00:00:00 --- log: started forth/06.08.08
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06:24:06 <Ray_work> Good morning world.
06:31:28 <vatic> Hi Ray_work!
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08:26:24 <nighty_> lo
08:30:02 <vatic> hi nighty_
08:31:58 <nighty_> :)
08:32:57 <vatic> nighty_ what's up?
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10:05:31 <Quiznos> w00t
10:05:58 <k4jcw> http://www.woot.com/
10:09:53 <PoppaVic> hmm?
10:16:13 <virl> I'd like a forth computer 
10:18:08 <Quiznos> we all would
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10:20:30 <PoppaVic> I don't pretend to "guru" or "elite" so "w00t" lost me and I was curious.
10:21:02 <Quiznos> curios about what?
10:26:47 <virl> what would the ideal forth computer have?
10:27:03 <virl> what do you imagine?
10:27:11 <virl> I'd like really to build one.
10:28:48 <Ray_work> virl the Ultimate forth computer would come with a vagina.
10:29:23 <virl> wtf?
10:29:40 <virl> aha.. ehm that's not what I would call a forth computer
10:30:01 <Quiznos> 2 on-chip stacks, registers (ip, sp, rp), interrupts, 32bit addressing :), extendible micro-code, 
10:31:08 <Quiznos> in a pen shaped case.
10:31:29 <Quiznos> or one dice
10:31:57 <Quiznos> or maybe a rubik's cube would be big enuf
10:33:22 <Ray_work> As an overlay for your watch.
10:33:29 <Quiznos> yea yea sure sure
10:33:45 <Ray_work> in clear pollystyrene
10:33:50 <Quiznos> heh
10:33:56 <Quiznos> no moving parts
10:34:02 <Ray_work> right.
10:34:06 <Ray_work> have to be that
10:35:04 <Ray_work> powered by the differencial between the fact that it does exist when it shouldn't. 
10:35:30 <Quiznos> heh, nah, just an antenna for soaking power from the air :)
10:35:52 <Ray_work> ooh it is air.
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10:37:06 <Quiznos> I!
10:38:38 <I440r> hi
10:38:47 <I440r> shhh im not here !
10:38:47 <I440r> :)
10:38:51 <I440r> HONEST!
10:40:01 <nighty_> Quartus: :)
10:40:06 <nighty_> 15:00 :)
10:41:28 <virl> well my wishes are similiar, but I don't think it makes sense to have the computer in a pen..
10:42:41 <Quiznos> well, i'm just emphasing really small. 
10:42:52 <Ray_work> io when you write with it.
10:43:04 <Quiznos> it need not have ink
10:43:16 <Ray_work> tatooing needle.
10:43:30 <Ray_work> for persistance.
11:02:13 <PoppaVic> nm - have fun. Just Another Day.
11:02:20 <PoppaVic> laters, kids
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11:06:27 <Quartus__> hi nighty. I'll be around at 3.
11:06:49 <I440r> bbl
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11:13:07 <nighty_> :)
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14:03:42 <vatic> Hi Quartus__ I have a dumb question...
14:05:39 <Quartus__> Hey. Go ahead.
14:10:04 <vatic> Quartus__ I type the following into Quartus: "1 2 3 4 2swap . . . ." and get "2 1 4 3 ok" back...
14:11:13 <vatic> ANS stack diagram says: ( x1 x2 x3 x4 -- x3  x4 x1 x2 ). What am I not seeing here?
14:11:39 <Quiznos> vatic did you write your own 2swap?
14:12:05 <vatic> Quiznos: in PIC18F assembler...
14:12:23 <Quiznos> vatic i think you messed up the code
14:12:38 <Quiznos> abcd -- cdab
14:12:53 <Quartus> vatic, it's supposed to be 3 4 1 2 coming back.
14:13:07 <Quiznos> vatic write it in : instead
14:13:08 <Quartus> If you . . . . you'll get 2 1 4 3.
14:13:24 <Quiznos> or with pick
14:13:57 <Quartus> It's working fine.  Try 1 2 3 4 2swap .s
14:14:13 <Quartus> nighty, thanks for the invite; interesting to see what you're up to there.
14:14:14 <vatic> Quartus__: so it's an issue between the char size of 1234 and the cell size of . . . . ?
14:14:57 <Quartus> No.  1 2 3 4 places 1 2 3 4 on the stack.  2swap turns that around to 3 4 1 2.   Displaying that with . returns them in reverse order, top-first.  So you get 2 1 4 3.
14:15:54 <Quartus> There are no chars involved in the operation, just cells.
14:15:56 <vatic> Quartus__: so the problem is I can't read a stack diagram correctly. How embarrassing!
14:16:27 <Quiznos> vatic lol
14:16:30 <Quartus> If you do     1 2 3 4 2swap .s  you'll see them on the stack in the expected order.  It's just that displaying them with . pulls them off and displays them in reverse order to the way they are on the stack.
14:16:31 <Quiznos> vatic cool
14:17:18 <vatic> Quartus__ yeah, I see that, thanks!
14:23:33 <vatic> Quartus__ thanks for that sheet on the minimum # of primitives for a Forth...
14:24:26 <vatic> Quartus__ the thing I did with Albert's ciForth was a bit different: Of the ASN CORE word set, what words were written as ASM primitives.
14:24:34 <vatic> Quartus__: http://pastebin.ca/122717
14:25:48 <Quartus> There are certain words that have to be primitives, like @ and !.  Some are a matter of choice.
14:30:32 <vatic> Quartus__ What I find valuable about your list is that it suggest a priority for development...
14:31:01 <vatic> For better or worse, I chose to get an interpreter running and deal with compilation later...
14:31:57 <Quiznos> vatic on the PIC?
14:32:11 <vatic> Quiznos: yeah...
14:32:29 <Quiznos> k
14:32:59 <vatic> Quiznos: for my friend's board: http://multio.mamalala.net/
14:34:04 <virl> I'm asking everytime how .s would be implemented in forth. a hell of stack juggling, perhaps?
14:35:21 <Quiznos> virl use sp0 to step up to sp0+depth
14:35:47 <Quiznos> vatic cool
14:36:18 <vatic> Quiznos: hopefully my Forth will work! ;-)
14:36:19 <Quiznos> copy sp0 and depth and do a sp0 (depth--) add .
14:36:23 <Quiznos> vatic yep
14:39:40 <Quartus> .s is generally implemented reading directly from stack memory, but there's a way to do it without accessing memory directly.
14:40:27 <virl> well, I would do it directly. 
14:44:46 <Quartus> In which case, no stack juggling to speak of.
14:45:53 <vatic> Quartus: I think .s is a high priority for me. Right now I just have u.
14:46:04 <Quartus> Can you read stack memory directly?
14:47:32 <Quartus> This is one way to do it if you can't:  : (.s)  depth if  >r recurse  r> dup .  then ;  : .S  ." <" depth u. ." > "  (.s) ;
14:47:47 <Quartus> Requires sufficient stack depth.
14:47:47 <vatic> Quartus: certainly from PIC ASM... All I have is an interp so I can define a word that iterates...
14:48:13 <vatic> can = can't
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14:48:30 <Quartus> Oh. You might want to do the 20 minutes work that builds the actual compiler. :)
14:49:27 <vatic> Quartus: my thinking was that once I had an interpreter and a certain number of ANS primitives, the compiler would be pretty straighforward.
14:50:06 <vatic> Quartus: thanks for the .s snippet!
14:50:07 <Quartus> I guess, if you're determined to write the compiler in high-level Forth.
14:50:34 <vatic> Quartus: oh, do you think it's that little work in ASM?
14:51:30 <Quartus> In a Standard Forth system, the compiler is a function of the interpreter (responding to STATE).  So the compiler isn't something you build afterward, it's integral to the interpreter loop.
14:51:59 <Quartus> In an antique implementation, : is a separate interpreter loop that is terminated by ;
14:52:47 <vatic> Quartus: well I spent some time avoiding the examination of STATE and such to build my interpreter. :-)
14:53:20 <Quartus> If you plan to build an antique implementation, you could build : to be its own interpreter loop, and thus write it readily enough in high-level Forth.
14:53:30 <Quartus> I don't recommend that, but it's one way to go.
14:53:51 <vatic> Quartus: so my interpreter loop is modelled the flow chart in Rather's book for example, but I've ignored the tests for compilation...
14:54:15 <Quartus> I don't have her flowchart at hand, but it sounds like the modern model.
14:54:26 <vatic> Quartus: been trying to model my interpreting words on ANS definitions...
14:54:38 <Quartus> I don't quite see how you'll use defined primitives to graft state-awareness into your interpreter loop.
14:54:50 <vatic> ABORT QUERY ACCEPT WORD >IN...
14:55:31 <Quartus> QUERY is deprecated, but ok.
14:57:26 <vatic> Quartus: so it's part of QUIT now?
14:58:02 <Quartus> You lost me.
14:59:26 <vatic> Quartus: Here's my QUIT loop. Sorry for the CRLF messiness: http://pastebin.ca/122762
15:00:27 <segher> : .s ( -- )  depth dup   BEGIN dup WHILE 1- rot >r REPEAT drop   BEGIN dup WHILE 1- r> . REPEAT drop ;
15:01:00 <Quartus> vatic, when I say QUERY is deprecated, I mean in the Standard REFILL is the replacement for QUERY.
15:01:08 <vatic> segher: thnx!
15:01:16 <Quartus> segher, that lightens the load on the return stack a bit.
15:01:25 <segher> vatic: np
15:01:36 <vatic> Quartus: OK, thanks. I must have overlooked the deprecation in the Draft standard.
15:01:42 <segher> quartus: yeah, needs return stack depth the same as parameter stack depth
15:02:04 <Quartus> vatic, http://quartus.net/dpans/dpansa6.htm#A.6.2.2040
15:02:33 <Quartus> Still, you're unlikely to have so shallow a return stack that the recursive version would bomb out.
15:03:20 <Quiznos> segher too many dups in that :?
15:03:27 <vatic> Quartus: you know. I asked about writing the QUIT loop using ANS words on c.l.f and didn't get a very good response.
15:03:30 <segher> recursive version needs twice the return stack, on implementations that can't transform the RECURSE into a loop anyway
15:03:39 <Quartus> vatic, I don't recall that.
15:03:54 <segher> quiznos: looks fine to me?
15:03:56 <vatic> Quartus:  oh, I'm not saying you should have responded...
15:04:03 <vatic> :-)
15:04:05 <Quiznos> 3 dups and one drop at the end
15:04:06 <Quartus> segher, yes.  So an average stack display might require 12 cells on the return stack instead of 6.
15:04:19 <Quiznos> 2 dups
15:04:29 <segher> one dup
15:05:02 <segher> and both those "depth" things are eaten by the loops, one each
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15:06:16 <vatic> Quartus: people basically said "you can't write the QUIT loopusing ANS words. Besides it'd be slow"
15:06:21 <Quartus> If a system has a return stack so small as to make that a consideration, a .S that reads stack memory directly would be the way to go.
15:06:29 <vatic> They didn't get I was looking for a model...
15:06:39 <segher> quartus: sure, almost always the stacks will be big enough, heh
15:08:04 <Quartus> vatic, I think it can, in general terms, be written using ANS words, but QUIT also resets the return stack, which is an implementation-specific thing.
15:08:57 <Quartus> It also has to reset the exception-handler chain, return the input source to the default, things like that.
15:09:18 <segher> : (kill-return-stack  BEGIN r> drop AGAIN ;  : kill-return-stack  ['] (kill-return-stack CATCH drop ;
15:09:25 <segher> well that won't really work, but heh
15:09:27 <vatic> Quartus: well I guess only someone as generous or crazy as you are would have offered help...
15:09:55 <Quartus> If somebody told you you can't do it, they'd be right as far as that goes, as you can't make a compliant QUIT without fiddling under the hood.
15:11:52 <segher> but you don't need to, as you already _have_ a QUIT if your system is compliant ;-)
15:12:11 <vatic> Quartus: yes, I see.
15:13:14 <vatic> segher: I'm interested in it as a model of what to code in ASM. I liked van der Horst's ciForth for that, but it's still a FIG Forth model...
15:14:35 <Quartus> vatic, you should check out MAF.
15:14:38 <segher> you need about 12 primitives or so.  but i guess you want  +  etc. as primitives as well, so better make it 30-40
15:14:53 <vatic> Quartus: what's that?
15:14:58 <vatic> MAF?
15:14:59 <segher> PAF/MAF is great fun, yeah
15:15:06 <Quartus> Minimal ANS Forth.
15:15:31 <segher> it's an ANS Forth that runs on top of another Forth
15:15:34 <vatic> I've never run across it.
15:15:51 <vatic> unless it a FIG UK thing...
15:15:52 <Quartus> It 's a Forth written in Forth, not intended for use but for education.
15:16:02 <Quartus> ftp://ftp.taygeta.com/pub/Forth/Applications/ANS/maf1v02.zip
15:16:49 <Quartus> There's a QUIT in there that's a good outline.
15:18:00 <vatic> Quartus: ah yes, actually, I saw this more than a year ago but lost track of it... Thanks!
15:18:35 <Quartus> There's a QUIT showing CATCH/THROW integration in the Standard, too: http://quartus.net/dpans/dpansa9.htm
15:19:19 <Quartus> So, no shortage of outlines of what steps the word needs to take.
15:26:05 <vatic> Quartus: well thanks again!!
15:26:22 <vatic> segher, you too... :-)
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16:03:35 <nanstm> Hello, Men!
16:03:41 <nanstm> oops sex change
16:03:46 --- nick: nanstm -> Raystm2
16:04:19 <Raystm2> ahem, Hello, Men! ( deeper voice)
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16:16:30 <Raystm2> hi slava, how's the factor?
16:16:36 * Raystm2 really needs to try that.
16:16:47 <slava> working on the compiler
16:17:19 <Raystm2> cool. 
16:17:43 <Raystm2> slava: do you have a chessgame in factor yet?
16:17:49 <slava> no
16:18:58 <Raystm2> I owe one to IsForth, which I'll do after I finish the Retroforth version. 
16:19:13 <Raystm2> Maybe if I can understand Factor, I'll give you one as well.
16:19:41 <Raystm2> I use chess to learn languages. It's my helloworld.
16:20:45 <Raystm2> actually, i'm at a conceptual stopping point in the RxChess, I should prob'ly do all three at the same time.
16:39:52 <ayrnieu> "thats after I get through the army and become a merc."
16:40:32 <Raystm2> is that from a movie or something?
16:41:24 <ayrnieu> wanting to join Britain's military?  OK, sure.  Want to be a sniper?  Fine, fine.  Want to get through British army and then become a mercenary?  ... yow, I just felt a rush of disgust, as if I were some kind of hippy pacifist.
16:41:34 <ayrnieu> someone on a forum.
16:42:49 <Raystm2> hehe.
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17:16:47 <nighty_> re
17:16:49 <nighty_> Quartus: thanks for dropping by :)
17:17:02 <Quartus> Hey. Thanks for the invite :) Sent my doc via email.
17:17:13 <nighty_> Quartus: I did not get that 
17:17:16 <Raystm2> hello.
17:17:17 <nighty_> Quartus: uhmmm
17:17:25 <Quartus> I can resend, let me know where.
17:18:22 <nighty_> Quartus: oh
17:18:30 <nighty_> Wait a second :)
17:18:38 <nighty_> I know what happens 
17:19:05 <nighty_> my machine at the office is picking the emails
17:19:11 <Quartus> Ah.
17:19:30 <nighty_> I really need to get a in house email server going there
17:19:50 <nighty_> their infras are just not good
17:20:00 <nighty_> need to put some order into this
17:20:10 <nighty_> with eric
17:20:13 <nighty_> :)
17:20:27 <Quartus> Heh. The challenges of infrastructure.
17:20:32 <nighty_> Eric did not speak much but he is a very knowledgeable person
17:20:42 <Quartus> I figured he just didn't like me. :)
17:20:49 <nighty_> no he liked you 
17:20:59 <nighty_> he just does not speak much 
17:21:30 <nighty_> Quartus: he is always like this 
17:21:42 <Quartus> Ok, that's good. I wasn't worried really.
17:21:45 <nighty_> Quartus: I know him for more than 15 years
17:23:09 <nighty_> Quartus: now that you have a better understanding of what NLT does
17:23:29 <Quartus> I do. Interesting operation.
17:23:33 <nighty_> Quartus: it is easier for you to see if there is anything you want and/or can do with us
17:23:53 <Quartus> Sure.  I talked a bit about it in my email.
17:24:09 <nighty_> i'll read tomorrow
17:24:48 <nighty_> I've got to put up some VPN once I get my Dry Loop
17:24:54 <nighty_> and ADSL
17:36:38 <Quartus> That's coming soon?
17:39:09 <Quartus> Your ADSL, I mean.
17:39:09 <nighty_> When I come from France on the 25th
17:39:27 <Quartus> So spell for me where you're from in France again?
17:39:28 <nighty_> No need to pay for it when I am not here
17:39:33 <nighty_> Reims
17:39:44 <nighty_> Reims , Marne (51) 
17:39:48 <nighty_> Champagne Region
17:40:09 <Quartus> I hear the sound of corks popping . :)
17:40:15 <nighty_> Yes :)
17:40:56 <Quartus> Did you finally get your beer the other night? Or was it ice cream?
17:41:00 <nighty_> I am going to host a machine and get some DID and SIP trunks
17:41:07 <nighty_> Quartus: none of it :)
17:41:50 <Quartus> Not good, I shall have to buy you a beer one evening.
17:41:59 <nighty_> Yeah! :)
17:42:01 <nighty_> nice 
17:42:21 <Quartus> Though you know, you can't smoke in bars here.
17:42:25 <nighty_> I went to buy car baby seats
17:42:32 <nighty_> that's ok :)
17:42:52 <nighty_> I had to go to Toy R Us 
17:43:07 <nighty_> because Zellers had only very bad quality seats
17:43:27 <Quartus> Zellers wouldn't be my first choice.  Maybe Canadian Tire?
17:43:45 <nighty_> I bought from Toy R Us
17:43:50 <nighty_> 100 $ each
17:43:53 <nighty_> I bought 2
17:43:54 <nighty_> :)
17:44:00 <Quartus> Right. Twins.
17:44:07 <nighty_> yep 
17:44:51 <nighty_> As you could tell Mike (NLT) likes to make long complicated sentences :)
17:45:04 <nighty_> To say very simple things :)
17:45:08 <Quartus> Perhaps I do too, I didn't really notice :)
17:45:22 <nighty_> no you were ok :)
17:45:38 <nighty_> I just have a good laugh everytime Mike is in a Meeting
17:45:49 <nighty_> he is an OK dude though
17:45:57 <Quartus> Seems like a nice guy.
17:46:11 <nighty_> Yes overall everybody is nice in the company
17:46:26 <nighty_> except for some of the sales guys :)
17:46:31 <Quartus> Heh.
17:47:43 <nighty_> The CEO dropped by just after you left 
17:47:52 <nighty_> he popped in our room 
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17:47:56 <Quartus> I was still nearby in Home Depot.
17:48:08 <nighty_> and asked me : so you had a meeting ? 
17:48:15 <nighty_> I answered: Yep 
17:48:23 <nighty_> he said: good good
17:48:26 <nighty_> and went away :)
17:48:31 <Quartus> heh
17:48:56 <nighty_> He is a good guy too 
17:49:04 <nighty_> spends its time playing golf :)
17:49:07 <Quartus> Well, hopefully some appropriate hardware people can be found.  I think it'd be interesting work.
17:49:10 <nighty_> with his buddies
17:49:31 <Quartus> Nice job he has. :)
17:49:40 <nighty_> yes and he is LOADED :)
17:49:51 <nighty_> I wish I had his job :)
17:50:01 <Quartus> Me too.
17:50:07 <nighty_> he just came back from australia
17:50:18 <nighty_> because there is an NLT in australia
17:50:30 <Quartus> Right, I saw that on the website.
18:00:41 <Quartus> How long has NL been at that location?
18:04:11 <nighty_> Since the begining
18:04:24 <nighty_> the building belongs to levitt safety
18:04:51 <nighty_> But they are making plans for a new one
18:05:17 <Quartus> Just in time? :)
18:05:25 <nighty_> lol :)
18:05:40 <nighty_> Well we have ROOFERS from HELL
18:05:59 <nighty_> these guys just don't know what they are doing
18:06:06 <Quartus> Flat roof, too.
18:06:08 <nighty_> and they already lost plenty money
18:06:15 <nighty_> because of insurance
18:06:48 <nighty_> they have to pay already more than the cost of ROOF 
18:06:56 <Quartus> Sheesh.
18:06:57 <nighty_> and Levitt is taking them to court
18:07:21 <nighty_> Levitt lawyers are a bunch of hungry dogs
18:07:27 <Quartus> I suppose they have to be.
18:07:39 <nighty_> I think they will tear apart the poor bastards
18:08:14 <Quartus> Rightly so, from the looks of things.
18:08:34 <nighty_> The roofers already have to pay for 2 Oscilloscopes
18:08:42 <nighty_> digitals one
18:08:51 <nighty_> top of the line stuff
18:09:07 <nighty_> Digital analyzers
18:09:08 <Quartus> Bad luck.
18:09:22 <nighty_> like 20000$ a piece thing
18:09:37 <nighty_> not counting several computers
18:09:43 <nighty_> and furnitures
18:09:49 <nighty_> carpetting
18:09:58 <nighty_> all the Cubicles
18:10:07 <nighty_> etc.... 
18:10:08 <nighty_> etc...
18:10:09 <Quartus> Ugly business.
18:10:32 <nighty_> Yeah if you have to redo a roof
18:10:38 <nighty_> I'll give u their names
18:10:44 <Quartus> heh
18:10:46 <nighty_> so you don't hire them
18:10:50 <Quartus> As long as it's not Avenue Road Roofing.
18:11:39 <nighty_> I got to buy a car 
18:11:46 <nighty_> do you know any good place to do so ? 
18:11:57 <nighty_> somewhere I could get good pricing ? 
18:11:57 <Quartus> I'm not a car-owner, so I can't really recommend.
18:12:03 <Quartus> I can ask a friend of mine.
18:12:10 <Quartus> New or used?
18:12:15 <nighty_> depends
18:12:19 <nighty_> New is ok 
18:12:24 <nighty_> but if I can get a nice demo
18:12:29 <nighty_> I might 
18:12:49 <Quartus> I sent a note, I'll let you know what he says.
18:12:51 <nighty_> I don't buy American cars thought
18:12:53 <nighty_> I don't buy American cars though
18:13:07 <Quartus> Noted.
18:13:18 <nighty_> Japanese or German
18:13:26 <nighty_> or UK
18:13:27 <nighty_> LandRover
18:13:31 <nighty_> for example
18:13:53 <Quartus> Ok.
18:13:54 <nighty_> if I can my hands on a nice LR3
18:13:58 <nighty_> cheap :)
18:14:12 <Quartus> My friend's a family man himself, he may have some good advice.
18:14:26 <nighty_> Quartus: you don't have any kids ? 
18:14:39 <Quartus> No, I don't.
18:15:30 <nighty_> here without a car , you don't do much 
18:15:38 <nighty_> I wonder how you manage
18:15:51 <nighty_> like for shopping and stuf
18:15:52 <Quartus> In fact I find no need for one in the city.  Transit's good.  Cabs if I'm in a rush.
18:16:18 <nighty_> but you shop very little ? 
18:16:25 <Quartus> I'm right downtown, so the market is right here, and 24hr. groceries, etc.  Occasionally I need something large, I'll have it delivered or use a friend's vehicle.
18:16:36 <nighty_> I see
18:17:26 <Quartus> Walking keeps me fit. :)
18:17:39 <nighty_> Yes I walk a lot too :)
18:17:41 <nighty_> for now :)
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18:18:46 <nighty_> re :)
18:20:29 <vatic> nighty_ :-)
18:20:32 <Quartus> I find walking assists thinking, too.
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18:48:33 <nighty_> Hey how do you specify the number of pixel in width in a CSS ? 
18:48:49 <nighty_> like for fieldset {margin: 1em 0 0 0}
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20:36:09 <nighty_> I guess not :)
20:39:53 <nighty_> uhhhh! I guess skunks now near my windows !
20:40:02 <nighty_> better not piss them off!
20:40:23 <nighty_> its a zoo here ! :)
21:46:23 <Quartus> Hey. Heard back from my friend.  Last time he bought a new car he joined the apa, www.apa.com  -- for a small fee they tell you the lowest priced places to go for three different makes/models, turned out ot be a very good deal.
21:47:27 <Quartus> He said for Toyota, it was http://wietzes.toyota.ca/ and for a Honda Civic http://www.georgetownhonda.com/ .  This was a few years back.  He definitely recommends the apa though.
21:47:36 <Quartus> Oops.  www.apa.ca
21:47:38 <Quartus> sorry for the confusion
23:06:11 <nighty_> ok:)
23:06:16 <nighty_> how about Nissan ? 
23:06:17 <nighty_> :)
23:12:28 <Quartus> That one I don't know... worth the $65 to join APA, he saved way more than that.
23:12:40 <nighty_> :)
23:13:23 <Quartus> They really know their stuff.
23:15:58 <nighty_> ok
23:16:00 <nighty_> bed time 
23:16:07 <nighty_> my fridge is dying on me
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23:16:20 <nighty_> I need to ask the superintendant
23:16:23 <nighty_> to change it
23:16:48 <nighty_> it is supposed to be new , but the rear freon tubes are all corroded
23:17:08 <nighty_> and the electric pump is hot 
23:17:24 <nighty_> I think they just bought a cheap ass fridge
23:18:03 <nighty_> and now instead of a making small economies they'll have to buy a new fridge
23:18:13 <Quartus> Gotta keep the chocolate milk cold. :)
23:18:17 <nighty_> sometimes I don't understand canadian company
23:18:23 <nighty_> sometimes I don't understand canadian companies
23:18:31 <nighty_> they always try to run cheap 
23:18:37 <Quartus> They make stupid and cheap all over the world.
23:18:40 <nighty_> but end up spending more money 
23:19:25 <nighty_> if you buy cheap stuff it last very little 
23:19:28 <nighty_> usually
23:19:52 <nighty_> also they buy american brands everything, which is mostly crap 
23:20:22 <nighty_> I went to try american 4WD from GM 
23:20:24 <nighty_> GMC
23:20:31 <nighty_> I went for test drive
23:20:42 <nighty_> I just got out of the parking lot when I heard a noise
23:20:51 <nighty_> I told the guy sitting next to me
23:20:55 <nighty_> we lost something
23:20:59 <nighty_> he said : NO
23:21:04 <nighty_> I stopped
23:21:11 <nighty_> the truck was pissing OIL
23:21:25 <nighty_> brand new GMC 4WD
23:21:46 <nighty_> I told the guy ...ok when you have something better to show me I'll come back
23:21:47 <nighty_> and left
23:21:54 <Quartus> Still in the infant mortality period.  New equipment fails more often.
23:22:43 <Quartus> Or maybe the last guy who test-drove it managed to drive over something that pierced the oil reservoir.
23:22:59 <nighty_> I don't think so 
23:23:13 <Quartus> Not that I'm a big fan of GMC, but I think they figured out how to keep the oil in the engine by now. :)
23:23:16 <nighty_> I found the OIL carter 10 meters behind
23:23:40 <nighty_> the screw on it was cut
23:23:44 <nighty_> broken
23:24:08 <nighty_> anyway so much for a trial 
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23:25:39 <nighty_> good night
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23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/06.08.08