotta run, but shall check back in 90mins or so. bye for now. 06:18:59 --- quit: arke (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 06:19:09 --- join: Ray_work (n=Raystm2@199.227.227.26) joined #forth 06:23:58 zpg .... >r swap 2drop r> 06:24:05 2swap ... 06:24:07 sticky key ... 06:27:46 --- join: madwork (n=foo@204.138.110.15) joined #forth 06:29:04 --- quit: madwork (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 06:30:29 Then how about 2>r and 2 wtf is 2 06:33:37 ? 06:35:35 2>r pushes to cells to the return stack, right? But I see now your suggestion doesn't need that. 06:35:50 "two cells" 06:35:58 there is no 2 at least not in my system 06:38:04 Sorry, 2r>. 06:39:08 i failed to drop one item 06:55:36 --- nick: crest_ -> Crest 07:01:11 --- join: virl (n=virl@chello062178085149.1.12.vie.surfer.at) joined #forth 07:08:44 --- join: Zarutian (n=Zarutian@194-144-84-110.du.xdsl.is) joined #forth 07:10:25 --- join: madwork (n=foo@204.138.110.15) joined #forth 07:11:04 * Crest is away: … 08:00:06 --- quit: TreyB (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 08:05:31 --- join: TreyB (n=trey@cpe-66-87-192-27.tx.sprintbbd.net) joined #forth 08:22:04 back 08:22:42 would these suggestions be more efficient? 08:26:28 zpg, you don't happen to have 3swap defined in your system? 08:27:00 nope 08:27:07 i could define it i guess. 08:27:16 don't worry about efficiency - youre not likely to read date 1 millions times in a second 08:27:24 indeed. 08:27:34 your could, and that would probably looks the cleanest 08:27:43 yeah, that's what i was thinking 08:27:45 ... 3swap 3drop ( or 2drop drop ) 08:28:12 yeah, that was my original plan. just wondering whether the code i pasted was apt, e.g, efficiency-wise. 08:28:24 it's certainly clear. but i'm not sure what the view is on extensive use of the return stack. 08:28:27 there is 2drop, 08:28:39 and as larsb said, 2>r and 2r> 08:28:44 yeah 08:29:13 or, 2>r nip nip nip 2r> 08:29:41 --- join: snowrichard (n=richard@12.18.108.162) joined #forth 08:29:56 hello 08:29:59 hi snowrichard 08:30:04 hi 08:32:00 how are ya. 08:32:19 finally got xorg compiled on my new gentoo install 08:34:01 brb 08:34:33 --- join: Ray-work (n=Raystm2@199.227.227.26) joined #forth 08:34:50 --- quit: TreyB (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 08:36:04 --- nick: Ray-work -> Raystm2 08:36:40 --- nick: Raystm2 -> help 08:36:54 --- nick: help -> Raystm2 08:39:26 --- quit: Ray_work (Nick collision from services.) 08:40:10 --- nick: Raystm2 -> Ray_work 08:46:15 Finally as in "lots of problems" or finally as in "xorg just takes a long time to compile"? 08:46:47 took several hours last night 08:47:11 on a 1.2 ghz p4 08:47:14 Yah. Of course, that's nothing compared to installed OO, KDE and Gnome. 08:47:22 Of course, you'd have to be insane to install Gnome. 08:47:32 I'm putting fluxbox 08:48:07 For grins, I once installed Gentoo (base system, no WM) on a P90 with 40MB of memory and 1GB of swap. It took over 10 days. 08:49:05 I went to goodwill while ago to pick up a twin mattress set. They had a computer desk marked $35.00 they let us have for $25 08:49:16 nice 08:49:47 now I can spread these two computers out on to two desks, and have some surface left for writing or whatever 08:50:06 I always seem to end up using folding tables for desks. 08:50:23 they are on a small dining table now 08:50:39 the P4 is on the floor 08:50:54 I also have a large dog crate one of the dogs sleeps in next to one of the tables. It doubles as the stand for one of the laptops. 08:55:32 your dog has a laptop ? 09:00:15 brb 09:00:18 --- quit: I440r ("Leaving") 09:00:34 when the lady went to ring up the desk she put in .25 first, then she fixed it 09:03:45 --- join: I440r (n=mark4@67.135.84.40) joined #forth 09:12:41 --- join: TreyB (n=trey@cpe-66-87-192-27.tx.sprintbbd.net) joined #forth 09:14:17 --- join: arke (n=arke@pD9E04E0C.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 09:15:52 wow, i just wrote a horribly convoluted 3swap 09:17:26 is there a better way than this --> 09:17:39 : 3swap 2swap swap >r >R 2swap r> rot rot >r >r rot rot r> r> r> ; 09:17:39 ? 09:17:48 uh, yes. 09:17:49 i'm pretty sure there must be. 09:17:53 Quartus: :) 09:18:09 a lot of head scratching a staring at numbers has gone into that beautiful piece of spaghetti i'll have you know 09:18:13 *and 09:18:37 i can't for the life of me see a simple solution. 09:20:31 going to shut down and rearrange the computers on new desks 09:20:34 --- quit: snowrichard ("Leaving") 09:22:23 also, imagine i wish to define this: 09:22:23 : 3>r 2>r >r ; 09:22:44 this clearly isn't working. i assume since i'm screwing with the return stack in one definition but intending the code to be used in another. 09:22:50 is there a way to get this working? 09:23:19 you have to branch out into immediacy and postpone to write 3>r. 09:23:56 okay, so is that still simple to write? 09:24:04 i haven't covered postpone yet. 09:24:23 Not too complicated, but you'd probably be happier just using 2>r >r idiomatically for now. 09:24:43 yes, i should probably understand postpone properly before tinkering with it. 09:24:51 could you give me a suggestion for rewriting 3swap? 09:25:32 i'm stumped :) manipulating 6-deep stack evidently confuses the living daylights out of me. 09:25:39 You could start by cleaning up yours. >r >r can be 2>r. rot rot can be -rot (assuming you have -rot, Gforth does). 09:26:26 yes, i gathered that. 09:26:30 2>r doesn't seem to be in quartus. 09:26:34 if it doesnt have it you should define it : -rot rot rot ; 09:26:37 (i wrote this on the palm) 09:26:41 yes, i've defined -rot before. 09:26:47 It is, it's in a memo. Do a find. 09:26:50 then your not a beginner :) 09:26:52 i just did this step by step in one word definition to follow my logic as written on paper. 09:26:58 ah ok. 09:27:07 so let me rewrite it for now, should take 30 seconds.... 09:28:29 From what you first posted, you don't actually want 3swap; what you want is 3nip, right? 09:28:36 --- join: neceve (n=claudiu@unaffiliated/neceve) joined #forth 09:30:45 for now, : 3swap 2swap swap >r >r 2swap r> -rot >r >r -rot r> r> r> ; redefined 3swap ok 09:30:46 3nip would be ( n1 n2 n3 n4 n5 n6 -- n1 n2 n3 ) ? 09:30:55 that's 3drop 09:31:02 erk. 09:31:03 Quartus: yes, but i decided to try 3swap. 09:31:21 if i replace >r >r with 2>r it messes up the order. 09:31:22 zpg, that's no different than what you posted before, except for the -rot. 09:31:40 i know. so you suggest i use 2>r and rething my logic? 09:31:45 *rethink 09:32:01 It'd be shorter, at the very least. 09:32:07 ok. 09:32:13 Hello, men! 09:32:18 What's the stack picture for 3swap? 09:32:18 hi ray 09:32:27 ( a b c d e f -- d e f a b c ) 09:32:39 OK. That's what I thought, but I wanted to make sure. 09:32:43 It's not something I'd encourage at any time. 09:32:49 Definitely not. 09:33:15 why? 09:33:29 Too many items on the stack. 09:33:50 oh i see. 09:34:08 interesting. confusing to deal with, from a beginner's perspective. 09:34:27 And don't even THINK about using ROLL to solve this problem. 09:35:00 heh 09:35:08 is this a stupid test btw? it seems useful to me. 09:35:17 (as in, useful to try and solve, not useful to have 3swap) 09:35:35 I think with that qualification, yes. 09:35:44 That is to say, not stupid. 09:39:17 : 3swap 2swap 2>r 2swap r> -rot .s 2>r -rot 2r> r> ; 09:39:23 (ignoring ths .s) 09:39:43 oh damn, still doesn't work. 09:40:07 : 3swap 2swap 2>r 2swap r> -rot 2>r -rot 2r> r> ; 09:40:08 there 09:40:58 so 2>r isn't >r >r then? 09:41:53 -- 09:41:57 this version: '<6> 13 14 15 10 11 12' 09:42:03 with >r >r instead of the first 2>r: 09:42:09 '<6> 12 14 15 10 11 13 ' 09:42:15 -- 09:47:34 also, i know it isn't a 3swap isn't a great word, but it can now be used quite cleanly --> 09:47:39 : 3drop 2drop drop ; 09:47:42 --- quit: TreyB (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 09:47:45 : date time&date 3swap 3drop ; 09:47:51 date ok 09:47:51 .s <3> 17 10 2006 ok 09:48:17 makes it slightly more satisfying to have lost half my hair over writing it heh 09:48:25 Except... 09:48:27 You're a week off. 09:48:37 oops. 09:48:54 latest 3swap in gforth is the 'buggered up example' i pasted above, using >r >r instead of 2>r 09:50:34 date ok 09:50:34 .s <3> 11 10 2006 ok 09:50:34 09:50:35 :) 09:50:42 Much better. 09:51:24 k4jcw: so, what gives re: 2>r versus >r >r? 09:51:27 Of course, doing the swap just to do the drop seems sub-optimal. 09:51:30 Dunno. 09:51:34 Word order, maybe? 09:51:34 yeah, ineffecient for sure. 09:52:00 : foo >r >r >r drop drop drop r> r> r> ; 09:52:12 Of course, you could optimize that to the '2' words where possible. 09:52:34 : foo 2>r >r 2drop drop r> 2r> ; 09:52:40 Exactly. 09:52:43 k4jcw: i wrote exactly that example earlier. 09:52:54 Must have missed that. 09:53:01 and i'm aware that it's cleaner. the 3swap code is self-contained, an experiment. 09:53:43 thinking over the 2>r / >r >r more clearly, it's obvious. s'1 2', r'' with 2>r would essentially transfer a double-cell, so s'', r' 1 2'. 09:54:03 >r >r would be s'1 2', r'' --> s'1', r'2' --> s'', r'2 1' 09:54:32 right? 09:54:52 k4jcw: got to leave in 5 mins, but i just hacked this up: 09:54:52 ": date time&date >r >r >r drop drop drop r> r> r> ;" 09:54:52 is that bad form? 09:55:01 etc. 09:59:18 --- join: TreyB (n=trey@cpe-66-87-192-27.tx.sprintbbd.net) joined #forth 10:04:20 --- join: vatic (n=chatzill@pool-162-84-156-148.ny5030.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 10:05:11 vatic! 10:09:52 --- quit: Quartus_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 10:12:20 zpg: hey! 10:13:05 how's it going? 10:13:52 --- part: Bushmill1 left #forth 10:18:08 zpg: OK, still eating lunch... 10:29:37 :) 10:41:03 trying to get a begin/while/repeat working 11:13:53 do you have 2drop or 3drop? 11:14:07 2drop drop or 3drop is more compact 11:14:46 What is this, Doctor Seusss? :) Do you have 2drop or 4drop or five? Six drop or seven? Eight drop or nine? Of all of the drops that a system could have, you must surely admit that those would be fine. 11:15:39 dropping two items is very common. 2drop is usefull. dropping 3 items is fairly common so defining 3drop isnt a bad idea 11:16:02 2drop drop is not hard to follow as an idiom, though. 11:16:41 I'd factor it if it added abstraction, for instance if you kept vectors as 3-cells each on the stack (I don't recommend this), and then I'd make a vdrop. 11:18:11 --- mode: ChanServ set +o I440r 11:22:48 --- quit: arke (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 11:23:34 --- join: arke (n=arke@pD9E04E0C.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 11:27:15 --- mode: ChanServ set +o arke 12:24:14 Aleksejj Saushev 12:54:56 anybody in here who has also like me the t18 simulator from intelasys? 12:57:44 Quartus: the Russian magic thing doesn't seem to be working. :-( 12:59:17 I noticed. 12:59:28 I'm not displeased. 12:59:49 ? 13:00:06 k4jcw, for awhile mentioning the name of the Russian invoked him magically. 13:00:21 ah 13:13:19 back 13:27:00 --- quit: timlarson_ ("Leaving") 13:27:26 --- join: erider_ (n=erider@unaffiliated/erider) joined #forth 13:27:31 hi 13:28:52 hey erider_ 13:29:07 how are you doing today? 13:34:41 --- nick: erider_ -> erider 13:35:12 --- quit: crc (Remote closed the connection) 13:49:50 Quartus: guess his pup-tent blew down or he's needed somewhere else on the front now that Winter is setting in... 13:50:07 Could well be. 13:51:09 maybe he's writing a standards documents for spit-forth... 13:51:16 document 13:51:24 hi Q 13:51:27 I wouldn't count on it. Hi erider. 13:52:25 erider: good thanks, you? 13:52:33 I do like the name spit-forth, though... 13:52:51 SP-Forth is ok. Not well documented, and not particularly fast, but it works. 13:53:21 He didn't write it, however. 13:53:37 zpg I'm fine I'm going to see if I can make some assemble instructions to work with Cheery forth assembler 13:59:17 --- quit: Cheery ("Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/") 14:00:07 sup homleys, I mean homies? 14:02:50 what's the word, Ray_work ? 14:03:25 hi vatic. working. sorta bz but I haven' t been in chat all day and I wanted to see whats up. 14:05:21 erider: ah, neat. 14:08:17 Ray_work: I estimate 3-4 lbs after packing. Send me email... 14:08:37 ooh ooh okay great 14:09:10 vatic pm? 14:11:34 --- join: Quartus_ (n=Quartus_@209.167.5.1) joined #forth 14:11:34 --- mode: ChanServ set +o Quartus_ 14:13:13 Ray_work: ? 14:13:30 --- join: snowrichard (n=richard@12.18.108.162) joined #forth 14:14:00 hi 14:14:40 vatic pm=private message. 14:14:53 it was a request to private message you. 14:15:28 reason I ask is that you might not be "signed in" with your password and you wouldn't beable to respond to me. 14:15:43 Ray_work: doh! I "just do it!" didn't know I needed permission... 14:16:17 I thought you only had to be registered to send /msgs 14:16:50 suppose that doesn't really matter though, if you want to have a conversation 14:17:44 I assume you can just ignore the PM, if you don't want to talk... 14:19:04 Some people are really anal about that. Asking permission to pm is like asking permission to ring someones doorbell, in my book. 14:19:23 So you're the unwelcome doorbell-ringer. 14:19:40 Yes. 14:19:45 BASTARD! 14:19:51 bah... the t18 simulator is a good example for not self explanatory 14:19:57 But I usually don't leave a flaming bag of dog poop for you to stomp out. 14:20:07 ah. 14:21:09 Do you have Girl Scouts of Canada up there? The ones that threaten you if you don't buy their delicious cookies? 14:21:50 We've got'em, but no threats. 14:24:08 --- quit: arke (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 14:32:19 Quartus, do you think Palm m100 connectors would work with V, for Outlook syncing? 14:32:31 k4jcw, I think they're different. 14:32:41 Bah. 14:32:41 Palm went to a 'universal' connector, but it was after the V. 14:32:45 You could IR. 14:33:01 What moron decided that you'd have to have the original CD for this crap, instead of making them downloadable? 14:33:11 As far as I know you can download it. 14:33:15 Nope. 14:33:26 You can get the sync application, but not the connector for Outlook. 14:33:27 Used to be so, not so long ago. What OS? 14:33:33 Windoze 2000 14:35:26 "The Outlook sync conduits are not included in the web download of Palm Desktop unless the download page mentions them." 14:35:32 And they don't. 14:35:53 http://kb.palmone.com/SRVS/CGI-BIN/WEBCGI.EXE?New,Kb=PalmSupportKB,ts=Palm_External2001,Case=obj(24276) 14:36:17 "If you have one of these devices, the Outlook Conduits are available only on the CD that came with your device. The conduits are not included in 4.1.4 download for your device." 14:36:22 That includes the m100. Hmm. 14:36:52 I have an m100 CD. But no V CD. 14:37:10 What version of Palm desktop are you using for the V? 14:37:17 Let me check. 14:37:45 4.1.4 14:37:47 Read the "Help! I need the Outlook Conduits and I don't have the CD." section on that page. 14:38:01 It says you can use the E conduits so long as you expect the extended fields to sync. 14:39:31 don't expect, maybe? 14:39:46 Does that mean if you have the original CD, the extended fields would sync? 14:40:00 sorry. Don't expect. 14:40:19 No, the original CD conduits with the CD desktop version wouldn't support the extended fields in any way. 14:40:50 Their wording leaves that open to interpretation, to those of us who don't know what 'extended fields' are. 14:41:11 "Version 4.1.4E was designed for devices with extended fields. For example, you can store up to three addresses for a person with the extended PIM fields; on previous devices, you could store only one address." 14:42:23 Conversely: 14:42:26 If you haven't installed the software from your CD, do so now. Additional conduits and applications are included on the CD, such as photo and video conduits, Documents To Go, eReader, or games. If you don't have the CD, you can install the version on this page, but you may be unable to sync some items. 14:42:55 I can't imagine the point of not making an ISO or a complete install available from the web. 14:43:39 I assume there's some reason why. At any rate, there's a road to a working solution there. 14:45:01 The cradle is at the office, so I'll have to try it tomorrow. 14:45:47 I use IR quite a bit. 14:46:41 I don't have an IR port on this laptop. And it's the only Windows machine I use. 14:47:11 I also don't sync with Outlook, though, so I can use pilot-xfer to just backup the whole gadget. 14:51:18 --- quit: snowrichard ("Leaving") 14:53:36 --- quit: neceve ("Leaving") 14:55:01 Is the application supposed to automatically read my Outlook contacts file? Or do I have to export it from Outlook, then import it to palmOne? 14:55:49 I believe it does the work for you. 14:55:59 Then it seems to have failed. 14:57:24 check the troubleshooting support info. 14:59:18 possibly that happens at sync time. 15:00:00 bah.. there isn't a good whitepaper about the t18 jesus.. this company is on a good way to shot into their own foot. 15:00:30 --- join: arke (n=arke@pD9E04AEF.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 15:03:39 --- quit: arke (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)) 15:05:53 --- quit: Ray_work ("User pushed the X - because it's Xtra, baby") 15:05:57 --- join: arke (n=arke@pD9E04AEF.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 15:09:19 --- quit: erider (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15:10:05 --- join: erider (n=erider@unaffiliated/erider) joined #forth 15:14:48 actually I'm pretty sure the conduit doesn't take any action until a sync. 15:19:58 there is a way to set up the emulator for local network hotsyncing, which is neat, but likely simpler to wait till you have the cradle. 15:24:26 --- join: zpg` (n=user@user-54474b80.wfd86a.dsl.pol.co.uk) joined #forth 15:27:16 --- quit: zpg (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 15:30:18 --- quit: erider (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 15:33:54 * Crest is away: … 15:41:50 --- join: erider (n=erider@unaffiliated/erider) joined #forth 15:52:13 --- quit: Quartus_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 15:55:44 hell, i've been writing miserably bad code for hours now. 16:01:47 --- quit: vatic ("*poof*") 16:16:24 --- quit: virl (Remote closed the connection) 16:21:42 --- quit: nanstm ("Should have paid the bill.") 16:24:56 --- join: Raystm2 (n=NanRay@ppp-70-248-34-141.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) joined #forth 16:25:56 --- quit: Raystm2 (Remote closed the connection) 16:29:49 --- join: Raystm2 (n=NanRay@ppp-70-248-34-141.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) joined #forth 16:32:44 --- join: nighty_ (n=nighty@sushi.rural-networks.com) joined #forth 16:32:45 zpg when you have finished that code delete it with extreme prejudice and then rewrite it from scratch. it wont be bad the second time 16:35:31 perhaps not. 16:35:34 good plan though. 16:35:58 i've just remembered i can't use >R before a do...loop then try and access saved values from within the branch. d'oh. 16:39:51 --- join: snoopy_1711 (i=snoopy_1@dslb-084-058-176-176.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 16:40:02 yea to get arround taht i usually put the >R inside the loop as the first operation and a r> as the last operation before the loop back 16:40:54 or you can define rpick :) 16:40:55 heh 16:41:27 but even thats dangerous because you dont know how many items Do put on the rstack 16:41:32 some forths put 2 items, others put 3 16:42:06 --- join: crc (n=crc@pdpc/supporter/active/crc) joined #forth 16:42:06 --- mode: ChanServ set +o crc 16:44:07 yeah this is a simple function gone terribly wrong! 16:44:23 really, really ugly. 16:48:13 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 16:48:32 --- nick: snoopy_1711 -> Snoopy42 16:50:00 nearly working now. 16:50:28 --- quit: Raystm2 ("Should have paid the bill.") 16:54:46 god i can't believe this took so long, you wouldn't believe the misunderstandings i happened across. 16:54:55 so here's what we've got... 16:58:07 http://forth.pastebin.ca/198425 16:58:28 grr, the l's do look like ones. 17:00:45 better --> http://forth.pastebin.ca/198429 17:12:54 --- quit: arke (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 17:13:18 --- join: arke (n=arke@pD9E04AEF.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 17:14:06 what does cons do ? 17:15:29 constructs a new list with the number on the stack at its head. it's a lisp term. 17:15:38 ok 17:16:15 incidentally, if i want to use 'quit' to simplify if branching, is there a way to get 'ok' printed still? a minor request i know, but i imagine if i'm not getting 'ok' then quit mightn't be the best method. 17:16:37 if you quit it should still do "ok" 17:16:45 it doesn't. 17:16:57 it should only hold back the ok on an abort 17:17:08 erm do you have see ? 17:17:13 make-list 0, leaving 17:17:14 what does see quit show ? 17:17:31 i typed make-list, 0, leaving was printed. that's it. 17:17:42 : make-list dup 0= if ." 0, leaving" quit then ; 17:19:36 in isforth quit is : quit rp0 rp! sp0 sp! beging .status .ok interpret again ; 17:19:52 .status you can ignore, its how i plug my status bar in heh 17:20:19 .ok tests to see if we just aborted and if we did we dont display ok 17:20:21 otherwise we do 17:20:56 i see. 17:21:14 i believe it's standard behaviour for quit to prevent 'ok' being printed 17:26:47 erm ok another reason to not like the standard lol 17:26:56 heh 17:27:40 you could dump EVERYTHING but one item off your return stack and do an exit 17:27:44 taht will take you back to quit 17:28:11 and it would assume everything was ok and thus say so ? 17:32:59 got some nicer code now. 17:33:10 want a sample? 17:33:23 sure 17:36:17 i'm quite please with this: http://forth.pastebin.ca/198474 17:38:35 I440r: perhaps. maybe my error messages are actually better than 'OK' 17:49:15 My idea of an ideal operating system goes something like this: When you boot up, you get a '*' prompt. When you enter the editor, you get a '*' prompt. The experienced user will immediately know which mode he is in. Errors are indicated by '?'. If you don't know what you did wrong, you shouldn't be using computers. 17:49:46 sounds terrible. 17:50:19 Minimalism, baby, minimalism. 17:51:30 I wonder why the Windows Malicious Software Tool doesn't remove Windows... 17:51:42 s/Tool/Removal Tool/ 17:58:48 ) 17:59:06 its called unix 17:59:11 with vi and no other editor 18:04:44 linux is nothing but a big emacs bootstrapper. 18:17:58 --- join: madgarden (n=madgarde@London-HSE-ppp3546145.sympatico.ca) joined #forth 18:24:29 god, there's forth for java? 18:26:48 yup 18:27:12 yeesh 18:33:12 you don't use quit to simplify branching; it terminates the application. 18:33:41 Those pastebins you put up, they don't show up. 18:34:07 say, just wondering, is there an Forth implementation that can run on SNES? 18:34:31 (SNES as in Super Nitendo Entertainment System) 18:39:48 I am not aware of any 18:44:23 Quartus: i think i set an expire limit. 18:44:33 Quartus: how should i simplify branching? 18:44:42 That would depend on how you've complicated it. 18:46:04 i haven't, but i could have sworn it was mention in here by someone. the quit is superfluous, it was a test. 18:46:17 QUIT is all but obsolete. 18:46:26 let me re-pastebin a nice-ish example 18:50:20 Quartus: http://forth.pastebin.ca/198581 18:59:08 best head to bed in 5-10 19:12:23 --- quit: madgarden (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 19:13:00 Looks ok, example-wise. 19:13:09 --- join: madgarden (n=madgarde@London-HSE-ppp3546145.sympatico.ca) joined #forth 19:13:15 mhmm. 19:13:25 it's actually not too untidy code-wise either. 19:13:31 Still suggest constants instead of variables for list-pointers. 19:13:46 --- quit: erider ("I don't sleep because sleep is the cousin of death!") 19:13:47 Save all the mucking about with ! and @ 19:13:47 yeah check the paste comment ... haven't got around to that yet, but it's planned. 19:14:04 i ended up writing a crappy reverse-list function that i just couldn't get working. 19:14:09 you could do it now ... 6 7 8 9 10 5 make-list constant my-list 19:14:16 my-list .list 19:14:31 an in-place reverse, or a copying reverse? 19:14:31 but setting? 19:14:38 setting? 19:14:58 never mind, it's 0315 so i ought to sleep. more on this tomorrow no doubt. 19:15:13 ok 19:15:30 reverse creates a new initial cons, and from there just re-aligns the cdrs of the other nodes via cons. 19:15:41 So it copies the list. 19:15:49 yes 19:16:00 double linked would be useful for stuff like this, efficiency wise. 19:16:32 Just by walking a list and creating a new one, the second one is reveresed. 19:16:35 oh i see what you're asking. yes, lisp style again. hte original list is unmodified. 19:17:38 it in my bag of useful things to try and write in forth 19:17:43 *it's 19:18:02 an in-place reverse is trickier 19:18:23 sounds it. hadn't crossed my mind actually. 19:19:05 would you use a copy-list then an in-place? 19:19:19 no -- a simple copying of a list makes a reversed copy automatically. 19:19:39 oh, fair point. 19:19:52 doing an identical copy, non-reversed, is actually harder. 19:20:18 Not much harder, but slightly. 19:20:39 :) 19:20:45 more soon, been interesting as usual. 19:20:46 night for now. 19:20:51 ciao 19:20:54 --- quit: zpg` ("ERC Version 5.1.3 (IRC client for Emacs)") 20:20:42 --- join: Joely (n=joel@adsl-70-131-135-79.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) joined #forth 21:08:39 --- join: Raystm2 (n=NanRay@ppp-70-248-34-141.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) joined #forth 21:33:08 --- quit: nighty_ ("Disappears in a puff of smoke") 21:35:59 more werties! 22:12:32 --- join: Anbidian (i=Anbidian@S0106000fb09cff56.ed.shawcable.net) joined #forth 22:42:42 --- join: I440r_ (n=mark4@65.244.197.34) joined #forth 23:06:53 Anbidian, send you an email 23:23:25 *nods* Thanks. 23:27:31 No fewer than 5 new werties tonight. 23:32:39 --- quit: I440r (Nick collision from services.) 23:33:03 --- nick: I440r_ -> I440r 23:33:25 --- join: I440r_ (n=mark4@67.135.84.40) joined #forth 23:35:49 . 23:36:17 --- mode: ChanServ set +o I440r 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/06.10.11