00:00:00 --- log: started forth/04.09.14 00:03:47 --- quit: mur_ (Remote closed the connection) 00:04:27 --- join: mur (~mur@uiah.fi) joined #forth 00:23:56 good night 00:27:08 --- join: mur_ (~mur@mgw2.uiah.fi) joined #forth 00:37:06 --- quit: mur (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00:52:23 * Tomasu is back (gone 11:41:18) 01:12:13 --- part: Tomasu left #forth 01:15:06 --- join: Topaz (jonny@spc1-horn1-6-0-cust217.cosh.broadband.ntl.com) joined #forth 01:28:54 --- quit: mur_ (Remote closed the connection) 01:29:27 --- join: mur (~mur@uiah.fi) joined #forth 01:48:31 re Topaz 01:50:44 lo 01:51:37 What are you doing up at this inhumane hour? :) 01:51:52 Or do you work a graveyard shift too? 01:51:53 heh :P 01:52:01 tis actually 10am here ;) 01:52:06 Hmmm. 01:52:13 which admittedly is still an inhumane hour 01:52:14 *grin* 01:52:27 but i have to talk to somebody about PHP, or something suitably exciting 01:52:27 Topaz: Oh -- I wasn't aware. Where do you live? 01:52:30 UK 01:52:48 Man, all this time, and I thought you were living in the states. Sorry. :) 01:52:56 hah 02:10:36 * Serg_penguin gives to kc5tja globe of Ukraine ... err, of USA 02:11:40 Hi :) 02:11:46 hi 02:11:53 * Robert is at school 02:12:24 * Serg_penguin installs boss's comp - he driven WinXP to crash by stupid gamez and XXX sites w/ malware 02:12:32 Haha 02:14:01 Serg_penguin: It's a common enough mistake. I've had Europeans confuse me for someone who lives in Europe too. So it's not just me. 02:14:01 * Topaz invisages an OS so transparent that there is nowhere for spyware/malware to hide ;) 02:14:19 heh, i've got into the habit of checking people's hostnames to work out where they're from 02:14:20 Topaz: Linux (and Unix in general) is one such operating system. 02:14:41 SUCKS !!!!!! kinda like broken hardware - freshly setup Win2K shows same glitch !! 02:14:43 well, yeah, but the available GUIs rarely successfully integrate the underlying structure 02:14:44 Topaz: I used to do that, but I got lazy. :) 02:14:47 cough rootkit cough 02:15:15 i'm quite happy without a GUI, but it'd be nice to have a properly integrated system 02:15:21 fridge: cough pstree cough 02:17:30 except that has been modified by the rootkit not to show anything nefarious 02:17:32 Dude, I haven't stayed up this late since I was in the military! 02:17:56 its very possible to hide malware on linux systems 02:18:08 --- join: crc (crc@38-pool1.ras11.nynyc-t.alerondial.net) joined #forth 02:18:30 kc5tja: i stayed up >24 hours few times for inet-cafe ;) 02:18:32 fridge: You seem to forget that I work at an ISP, whose boxes are routinely portscanned and SSH ports routinely exploited on Cobalt servers. 02:18:39 We're constantly dealing with malware. 02:19:16 Serg, et. al., are talking NOT about trojans or other things. You CANNOT defend against those (not, unless, you have an operating system built on capabilities instead of ACLs, but I digress). 02:19:29 What we're talking about are things like adware, spyware, etc. 02:19:46 Those things are easily detectable because they visibly and tangibly affect the operation of a computer. 02:20:24 The only way for malware to hide on a Linux box is to make the box' operation so smooth and seamless that no attention is raised. 02:20:39 Fortunately, even with trojans, this doesn't happen often. 02:20:59 i guess custom kernel traps (or a script) would be the only easy way to catch trojans etc 02:21:10 would just rely on you being the only person to use it, so people couldn't work around it, heh 02:21:18 security through obscurity, eh 02:21:27 The only solution is to ditch the Unix philosophy all-together, and go with a capability-secure operating system. 02:21:43 what do you mean by 'capability-secure'? 02:22:05 Topaz: Please wait a second -- let me fetch you some URLs. I can't really explain them right now in my current state. 02:22:29 heh ok 02:25:20 http://www.eros-os.org/essays/capintro.html 02:25:26 http://www.skyhunter.com/marcs/capabilityIntro/ 02:25:34 in that order. 02:27:40 why so complex ? 02:27:51 use Tripwire - and all trojans suxx 02:28:04 Until tripwire itself gets h4x0red. 02:28:21 hard to do so on CD-R ;)) 02:28:22 As fridge notes, if you obtain root-level privileges on a box, you're essentially God. 02:28:53 Serg_penguin: Unfortunately, Linux can't run on a read-only filesystem for long, which is why it loads into a RAM-disk first. 02:29:27 no, i mean test CD, not all work from CD 02:29:49 What you're describing is immeasurably complex compared to capabilities. 02:29:54 A capability is just a pointer. 02:30:00 In C, if you have: 02:30:03 FILE *fp; 02:30:23 then if fp is non-NULL (and actually points to a file object), then you have the permission and authority to access the file so designated. 02:30:40 You just plain, honest-to-goodness cannot get simpler than that. 02:31:20 Note that pointers are NOT capabilities. Pointers, unlike caps, can be forged, manipulated (indeed, C depends on this to access arrays), etc. 02:32:02 so essentially a system running entirely in a HAL 02:32:08 Also unlike normal memory pointers, capabilities can be revoked -- at ANY time, by anyone with sufficient capabilities. 02:32:20 Topaz: No. 02:32:27 although i suppose each file accessor needs considerably more state than just the file and position 02:32:33 Topaz: Unix file descriptors make great capabilities. 02:32:37 ah, ok 02:32:47 so you control RAM access like file access? 02:32:55 The thing Unix lacks, however, is discrete control over what open() can actually access. 02:33:13 Topaz: I don't understand what you're asking. 02:34:00 In a capability-secure OS environment, a process, by default, has no authority what-so-ever. 02:34:07 ah, ok 02:34:12 In fact, there isn't even any concept of a "user", even in multi-user OSes. 02:34:43 In order for you to run a program, you must have sufficient capabilities to do this -- e.g., your user shell interface must have the capability to assign other capabilities to its spawned processes. 02:34:54 Note that this capability does NOT grant it the ability to affect other processes. :) 02:35:07 Thus, a strict hierarchy of authority is imposed. 02:35:40 When you launch a web browser, for example, it'll receive a capability to open maybe two or so windows, some capabilities to its config files, etc. 02:35:44 But that is it. 02:36:06 anything what is invented by human can be cracked by other human ;)) 02:36:07 If your browser gets "root hacked," what the heck is it going to do? It has no other capabilities at its disposal. :) 02:36:28 Serg_penguin: KeyKOS, in its entire life of existance, has never been cracked. Never. 02:36:50 Serg_penguin: Not saying it isn't possible, but lord knows, it has been tried on numerous occasions. 02:36:56 KeyKOS ran Tymnet. 02:37:56 Not one exploit. 02:38:40 People think it is impossible to make a nicely secured operating system or runtime environment on a computer. 02:38:43 They are wrong. 02:38:45 They are VERY wrong. 02:38:53 "Anything man-made is fallible." 02:39:11 Sure. I can throw a brick at the window of the office containing the server, and cause the harddrive heads to chrash. 02:39:49 But this is driving the argument to the point of absolute absurdity, to where discussion is so nonsensical as to be a complete waste of time due to the divergence from the original point of argument. 02:40:38 Chuck Moore keeps driving the point home, and I do the same: context, context, context, context, context, context. Did I mention context? That's important too. 02:41:28 --- join: mur_ (~mur@uiah.fi) joined #forth 02:43:02 But such a system needs planning, and we all know that planning means Communism. 02:43:53 --- quit: mur (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 02:44:56 Robert: What? 02:45:00 If I should stop trolling for a minute... why aren't there any (free) such systems in widespread use? 02:45:14 Robert: one word: Unix. 02:45:34 You mean people are too used to it? 02:46:15 All the capability secure systems that ever existed (a) came out after Unix did, (b) were scorned by everyone who "knew" systems administration and security [e.g., knew Unix or Unix-like administration skills], and (c) all were commercial, and therefore, out of the hands of academics. 02:47:11 Robert: They still are today. 02:47:31 Haven't there been any open-source projects attempting such a system? 02:47:38 Name me one operating system today which is not somehow markedly inspired by Unix. 02:47:43 i'm reading www.eros-os.org atm 02:47:44 Robert: EROS 02:48:09 * Robert checks 02:50:38 Just saying, "If capabilities are so good, why aren't they used more often?" is like asking, "If XYZ is so good, why is Microsoft Windows still #1 on the desktop?" 02:53:12 But it's often hard to differ between conspiracy theories and things that actually ARE wrong. 02:53:32 Nobody in the capability camp are claiming its lack of use on conspiracy theories. 02:53:38 And neither am I. 02:53:42 I mean... Forthers, Haskellers, esperantists [etc etc] all claim to have found the truth. 02:53:56 I'm just saying I don't know enough about EROS to judge it. 02:54:01 Working with capabilities does require a different way of programming -- a method which is counter to an already established philosophy. 02:54:26 Robert: Capabilities have been mathematically proven to provide security far and beyond ACLs. 02:55:03 It's a very, very simple matter of logic: without a pointer to an object, you just plain cannot access that object. 02:55:07 It's just impossible. 02:55:24 hmm, i wonder if i could make L4 run on my ARM 02:55:33 anybody know how big the kernel actually is? 02:55:35 The key to the security of capabilities is controlling the distribution of other capabilities. 02:56:06 kc5tja: I admit it sounds interesting... Are there any problems or limitations? 02:56:11 Topaz: No idea, but L4/x86 assembled to about 12KB. 32-bit RISC code is typically 2.5x x86 code size on average. So be conservative and guess 36KB. 02:56:31 hm, ok 02:56:36 Robert: The problems associated with capabilities are, as I've indicated, controlling their distribution. 02:56:52 in an orthogonally persistent computing environment like KeyKOS or EROS, it's easy. 02:57:35 But what about a regular OS? Capabilities would need to be stored in system files, and be stored in an encrypted form so that no other task can gain access to another task's capabilities. 02:57:39 Many see this as a liability. 02:57:56 Obviously, making an O/P OS solves that issue completely. :) 02:58:11 (and actually solves many other issues at the same time, but that's a whole different discussion) 02:59:05 my uC has more cache than RAM atm, heh 02:59:09 32kb of caches, 16kb of SRAM 02:59:13 Okay. Sounds pretty interestig, but fow now I think my system is "good enough". 02:59:27 Topaz: Which one is that? 02:59:42 a 180mhz AT91 atmel thing 02:59:57 with an ARM9 core 02:59:59 Wow. 03:00:13 my friend managed to samplerise me one 03:00:15 two, in fact 03:00:27 Robert: That's another issue with capability system adoption: too many people think (rightly so) that what they have now is "good enough," and upgrading would cost too much. I'm not complaining that this is a bad thing overall, but it certainly will become an issue as more and more and more of our lives are dominated by the threat of Internet security issues. 03:00:28 That microcontroller beats most of my computers. 03:00:39 i intend to make a ridiculously small SBC 03:00:58 uC+SDRAM chip+SD slot+stereo ADC/DAC 03:01:35 kc5tja: Yeah... I'd convert if I knew things would work properly, and that I could have the same functionality. 03:01:55 Topaz: Small as in size or resources? 03:02:08 well, size 03:02:24 i reckon i could fit it inside a matchbox with ease 03:02:33 (a little one ;) 03:02:35 Cool :) 03:02:47 What will you use it for? 03:02:50 i might throw in a ethernet PHY, if i can get one 03:02:52 playing with, heh 03:03:06 ARM is easily assembly-able, so i might try some low latency audio effects with it 03:03:14 :) 03:03:23 i could also hook it to a hdd and do digital-audio recording 03:03:32 (could even LAME it in the available CPU, heh) 03:03:52 That would be pretty neat... I need some "use" for my next computer project. 03:04:01 i could also make a very tiny wifi sniffer 03:04:12 Was thinking about a digital radio mode decoder connected to a matrix printer 03:04:12 since i've got a USB wifi card with linux driver source somewhere 03:04:23 heh, sounds fun 03:05:08 and i'll also make an mp3/ogg/wmv/ra/etc player out of it too, methinks 03:05:26 But I'd prefer a small computer, with keyboard and a monitor. 03:05:35 yeah, i was wondering about the interface 03:05:37 Problem is I don't have any good enough monitor. 03:05:39 a serial port will do for testing 03:05:48 Yeah, but I want something neat and portable. 03:06:12 if i was insanely geeky (and rich), i'd stick a old TFT projector element in it and a 5W LED and tiny lens system ;) 03:06:26 matchbox-sized computer with projector monitor 03:06:29 Heh. 03:06:30 Topaz: Have you looked into narrow-band TV at all? 03:06:33 THAT would be cool. 03:06:36 i haven't 03:07:16 You might be able to use a motor, and an old LP record or something, to make a low-bandwidth monitor (say, 128 pixels across by 128 pixels or 256 pixels tall). 03:07:31 ah, i did try making a TV camera like that once 03:07:32 Typically around 10fps or 15fps. 03:07:36 made lots of holes in the silver on a CD 03:07:42 (in a radial curve) 03:07:49 and spun it violently 03:07:51 Yep, same idea, only in reverse. 03:08:15 would be retro, definitely ;) 03:08:23 Heh. 03:08:26 i could probably even use my 24x20 pixel LED matrix as a display ;) 03:09:35 Actually, if you had a band with an array of 24x20 pinholes in them, and spun via a motor, you could perhaps get a 240x200 display that way. :) 03:10:00 haha 03:12:49 It would be cool to have a computer that loaded its ROM software from an LP disk. 03:13:04 heh, i remember reading old computer magazines, you could buy them 03:13:15 i think it was elektor which had a build-your-own-computer project 03:13:18 and they sold various games on LP 03:13:33 Probably just recorded 300 baud modem sounds. :) 03:14:11 Haha, cool. 03:15:11 Seriously. I remember seeing a CD that had, as a special bonus track, some 1200bd audio, which contained the lyrics to the songs on the CD or something. :) 03:15:14 It was pretty cool. 03:15:43 Whoa 03:15:56 Geeky music... 03:16:58 Yeah, I can't remember the artist though. 03:17:07 One of my former roommates had it. 03:18:18 At sk0mt I found a book about packet radio... Looks like they had some fun back then. 03:18:36 But it's hard for me to imagine such slow and (relatively) unreliable connections. 03:18:56 Must have felt good to get it to work, but USING it.. :) 03:18:58 Robert: Actually, the slowness of the connection isn't that bad as long as you don't layer TCP/IP on top of it. :) 03:19:33 I don't just mean it like that, but also the fact that you just can't instantly forward everything to New Zealand like you do today. 03:19:37 1200bps is nice because it's about the speed at which most people actually read stuff on the screen. 03:20:10 Oh, yeah, well...true. But for local access BBSes and such (which is what it was really designed for), it served its purpose quite well. 03:35:42 --- quit: mur_ (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:42 --- quit: onetom (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:42 --- quit: crc (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:43 --- quit: I440r (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:44 --- quit: arke (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:44 --- quit: madgarden_ (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:44 --- quit: cmeme (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:44 --- quit: fridge (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:46 --- quit: jim (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:46 --- quit: scope (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:46 --- quit: ChanServ (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:49 --- quit: Topaz (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:49 --- quit: Robert (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:50 --- quit: I440r_ (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:50 --- quit: Frek (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:50 --- quit: Fractal (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:50 --- quit: Serg_penguin (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:50 --- quit: tgunr (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:52 --- quit: kc5tja (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:52 --- quit: slava (burroughs.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 03:35:53 --- quit: skylan (Dead socket) 03:36:54 --- join: kc5tja (~kc5tja@66-74-218-202.san.rr.com) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: mur_ (~mur@uiah.fi) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: saon (Ecoder@c-24-129-95-254.se.client2.attbi.com) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: skylan (~sjh@vickesh01-4677.tbaytel.net) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: crc (crc@38-pool1.ras11.nynyc-t.alerondial.net) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: Topaz (jonny@spc1-horn1-6-0-cust217.cosh.broadband.ntl.com) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: Serg_penguin (~z@212.34.52.140) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: tgunr (~davec@vsat-148-63-4-107.c001.g4.mrt.starband.net) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: madgarden_ (~madgarden@Toronto-HSE-ppp3875946.sympatico.ca) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: cmeme (~cmeme@216.184.11.30.unused.swcp.com) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: slava (~slava@CPE00096ba44261-CM000e5cdfda14.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: I440r_ (~mark4@216-110-82-59.gen.twtelecom.net) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: Frek (anvil@h229n2fls31o815.telia.com) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: scope (~junk@njd.paradise.net.nz) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: Robert (~snofs@c-bf5a71d5.17-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: I440r (~mark4@216-110-82-59.gen.twtelecom.net) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: fridge (~fridge@dsl-220-253-66-141.NSW.netspace.net.au) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: arke (arke@adsl-69-209-54-62.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: onetom (~tom@novtan.bio.u-szeged.hu) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: jim (~jim@cpe-24-143-141-183.cable.alamedanet.net) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- join: Fractal (jah@selling.kernels.to.linus.torvalds.at.hcsw.org) joined #forth 03:36:54 --- mode: irc.freenode.net set +oo kc5tja ChanServ 03:42:07 --- quit: Serg_penguin (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 03:44:23 --- quit: mur_ (Remote closed the connection) 03:44:55 --- join: mur (~mur@smtp.uiah.fi) joined #forth 03:48:06 --- quit: saon ("Leaving") 03:53:34 Man, my vision is getting blurry. 03:53:38 :( 03:53:44 Without or with glasses? 03:53:45 And I still have four more hours. 03:53:48 With. 03:53:51 Ouch 03:54:05 Well, I need to get new glasses some day... But now, time for a class 03:54:10 (Hooray, elementary Java) 03:54:26 It's because I've been up for more than 20 hours. 03:54:49 More ouch 03:55:00 When I wake up, I can see clearly. :D 03:55:01 brb 03:56:36 kc5tja: how's the graveyard shift going? 03:59:09 It's going. 04:00:06 But it will be a while before I fully adapt to this schedule. 04:00:14 I can understand that 04:00:19 * kc5tja has yet to learn how he will be able to handle sleeping during the day though. 04:00:59 * crc still has trouble sleeping during the day 04:05:55 Yeah, I can imagine. 04:07:02 I've been working graveyard for three years. 04:07:16 A few more months and I'll be done with it :-) 04:07:28 Nice. You can join the ranks of the living again. :) 04:07:34 yup 04:07:40 What kind of effect has it had on you overall? 04:07:45 * crc thinks about how nice that will be 04:07:48 1) tired 04:07:55 2) lack of appetite 04:08:09 That's the main effects 04:08:26 Overall I'm not much worse off than I was before I started 04:08:51 Interesting. 04:08:55 * crc also gained 15lbs, but that's because I didn't start exercising until recently 04:09:05 The lack of appetite thing would be beneficial to me in some respects -- I'm rather overweight at the moment. 04:09:37 * kc5tja is, however, working to start a jogging program with my roommate. 04:09:40 * crc will take up unicycling and bicycling again in the near future 04:09:46 We're just finalizing a schedule on when we both can go out jogging. 04:09:52 cool 04:10:00 I haven't jogged in years... 04:10:10 * kc5tja needs to jog -- I have to rid myself of this weight, and I need it for the cardio aspects of aikido. 04:10:38 * crc started gaining weight when I stopped unicycling 04:10:48 hmm, is MD5 still used? there appear to be claims of collisions in it, etc 04:11:01 (i don't know any alternatives) 04:11:18 MD5 is still used extensively. 04:11:40 If you're worried about collisions, though, you might want to try SHA1. 04:11:49 would there be any sense using SHA-1 instead then? 04:11:49 However, they are both hashes, and as such, they are both prone to collisions. 04:11:54 yeah 04:12:05 SHA-1 has 16 bits more "precision" than MD5. 04:12:20 this isn't exactly ultra high security, but i presume an MD5 hash would still stand up in court 04:12:40 Is this for legal purposes? 04:12:53 potentially 04:13:05 (although i've recommended it be checked with somebody with a clue, to alleviate me of any responsibility ;) 04:13:39 Good idea. 04:28:46 haha, the guy i'm working with multiplied all my expected-programming-time estimates by 4, just in case ;) 04:28:59 Another good idea. 04:42:32 --- join: mur_ (~mur@uiah.fi) joined #forth 04:50:04 In another ten minutes, I will need to be here a mere two more hours before I can go home. 04:52:07 hey 04:52:13 you must work the same shifts as me 04:52:27 10PM to 7AM 04:53:03 4pm to 12am 04:53:09 hmm 04:53:21 maybe you work a bit longer 04:53:29 --- quit: mur (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04:53:48 Well, I get an hour for lunch too -- it's an eight hour shift. 04:54:30 I don't really have a lunch break 04:54:45 I can't actually leave the premises at any stage 04:54:55 Security guard or something? 04:55:09 nah, just network ops/sysad/fixit monkey 04:55:19 That's retarded. 04:55:23 Why can't you leave at any stage? 04:55:35 this whole company is retarted 04:55:39 I've had my fill 04:55:43 Hmmm 04:56:02 The company I work for isn't without its retardations either. 04:56:12 --- join: warpzero (~warpzero@dsl.103.mt.onewest.net) joined #forth 04:56:20 my fiance is quite quite over me working odd hours 04:57:35 Well, I'd rather work 4PM to 12AM than 10PM to 7AM. That's for sure. :) 04:58:26 yes 04:58:32 my other shift is 12am to 8am 05:00:22 See, I can even see the logic of that shift too 05:00:39 Although, those hours wouldn't allow me to get to aikido. 05:00:39 :) 05:01:02 Not without me losing some sleep first, going to aikido, then napping the remainder of my usual sleep allotment. 05:01:05 :) 05:01:31 shift work would rule if sleep was optional 05:03:11 Hey, maybe I should burn an audio CD full of various brainwave entrainment audio patterns. One of them would be beta-state. :) 05:17:23 --- quit: crc ("Time for bed... Goodnight!") 05:18:51 --- quit: mur_ (Remote closed the connection) 05:20:08 --- join: mur (~mur@uiah.fi) joined #forth 05:21:06 sup kc5tja 05:26:18 re 05:26:20 * kc5tja is at work. 06:42:49 --- quit: tgunr (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 06:44:26 --- join: tgunr (~davec@vsat-148-63-4-107.c001.g4.mrt.starband.net) joined #forth 06:47:43 --- join: tgunr1 (~davec@vsat-148-63-4-107.c001.g4.mrt.starband.net) joined #forth 06:47:44 --- quit: tgunr (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 06:49:18 --- join: Herkamire (~jason@h000094d30ba2.ne.client2.attbi.com) joined #forth 06:49:18 --- mode: ChanServ set +o Herkamire 06:51:44 --- join: mur_ (~mur@uiah.fi) joined #forth 06:53:53 --- quit: mur (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 07:56:13 --- join: T0paz (~top@spc1-horn1-6-0-cust117.cosh.broadband.ntl.com) joined #forth 07:57:49 --- quit: Topaz (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08:12:47 --- quit: mur_ (Remote closed the connection) 08:13:20 --- join: mur (~mur@kyberias.uiah.fi) joined #forth 08:15:31 --- quit: madgarden_ (Excess Flood) 08:19:33 --- join: madgarden_ (~madgarden@Toronto-HSE-ppp3875946.sympatico.ca) joined #forth 08:33:20 --- join: jdavidboyd (~user@wbar5.tampa1-4-11-125-246.dsl-verizon.net) joined #forth 08:33:50 ahhh... I fixed the pageup and pagedown keys in this stupid terminal 08:36:13 --- quit: madgarden_ (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 08:36:42 --- join: madgarden_ (~madgarden@Toronto-HSE-ppp3875946.sympatico.ca) joined #forth 08:42:33 --- quit: madgarden_ (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 09:06:45 --- join: arke|school (apache@11.198.216.81.dre.siw.siwnet.net) joined #forth 09:07:44 hiya 09:07:45 :) 09:08:05 Hi 09:08:26 hola Robert 09:11:11 --- quit: jdavidboyd (Remote closed the connection) 09:13:56 --- quit: arke|school ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 09:22:37 --- join: arke|school (apache@11.198.216.81.dre.siw.siwnet.net) joined #forth 09:31:49 --- quit: arke|school ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 09:51:23 --- join: tathi (~josh@pcp02123722pcs.milfrd01.pa.comcast.net) joined #forth 09:59:47 --- join: madwork_ (~madgarden@derby.metrics.com) joined #forth 09:59:51 --- nick: madwork_ -> madwork 10:06:33 --- join: mur_ (~mur@uiah.fi) joined #forth 10:17:59 --- quit: mur (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 10:23:09 --- quit: tathi ("leaving") 10:34:45 --- quit: mur_ (Remote closed the connection) 10:35:31 --- join: mur (~mur@mgw2.uiah.fi) joined #forth 12:08:23 --- join: mur_ (~mur@uiah.fi) joined #forth 12:11:21 --- quit: mur (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 12:22:00 --- join: mur (~mur@uiah.fi) joined #forth 12:22:25 --- join: arke|school (apache@11.198.216.81.dre.siw.siwnet.net) joined #forth 12:33:15 --- quit: mur_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12:44:47 --- quit: arke|school ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 12:51:34 --- join: wossname (~wossname@rn-v1w5a06.uwaterloo.ca) joined #forth 13:29:48 --- quit: T0paz (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 13:30:22 --- join: T0paz (jonny@spc1-horn1-6-0-cust217.cosh.broadband.ntl.com) joined #forth 14:34:18 --- join: mur_ (~mur@smtp.uiah.fi) joined #forth 14:44:33 --- quit: mur (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 14:50:00 --- quit: tgunr1 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 14:50:49 --- join: tgunr (~davec@user-2ivfmp9.dialup.mindspring.com) joined #forth 15:10:55 Good morning. 15:18:39 --- join: tgunr1 (~davec@vsat-148-63-4-107.c001.g4.mrt.starband.net) joined #forth 15:20:48 --- join: saon (Ecoder@c-24-129-95-254.se.client2.attbi.com) joined #forth 15:25:32 --- quit: tgunr (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15:30:24 --- join: Robert__ (~snofs@c-bf5a71d5.17-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) joined #forth 15:30:57 --- quit: mur_ (Remote closed the connection) 15:32:28 --- join: mur (~mur@kyberias.uiah.fi) joined #forth 15:36:34 --- quit: Frek ("Client exiting") 15:39:17 --- join: Robert___ (~snofs@c-bf5a71d5.17-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) joined #forth 15:42:25 --- quit: Robert (Success) 15:44:11 --- join: Frek (~anvil@h229n2fls31o815.telia.com) joined #forth 15:44:15 --- join: Robert (~snofs@c-bf5a71d5.17-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) joined #forth 15:49:24 --- quit: saon ("Leaving") 15:54:06 --- quit: Robert__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 16:00:07 --- quit: Robert___ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 16:11:36 --- quit: T0paz ("Leaving") 16:36:06 sup kc5tja 16:50:52 --- quit: wossname (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 17:00:23 Feeling nauseated. 17:04:15 --- join: saon (Ecoder@c-24-129-95-254.se.client2.attbi.com) joined #forth 17:10:58 --- join: mur_ (~mur@smtp.uiah.fi) joined #forth 17:13:27 --- quit: jim (Remote closed the connection) 17:14:39 --- join: crc (crc@217-pool2.ras11.nynyc-t.alerondial.net) joined #forth 17:16:23 --- quit: tgunr1 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 17:18:07 --- join: tgunr (~davec@vsat-148-63-4-107.c001.g4.mrt.starband.net) joined #forth 17:22:02 --- quit: mur (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 17:25:43 --- join: TheBlueWizard (TheBlueWiz@modem-014.nyc-tc03a.FCC.NET) joined #forth 17:25:43 --- mode: ChanServ set +o TheBlueWizard 17:27:12 --- join: Frag-101 (~Frag-101@12-222-128-22.client.insightBB.com) joined #forth 17:38:20 kc5tja: :( 17:39:06 --- join: randoml (~wossname@rn-v1w5a06.uwaterloo.ca) joined #forth 17:42:51 --- quit: saon ("Leaving") 17:44:15 --- quit: crc ("Time for bed... Goodnight!") 17:50:03 --- quit: Frag-101 (Remote closed the connection) 17:51:29 --- join: Frag-101 (XINU@12-222-128-22.client.insightBB.com) joined #forth 17:54:36 Well, I think I'm going to go to aikido now. 17:54:43 Upset stomach and all. Maybe it'll make it beter. 17:54:45 better even. 17:54:53 * kc5tja has had cases where that has happened in the past. 18:25:31 --- join: mur (~mur@mgw2.uiah.fi) joined #forth 18:27:35 --- quit: mur_ (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 18:35:46 hi 18:38:24 hi 18:38:40 whats up? 18:38:57 hjgdasgugi 18:39:13 * arke and thin are pair-programming later today 18:39:20 coo. 18:39:27 whats hjgdasgugi? 18:44:03 --- quit: randoml (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19:12:04 --- join: wossname (~wossname@rn-v1w5a06.uwaterloo.ca) joined #forth 19:24:55 --- join: slava_ (~slava@CPE00096ba44261-CM000e5cdfda14.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 19:25:07 --- part: slava_ left #forth 19:27:22 --- part: TheBlueWizard left #forth 19:40:53 --- quit: tgunr (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 19:42:39 --- join: tgunr (~davec@vsat-148-63-4-107.c001.g4.mrt.starband.net) joined #forth 19:44:07 anybody doing anything cool in forth? 19:44:39 are you? 19:57:44 --- quit: wossname (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19:59:19 Herkamire: well, I am implementing the FTS/Forth Block words, if that could be considered cool :P 20:04:47 arke, you're working on fts/forth now? 20:04:50 arke, what happened to F2? :) 20:07:42 --- join: mur_ (~mur@kyberias.uiah.fi) joined #forth 20:11:41 slava: yeah, I just added LOAD to my asm kernel, now I'm going to stick my basic load sequence in block 0 20:12:01 then I'm going to make constants for a few of the block numbers with the linux-specific stuff in them, 20:12:21 so I can change the constants, and bootstrap, to create an ELF file made to run in OpenFirmware 20:12:27 cool 20:15:28 anyone know how to insert a literal ^ in latex? 20:18:31 --- quit: mur (Read error: 238 (Connection timed out)) 20:54:36 slava: no idea 20:54:45 * arke is working on FTS/Forth 20:55:09 the computer I'm shelling into is too slow connetion-wise to make a fullscreen editor usable :P 20:55:22 * arke is using a line editor. Not that I care. 20:55:45 its a "block" line editor, so its good :) 20:56:14 --- quit: mur_ (Remote closed the connection) 20:57:03 --- join: mur (~mur@mgw2.uiah.fi) joined #forth 21:04:11 I'm back. 21:04:32 hi kc5tja :) 21:05:08 slava: Wouldn't \^ work? 21:09:25 --- join: imaginator (~George@georgeps.dsl.xmission.com) joined #forth 22:09:31 --- quit: Herkamire ("my pillow awaits") 22:26:39 --- join: Serg_penguin (~z@212.34.52.140) joined #forth 22:30:45 --- join: mur_ (~mur@mgw2.uiah.fi) joined #forth 22:40:14 --- quit: mur (Read error: 238 (Connection timed out)) 23:38:25 --- quit: Serg_penguin (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 23:50:48 --- quit: mur_ (Remote closed the connection) 23:51:38 --- join: mur (~mur@smtp.uiah.fi) joined #forth 23:52:08 w00t 23:52:13 from 6GB down to 5GB 23:52:18 lets see if I can get 2 :) 23:54:01 I must have missed something. 23:54:09 Anyway, I'm going to watch a movie. 23:54:54 :) 23:58:44 Time for school... bye 23:59:55 adios 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/04.09.14