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06:06:15 <SeaForth> crc, what is that saying, two stacks, dictionary ...?
06:06:49 <SeaForth> found it.
06:08:53 <SeaForth> ok, what are 'blocks' in forth?
06:10:02 <SeaForth>  A block is defined to be a 1024 byte chunk of memory which the Forth application can reference
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07:06:59 <zoly> g'day
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07:34:54 <zoly> hi herk
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08:15:20 <zoly> i'm just about to start implementing a forth interpreter in javascript, knowing very little about javascript
08:15:40 <zoly> but looks very simple, what i've seen as far
08:15:59 <zoly> progress will be here:  http://forthfreak.net/javascript.html
08:16:11 <zoly> no idea yet how to address arrays for memory
08:23:33 <Herkamire> hi zerk
08:32:13 * samc_ just learnt of this http://raskincenter.org/
08:32:40 <samc_> THE is now called Archy
08:33:45 <SeaForth> bashforthman?
08:34:15 * samc_ refuses to bash forth, man :P
08:34:55 * SeaForth bashforths all the time, SeaFORTH used bf as its benchmark for interface and 'testedness'  BTW, finding some bugs either in BF or in SF, thinking BF.
08:36:24 <SeaForth> zoly, do you have a block diagram anywhere on the logic of the forth interpreter?
08:36:39 <SeaForth> from bashforth or others?
08:50:38 <zoly> SeaForth: source no good ?
08:51:26 <zoly> oh!
08:51:31 <zoly> you know bashforth, then ?
08:53:03 <SeaForth> yes, i use bashforth all the time.
08:53:12 <zoly> nice
08:53:19 <zoly> i've written it :)
08:53:19 <SeaForth> I'm using it right now.
08:53:27 <SeaForth> Yes, I know you have, you and I have talked before.
08:53:33 <zoly> ah,ok
08:53:35 <SeaForth> So you are going to do a new implementation in JS.
08:53:39 <zoly> right
08:53:53 <SeaForth> I'm writing a FORTH in Sensetalk, and using yours as a means to motivate me :)
08:53:54 <zoly> you know that there is OO for bashforth now ?
08:53:59 <SeaForth> yes, I have seen it.
08:54:23 <SeaForth> http://seaforth.dyndns.org:8080/
08:54:55 <zoly> if you want an implemention in OPL (which is very BASIC-alike), look here:  http://www.forthfreak.net/misc/interpreters/PsiForth.asc
08:55:10 <zoly> pol is the built-in interpreter of the psion-5
08:55:14 <zoly> opl
08:55:42 <SeaForth> is there a gpl'ed opl for linux/unix/osx?
08:55:53 <zoly> i doubt it
08:55:55 <SeaForth> :(
08:56:04 <SeaForth> too bad, I don't own a PDA, and I only use OSX and linux now.
08:56:08 <zoly> but is ut very much basic, with some psion extensions
08:56:15 <SeaForth> I have a tri boot eMac that I'm pretty happy with these days.
08:56:19 <SeaForth> I love basic.
08:56:37 <SeaForth> well, I guess I could convert it to abc or something.
08:56:47 <SeaForth> or maybe wbasic
08:56:51 <zoly> probably. most mem access goes through peek and poke
08:58:42 <zoly> definition of "emit" as example for its basicness:
08:58:44 <zoly> 	print chr$(tos&); 	tos& = peekl(sp&) 	sp& = sp&+KCell& 	goto xnext    
09:00:02 <zoly> only tricky thing is probably the vectored execution for dispatching to primitives
09:07:35 <zoly> i like to write forth interpreters to get a better grasp of the language i write it in
09:07:47 <zoly> and now i need some javascript
09:07:57 <ianp> :(
09:07:59 <zoly> therefore its going to be a forth interpreter :)
09:09:10 <Herkamire> something's actually happening with THE?
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09:14:09 <Herkamire> heh pygame :)
09:14:58 <arke> hi Herk :)
09:17:22 <SeaForth> zoly, that is impressive, I'm working on getting bwbasic working on osx and also abc (I used abc years ago on beos)
09:17:59 <arke> hi all :)
09:18:01 <arke> hi SeaForth
09:18:10 <SeaForth> unfortunately peeks and pokes mean some level of hardware awareness, and I don't know if the basics that I have here will abstract to a virtual hardware layer.
09:18:14 <SeaForth> arke, hello!
09:27:17 <SeaForth> zoly, in bashforth, defining words   : i i ;   and  : j j ;   and then   i j .s   outputs   1138 683 
09:27:19 <SeaForth> why?
09:27:32 <SeaForth> are we pushing the address of the interloop variables?
09:33:05 <zoly> SeaForth: no not really (hw aware), as it is only used as mem interface, relative to array begin addresses
09:33:22 <zoly> no peek or poke done to registers
09:35:10 <zoly> cause it returns the stacked return address of your redefined i
09:35:29 <zoly> i (a bashforth primitive) reads top of return stack
09:35:52 <zoly> if you high-level redefine it, it pushs its return address to return stack, which is consequently read
09:38:30 <zoly> no "interloop" vars. loop index is top of return stack
09:39:52 <zoly> there is an "innerloop" variable, basically anchor of linked list through loops, but thats only used at compile time, for allowing leave to determine the address of loop.
09:41:21 <zoly> it goes like this; there a memory location behind do, which loop knows how to find, and writes the address behind loop into it.  leave also knows how to find do, therefore leave gets to know where to branch too.
09:41:23 <zoly> to
09:42:12 <zoly> that means, the linked list through do (innerloop) is basically used as stack of do addresses
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09:44:13 <arke> hehe
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09:45:41 <zoly> hmm... mij gaim just crashed.
09:46:04 <zoly> SeaForth: what did you receive, i.e. how much ?
09:48:07 <zoly> SeaForth: here's an implementation which i used for an embedded system. note that find, number?, number are not standard conform - different stack effects:  http://www.forthfreak.net/interp
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09:49:38 <PWizard> hiya
09:50:32 <zoly> alternatively, have a look at forthforth, lines 1749 to 1784:  http://www.forthfreak.net/forthforth/ff18.f
09:51:11 <zoly> hi wizard
09:51:26 <PWizard> what's up
09:52:04 <arke> hi
09:52:08 <arke> zoly: are you speuler? :)
09:52:23 <zoly> wizard, marvin would say "i don't know, i haven't been there"
09:52:27 <zoly> arke, right
09:52:31 <SeaForth> zoly, you got booted for 'flood'
09:52:37 <PWizard> heheh
09:52:42 <SeaForth> zolly, I got 2 lines of mosttly nothing.
09:52:45 <zoly> arke, rance muhamitz would say "i am known by many names" :)
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09:52:58 <arke> zoly: i figured :)
09:52:59 <SeaForth> zoly, maybe paste to lisppaste
09:53:09 <arke> zoly: I know few people crazy enough to code a forth in bash :P
09:53:25 <zoly> SeaForth: i can put stuff on the forthfreak web server easily
09:53:31 <SeaForth> that would be great!
09:53:56 <zoly> arke, what about forth in javascript ?
09:54:38 <zoly> just starting: http://forthfreak.net/javascript.html
09:55:33 <arke> zoly: Bleh :)
09:56:08 <arke> zoly: im at school, your site is blocked.
09:56:43 <arke> zoly: send me an email with the meat, I might provide some things :)
09:56:56 <zoly> why would they block my site ??
09:57:03 <segher> i wrote a Forth in Perl + C preprocessor + C :-)
09:57:04 <zoly> it is an informative one
09:57:29 <zoly> arke, i'm very sure you could be helpful. i know about 1 hour of javascript as far
09:57:39 <zoly> just got to loops
09:58:20 <zoly> arke, there's not much meat yet. mostly bones.
09:59:25 <arke> zoly: its blocked because they havent given it a rating yet. and they wouldnt approve of it. :/
09:59:34 <zoly> gotta multitask a bit ... birthday party and coding at the same time ...
09:59:37 <arke> zoly: evil communist bastards :)
09:59:39 <arke> zoly: hahaha
10:00:01 <zoly> very experimental drinks too
10:01:14 <zoly> just used kurkuma (turmeic) to brighten the color of the punch a bit :)
10:01:19 <zoly> turmeric
10:08:24 <arke> :)
10:08:30 <arke> wait
10:08:42 <arke> where in germany do you live?
10:09:09 <arke> which bundestaat?
10:09:18 <arke> err, two "s", not one :)
10:13:04 <arke> crap, i have to go.
10:13:24 <zoly> depends
10:13:40 <zoly> i'm officially not living in DE at all
10:13:47 <arke> err?
10:13:54 <arke> when, why a german ISP? :P
10:14:05 <zoly> cause i stay in germany
10:14:14 <arke> hehe.
10:14:22 <arke> where do you "officially" live?
10:14:27 <arke> and where in germany are you right now? :)
10:14:27 <zoly> the netherlands
10:14:35 <zoly> bavaria, munich
10:14:38 * arke is going to like in hessen in a few months
10:14:40 <arke> aah.
10:14:48 <arke> bleh, too far :P
10:15:03 <arke> i hate those bastardized names *sigh*
10:15:10 <arke> BAYERN MUENCHEN :P
10:15:18 <arke> gotta go
10:15:18 <arke> adios
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12:00:38 <bbls> hello everyone
12:10:01 <Herkamire> wow, rchi (humane thing) actually runs on my linux box
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12:10:25 <bbls> what's that?
12:10:25 <Herkamire>         cvs -d:pserver:anonymous@cvs.sourceforge.net:/cvsroot/humane login
12:10:26 <Herkamire>         cvs -z3 -d:pserver:anonymous@cvs.sourceforge.net:/cvsroot/humane co -P reducks
12:10:27 <bbls> hi snowrichard
12:10:28 <Herkamire>         cd reducks
12:10:31 <Herkamire>         python -u convertFromHPY.py
12:10:34 <Herkamire> run like so: python -u pygame_run.py
12:10:36 <Herkamire> humane interface 
12:10:38 <Herkamire> jeff raskin
12:10:44 <bbls> Herkamire what's this?
12:10:56 <Herkamire> I can't figure out how to leap though. that may be broken
12:13:56 <tathi> too bad that raskincenter site is just one huge page.
12:15:41 <Herkamire> yeah, kinda annoying
12:15:51 <Herkamire> the software actualy runs on my box though.
12:15:57 <Herkamire> I'm quite happily suprised
12:16:13 <Herkamire> leap doesn't though.
12:16:34 <snowrichard> I downloaded retroforth a few days ago.  
12:17:01 <tathi> huh.
12:17:12 <tathi> I wouldn't think Shift-Space would cause problems
12:17:23 <tathi> how about the command mode?
12:17:38 <Herkamire> keybinding issue I think
12:17:51 <Herkamire> rchi uses pygame
12:17:55 <Herkamire> which uses SDL :)
12:18:00 <tathi> exactly
12:18:05 <tathi> I'd think that it would work anywhere.
12:18:06 <Herkamire> it doesn't use shift-space anymore
12:18:08 <Herkamire> now it's caps
12:18:16 <Herkamire> you press it once to enter quasi, and again to leave
12:18:22 <Herkamire> so not really a quasi-mode anymore
12:18:23 <tathi> that's the command mode.
12:18:41 <tathi> leap is still on shift space
12:18:52 <tathi> at least according to the tech spec on raskincenter.org
12:18:55 <Herkamire> the code in key.hpy says it's looking for left-alt and right-alt for the leap keys
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12:19:39 <tathi> oh.
12:19:48 <tathi> well...that won't work here.
12:19:58 <tathi> Ion takes a fair number of Alt keys.
12:20:35 <Herkamire> shift-space used to get you into the quasi-mode
12:20:57 <Herkamire> in the mac version
12:21:02 <tathi> the LEAP quasimode.
12:21:27 <tathi> there's also a Command quasimode.
12:21:29 <Herkamire> on the mac version it got you the comand quasi-mode. ond you had to hit > or something to get leap
12:21:37 <tathi> huh.
12:21:58 <tathi> I always assumed his implementation followed his spec.
12:22:02 <tathi> what a dope
12:22:19 <Herkamire> right now it seems completely oblivious to the alt keys, I hold alt and type and the letters just get typed in
12:23:57 <tathi> hmm...
12:24:17 <tathi> When I press alt, I get a transparent window saying Leap (direction)
12:24:24 <tathi> and all the invisible codes show up in the document
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12:25:02 <Herkamire> ahh, nice, I changed it from "left alt" to "left meta" and it worked.
12:25:13 <Herkamire> nice.
12:25:33 <Herkamire> ok, probably an issue with my X keymap.
12:25:45 <Herkamire> tathi: can you send me your .Xmodmap?
12:26:10 <tathi> I just said, I'm not using an xmodmap any more.
12:26:14 <tathi> I got the xkb thing working.
12:26:38 <Herkamire> oh
12:26:49 <Herkamire> perhaps I hsould do that. my modmap doesn't say anything about alt in it
12:26:54 <Herkamire> what'd you do?
12:27:18 <tathi> looking...
12:27:23 <Herkamire> can you switch to QWERTY and back without issues?
12:27:26 <tathi> yes.
12:27:29 <Herkamire> nice
12:27:44 <tathi> xkbswitch
12:27:51 <tathi> that's why I did it, actually.
12:27:56 <tathi> I wanted to let someone else use my box
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12:43:39 <zoly> arke, i think i got everything i need of javascript figured out, except one thing: can i call javascript functions by token, rather than name (which would require run-time lookup, thus impairing performance considerably) ?
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12:50:41 <arke> zoly: yeah, thats how OOP works in it.
12:51:06 <arke> this.my_method = my_method_implementation;
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12:56:15 <arke> you might have to play with it a bit though, just storing integers wont work :)
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13:03:52 <zoly> am now trying along the line: 
13:03:56 <zoly> function foo() { document.write("foo") } 
13:04:00 <zoly> var primitive = new Array()
13:04:03 <zoly> primitive[1]=foo
13:05:01 <zoly> now the parts to call  primitive[1] don't produce any output "foo" yet
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13:21:18 <zoly> i've put the source with the missing part under  http://www.forthfreak.net/fncall.js
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14:28:41 <crc> hi all
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18:35:26 <TheBlueWizard> hiya I440r :)
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22:30:14 <bbls> hello
22:30:36 <bbls> anyone here who used the Humane Interface?
22:33:17 <fridge> it was crap
22:33:23 <bbls> fridge hi
22:33:30 <bbls> can you explain to me how it works?
22:33:35 <fridge> no
22:33:41 <bbls> To start a new document, use the New command from the File menu, or type
22:33:41 <bbls> Command\ n\ n/ Command/
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22:33:51 <bbls> but i have no menus :)
22:34:03 <fridge> sounds like you're in a pickle
22:35:00 <fridge> I used it but I still don't have a clear understanding of it, or how his text editor would successfully be migrated to an image editor, say
22:35:14 <fridge> without sucking terribly that is
22:35:38 <bbls> ok, what key is Command?
22:35:44 <samc> fridge read his book
22:36:05 <samc> bbls it's a mac key
22:36:13 <fridge> the key with the funny symbol on it, that looks kinda like a simple celtic knot
22:36:24 <bbls> hmm, i'm on wintel :)
22:36:32 <bbls> ah, caps lock does it
22:36:39 <bbls> it displays a Command window
22:36:42 <bbls> where i can type
22:38:00 <bbls> hmm, i still can't run any command
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