00:26:18 --- log: started forth/06.04.03 00:26:18 --- quit: Quartus (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 00:48:11 --- join: Quartus (n=trailer@CPE0001023f6e4f-CM013349902843.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 01:33:23 --- join: ecraven (n=stud@62.218.37.98) joined #forth 01:36:58 --- join: Cheery (n=Henri@a81-197-45-47.elisa-laajakaista.fi) joined #forth 01:41:15 has anyone here ever met Prof. Anton Ertl from vienna? 01:42:00 No, but I see his usenet posts quite often :) 01:42:30 is he a nice guy? 01:42:36 friendly and stufF? 01:42:59 No idea, I haven't talked to him. Why? 01:43:16 The posts I've seen haven't been too unfriendly. 01:43:24 i think he's the only prof. who knows anything about stack machines in Austria.. 02:00:30 --- part: ecraven left #forth 02:10:45 --- quit: slava (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 03:49:31 --- join: virl (n=virl@chello062178085149.1.12.vie.surfer.at) joined #forth 04:25:26 hi 04:48:44 --- join: PoppaVic (n=pete@0-1pool46-102.nas30.chicago4.il.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 05:30:24 --- join: PoppaVic1 (n=pete@0-1pool66-204.nas22.chicago4.il.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 05:30:40 --- quit: PoppaVic (Nick collision from services.) 05:30:44 --- nick: PoppaVic1 -> PoppaVic 06:05:30 --- join: rehges (n=segher@blueice4n1.de.ibm.com) joined #forth 06:11:32 --- join: ravenEx (i=ravenEx@VPN-224-44.aichyna.com) joined #forth 06:17:18 I dunno' if I hate finkcommander or SDL more *sigh* 06:17:46 --- part: rehges left #forth 06:24:26 --- join: segher (n=segher@dslb-084-056-171-234.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 06:33:50 --- quit: segher_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 06:38:33 --- join: PoppaVic1 (n=pete@0-1pool46-254.nas30.chicago4.il.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 06:38:52 --- quit: PoppaVic (Nick collision from services.) 06:38:55 --- nick: PoppaVic1 -> PoppaVic 06:40:12 --- quit: ravenEx (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 06:43:43 --- join: ravenEx (i=ravenEx@VPN-224-22.aichyna.com) joined #forth 07:47:04 well, shit.. No matter what I do, I ain't going to build Fovium with SDL 07:53:39 hmm... maybe I'm approaching it badly (and I do not mean SDL) 07:56:49 --- join: JasonWoof (n=jason@pdpc/supporter/student/Herkamire) joined #forth 07:56:50 --- mode: ChanServ set +o JasonWoof 07:59:57 --- join: tathi (n=josh@pdpc/supporter/bronze/tathi) joined #forth 08:00:07 hi tathi 08:00:18 hi 08:01:41 tathi: I've been deep-thinking "the stack(s)"... Are they not almost identical to a message-queue? 08:07:25 tathi: ?? 08:20:36 no. 08:20:47 a queue is first-in, first-out 08:20:54 a stack is last-in, first-out 08:21:21 roll and pop and such refute that, but... Look at it a few. 08:22:15 no. 08:22:22 tathi: isn't the queue just "add to the TOP/front"? 08:23:12 no, in a queue you add to the rear, or tail 08:23:19 you take things off when they get to the front of the line 08:24:41 ok, but it's not a LIFO either. 08:25:12 it's almost more akin to an array 08:25:15 a stack IS a LIFO. 08:25:47 I know what it is SUPPOSED to be, but the assorted gymnastics suggest otherwise. 08:26:03 yes, there are stack-manipulation words to grab the top few, but that doesn't change things much. 08:26:24 and as far as I'm concerned, ROLL and PICK should not be part of a forth. 08:26:28 hmm... I think it does, but it just changes dependencies. 08:26:41 tathi: most purists do. 08:27:23 interesting 08:29:37 I can recall, (once upon a time), coding F-pc to add a header-field and use it for accounting of uses.. Refcount. Gymnastics were the most huge mess. 08:30:18 It's not _seriously_ suprising, but folks seem to want to ignore it. 08:32:20 tathi: I presume you are also against "locals"? By these, I do mean "as they are"? 08:34:38 hmm? 08:34:57 I don't see any use for them. 08:35:03 ahh 08:35:15 OK, I thought so. Thank you. 08:35:50 Yet, we deal daily with "stack frames" - and deal well, on the most part. 08:35:54 I think that if you want a register based language, you should just use one 08:36:01 ahh 08:36:07 instead of trying to overlay named parameters on Forth 08:36:19 ok, so you see those as registers? 08:36:40 how else? 08:37:01 I was thinking of offsets, actually. 08:38:22 sorta' like dealing with sizeof/offsetof and the infamous typeof 08:38:55 in a backasswards, sideways way 09:10:08 tathi: I think we need a pascal-type func-call to interface C to a Forth. But, that's a rough. 09:11:00 or, a consumes vs sources symantic. 09:12:29 I don't know anything about pascal 09:14:16 tathi: the diff with pascal and C.. arg-order, and the caller (in C) pops the args it passed; in pascal-mode it lets the callee pop the args 09:14:46 So, naturally... I am pondering what it all means. 10:11:40 * PoppaVic twiddles his thumbs 10:16:27 humph 10:20:04 OK, I see a potential solution. 10:20:10 laters... 10:20:12 --- part: PoppaVic left #forth 11:04:03 --- quit: ravenEx (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 11:10:24 --- join: ravenEx (i=ravenEx@VPN-224-136.aichyna.com) joined #forth 11:49:30 --- quit: snowrichard ("Leaving") 12:09:09 --- quit: Cheery ("Leaving") 13:20:25 --- quit: ravenEx ("IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH") 13:35:02 --- quit: tathi ("leaving") 14:10:38 --- join: Lars_G (n=lars@unaffiliated/lars-g/x-000001) joined #forth 14:14:57 --- part: Lars_G left #forth 14:35:03 --- quit: virl ("Verlassend") 16:29:07 --- join: ajs (n=alan@cpe-69-200-85-107.nyc.res.rr.com) joined #forth 17:21:20 --- nick: Raystm2_ -> Raystm2 18:32:29 --- quit: uiuiuiu (Remote closed the connection) 18:32:33 --- join: uiuiuiu (i=ian@dslb-084-056-240-164.pools.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 19:59:26 --- join: slava (n=slava@CPE0080ad77a020-CM000e5cdfda14.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 20:29:24 --- join: LOOP-HOG (n=chatzill@sub22-119.member.dsl-only.net) joined #forth 20:55:35 --- quit: LOOP-HOG ("ChatZilla 0.9.61 [Mozilla rv:1.7.5/20041217]") 21:51:09 --- quit: arke (Nick collision from services.) 21:51:11 --- join: arke (i=c_walton@lnx101.hrz.tu-darmstadt.de) joined #forth 21:51:39 --- quit: arke (Nick collision from services.) 21:56:11 --- join: arke_ (i=c_walton@lnx101.hrz.tu-darmstadt.de) joined #forth 22:10:29 --- quit: arke_ ("Lost terminal") 22:12:27 --- join: arke (i=c_walton@lnx103.hrz.tu-darmstadt.de) joined #forth 22:39:27 --- join: jungledog (n=dschauer@adsl-68-88-123-214.dsl.lgvwtx.swbell.net) joined #forth 22:39:49 --- part: jungledog left #forth 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/06.04.03