00:00:00 --- log: started forth/06.09.03 05:58:04 --- join: PoppaVic (n=pete@0-1pool46-154.nas30.chicago4.il.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 06:18:49 morning 06:18:56 howdy 06:19:14 it's too early, i was up late 06:19:24 really late for me 06:19:29 heh.. Me too, but I slept later 06:20:03 i could go back to sleep but i dont want to miss the sunday readio Beatles hour 06:20:08 radio 06:20:16 ugh 06:21:01 so i "wrote" some lispy words in forth last night 06:21:13 i have, cons, car, cdr, append, map. 06:21:13 yah? 06:21:31 they are so simple; i contemplate using a heap 06:21:54 which only makes sense given all the consing 06:22:32 i think i also have a viable word for marking/envapsulating lambda code 06:22:39 Yeah.. I've pretty well decided that whatever I do, it's all going to really be out in the heap 06:22:46 nods 06:23:08 the lambda makes applying a "block" of code to a list via map 06:23:18 it'sso simple 06:23:24 I'm pretty sure I lose nothing important by letting stacks just be LL of nodes of data 06:23:35 exactly. 06:24:05 i've considered that too but i think i'm gonna make a code word to switch to linear vector allocated on the heap instead 06:24:13 with better stack checking 06:24:21 strict checking actually 06:25:35 to the memory alocation words, you'd prefix an `h' to use heap instead 06:25:44 and one code word to switch stacks 06:26:17 and someone in #lisp that that is the essence of implementing what he called `continuations' which is highly used in lisp/scheme/fp systems 06:26:24 I'm not sure what you mean by "linear vector", and I'm not sure I'm all that worried about letting folks allocate and access "any ol' thang" 06:26:44 a plain contiguous array of memory address 06:26:53 vect[] 06:26:56 Yeah, I plan to allow users to create and switch stacks - stacks of stacks, etc 06:27:04 right 06:27:09 oh.. a block or array 06:27:12 yea 06:27:26 i also wanna port a few things out of Icon too 06:28:13 do you know (of) Icon? 06:28:25 sounds familiar, but can't recall 06:28:25 by the Griswolds? 06:28:37 spawn of Snobol 06:28:39 :) 06:28:46 ugh 06:28:48 ack! 06:28:51 heh 06:28:53 ptuuie! 06:28:57 heh 06:29:04 quit, lemme finish wiring 06:29:06 writing 06:29:40 so, it has this syntax where it's really easy to cache evaluated things for faster recall, instead of recalculating them all over again 06:29:49 i have to port that 06:31:03 Not sure what you are implying there. 06:31:10 ok 06:31:47 for factorial you have to calculate all the previous N's before you get to N. right? 06:31:54 right 06:32:07 it's a seq of ops, repeated 06:32:22 so in Icon you there is a syntax to save all those previous's once calculated 06:32:40 in lisp, it would be consing to an Result list 06:32:47 in forth, it's impossible. 06:32:55 standard, normal forth 06:32:58 umm.. sounds quite wasteful, when you could just set a var or array-member, or whatever 06:33:06 that's what it is 06:33:31 but with a lispy list, just cons to a list 06:33:46 append knows howto add a value to a list 06:33:49 sounds akin to letting the compiler optimize, rather than assemble 06:34:15 not really; if N is unknown, there's no way to pre-calc at compile-time 06:34:22 oh, yer talking about letting the programmer make the call then 06:34:29 even g++ cant do that unless N is known 06:34:44 or i should say C++ 06:34:55 ugh 06:35:03 coffee 06:36:10 --- join: nighty_ (n=nighty@CPE00119576a9c5-CM0012c90d36fc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 06:38:23 in lisp, to cache calculated answers, you just cons to a list 06:38:30 everyone does it, why not forth? 06:39:47 another thing I have a problem with in forth isthe apparently, strictly linear memory alocation; ie, here allot 06:40:10 yep 06:40:38 I have no interest at ALL in propogating stuff left over from the days of 8080's and before 06:40:56 i've been wondering if word structure can be made more impervious to being moved, like, in c, you'd use X **varname to be immune to such shuffling 06:41:05 yea 06:41:21 Not sure what you mean.. Locals? 06:41:39 no, have you ever done windows coding? 06:41:51 long ago 06:42:02 oh.. you mean handles 06:42:06 yea, exactly 06:42:22 Yeah, I've used and done such. 06:42:28 kernel handles are stable while the actual content they refer to can move 06:42:45 to me, that's pointer to pointer 06:42:47 It just abstracts the ptrs to handles and a dbase or map that you keep sticky fingers the hell out of 06:42:54 right 06:43:20 This is in line with what I'm hoping to do with OO words 06:43:24 ok 06:43:39 every object would require a ctor/cctor and dtor. 06:43:59 ..the ptrs are never passed around in the hi-level mess. 06:44:02 oh, reading this morning's google.forth group, i'm sensing that "find" and other words defined in ANS are "sacred cows" 06:44:06 yea 06:44:23 yes, there are many sacred-rules in forths. 06:44:31 that's not good 06:44:40 sacred cows dont live viably 06:45:07 I plan to write the stuff that does 'find'-like stuff as a set of methods that can use RAM or a dbase or whatever 06:45:19 to me, find means the same as usr/bin/find. just find all 06:45:49 nah, it's closest to the dbopen key/value search 06:46:01 forth is becoming more lispy to me and i've havin an easier time "seeing" the definitions 06:46:16 this is a good developement 06:46:55 I'm not even sure we should mandate that the outer-interp try to do a find and THEN do a number 06:47:02 ..Makes too many assumptions. 06:47:16 then what? 06:47:27 i conceptually/conditionally agree :) 06:47:28 ..it's just fucked enough to piss off lexing. 06:47:43 i prefer numbers with a prefix 06:47:50 [0][xX]digit+ 06:47:58 that's easy to parse even in forth 06:48:12 [0][xX][1-9]+ 06:48:12 I think we need to take a clue from Metacompilers and such and use either prefixes or words like H# O# D# F#, etc - that parse 06:48:51 if you start with the latter, then almost anything - including prefixes - is possible 06:48:57 yea, but why are Forthers so eager to invent a new syntax when there's already a good one that coders of other langs and Forthers already know? 06:49:15 ie, why wasnt CPP style of conditional blocking used? 06:49:28 this seems ridiculously rebellious to me 06:49:35 but nooooooooo 06:49:42 they had to go with [if] and [then] 06:49:50 well, for starters, some metacompilers use that latter. Meanwhile, it would let you bootstrap a simple, trivial "interpreter" (evaluate) 06:50:15 conditional-blocking....? 06:50:27 oh.. Back to legacy: the [ and ] stuff 06:50:28 conditional complation blocks in C, the #macros 06:51:35 well, the cpp "language" is nearly junk - it's very, very close to crap. 06:51:47 forths can do far, far better 06:51:55 it maybe that but its keywords are familiar to all 06:52:22 Some ancient FIG issues introduced real "macros" and engendered MONTHS or arguments and screams and fights. 06:52:33 k 06:53:00 why is Valerie Plam being discussed this morning? 06:54:11 eruh? 06:54:26 sorry heh, non-sequiter, i'm watching the poli-shows on tv 06:54:58 her situation is being hashed again in context of someone else who might have had some responsibility 06:55:03 i duino who tho 06:55:58 this was a total none-issue after it was announced that the law regarding outting if a spook is punishable if said spook's cover was less than 5 years. 06:56:15 she'd been flying a desk state-side for more than five years at time of outage 06:56:21 Well, *sigh* THe longer I glare at things, and talk with you, the more I think I might see a possibility, but I don't much enjoy what I'm seeing. 06:56:37 what do you see? 06:57:04 I think I see some validity to tathi's fovium stuff, but twisted. 06:57:16 i havent seen his stuff 06:57:35 i have 80gig of stuff i have to read 06:57:59 Basically, I think we need to write our own minimal pseudo-assembler-to-RAM.. And base everything on those "opcodes" 06:58:13 well, that's easy to do imo 06:58:38 skip the L&P asm syntax and just make words to handle a smidge of what's required 06:59:05 Yeah, I'm trying to decide what codes I am willing to accept. Because, there is no goddamned excuse for the forthish-writer presuming to know about actual registers and whatnot. 06:59:06 my forthy asm has alot of enums {} 06:59:30 well, again, as yesterday, you have to make a decision about the host platform 06:59:58 The only shit that needs to make assumptions about true registers and such is the underlying asm or c or .o code 07:00:19 which is what you have to forthify 07:00:30 no. 07:00:41 for me, it's all constants that get c, 07:00:43 we code for the emulator-level. 07:00:54 you mean the vm? 07:00:58 yeah 07:01:01 k 07:01:31 ok 07:01:32 the forthish author and user can only see what the vm-level "opcodes" and later enhancements offer - period. 07:01:53 vm 07:01:56 uhmmm 07:02:03 like virtual machine ? 07:02:05 so the vm abstracts the host-cpu with inner interp and core words 07:02:22 yepeprs 07:02:23 vm is EVIL 07:02:25 yea a virtual machine 07:02:27 no it aint. 07:02:36 no, it's beautiful 07:02:37 it's the base concept 07:02:41 required even 07:02:48 else you're not coding forth 07:02:52 only forthish 07:03:03 ..and any idiot with the time and energy could actually REALLY write a filter into real asm or C 07:03:22 depending on the host os services, yea. 07:03:30 writing filters cant be done on windows 07:03:32 yeppers 07:03:41 there's no syntax for data pipes, | 07:04:01 anyone can filter - might have to enter filename in a dialog, etc 07:04:15 that's not pipe fitting tho 07:04:25 Anyway it is raining here 07:04:30 and that sux 07:04:32 yeah, ut predates a lot 08:20:59 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Handle_%28computer_science%29 08:21:12 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opaque_pointer 08:21:33 Quiznos: when you get a chance, see those two.. I think they are relevant. 08:31:01 ok 08:31:36 I think you are likely on the right track, and it looks like others are as well. 08:31:54 okidoke 08:33:09 well, opaque pointers dont normally exist in forth; ' a word use a >word to find some field of it; that's not an opaquable action 08:33:37 yeah, and there are issues dripping all over 08:33:59 opaqueness would have to occur at a higher level, as in with my lispy code 08:34:07 you see ghosts everywhere :LOL 08:34:22 I'm not sure which should be at what level, to be honest. 08:34:35 abstract the abstraction too many times and you'll be in space not seeing forests at all 08:34:47 Yeppers - I live in there 08:35:04 for me, forth is level 0; i envision my lispy code being ++level 08:35:20 hmm.. 08:35:33 but it doesnt even need to be that way 08:35:46 I know 08:35:48 the lispy code is just more words that does heap stuff 08:36:00 so it's not really a higher level 08:36:07 the abstraction comes in mentally only 08:36:16 or appears mentally 08:36:21 as I see it, the vm "language" should be pretty limited, but abstracted. 08:37:05 well, the vm words abstract the programmers' view of the hw, the cpu, the ports, the hd as blocks, and perhaps memory 08:37:20 I'm pretty sure there is more to life than registers and pointers, but that the vm has to handle at LEAST pointers and variants. 08:37:21 abstraction via vm is meant to simplify 08:37:31 right 08:37:47 i dont htink most forthers code engines to respect "pointers" 08:37:51 They can plugin more drivers/support for devices and shit as time goes on 08:38:14 if RTTI were used more then the Di register would be more popular 08:38:19 sure they do, they just lump pointers in with ints and doubles and chars and whatever 08:38:23 but again, that's just a coding issew for me 08:38:36 designing certain words to use di instead of a or b 08:38:55 well yea, all objects at a memory level are cell-sized 08:39:09 I don't want anyone writing FOR the vm (from above) even thinking of "registers" 08:39:11 that's commmon across all langs that expose ptrs 08:39:39 right, but that comes from a ``maturity in coding forth'' 08:39:41 writing to the vm (from below) is where asm belongs 08:39:49 right 08:40:05 asm code produces the vm that runs on the cpu 08:40:24 cpu -> vm -> programming environment 08:40:42 and, I don't want the vm generating self-modifying code that affects the underlying stuff. 08:40:43 and sometimes coder needs to write code words to extend the vm 08:40:51 sure 08:40:55 well, wait a sec 08:41:09 self-modifying is a variable colon word 08:41:11 usually 08:41:18 a variable declartion 08:41:39 if you dont want self-m then you have to separate text and data into separate segs, which is easy in C 08:41:56 you'd be producing a normal ELF/aout binary (non-ms host) 08:41:57 Look.... They need to think of the VM as "the processor" - they can't affect the transistors and "microcode" from there. 08:42:27 then that's how you need to build the Programmer's view; sounds to me like a forth-79 thing 08:42:34 no internal coding allowed 08:42:46 fig and f83 were more flexible in allowing that 08:42:51 f79 went the other way 08:42:53 if they DO want to change that, they need to write with some other tool, rebuild the vm, and reload there. 08:42:59 ok 08:43:14 maybe you should look at the Parrot project 08:43:35 do you know of it? 08:44:47 Quiznos: our prob has always been folks that expect too much access from too high (like inline-asm in C) with too few constraints. - or the reverse, where we couldn't get down INTO the vm or underlying code in a sensible manner. Parrot? I think I looked it over like I have lua and such 08:45:52 even basics allow for asm coding to either get at the hw or to extend the "basic vm" 08:46:22 if you prevent such activity, then some folks reviewing your wares might reject it as a usable system to implement their wares in 08:46:35 they might deem it too restrictive 08:46:54 and that's why i rejected f79; i looked into it on the ][+ and kept on walking 08:47:48 hmm.. It's even worse than I imply... In some cases, some forthers think like assemblers - and in other cases they think like compilers, or a cpp-like "interpreter". 08:48:00 F79 was..... weird 08:49:06 But, please remember: a lot of the FIG articles in those days tended to the esoteric uses of stacks and cells and then bled into whose cpu and box was better than some other guys 08:49:49 well, fundamentally, for me, all language, whether spoken or coded, exist to allow the user of language to express thought. if, given all the bits and pieces i know about all the languages i know something about, if i cant express a thought in or using a particular language construct then the language is the wrong one and i search for another language to use. 08:50:03 another that is more expressive to allow me to communicate. 08:50:24 All I care about is building-blocks. 08:50:28 this is why i'm looking forward to lifting certain concepts from other languages 08:50:35 getting FOO done 08:50:44 that's not enuf 08:50:53 you have to decide your basement issew already 08:51:01 the more flexibility the better, the more shit piled in a heap, the worse it gets 08:51:16 you're floundering in all the stuff that's preventing you from finishing the implementation 08:51:28 flexibility comes from thinking out side the box 08:51:32 limits are boxes 08:51:36 heh - and others just write enough to accomplish a task. 08:51:38 contraints are boxes 08:51:55 right, the Tao of Unix is ``implement 90%'' 08:52:10 limits are a fact of life, but when the limits are imposed w/o sensible reasons, they become restraints. 08:52:12 dont persue 'the best'; persue what gets acommplishged 08:52:21 no, limits are part of fear. 08:52:42 i'm not talking adrenalin based fear, but that irrational fear that people have 08:52:45 ph34r 08:52:49 heh 08:52:57 phobias 08:53:18 sorry, I disagree - granted, I am paranoid... Folks need to understand gravity and mass and where they are and falling 08:54:01 Certainly, at some point folks will learn enough to ignore the "limits of gravity" - I won't be around. 08:54:37 wait, gravity, mass are not what i infer when i refer to phobias 08:54:45 falling is a real issew, so that's excluded. 08:54:51 I think an awful lot of forth is all legacy noise inherited and flogged for the wrong reasons. 08:54:57 ok 08:55:04 and 08:55:14 how much of that legacy code is just "good code"? 08:55:19 and it deserves to be reconsidered. 08:55:45 simple is good, simple and restrictive w/o sense is not. 08:55:51 ok 08:56:01 for example... 08:56:24 Forth likes "words"... I've used "lines" and "text" for decades. Fine. 08:56:48 hey, what's your first instinctual response to (in forth) a lisp-style macro system that works at runtime? 08:56:56 however, at no time do I FORCE myself into a dinky, restrictive size 08:57:01 k 08:57:24 Quiznos: Not sure about lisp - barely follow the debates: how do they treat a "macro"? 08:57:44 a macro is a macro is a macro; keywords replacable with other stuff 08:57:58 i'm contemplating runtime macros 08:58:04 well, you specified "runtime" - so, talk to me. 08:58:05 that would be really twisted :) 08:58:19 Sounds like ancient FIG issue arguments 08:58:24 i wouldnt know 08:58:36 ok, lemme' overview... 08:58:55 like i said, if a language doesnt allow me to expressive a thought or concept then (with forth) add a concept 08:59:06 expand expressiveness 08:59:12 THey used to argue about "words that saved text and would feed it back into the istream when called". 08:59:26 isnt that akin to ungetc()? 08:59:39 sorta', yeah? 08:59:44 ok 09:00:03 well that's an buffering thing prior to istream calls it 09:00:04 for it 09:00:30 which means more scaffolding within the kernel or added on 09:00:59 why "kernel"? 09:01:10 you must mean VM 09:01:12 either, or added on 09:01:16 in extend.bat 09:01:33 but it would have to be part of read() and write() 09:01:37 which are syscalls 09:01:51 in neither case was F79 doing such - it was all buffered 09:01:53 key and key? are too minimal 09:01:58 k 09:02:32 coffee 09:03:11 --- quit: cods (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09:08:36 --- join: cods (n=cods@tuxee.net) joined #forth 09:10:00 Sunday Radio Beatles hour!!! 09:18:41 --- join: forthlet (n=fox@adsl-75-35-200-125.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) joined #forth 09:22:44 Yeah, we need something akin to ncurses interfacing for raw/cooked and lookup, etc. 09:25:13 yea 09:33:48 --- join: Astrobe (n=astrobe@82.67.86.119) joined #forth 09:35:44 it's gotta forthy 09:37:01 gotta be 09:51:58 --- quit: PoppaVic ("Pulls the pin...") 09:54:02 --- join: PoppaVic (n=pete@0-2pool238-214.nas24.chicago4.il.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 09:54:38 --- join: segher_ (n=segher@dslb-084-056-150-131.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 10:01:20 --- join: TheBlueWizard (i=TheBlueW@ts001d0580.wdc-dc.xod.concentric.net) joined #forth 10:06:26 --- quit: segher__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 10:14:43 --- quit: astecp (Remote closed the connection) 11:12:14 --- part: TheBlueWizard left #forth 11:28:41 --- quit: forthlet (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 11:33:00 --- join: snoopy_1711 (i=snoopy_1@dslb-084-058-130-014.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 11:41:17 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 11:41:32 --- nick: snoopy_1711 -> Snoopy42 11:50:40 --- quit: PoppaVic ("Pulls the pin...") 12:14:05 --- quit: Cheery ("Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/") 12:53:07 --- quit: Astrobe ("Leaving") 13:14:57 --- join: Topaz (n=top@spc1-horn1-0-0-cust255.cosh.broadband.ntl.com) joined #forth 13:19:14 --- join: Quartus_ (n=Quartus_@209.167.5.1) joined #forth 14:18:01 --- quit: virl (Remote closed the connection) 14:54:19 --- log: started forth/06.09.03 14:54:19 --- join: clog_ (n=nef@bespin.org) joined #forth 14:54:19 --- topic: 'Welcome to #forth. We discuss the Forth programming language, simplicity, and a variety of technical subjects. Introduction: http://tinyurl.com/kvawv | Starting Forth: http://tinyurl.com/rm7pq | Thinking Forth: http://tinyurl.com/nsy4j | Gforth compiler: http://tinyurl.com/s8uho | ANS/ISO Forth Standard doc: http://tinyurl.com/nx7dx | Paste >5 lines: http://forth.pastebin.ca/' 14:54:19 --- topic: set by Quartus on [Wed Aug 30 23:43:43 2006] 14:54:19 --- names: list (clog_ Quartus_ Topaz Snoopy42 segher_ cods nighty_ ayrnieu madgarden Quiznos k4jcw @JasonWoof madwork nighty @crc @Quartus Raystm2 virsys ohub lukeparrish Zymurgy michaelw clog TreyB ccfg juri_ warpzero Zarutian) 15:02:44 --- quit: clog (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 15:02:45 --- nick: clog_ -> clog 15:31:46 --- quit: Topaz (Remote closed the connection) 16:05:17 --- quit: Quartus_ ("used jmIrc") 17:50:03 --- nick: segher_ -> segher 18:09:21 --- quit: virsys (Remote closed the connection) 18:10:26 --- join: virsys (n=virsys@or-71-53-74-48.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) joined #forth 20:31:48 --- quit: ayrnieu (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 21:03:43 --- join: Anbidian (i=anbidian@S0106000fb09cff56.ed.shawcable.net) joined #forth 21:09:13 Why am I up? 21:09:35 ''cause cocaine keeps you going for days? 21:09:49 Hey. 21:10:05 Not any more it doesn't. Not for a long, long, _long_ time. 21:10:16 Hey Quartus :) 21:10:18 Just keep telling your employer that. 21:10:30 My employer could care less. 21:11:07 You work for the government? 21:11:14 I'm sure if he thought I could afford cocain on my wages, he'd cut them. 21:11:21 heh 21:12:27 I do usually feel compelled to turn the radio up when either J.J. Cale's or whoever did the remakes version comes on. 21:12:37 Not Peter Frampton. The other guy. 21:12:41 I ate a brownie about 2 hours ago. I'm about to test and I bet my sugar is high. 21:13:16 Eric Clapton 21:14:31 My Dad does a version of a song called 'Cocain Blues'. Worth the trip to Masssachusettes. 21:14:46 even with that many s's in it. 21:15:01 Is "My Dad" a group, or do you mean your father? 21:16:33 Ya my father 21:16:53 He's pretty entertaining, even at 70. 21:17:15 Ah, there's a Johnny Cash version of it. 21:17:24 263, i'm higher then a kite. 21:17:34 Ya, that's right, Johnny Cash. 21:17:40 Great song. 21:18:13 I'm partial to 'Hey Porter' myself. 21:18:39 Heh. Johnny Cash -- "The Man in #000000" 21:18:46 Reminds me of my journey home after separating from the Navy. 21:19:25 One set of lyrics show the "She don't lie; She don't lie; Cocaine" as the last line of the song. I wonder if Claptons version takes from that. 21:20:44 --- quit: nighty_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 21:24:05 Cocaine doesn't lie. 21:25:03 I knew early on that I had an addictive personality, and to not try coke. Because I KNEW I would like it. 21:25:18 Read it again as if Cocaine were his lover. 21:25:55 Were your parents alcoholics? Mine are. 21:26:37 My kids are the sole reason I don't drink. They do as you do, and ignore what you say. 21:28:10 http://www.cocaine.org/cocaine-socialism.html A collection of several cocaine songs 21:34:07 Cool, I hadn't heard that in a very long time. Thanks. 21:35:03 Huh. I didn't realize that J.J.Cale also wrote After Midnight. 21:49:45 --- join: segher_ (n=segher@dslb-084-056-134-031.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 21:52:34 Steve Irwin (the croc hunter) has died. 21:52:45 Apparently stung by a stingray in a marine accident of some kind. 21:53:44 When you get right up next to dangerous animals and taunt them, I'm not sure 'accident' applies. 21:54:21 Perhaps. 21:55:21 http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,20349541-5001021,00.html 22:00:28 Since i'm up, I've downloaded the latest rfans.fs and am reading. Cool beans, this. 22:01:27 --- quit: segher (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 22:02:03 Glad you're enjoying it :) 22:03:45 --- join: Cheery (n=Cheery@a81-197-19-23.elisa-laajakaista.fi) joined #forth 22:07:27 I do enjoy this. Not easy to find good Forth source. 22:07:58 Wish I knew where to find more source to read. 22:08:14 I'm working on that. I hope that the rf sources aren't too opaque. If any of it is too abstruse, please let me know. 22:09:06 It can be. But i'm used to colorforth and have learned to read and be patient for answers that come in time. 22:09:39 As I mentioned to k4jcw, it is intended for an audience familiar with both rf and Standard. 22:09:51 So it's a bit of an odd bird. 22:14:57 --- join: snowrichard (n=Owner@12.18.108.181) joined #forth 22:15:00 hi 22:20:54 Hi Snoopy42. 22:20:55 oops 22:20:57 Hi snowrichard 22:21:16 --- quit: snowrichard (SendQ exceeded) 22:22:48 --- join: snowrichard (n=Owner@12.18.108.181) joined #forth 22:22:50 hi 22:26:27 Hi again. 22:26:37 Hi. 22:26:41 i'm in a lame cygwin irc client 22:27:13 new computer 22:27:14 Why? 22:27:16 oh. 22:27:25 What is the machine? 22:27:28 downloading a linux distro now 22:27:32 :) 22:27:44 Emachines T3508 22:28:30 I've got to repartition, then restore the XP and then install the linux 22:29:46 but I'm downloading Mandriva One its a live cd you can install from 22:32:18 Looks like a cool machine. Fast. 22:32:24 Lots of room. 22:32:39 Did you get a monitor with it? 22:32:41 160 GB drive I think 22:32:44 Ya. 22:32:46 yea 17 inch crt 22:32:50 Cool. 22:33:00 and a printer 22:33:06 $424 at best buy 22:33:10 I like that you have the memstick port. 22:33:16 for the package? 22:33:19 --- join: fission (n=fission@69.60.114.33) joined #forth 22:33:24 with monitor and printer? 22:33:25 well had a usb cable too 22:34:13 Great price. 22:34:43 they had 1 machine that was cheaper but it only had DVD-ROM / CD RW and half the ram 22:34:57 and no memory ports on the front 22:35:29 make a good slave. :) There was a time when we'd druel over that machine. :) 22:36:20 I'm planning on developing some software for sale this should speed up the compiles :) 22:36:34 :) 22:36:39 what do you have in mind? 22:36:51 Or would that be giving too much away? 22:37:09 I've got a GUI that controls a shoutcast server and some other programs I use. I wanted to change to icecast for the audio streamer 22:37:25 Neat. 22:38:32 and ogg format for the audio files 22:38:49