00:00:00 --- log: started forth/05.07.04 00:01:02 --- quit: JasonWoof ("off to bed") 00:13:51 --- join: snoopy_16 (snoopy_161@dsl-084-058-133-221.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 00:21:50 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 00:22:05 --- nick: snoopy_16 -> Snoopy42 01:25:33 --- quit: onetom ("Lost terminal") 01:25:56 --- join: onetom (~tom@ns.dunasoft.com) joined #forth 01:26:29 --- quit: onetom (Client Quit) 01:26:42 --- join: onetom (~tom@ns.dunasoft.com) joined #forth 01:32:59 --- quit: kunphuzil ("Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/") 01:43:14 --- join: egg (~pugsuc@218-162-216-105.dynamic.hinet.net) joined #forth 01:45:36 --- quit: egg () 02:09:15 TV signals are annoying, so much problems with them. 03:05:15 --- quit: virl () 03:36:13 --- join: virl (~anonym@chello062178085149.1.12.vie.surfer.at) joined #forth 03:50:27 --- quit: saon (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 03:53:01 --- quit: saon|smgl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 03:56:19 --- quit: virl ("Dana") 05:23:51 --- join: saon (1000@c-66-177-224-222.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 05:24:17 --- join: virl (icechat5@chello062178085149.1.12.vie.surfer.at) joined #forth 05:25:07 --- join: saon|smgl (~saon@c-66-177-224-222.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 05:42:45 --- join: PoppaVic (~pete@0-1pool47-198.nas30.chicago4.il.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 05:43:03 Mornin' 05:55:36 --- join: tathi (~josh@tathi.bronze.supporter.pdpc) joined #forth 05:55:46 lo 05:55:59 hi 05:56:10 PoppaVic, whats shakin? 05:56:15 things going better today? 05:56:34 not much - wakin' up.. Trying to arrange a new tarball/project dir. 05:57:11 Thinkin' about HOW to make things, now. I either MUST rely on Make, or I must write a C-program to act for it. 05:57:45 Also, still wrangling over the "libtil" concepts. 06:00:56 I'm still pretty darned tempted to consider 'opcodes'/ids/xts - something meaningless except for steppers/lookup. 06:01:53 The only advantage I can see to that is if we had a reader/writer for 'modules' compiled thus. 06:02:49 oh.. and using that 'module' as a "first pass" for some sorta' real compiler. 06:03:57 yah 06:05:16 IF, (and only if), we could encapsulate the assembler and generate .o on the fly, that opens a completely new universe. BUT, it seems likely that such an idea isbetter (again) as a source-module. 06:06:36 I looked around, but there seems to be a 100% lack of any lib, (portable or not), that assists in r/w (load/generate) of object-files. 06:08:25 It would be a gorgeous thing if we had a portable lib for generating .o, module/plug-in, and shared-libs 06:09:03 Writing compilers, linkers and loaders would become.. "Interesting". 06:10:34 Anyway, yeah.. Trying to organize my thoughts with a new work-dir (hierarchial), and then I gotta' dive into the copied-code and see what I must and can change to incorporate some of the ideas I've bounced around. 06:12:54 In some ways, it seems like it will be an awful lot like such as FIG-forth... Where we had a minimum of code and most of the rest was hi-code 06:13:14 right 06:13:34 which, of course, is not a Bad Thing 06:14:09 but, unless we want every lib-user to read and compile those words, we have to generate the hi-code when we generated the libtil lo-code 06:16:16 otoh.. hmm... Might also be possible to generate several "levels" of libtil 06:17:22 Not sure what the terms for such might be, but I'm thinkin' "core", "basics", "full-blown". 06:17:45 three libs, perhaps? 06:17:55 or one lib and 2 modules? 06:18:06 yeah, I don't see why not 06:19:10 hmm... Any extra ideas? 06:19:57 not ATM. sounds like you're on a fairly good track for what you're trying to do. 06:19:58 C-interfaces; dump the r-stack; func-vectors; func-tags for stack... 06:23:00 Also, I'll just implement an integer-stack 06:26:38 --- quit: saon ("leaving") 06:36:07 ANy suggestions on the module-breakout? 06:36:56 I've never been happy with ANS-like group/namespace shitzu 06:39:33 --- quit: saon|smgl (Remote closed the connection) 06:39:35 --- join: saon|smgl (~saon@c-66-177-224-222.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 06:39:49 --- join: sproingie (foobar@64-121-15-14.c3-0.sfrn-ubr8.sfrn.ca.cable.rcn.com) joined #forth 06:40:03 lo 06:40:10 --- join: saon (1000@c-66-177-224-222.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 06:40:14 --- join: artoffoo_ (~artoffoo@c-66-177-224-222.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 06:40:19 --- quit: artoffoo_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 06:43:45 you'd rather have something more like other langs? 06:43:58 where you do module.fn or module:fn, that sort of thing? 06:44:21 no, I was thing of the logical groups/levels - committees rarely make me happy. 06:44:35 But, that sorta' thing I've been thinking of for 'words' 06:46:54 so you don't agree with the wordsets that ANS defined -- you'd rather have a different organization? 06:47:28 well, I'masking you (and the others) - there may be a better organization 06:48:09 core certainly means little beyond universe and steppers 06:48:12 ok 06:48:30 but, the next notch up is prolly vars/consts/vocs, etc 06:48:40 then maybe interp-type 06:49:24 not sure, but I know I often felt the commie "arrangements" or "groups" felt sorta' weird/poor 06:50:00 maybe.... THink in terms of "OK, now let's cross-compile a turnkey" 06:51:29 There are very many ideas to consider in various patterns, but the goals rarely come together universally 06:52:33 I would think, done properly, that assemblers would be a lot easier to write and so forth. 06:53:13 btw, I _did_ find that forth2c tarball, but have not screwed with it further. 06:59:19 morning everyone 06:59:24 lo 06:59:25 Hi 07:03:28 hi crc 07:26:11 hmm... 07:26:43 stepper(t1) in the core; stepper(N) in the next module? 07:28:24 hmm 07:28:49 * PoppaVic almost "sees" how to proceed 07:46:03 brb 07:46:09 --- quit: PoppaVic ("Pulls the pin...") 08:11:22 --- quit: saon (Remote closed the connection) 08:12:16 --- join: saon (1000@c-66-177-224-222.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 08:12:24 --- join: JasonWoof (~jason@Herkamire.student.supporter.pdpc) joined #forth 08:12:24 --- mode: ChanServ set +o JasonWoof 08:16:38 --- quit: saon (Client Quit) 08:17:23 --- join: saon (1000@c-66-177-224-222.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 08:45:01 --- join: PoppaVic (~pete@0-3pool158-69.nas24.chicago4.il.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 08:45:39 heh.. Back, sorry 08:46:30 --- join: Topaz (~top@host81-157-97-213.range81-157.btcentralplus.com) joined #forth 08:47:05 hi 08:47:08 Looks like I'll be selling off one 30/06 to buy Dad's BLR from #2 son ;-) 08:48:16 Now I can dream of the BLR and deal with this damned code 09:14:13 --- nick: madwork_ -> madwork 09:14:44 What is - thru history and actual experience - the forthish 'core' anymore? What's needed to read/write & step TIL-code? 09:15:13 * PoppaVic knows what his books say, he wants some reality-leavening 09:17:59 * crc is happy: I finally finished the hdd boot support for RetroForth/Native! 09:24:44 :) 09:26:59 Cool, another compiler 09:30:20 --- quit: saon ("Lost terminal") 09:31:14 --- quit: Topaz ("Leaving") 09:33:24 --- join: saon (~artoffoo@c-66-177-224-222.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 09:41:37 --- quit: PoppaVic ("Pulls the pin...") 09:43:00 --- join: Topaz (~top@host81-157-97-213.range81-157.btcentralplus.com) joined #forth 10:30:43 --- quit: saon (Remote closed the connection) 10:49:38 --- quit: Topaz ("Leaving") 11:00:31 --- join: saon (1000@c-66-177-224-222.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 11:11:52 --- quit: crc (Connection timed out) 11:48:55 --- join: ICaMonkey (~chatzilla@80.122.33.114) joined #forth 11:49:22 Hi 12:05:51 --- quit: Robert ("kgaybbq") 13:52:14 --- join: qFox (~C00K13S@92pc222.sshunet.nl) joined #forth 13:53:36 --- join: slava (~slava@CPE0080ad77a020-CM000e5cdfda14.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 14:33:35 --- quit: warpzero (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 14:38:27 --- join: warpzero (~warpzero@wza.us) joined #forth 14:50:26 --- quit: qFox ("this quit is sponsored by somebody!") 14:53:29 --- quit: ianp (Remote closed the connection) 15:05:27 --- join: ianp (~ian@inpuj.com) joined #forth 15:07:05 --- quit: saon|smgl ("Lost terminal") 15:07:55 --- join: saon_ (~saon@c-66-177-224-222.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 15:08:55 --- quit: saon ("Lost terminal") 15:09:16 --- nick: saon_ -> saon|smgl 15:09:39 --- join: saon (1000@c-66-177-224-222.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) joined #forth 15:42:19 --- join: snoopy_16 (snoopy_161@dsl-084-058-133-221.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 15:49:02 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Nick collision from services.) 15:49:14 --- nick: snoopy_16 -> Snoopy42 15:50:02 --- join: solar_angel (~jenni@CPE0000e812679b-CM000a7362da55.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 15:50:37 --- quit: tathi ("leaving") 16:05:31 --- quit: ianp (Remote closed the connection) 16:05:44 --- join: ianp (~ian@inpuj.com) joined #forth 16:08:09 --- quit: solar_angel ("Slips out quietly.") 16:27:15 --- quit: ianp (Remote closed the connection) 17:01:45 --- join: ianp (~ian@inpuj.com) joined #forth 18:35:45 --- join: crc (crc@pool-70-110-184-181.phil.east.verizon.net) joined #forth 18:36:50 --- quit: warpzero (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 18:37:19 --- join: warpzero (~warpzero@wza.us) joined #forth 18:46:23 --- mode: ChanServ set +o crc 19:09:53 --- join: warpzero_ (~warpzero@wza.us) joined #forth 19:11:34 --- quit: warpzero (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 19:23:15 --- join: snoopy_16 (snoopy_161@dsl-084-058-135-103.arcor-ip.net) joined #forth 19:23:16 --- quit: Snoopy42 (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)) 19:23:33 --- nick: snoopy_16 -> Snoopy42 19:45:35 --- join: warpzero (~warpzero@wza.us) joined #forth 19:45:35 --- quit: warpzero_ (Client Quit) 19:46:15 --- quit: crc (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19:55:29 --- quit: warpzero (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 19:57:07 --- join: warpzero (~warpzero@wza.us) joined #forth 21:27:37 --- quit: onetom (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 21:29:03 --- quit: virl (Ping timeout: 14400 seconds) 22:08:03 --- quit: vitaminmoo (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)) 22:08:05 --- join: vitaminmoo (~vitaminmo@dsl-94-128.peak.org) joined #forth 22:31:05 --- quit: sproingie ("Konversation terminated!") 22:36:58 --- join: onetom (~tom@ns.dunasoft.com) joined #forth 22:54:14 --- join: virl (icechat5@chello062178085149.1.12.vie.surfer.at) joined #forth 23:42:59 --- quit: JasonWoof ("off to bed") 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/05.07.04