00:00:00 --- log: started forth/04.07.02 00:01:25 hum 00:01:43 if you xor something with 1, wont the result always be a TRUE for IF ? 00:03:58 oh, no thats or 00:04:00 ack 00:06:05 not used to getting up early in the morning anymore, thats clear. 00:06:57 Heheh 00:12:20 at least i DID fix a WID search order listing word 00:12:42 ohwell. time to paint hte house. 00:12:43 later 00:13:19 kc5tja: you're still here? :) 00:13:25 kc5tja: you don't have work tomorrow or something? :P 00:28:54 --- join: crc (crc@0-1pool176-15.nas6.philadelphia1.pa.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 00:31:09 --- quit: Herkamire ("bed") 00:46:26 * crc has finally released a beta of RetroForth 7.0 00:47:24 :) 00:47:36 hmm 00:47:41 * arke needs to downlaod the intel specs 00:48:15 Get the printed ones! 00:51:14 * arke wis getting teh PDFs 00:57:33 download the PDF's & order the printed ones! 00:58:03 http://developer.intel.com/design/pentium4/manuals/index2.htm 00:58:35 * crc just realized that they are out of printed specs 00:58:51 * crc curses Intel for their stupidity in running out of them 01:01:33 * Tomasu is away: dlrrpy 01:15:30 * Tomasu is away: sleep 02:05:42 --- join: SolarFire (SolarFire@pD9EE19F3.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 02:06:00 * SolarFire greets 02:10:36 * crc greets SolarFire 02:10:55 ola crc 02:11:02 What's new? 02:11:28 hmm... 02:11:43 today is new :-) 02:12:05 ok nothing special afaik 02:12:18 and how about you? 02:13:37 I released the first beta of RetroForth 7.0 :-) 02:13:50 And I've been working on a chart of assemblers for the x86 02:14:12 if i had time and nerves i would bugtest your win port of retro.. ;-) 02:14:27 sighs 02:14:29 It won't hurt anything 02:14:39 * crc has already spent three weeks testing this beta 02:15:18 you mean besides regular work, right? 02:15:23 Yes 02:15:58 how much time did you spend per day? 02:16:06 2-3 hours 02:16:16 oh, a lot.. 02:16:19 Yup 02:16:48 About 18 hours/week testing 02:17:02 My wife isn't too happy with that though... 02:17:08 lol 02:17:13 ... 02:17:34 * crc wants RetroForth 7.0 to be as stable as possible when it's officially released :-) 02:18:22 I have to run my tests under BeOS, Linux, and Windows; I haven't managed to obtain a copy of FreeBSD to test with yet... 02:19:25 industrious.. ;-) 02:19:39 My longest test is a compiling & interpreting a 25MB program 02:20:09 ack 02:20:52 but nothing compares to a huge crowd of beta testing customers ;-) 02:20:58 I spend about an hour a day working on that program (~300 files), then building it into a single file that I then run through RetroForth to generate a list of errors 02:21:00 I agree 02:21:07 That's why I released the beta :-) 02:21:12 see Microsoft Windows eg. ;-) 02:21:38 * crc doesn't give out "stable" versions of software for bug testing! 02:21:54 right! 02:22:25 Hopefully I can wind down the massive testing phase by next week and work on the sample programs+documentation 02:23:08 Users are the best testers. Herkamire found a bug that had been in place for over 10 releases :-) 02:23:44 yup 02:24:04 and herkamire anyway 02:26:31 I'm also planning some further changes to the retroforth.org website 02:27:01 It doesn't scale up to higher resolutions (>800x600) very well 02:29:36 your site has become much more nicer and smoother lately imo 02:30:59 I agree 02:31:38 I'm still evolving the design though. On some of the forum pages, for instance, the logo at the top is shorter than the width of the table 02:31:52 I need to fix things like that 02:32:15 * crc is working on a new design - which looks & feels very close to the current one - but scales better 02:32:56 The whole thing is template driven; soon I'll be using RetroForth to generate the HTML for each page as well 02:33:55 aha good idea not often found amongst forthers.. 02:34:35 forth usability in such things *can* be improved 02:35:52 My wiki already uses RetroForth to convert the Wiki markups to HTML 02:36:21 I'll eventually remove all dependence on the PHP wrapper (used to edit the pages) 02:37:01 no serious xml svg rdf rss parser in forth eg. 02:37:53 I don't care for XML, SVG, etc very much 02:38:57 so you'll use a non-forth jabber client 02:39:31 anyone using a forth irc client? 02:40:27 I440r is writing one I think 02:40:47 * crc only uses IRC for chat 02:40:52 the first one ever, right? 02:40:57 Probably 02:42:59 i can remember arguing w/ kc5tja about wiki or no wiki 1-2 years ago 02:43:30 it was a quite critical discussion 02:45:30 I love wiki's 02:46:22 I use a standalone wiki-like tool (NoteBook) to write documentation, and wiki underlies all of my sites (except the Forum) 02:47:40 so do i, but it's just a beginning of effortless usability 02:49:11 I wrote the code underlying my sites several years ago. I've been slowly moving it from PHP to Forth :-) 02:49:15 in the sense of: writing when it comes is a joy, later it's a pain (see oss documentation situation) 02:49:48 crc: that's the right way 02:50:14 --- join: segher (~segher@blueice1n1.de.ibm.com) joined #forth 02:50:27 welcome segher 02:50:33 Welcome segher 02:50:33 howdy 02:51:07 segher: new nick? 02:51:24 no? 02:51:43 i don't _do_ nicks. it's my actual name. 02:51:51 ok then i mixed up 02:51:59 np 02:52:32 what ya doin at ibm? 02:52:48 working ;-) 02:52:58 firmware stuff, mostly 02:53:48 ah. please excuse my curiousity.. never seen you here b4 02:54:07 i don't frequent this channel often anymore 02:54:44 working, yes... that's the keyword 02:54:52 heh 02:54:57 feels already *guilty* after 15min chat-chilling 02:54:59 it's not like i'm chatting all day ;-) 02:55:16 lol 02:55:36 so do i 02:55:41 * SolarFire coughs 02:56:03 hehe 02:56:16 so where do you work? 02:56:48 ~~ afk back2work cu 02:56:56 segher: freelance 02:57:09 i'm a contractor, too 02:57:34 crc: nice to meet you again, have a great day cu 02:57:55 have fun working... 02:58:11 segher: doin a hotel lan plus everything atm 02:58:17 thx 02:58:26 and now.. 02:58:30 ~~ 02:58:59 CARRIER LOST 03:29:56 New design for RetroForth.org (work in progress): http://www.retroforth.org/index2.php 03:33:20 And my list of x86 assemblers :-) 03:34:00 Err, wrong channel :-) 03:56:17 --- quit: aum () 04:26:56 forth in #forth, how apropos 04:27:08 plz keep on topic mkayu 04:27:34 ???? 04:29:26 sorry 04:29:28 just being silly 04:29:31 Ok 04:29:32 blame the tequila 04:29:34 blame mexico 04:29:39 blame bush 04:29:42 * Robert blames Mexico for everything. 04:29:43 * crc blames mexican tequila 04:29:44 anyone but me 04:29:50 Why blame Bush? 04:29:54 What did he do now> 04:30:00 s/>/?/ 04:30:03 What didn't he do 04:30:04 crc: He tricked Klaw into getting drunk. 04:30:15 that whole mexican amnesty thing 04:30:19 I see 04:30:21 it surely got me drinking 04:30:38 I managed to upset the political position of my local liquor store 04:30:40 * crc noticed that Klaw dropped into #retro breifly 04:30:48 commenting on a fox news broadcast played behind the counter 04:31:02 recognized the #retro tag in your whois, was checking for a list of names 04:31:23 :-) 04:31:32 it reminded me of tunes 04:31:57 Ahh. RetroForth isn't related to Tunes anymore 04:32:48 yeah, but is anything related to tunes 04:32:52 anymore 04:33:32 Slate & Max 04:33:37 and furthermore, is there any point in dialog with someone in my mental state 04:33:45 Yes 04:34:04 ;-) 04:51:38 http://homepage.mac.com/mjsmitho/FoxNewsPornSlip/FoxOpps.html 04:51:45 a little inapropriateness for your morning 04:51:54 and bad typinmg 04:59:12 Quite a big oversight on their part 04:59:36 To filter it properly, just blank the screen :-) 05:00:34 it's the kind of oversight that makes me love capitalism 05:01:07 they're labled a republican-machine, but at heart, they're real 05:03:02 the Fox-right-wing argument has penetrated into daily interaction -- i'm in orange county though, so that my factor in 05:07:29 --- join: crc_ (crc@0-1pool176-15.nas6.philadelphia1.pa.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 05:07:44 --- quit: crc (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 05:08:42 --- nick: crc_ -> crc 06:02:33 --- part: crc left #forth 06:06:19 --- join: Murrlin (murr@dialup-207-218-218-80.ev1.net) joined #forth 06:14:58 --- quit: Murrlin ("Mischief managed! ....Nox.") 06:24:41 --- join: Herkamire (~jason@h000094d30ba2.ne.client2.attbi.com) joined #forth 07:04:41 --- join: Fadeproof (~Fadeproof@c-67-166-14-190.client.comcast.net) joined #forth 07:05:44 --- part: Fadeproof left #forth 07:27:49 Good morning. 07:40:58 moin 07:42:37 hi 07:42:41 kc5tja: no work today? 07:43:29 I work through to saturday this week. 07:44:35 ok 07:44:38 how are you: 07:44:39 ? 07:44:47 Tired. 07:44:56 Hungry. 07:45:00 And getting ready for work. 07:48:41 :) 08:01:01 --- quit: Herkamire ("bugger") 08:25:36 --- quit: kc5tja ("THX QSO ES 73 DE KC5TJA/6 CL ES QRT AR SK") 08:31:22 i'm getting arabic spam and its slipping right thru hotmails spamfilter 08:57:20 lol 08:58:12 Heh 08:58:32 Too bad you don't speak arabic, now you can't buy their penis enlargement pills. 08:59:01 btw, I just discovered a useful little program 08:59:07 "gdb" it's called :P 09:10:26 does it prevent crashes? 09:13:55 Nah, but it tells me WHY stuff crashes. 09:14:03 Instead of just "SEGFAULT, YOU MORON". 09:14:34 oh, "you made a segbooboo, you not so very bright person" 09:14:41 :p 09:16:52 Pffft 09:32:07 qFox set themself on fire. This terrible calamity has slowed them 0 days, 00:36:18 from level 36. 09:32:09 oops 09:32:29 Ehm. 09:32:31 Idler 09:48:37 gdb is absolutely the most USELESS pile of crap debugger ever devised 09:48:48 its even worse than NEC in circuite emulators 09:52:58 Bah 09:53:06 It's hell of a lot better than printf() 09:53:17 And it adds the interactive Forthish feeling to C ;) 09:57:42 I gotta agree with I4_wrk. gdb is a steaming pile of crap. I've never seen it be able to debug anything but the most obvious errors. 09:58:01 And printf() is a bad choice, generally. You want fprintf (stderr). 09:58:16 'cause a segfault won't cause printf() to flush it's buffers, unless you put a flush() after every one. 09:58:36 gdb is also hopelessly thread-stupid. 10:00:30 you can also tell stdout to be line flushed, or flushed per write 10:00:53 it's just the default that's different for stderr and stdout 10:02:49 Yah, but it's usually not worth the trouble for debugging to switch the mode. 10:03:28 sure 10:05:46 Uhm. 10:05:51 What I want to know is what possesses these idiots to write 'foo --help' to stderr, instead of stdout. They have more than 25 lines of output, it becomes a lot more trouble to pipe it through more or less. Not everyone is running screen or a xterm with scroll bars. 10:06:39 A 486 with Win95 might suck, but it's still better than a vacuum tube computer. 10:06:48 And gdb is better than nothing. 10:07:11 gdb sucks. 10:07:21 real men debug with fprintf 10:07:37 I'm a transvestite then. 10:07:47 gdb + fprintf 10:07:54 ;) 10:08:07 Or rather, converting from one to the other, but only getting half-way 10:11:14 just stay with fprintf. 10:11:14 real men don't need to debug. 10:11:14 fprintf+getchar 10:11:15 segher: real men usae forth. 10:11:15 segher: :) 10:11:41 of course. 10:17:34 Lord knows, I've *never* had a runaway stack problem... :) 10:23:53 ;) 10:30:08 --- quit: skylan (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 10:31:43 * Tomasu is back (gone 09:16:13) 10:32:42 Hi there 10:36:03 --- join: skylan (~sjh@vickesh01-4554.tbaytel.net) joined #forth 10:38:55 10:38:57 "Wait for Hurd if you want something real" --Linus 10:38:59 lo\ 10:50:23 * Tomasu is away: later 10:54:27 hm 10:54:45 if this chan wasnt logged publicly i'd have given my oppinion about the author of ciforth 10:55:19 in his reply to my request for an uptodate version of the bootable ciforth he reminds me that his hourly fee is 80 euro 10:55:51 i mean, what does he expect, me paying for this, hello :\ 11:05:23 * Tomasu is back (gone 00:15:00) 11:18:36 What a dick. 11:19:15 ahwell no matter. i'll try to get hold of the latest version in bootform and tear out the stuff myself 11:20:08 I can see nicely explaing that he might not have to work on it, or help you, or if you're a commercial enterprise that he is available for support at an hourly rate, but a shutdown like that just isn't necessary. 11:21:40 well he didnt exactly say "for 80 bucks i'll tear it out", its just like, he said that its embedded so much that it'll take a lot of time and it might be better to just get a different forth without it. and at the end he states his hourly rate and that he doesnt know for sure how much work it would be to tear out. 11:21:41 blah 11:22:07 i guess he's just dutch 11:22:14 :\ 11:22:51 :) 11:24:33 err what are you talking about ? 11:25:23 i contacted the author of ciforth, asking for a boot img for the latest ciforth version (the bootable version on his website was much older then the latest windows port of ciforth there) 11:25:45 marcel hendrix ? 11:25:46 and i asked him that if he had to assemble it, whether it was possible ot drop a few things i didnt want 11:25:48 eh 11:25:51 i cant remember if ciforth is his or not 11:25:54 --- join: SolarFire-| (SolarFire@pD954522F.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 11:25:56 iforth is marcel 11:25:58 no, albert van der horst 11:26:02 aha right 11:27:02 he didnt have to go all money on me imo. its not like i gave any idea that i might be using it for profitable ends or anything. 11:27:10 well whatever 11:29:59 I just read the synopsis of ciforth. What are you trying to do to it that it doesn't do already? 11:30:26 i'm trying to tear out denotations, going to make it case insensitive, and um, there was another thing 11:30:54 after that i'm gonna try to develop a system on top of it (note, TRY :) 11:30:56 Is there a URL to what denotations are? 11:31:11 hm here's the description in the doc... 11:31:21 The name of the DENOTATION vocabulary. The associated word list contains prefix words, called denotation definitions. In ciforth all words of DENOTATION belong to the minimum search order , such that number, strings and other denotations are still available after ONLY. If found the parse pointer is moved back to immediately after the prefix, and the corresponding denotation definition executed. This word list must be used with care as a CONTEXT wor 11:31:59 (this is the description for the word DENOTATION ,but that says it pretty much all i think) 11:32:28 Hmmm. I guess I don't know why you'd use them, now. 11:32:54 i dont want forth to return something if it doesnt exist. denotations will return partial hits to words in that voc's, if the complete word isnt found in the other voc's 11:33:27 so say i have DUP, and i do ' DUUP ,the system will return the xt of D 11:33:30 rather then an error 11:33:33 or 0, or whatever 11:33:51 i think the idea behind denotations is mainly speed 11:33:58 Bleh. That should have been a compile time option. 11:34:00 or possibly a prefix-supported feature thing 11:34:38 it also has this "string" thing, which is completely not-forthish 11:34:49 i dont mind that though. 11:34:58 but "bla" is the same as S" bla" 11:36:13 perhaps i should abandon my work so far and find a different forth, with an author who might be more helpfull. i did like ciforth being developed so far though 11:40:16 heh. check this out 11:40:17 http://www.ynet.com.au/sean/map0.html 11:40:34 nice idea, not sure whether it's very userfriendly though 11:42:41 --- join: slava (~slava@CPE00096ba44261-CM000e5cdfda14.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 11:42:42 hi 11:43:15 --- quit: SolarFire (Connection timed out) 11:45:54 --- nick: SolarFire-| -> SolarFire 11:51:18 um, did XP forget how to execute .bat files? :\ 11:55:40 --- join: Serg (~z@193.201.231.126) joined #forth 11:55:52 --- part: segher left #forth 11:55:54 hi 11:56:25 i just designed a CSS webpage what looks OK in either browser - IE, Mozilla, Opera 11:57:35 --- join: fridge (~fridge@dsl-203-33-162-85.NSW.netspace.net.au) joined #forth 11:57:37 only 1166 bytes be4 content and no tables :) 12:05:53 1k of css and crossbrowsercompatible? congrats :p 12:05:57 isforth.clss.net looks right in all browsers now too 12:06:14 I4_wrk> is there a bootable port of isforth available? 12:06:33 as in with isforth being THE operating system ? 12:06:37 aye 12:06:39 no :/ 12:06:45 ahw 12:06:53 onwards my search goes 12:06:54 isforth uses Linux as its BIOS :) 12:06:57 hehe 12:10:16 i wonder whats up with batch files in cmd 12:10:18 if you wrote the boot code and the switch into pmode and the I/O..... 12:10:23 it would be possible 12:10:27 echo doesnt seem to work, rem is not being recognized 12:10:43 nah, if i could make a bootable forth, i'd do it all the way 12:11:12 i just dont posess the x86 asm knowledge to code it :( 12:11:43 qfox: http://www.aflow.ru/test/css_ultralite_blue.htm 12:12:09 looks clean. is the menu not supposed to change color on hover? 12:12:14 RU, our company site would-be redesign 12:12:28 no hover by now 12:12:37 yeah i have not a single clue about the text :p 12:12:39 oki 12:13:00 text is just a "fish" to show design 12:13:07 some agro adv 12:13:33 links are "#" 12:13:34 oh i see, all the links point to the same 12:13:35 hehe 12:13:44 well it looks clean, clear, nice 12:14:04 i gonna use mod_rewrite and SSI/Perl as engine 12:14:16 qFox: thanks ;)) 12:15:17 this is my goal - almost clear text 12:15:59 i tested it in IE5 and Opera, and my friend said OK in latest Linux Mozilla 12:16:20 ie6 fine too then :D 12:16:46 now the site is Babel tower of wrecky tables 12:17:14 made in wild 90-s 12:17:15 hehe 12:17:41 totally unmaintainable, no even SSI 12:18:04 its all russian 12:18:05 i insist on remake coz of this 12:18:12 how am i supposed to read that :P 12:18:21 yes, we are RU 12:18:27 i know lol 12:18:30 u are supposed to look at SRC 12:20:17 ru should start speaking english 12:20:18 :p 12:20:19 i also cleaned paths in the site of major lawer company involved in lawsuit of Nord-Ost hostage capture 12:20:44 some do, at least 12:21:19 from /cgi-bin/faq/index.cgi?param=val¶m2=val2 to... 12:21:39 www.site.ru/v2/faq/param1/param2.htm 12:22:34 search spiders choke on old but accept mine 12:23:17 mod_rewrite rulez ! 12:35:56 --- join: Murrlin (murr@dialup-207-218-218-80.ev1.net) joined #forth 12:37:27 --- quit: Serg ("Unplugging for sleep") 12:38:33 hm, "he" says that all the files with "boot" in their name, create boot images, however, there are no files with boot in their file :p 12:40:30 holy shit 12:40:40 I didn't know my car could go 85, not to mention 90!!! lol 12:42:33 i really do hope you mean mph ;) 12:43:35 btw, what linux viewer uses the extension .mi ? 12:52:03 marriage = long term financing on a piece of ass 12:52:10 lol 12:52:35 ;) 12:56:23 lol eee 12:58:42 oh i figured out what was up with the batches, it was missing ECHO OFF 12:59:10 ...... 12:59:11 eww 12:59:13 lol 12:59:40 yeh well at least now it was a nice batchfile 12:59:46 rather then getting 50 REM lines :p 13:05:59 ;) 13:09:48 --- quit: Tomasu (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 13:12:17 --- join: Tomasu (~moose@d66-222-216-222.abhsia.telus.net) joined #forth 13:12:33 --- quit: Murrlin ("Mischief managed! ....Nox.") 13:13:46 --- join: wmg (~weldon@c208-37-6-202.ip.newc.com) joined #forth 13:20:53 --- quit: wmg ("Leaving") 13:22:24 --- join: trap1010 (~trapxvi@CPE0030654f85d8-CM014400102747.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #forth 13:31:28 IIIIIIEEW. albert used HCC in the batchfile. evil!!!!!! 13:32:19 hcc is like this "big dutch computerclub". on one side i think of them as a big bunch of aol'ers, and on the other side i know a few dont deserve that. 13:32:47 also, i cant get the freaking batchfile to work :( 13:42:14 haha 13:42:46 hhc ? 13:44:54 "haagse computer club", it started as "the computer club of the hague" (a dutch city), which later became national, i guess 13:46:49 it has an anual uhm, "convention". basically a big market to buy computer related stuff, alot of marketing companies pitching their stuff, and i believe somewhere there's a bit of hcc itself as well. a few hobby clubs go their with some members etc. 13:52:18 ahw i hate this. this movie i'm watching has a scene where the main char receives an email with an avi. after playing the avi (manually, no less), a virus deletes the avi. media (atm) cannot contain virii. movies like that imply otherwise :\ 13:53:54 hm i dont get this bat. its using debug to write the file to floppydrive, but its missing the parameters to L 14:02:38 > Sadly, I've no talent or skill for teaching Forth. One of my continuing 14:02:38 > goals is to understand why Forth works so well. 14:02:46 -- chuck moore 14:08:02 am i allowed to say he needs to get off that pedestal? 14:08:26 i mean, forth is great and all, but these quotes keep coming back for some reason :) 14:08:43 yet its not like forth has taken over, if anything its dying :\ 14:08:53 well not exactly dying, but you know what i mean 14:09:10 File it under dead like FreeBSD 14:10:06 so what chuck needs to do, is use his "hi-im-famous"powers and "chuck" forth down the throath of some universities :p 14:13:34 its no where near dying 14:13:38 :) 14:14:18 is there some pie chart with the usage of programming language? 14:14:21 :) 14:14:35 i'm sure forth will fall under "other" 14:14:41 the 1% one 14:14:43 :p 14:15:20 and in that 1% it accomplishes more than anything else 14:15:22 :P 14:15:54 hehe 14:20:05 * Tomasu is away: anime 14:36:40 qfox: you can embed code in media files 14:37:17 I've seen realplayer and maybe windows media player run such code for advertisements 14:37:23 fridge> mp3? avi? mpg? wav? 14:37:40 well, use a decent player ofc 14:37:58 realmedia sux anyhow, that stuff is pure evil 14:38:06 and there are exploitz out there 14:38:12 Truer words never spoken. 14:38:37 that can make media players run arbitary code 14:39:30 embedding executable code in a media file is plain stupid. bugs in players... well dunno 14:40:02 yep, its stupid 14:41:23 media is media and should remain that way 14:41:38 who the FUCK thought of doing that. the fucking moron should have his freekin computers confiscated 14:41:59 thats a huge "come fuck me up the ass everynoe, my butt is wide open" 14:42:30 a bug in a program is like using windows, can be fixed, but executionable code embedded in media is wrong 14:42:55 hehe 14:43:03 well large companies dont think like that 14:43:09 they think about revenue streams 14:43:12 and advertising 14:43:14 and shit like that 14:43:19 and tell engineers to implement it 14:43:25 who grumble and say it is stupid 14:43:30 but end up doing it anyway 14:43:36 because they've got a mortgage to pay 14:44:17 the fucking media players should ignore that shit 14:44:23 some do 14:44:33 and anyone using any media player that doesnt is even MORE moronic 14:44:52 in fact the media players should blacklist all media that embedds any sort of code 14:44:55 not ignore it 14:44:56 or is using it to further a plot in a movie ;) 14:45:05 IF at any point i decide to write an app that views/plays media, i will do only that and nothing else. that is for sure 14:45:11 Now come on, how the hell is my mother supposed to know id her media player executes code or not? 14:45:39 thats the whole issue 14:45:43 dont let mommy near the keyboard :) 14:45:57 does your mommy know mediaplayer by default sends out data when running? 14:45:59 uh huh. 14:46:10 To I4_wrk, not you. 14:46:19 mp9 did, unless that changed 14:46:24 lol 14:46:25 And no, she probably doesn't. 14:46:40 you had/have to manually turn it off in a tab in the options 14:47:51 where the heck is tathi ? 14:47:55 My mother has no idea what MP3s are. I bought her a CD player that holds 150 discs. 6 slots are used. 14:48:10 lol 14:48:17