00:00:00 --- log: started forth/05.08.20 00:21:53 --- join: tattrdkat (n=virsys@or-65-40-179-12.dyn.sprint-hsd.net) joined #forth 00:24:12 --- quit: virsys (Connection timed out) 02:33:06 --- join: Topaz (n=top@spc1-horn1-6-0-cust128.cosh.broadband.ntl.com) joined #forth 03:26:58 --- quit: aum () 05:34:03 --- join: PoppaVic (n=pete@0-1pool73-83.nas24.chicago4.il.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 05:34:49 G'day 05:35:36 hi PoppaVic 07:03:55 --- join: snoopy_16 (i=snoopy_1@dsl-084-058-164-176.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 07:12:06 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 07:12:22 --- nick: snoopy_16 -> Snoopy42 08:05:58 --- quit: PoppaVic ("Pulls the pin...") 08:10:17 --- join: PoppaVic (n=pete@0-1pool73-54.nas24.chicago4.il.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 08:59:13 --- quit: PoppaVic ("Pulls the pin...") 10:28:46 --- join: Amanita_Virosa (n=jenni@CPE0000e812679b-CM000a7362da55.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 10:38:33 --- join: OrngeTide (i=orange@rm-f.net) joined #forth 10:38:43 hi OrngeTide 10:41:22 hi slava 10:55:08 --- join: ayrnieu (n=julian@ip68-13-110-105.om.om.cox.net) joined #forth 11:04:31 Hey. What's the state of the Forth world today? 11:05:38 * slava is working on a code formatter 11:08:58 * ayrnieu compiling gforth on new Debian/PPC system to write a program to fix brokenly !dvorak keymap, where setxkbmap doesn't want to do its job. 11:10:13 * Quartus recently wrote a sunrise/sunset routine for Quartus Forth, easily ported to other systems: http://quartus.net/files/PalmOS/Forth/Examples/sun.zip 11:11:31 oh, nifty. 11:21:18 I used Wil Baden's OPG for the formulas. 12:08:05 --- quit: Amanita_Virosa ("Gak.") 12:39:28 http://paste.lisp.org/display/10977 # xmodmap tools 14:03:40 --- quit: hajamieli (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 14:58:14 --- nick: Raystm2 -> nanstm 15:14:54 --- quit: ayrnieu (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15:16:50 --- join: ayrnieu (n=julian@ip68-13-110-105.om.om.cox.net) joined #forth 15:21:33 --- join: aum (n=aum@60.234.156.82) joined #forth 15:49:45 hi all 15:50:57 hey 15:51:39 how's factor going? 15:52:20 good. i'm porting the common lisp 'xp' prettyprinter, for better looking 'see' output 15:52:40 nice 15:52:58 this is important, for when i have a structure editor, since no manual indentation/formatting will be possible 15:53:06 i'm converting my pic forth OS from token threaded to stc 15:53:18 cool 15:53:36 bloats the code to 4x its size, but speeds it 4-20x 15:54:20 token threading is similar to a VM, right? 15:54:22 i wonder if i've crossed the line between language and OS 15:54:28 haha 15:54:34 is it multithreaded? ;) 15:54:35 Topaz: yes, executed bytecodes 15:54:43 yes, multitasking and OO 15:54:51 aum - you're not having fun until you do that :-) 15:54:54 the line between language and OS is very blurry indeed, see squeak for an example 15:54:54 haha, madness... sounds like an OS to me ;) 15:55:03 or any forth with integrated editor and metacompiler 15:55:13 guess i should call it 'PicOS' 15:55:17 squeak, erlang... 15:55:23 emacs. 15:55:26 lol 15:56:08 now it's a matter of rewriting the slow/bloaty core stuff like 'allocate'/'free' from forth to assembler 15:56:21 invest effort in an optimizing compiler instead 15:56:37 the scheduler's pretty efficient, because tasks just sit in a ring 15:56:49 cooperative? 15:56:58 yes 15:57:07 preemptive is way too expensive on PIC 15:57:08 i guess anything preemptive is total overkill 15:57:17 wastes a timer, i guess ;) 15:57:26 i'd have to unroll the stack with each context switch 15:58:03 user can declare each word as using forth retstack or PIC retstack 16:00:03 what i'm thinking now though is i maybe should put the multitasking in the core of the language, rather than an optional lib - that way, i'll be able to write all the API prims like 'key' to call 'yield' when waiting for chars 16:00:14 that's how factor's I/O works 16:00:28 so factor is multithreaded? 16:00:32 co-operatively 16:00:41 sane 16:00:52 i figured pre-emptive threading was too complex 16:01:12 on an AVR chip, the architecture is way better and I could do preemptive 16:01:37 my AVR OS is preemptive 16:01:42 though it's not exactly clever 16:01:52 infact, preemptive multitasking is its only feature ;) 16:02:03 otherwise known as a timer, and a huge number of push/pops in the interrupt handler 16:02:04 but i'm aiming for a language/API that's consistent between PIC18F, AVR, ARM etc 16:02:08 neat 16:02:47 sadly, can't support PIC16 because the architecture sucks too much 16:02:58 the implementation of a pre-emptive scheduler is easy, but doing thread-safe data structures and so on is not 16:03:07 PIC16s are the only PICs i tried programming 16:03:15 tis probably why i dislike PICs so much 16:03:45 you should try PIC18F - way better, even bearable 16:04:05 it is Microchip's contrition for the sins of the 16F 16:04:40 and fully pin-compatible with the 16F chips 16:04:52 neat 16:05:46 and in many markets, the PIC chips are around half the price of equivalent AVRs 16:25:18 --- quit: ayrnieu ("system") 17:28:05 --- quit: Topaz (Remote closed the connection) 19:45:01 --- join: zoly (n=l@p549DB9A6.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 19:45:34 'morning 19:45:47 hi 19:45:59 hi factormaster 21:08:23 --- join: ayrnieu (n=julian@ip68-13-110-105.om.om.cox.net) joined #forth 21:19:04 --- quit: ayrnieu (";t;kdm") 21:25:44 --- quit: tattrdkat ("bah") 21:39:20 --- join: virsys (n=virsys@or-65-40-179-12.dyn.sprint-hsd.net) joined #forth 22:07:09 --- nick: nanstm -> Raystm2 22:20:28 --- quit: zoly (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 22:34:08 --- join: amca (n=plump@as-bri-4-1-185.ozonline.com.au) joined #forth 22:41:07 --- quit: virsys (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 22:42:46 --- join: virsys (n=virsys@or-65-40-179-12.dyn.sprint-hsd.net) joined #forth 23:00:04 --- join: amca_ (n=plump@as-bri-3-108.ozonline.com.au) joined #forth 23:01:19 --- quit: amca (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/05.08.20