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03:05:13 <akebono> hi
03:05:38 <akebono> people are asleep...
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19:59:04 <akebono> Oh, so many people in the Forth community.
19:59:21 <akebono> I'm a new visitor here.
19:59:25 <akebono> How are you?
19:59:40 <akebono> Ha, everyone is sleeping?
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21:21:44 <Om3r> hi
21:22:10 <Om3r> everyone idle or what?
21:22:18 <Raystm2> hi
21:22:59 <Om3r> i want learn this programming language
21:23:14 <Om3r> where i can find information..
21:24:31 <Raystm2> http://www.forth.org/
21:25:21 <Raystm2> http://www.colorforth.com/
21:26:14 <Raystm2> http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?ForthLanguage
21:26:25 <Om3r> i need someone to write a program for me i'll pay for it
21:26:40 <Om3r> i have a course at school on this language i failed it 3times =)
21:27:33 <Raystm2> hehe
21:27:57 <Om3r> u can do it?
21:31:16 <Om3r> ...
21:32:19 <Raystm2> No I can't do it., sorry.
21:33:05 <Om3r> is there a version of isForth fow windows
21:33:08 <Om3r> or its just for linux?
21:33:43 <Raystm2> I've never used isForth, I don't know the answer to that question, sorry.
21:33:52 <Raystm2> Did you check the isForth site?
21:34:10 <Om3r> isForth and forth its same no?
21:37:11 <Om3r> ?
21:42:31 <Om3r> alo?
21:42:42 <Raystm2> isForth is a version of forth
21:42:50 <Raystm2> there are many others
21:43:05 <Raystm2> Gforth and Win32forth prob'ly the most popular.
21:43:24 <Raystm2> They are free and work in windows.
21:43:41 <Om3r> isforth work in windows?
21:44:06 <Raystm2> also the online book called "Starting Forth" is prob'ly the best tutoriial for beginners.
21:45:00 <Raystm2> I don't think ( after having just looking it up in google) that there is not a windows version.
21:45:12 <Raystm2> yikes :) 
21:45:32 <Om3r> online book called "Starting Forth"
21:45:32 <Raystm2> i mean there's no windows version of isForth as far as I can tell.
21:45:43 <Om3r> where i can find it
21:45:44 <Raystm2> Yes by Leo Brodie.
21:46:28 <Raystm2> http://home.iae.nl/users/mhx/sf.html
21:46:42 <Om3r> merci raymond
21:47:33 <Raystm2> My great pleasure to assist you. 
21:48:25 <Om3r> you speak french?
21:48:38 <Raystm2> No, sorry, I wish I did.
21:48:55 * Raystm2 = 1/2 French
21:49:02 <Om3r> lol
21:49:16 <Raystm2> My fathers family is French.
21:49:44 <Om3r> st marie is french name 
21:49:53 <Raystm2> Yes.
21:55:50 <Om3r> it is possible to buy this book
21:57:25 <Raystm2> I believe they are rare anymore, checking amazon...
21:58:55 <Raystm2> http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/013843087X/qid=1034103279/sr=1-2/ref=sr_1_2/104-0967176-9423963?v=glance
22:01:11 <Om3r> thx
22:02:50 <Raystm2> np :)
22:14:59 <Om3r> is I440r wrote isForth?
22:15:25 <JasonWoof> Om3r: yes
22:15:35 <Raystm2> Yes I believe he did, and he's here quite often.
22:15:52 <Raystm2> Om3r meet JasonWoof, He created Herkforth.
22:15:58 <JasonWoof> hmm... actually, I'm not entirely sure he started thoe project
22:16:03 <JasonWoof> but he's at least written most of it
22:16:14 <JasonWoof> and is the current maintainor and main developer
22:16:35 <Raystm2> I think your correct JasonWoof, I believe he took over the project from someone.
22:17:08 <JasonWoof> I know tcn had something to do with it
22:17:34 * Raystm2 re-reading Thinking Forth currently, I've never finished it and i've started from the beginning yet again.
22:17:49 <JasonWoof> Om3r: oh, in regards to your question about forth vs isforth... "forth" is a broad term. a catagorie of languages
22:17:50 <Raystm2> I didn't know that.
22:18:03 <JasonWoof> Om3r: isforth is a particular variant/implementation
22:18:23 <Om3r> so what i should do if want learn programming with isForth
22:18:31 <JasonWoof> I think he did anyway...
22:18:33 <Raystm2> There is a little history of how forth came together on Chuck Moores site.
22:19:19 <JasonWoof> Om3r: I'd reccomend reading Starting Forth
22:19:23 <Raystm2> Om3r do you have a linux box?
22:19:30 <Om3r> yes
22:20:20 <Om3r> no one of you want write a little program for me i'll pay for that =)
22:20:24 <JasonWoof> I don't see any documentation on the isforth website. There's hopefully some that comes with the source code
22:20:45 <JasonWoof> Om3r: you'll pay for me to write you a forth program?
22:20:50 <Raystm2> Good, please read starting forth and be sure to code the examples. You will be tested for your proficiency in an hour and if you do not write a world class application in a day or so you will be asked to leave never to return. 
22:21:10 <Om3r> JasonWoof yes
22:21:20 <JasonWoof> Om3r: cool :) what should it do?
22:21:26 <Om3r> im serious
22:21:28 <Raystm2> You will be tested this way on a monthly basis.
22:21:40 <Raystm2> Should you fail you will owe me money :)
22:21:41 <Raystm2> hehe
22:21:56 <Raystm2> Begin reading now!
22:22:05 <Om3r> lol
22:22:08 <Raystm2> :)
22:22:11 <Om3r> i wish but my english suck
22:22:25 <Om3r> thats why im looking someone to write for me
22:22:30 <Raystm2> so what so does mine and its my main language.
22:22:38 <JasonWoof> Om3r: what would you like written for you?
22:22:46 <Raystm2> His homework.
22:22:53 <JasonWoof> hehe
22:23:03 <Raystm2> what is you homework anyway Om3r?
22:23:05 <JasonWoof> what's the assignment?
22:23:05 <Raystm2> you never said.
22:23:05 <Om3r> its my project for school
22:23:16 <Raystm2> what is the project?
22:23:20 <Om3r> i should get this course if want get my diplom
22:23:42 <Om3r> i have to make a Data logging
22:24:09 <Raystm2> what are the inputs, what are the outputs?
22:26:12 <Om3r> using the parallel port of the computer
22:26:33 <Raystm2> Connected to what?
22:28:30 <Om3r> the project consist to make a program that get information from sensors and log the information on the floppy
22:30:52 <Raystm2> Were you issued sensors and a computer to achieve this?
22:32:27 <Om3r> we have a board with the micro processor
22:33:37 <Om3r> the information to log could be anyting like temperature or voltage...
22:36:06 <Raystm2> I see. You have to beable to poll the port for information and log that information on a floppy. Do you have a requirment as to how that information is to be formatted?
22:37:00 <Om3r> nop
22:38:52 <Om3r> like the information logged could be written in a file and saved on the floppy
22:39:49 <JasonWoof> ok, my uncompiler is as tested as I'm going to test it
22:41:13 <JasonWoof> Om3r: could you just write to the disk directly (ie sequentially, no filesystem)
22:41:41 <Om3r> nop.. it should be writted on the floppy
22:42:03 <Raystm2> Om3r, I've read the keyboard port before but never the parallel port. I'm trying to find information on doing that.
22:42:06 <JasonWoof> by "disk" I meant "floppy disk"
22:42:14 <Om3r> yes
22:43:05 <JasonWoof> Om3r: do you have to process the data from the parallel port? or just dump it onto the floppy?
22:43:09 <Om3r> when ill finish my board ill take a picture so that could help you
22:43:34 <JasonWoof> l /dev/port*
22:43:41 <JasonWoof> eh
22:43:43 <Raystm2> http://www.forth.org/fd/Step.html
22:43:50 <Om3r> from the parallel port
22:44:27 <JasonWoof> Om3r: do you have to change or parse or interpret or otherwise process the data you're reading from the parallel port?
22:44:40 <JasonWoof> Om3r: or do you just want to dump the data directly from the parallel port onto the floppy?
22:45:04 <Om3r> nop
22:45:25 <Om3r> just dump the data directly from the parallel port onto the floppy
22:45:35 <JasonWoof> can't you just do something like this:
22:45:46 <JasonWoof> cat /dev/pport > /mnt/floppy/pport.log
22:46:05 <Om3r> yes
22:46:21 <Om3r> there should have 4 sensors
22:46:45 <Om3r> so it mean 4 analog/numeric convertor
22:46:53 <JasonWoof> (I'm not sure if the parallel port can be read in this way, I've never had a computer with a parallel port)
22:47:31 <JasonWoof> If it can be read with in that way, I'd reccomend taking advantage of that
22:47:42 <Raystm2> JasonWoof what do you connect your printer with, usb?
22:48:17 <JasonWoof> if you need to process it at all, pipe it. eg:   isforth foo.txt < /dev/pport > /mnt/floppy/foo.log
22:48:33 <JasonWoof> Raystm2: if I had one... it'd most likely be USB. I've got a mac
22:48:40 <Raystm2> I see. 
22:48:59 <JasonWoof> usb is pretty popular for printers these days anyway
22:49:03 <Raystm2> yes
22:49:05 <Om3r> yea
22:49:16 <Raystm2> http://www.forth.org/fd/Step.html
22:49:29 <Raystm2> Om3r this artical is doing what you want to do.
22:50:30 <Om3r> lol im trying to read it
22:50:46 <Om3r> but my english is so bad
22:52:47 <Om3r> so guyz someone want do it?
22:53:26 <Om3r> ill pay by Paypall or ship something you need from the internet
22:53:49 <JasonWoof> I don't understand what you want well enough to do it
22:54:12 <JasonWoof> sounds like you could just do: cat < /dev/pport > /mnt/floppy/log.txt
22:56:11 <Om3r> you have 4sensors connected with the microprocessor and using the port parallel of the computer the information is saved in the floppy
22:56:26 <Om3r> isnt enough?
22:56:38 <JasonWoof> cat < /dev/pport > /mnt/floppy/log.txt
22:56:55 <JasonWoof> anyway, I'm going to sleep now.
22:57:03 <JasonWoof> goodnight you two
22:57:38 <Om3r> see ya later
22:57:58 <Om3r> Raystm2 do you understand?
23:00:51 <Om3r> ...
23:02:14 <Raystm2> yes I think i understand.
23:02:24 <Raystm2> i've started to research the problem.
23:02:58 <Om3r> ok dude
23:03:05 <Om3r> are you interested to do it?
23:03:07 <Raystm2> If i'm a little slow in responding, I have BIG windows open on my display and I reading lots of stuff to see how others have approached the problem in the past.
23:03:46 <Raystm2> Well the software is pretty straight forward. 
23:04:05 <Raystm2> It's basically a loop that does something like...
23:04:33 <Om3r> yea
23:04:44 <Raystm2> : read-sensors read-sensor-1 ... read-sensor-8 ;
23:05:27 <Om3r> think about it
23:05:33 <Raystm2> each of which is a loop the first checks the port to see if there is information at the particular sensor.
23:05:50 <Om3r> tomorrow ill come and we could continue if you want
23:06:03 <Raystm2> if there is information at that sensor then you xor that with a number for each sensor.
23:06:41 <Raystm2> then you pack that as a byte of information at the next location on the floppy for maximum density.
23:06:56 <Om3r> yea
23:07:33 <Raystm2> You need floopy code, port reading code and a loop to make it all connect and happen.
23:08:00 <Raystm2> i've done this before using colorforth.
23:08:07 <Om3r> we have to know the floppy  pins
23:08:09 <Raystm2> but i've only ever polled the keyboard.
23:08:10 <Om3r> to write..
23:08:17 <Raystm2> I see.
23:08:25 <Raystm2> your building a real device.
23:08:46 <Om3r> yea
23:08:58 <Om3r> so what you think dude?
23:09:45 <Raystm2> The advantage of colorforth is that it boots the computer from the floppy and stores itself to a floppy on save.
23:10:20 <Raystm2> The port can be easily addressed and the information can easily be converted to html using a separate program.
23:10:43 <Om3r> yea but i cant do it with colorforth
23:10:48 <Om3r> should be with isforth
23:11:16 <Raystm2> Why isForth, please?
23:12:20 <Om3r> cuz my course is on isForth =)
23:12:37 <Raystm2> oh hehe
23:12:48 <Raystm2> shame, it should be on colorforth :)
23:13:12 <Om3r> =)
23:13:18 <Om3r> teacher wont accept it
23:13:26 <Raystm2> You should talk to Mark = 144r
23:13:45 <Om3r> he's here regulary?
23:13:54 <Raystm2> 1440r that is , yes
23:14:04 <Raystm2> he will know how to help you.
23:14:08 <Om3r> ok
23:14:13 <Raystm2> I don't know isForth.
23:14:18 <Raystm2> never tried it.
23:14:20 <Om3r> anyway thanks
23:14:25 <Om3r> ill come back later
23:14:27 <Raystm2> i'm on windows
23:14:32 <Om3r> gotta sleep now
23:14:35 <Raystm2> I could do it in colorforth ;)
23:14:39 <Raystm2> okay good night.
23:14:40 <Om3r> =)
23:14:43 <Om3r> see ya later dude
23:14:45 <Om3r> thx again
23:14:54 <Raystm2> bye = the forth way to exit
23:14:59 <Om3r> loool
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