00:00:00 --- log: started forth/04.02.16
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02:04:49 * warpzero is away: Butterfly in the sky, I can go twice as high. Take a look, it's in a book, a Reading Rainbow.
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04:34:00 <Speuler> 'morning
04:35:17 <Robert> Morning, Speuler 
04:35:32 <Speuler> hi the_rob
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07:51:35 <Robert> Hi
08:24:15 <mur> Hi.
08:27:41 <Herkamire> hi
08:27:51 <mur> niu
08:53:48 <fridge> hi
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09:32:05 <fridge> hey kc5tja
09:34:35 <fridge> cooked anything with your solar oven yet? =)
09:42:22 <kc5tja> Not yet.  I'm still constructing it.
09:42:38 <kc5tja> I now have the outer box lined mostly with aluminum.  I have to finish later today with it though; I ran out of glue yesterday.
09:43:07 <kc5tja> Then I'll need to make the inner box suspension.  At that point, it'll be ready to cook, though not well.
09:43:22 * kc5tja also needs to figure something out for the solar glazing, and for the actual reflector.
09:47:54 <fridge> My parents recently bought a farm so I've been investigating a lot of subjects along those lines, unfortuantley it has very high rainfall, which is good for the soil, but means it is quite often overcast or foggy, which is bad for solar powered devices.
09:48:25 <kc5tja> PV arrays still generate power on overcast days; just not as much.
09:48:44 <kc5tja> However, rainfall generally is accompanied by wind.
09:48:51 <kc5tja> You may want to consider wind power as well.
09:49:41 <kc5tja> Perhaps another possibility is to harness the power of the rainfall itself too.
09:49:57 <fridge> yes, I've been looking for a cheap anemometer to figure out how much
09:50:42 <fridge> kc5tja, now there's an idea
09:52:08 <arke> mornin'
09:52:31 <fridge> Maybe I can harness the power of wombats and rabbits, there are plenty of those around too
09:53:13 <kc5tja> Hook them up into a little bunny-Matrix?
09:55:13 <fridge> get them on little hamster wheels
10:01:45 <arke> http://www.securitytracker.com/alerts/2004/Feb/1009067.html <--- read at bottom
10:07:36 <arke> I'm not really blaming microsoft for having that code (although it is stupid), but rather it shows them why linux et al are so much more secure --- there's many many more eyes looking at it.
10:11:28 <fridge> the advisory says it is already fixed in the latest version
10:14:32 <fridge> from what I've seen of the code it looks to be of the same quality as most decent quality software shops I've worked for. that is, there are well thought out bits, and your usual array of stuffups. It has a lot more to do with humans not being able to work at full capacity 24/7 than Microsoft BEING GAYER THAN AIDS
10:41:08 <arke> yeah lol
10:41:22 <mur> niu arke
10:42:04 <arke> terve mur
10:43:08 <mur> (not finnish greeting but typo)
10:43:34 <kc5tja> Apparently, only 5% of the Windows source code was leaked.
10:43:46 <kc5tja> That's 5% of the code at 213MB of source.
10:43:47 <kc5tja> Do the math.
10:43:51 <kc5tja> I wouldn't want the full source.
10:43:58 <mur> ms source where?
10:44:09 <arke> :)\
10:47:03 <fridge> mur: bittorrent, edonkey network, most of the P2P networks actually
10:47:37 <mur> does it have goto's as rumours indicate?
10:47:52 <mur> what parts does it have?
10:48:06 <fridge> http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2004/2/15/71552/7795
11:04:00 <Herkamire> 213MB/5% == 4260MB
11:05:20 <Speuler> compressed 213 MB
11:05:39 <Speuler> whole win source estimated 30..40 GB uncompressed
11:05:50 <Speuler> win sources expand to 660 MB
11:06:05 <Speuler> the ones in the wild now
11:41:10 <arke> 40GB is probably sources+images+all that
11:42:35 <Speuler> it contains files from 1989
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11:57:18 <kc5tja> Don't fix what isn't broken.
11:57:18 <kc5tja> :)
11:57:59 <Robert> Hehe.
11:58:05 <Speuler> wasn't windows broken in 1989 ?
11:58:14 <kc5tja> Windows was broken in 1985.
12:03:54 <kc5tja> Anyway, I'm going to get some food, run down to the store for more glue, then resume work on my solar oven.
12:16:47 <ratziggurat> Perhaps... or will the solar oven resume work on *you*?
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12:17:21 <kc5tja> Funny, everytime I put my hand inside the oven cavity, I can feel it get distinctly warmer.
12:18:33 <madgarden> For a second there, I read "my own cavity". 
12:19:14 <madgarden> Now you just need to get your hands on some aerogel for insulation. :)
12:19:35 <kc5tja> That would be sweet.
12:19:43 <kc5tja> But crumpled newspaper works just as well.  :)
12:19:58 <madgarden> Heh.
12:21:23 <madgarden> Aerogel has got to be the freakiest stuff.
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12:39:21 <fridge> aerogel? is that the substance they used in the NASA coment/meteor probe?
12:39:32 <fridge> to trap particles
12:41:48 <kc5tja> I don't know.
12:42:48 <fridge> I'll ask the oracle
12:43:01 <fridge> yes, yes it is.
12:43:12 <fridge> http://stardust.jpl.nasa.gov/tech/aerogel.html
12:45:12 * kc5tja nods
12:45:25 <mur> related to win source code
12:45:35 <mur> can you actaully build NT from sources?
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12:46:12 * mur wonders if anyone has tried to do that yet
12:47:05 <fridge> For relatively small quantities of aerogel the cost is about $1.00 per cubic centimeter for one liter.
12:47:13 <kc5tja> No.
12:47:22 <kc5tja> The sources as distributed represents only 5% of Windows.
12:47:32 <kc5tja> It includes the core kernel, but NOT any device drivers, for example.
12:47:42 <kc5tja> I think it includes GDI, but not DirectX, as another example.
12:47:43 <mur> and NT source?
12:47:56 <kc5tja> The sources are pretty much the same.
12:47:59 <mur> ok
12:48:00 <kc5tja> Win2K is just NT 5.
12:48:48 <kc5tja> OK, I'm off to the store.  Back in a bit.
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13:13:09 <madgarden> Check out the thermal properties of that aerogel.
13:17:21 <Robert> Sounds expensive.
13:17:25 <Robert> $1k/litre...
13:17:47 <madgarden> You'd have to spread it thin. ;)
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13:27:38 <arke> hi
13:43:23 <mur> re
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13:57:06 <kc5tja> Well, right now, the inner box is separated from the outer box by 1" all the way around.
13:57:11 <kc5tja> That's plenty for my purposes.
13:57:25 <kc5tja> (in fact, it's twice as wide as suggested in many online plans for solar ovens)
13:57:52 <kc5tja> The newspaper really only provides the support needed to hold the boxes in place should the oven get jostled by wind and what-not.
13:58:25 <kc5tja> The aluminum foil acts as a heat reflector.  The inner and outer boxes basically forms something quite similar to a DeWar flask, except that there is air inside the oven, and not a vacuum.
13:58:33 <kc5tja> A proper vacuum would be more proper of course, but...
14:44:35 <arke> :)
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16:03:42 <TheBlueWizard> hiya all
16:03:56 <blockhead> hey hey
16:04:54 <TheBlueWizard> hiya, um, blockhead (boy, I feel funny calling you by that nick)
16:05:08 <blockhead> :)
16:09:24 <kc5tja> Hello TheBlueWizard 
16:09:30 <kc5tja> Bye, though -- time to go to work.
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16:09:51 <TheBlueWizard> hmm...so short!
16:12:14 <arke> I think I shall 
16:12:26 <arke> I think I shall make a 16-bit DOS demo of my GUI..
16:12:42 <arke> slow, but ... well, I know how to work DOS
16:14:57 <TheBlueWizard> homegrown GUI?
16:17:04 <arke> yeah
16:17:13 <arke> I think I'll have it be asm
16:17:18 <arke> asm only for the demo
16:17:30 <arke> I work well with dos asm (when I don't worry about pipelining)
16:18:14 <TheBlueWizard> why worry about pipelining?
16:18:27 <arke> to make it faster
16:18:34 <arke> but in this case, I won't even worry about it
16:18:37 <arke> even if I should
16:18:41 <arke> its only a demo, after all
16:19:38 <TheBlueWizard> worrying about pipelining is only useful for small, extremely frequently used code fragments...otherwise it is best left to compilers to sweat it out
16:25:02 <arke> well, but what if the whole thing's in asm? :)
16:26:28 <fridge> you need to assemble the code, then use a decompiler to turn it into C
16:26:41 <fridge> then you can compile it and let the compiler worry about pipelining
16:26:45 <TheBlueWizard> if you want to go nuts trying to keep it perfectly pipelined, suit yourself <shrug> ... besides, each generation of CPU does the pipelining a bit differently
16:39:41 <TheBlueWizard> gotta go...bye all
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16:39:53 <Robert> Bye
16:45:37 <blockhead> http://www.bash.org/?221306
16:47:54 <arke> l0l
16:48:26 <Robert> Heh.
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17:04:00 <arke> Robert: how does the x86 mul/imul work? of all the things, I still don't get how that works ^_^
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18:09:35 <slava> hi
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18:26:28 <LoopHog> hi
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20:31:32 <arke> Sonarman: got any more decent songs?
20:31:35 <arke> :)
20:38:38 <Sonarman> i've got graveworm - unhallowed by the infernal one :)
20:39:31 <Sonarman> and as i lay dying - forever
20:39:39 <Sonarman> s/and//
20:39:54 <Sonarman> probably not your taste though :)
20:52:03 <fridge> they sound evil
20:52:38 <fridge> \m/ O_o \m/
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21:21:55 <Sonarman> fridge: hehe
21:22:17 <Sonarman> nice ascii-art
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21:35:45 <arke> hi kc5tja
21:39:04 <slava> hi
21:40:10 <arke> hi slava
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23:00:03 <slava> hi ratziggur
23:00:23 <ratziggur> Hi!
23:00:23 <ratziggur> Er...
23:00:26 --- nick: ratziggur -> madgarden
23:00:29 <madgarden> That's better. ;)
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23:26:04 <warp0b00> uh oh
23:26:10 <VitaminMoo> Freaky, huh
23:26:32 <warp0b00> yeah this kid kc5tja here he works at the in and out burger or something but he rules
23:29:24 <VitaminMoo> My good hardware forth interpreter is dead.
23:31:01 <warp0b00> you sold it on ebay
23:32:00 <VitaminMoo> Nah, my one that only broke once
23:32:02 <VitaminMoo> My invincible 9600
23:32:07 <VitaminMoo> It's in my closet breaking my floor.
23:32:21 <VitaminMoo> The thing was a little bit broken for like 4 years
23:32:24 <VitaminMoo> But it held on
23:34:19 <warp0b00> oic
23:34:29 <VitaminMoo> It no longer boots
23:34:34 <VitaminMoo> It might boot if I fscked with it enough
23:34:46 <VitaminMoo> But I don't really have the motivation
23:34:49 <VitaminMoo> It's kind of loud
23:34:51 <VitaminMoo> And kind of slow
23:34:53 <VitaminMoo> And kind of heavy
23:35:09 <warp0b00> yeah well
23:35:12 <warp0b00> mine is fast and light
23:35:22 <VitaminMoo> And on its way toward being broken
23:35:35 <warp0b00> its in constant sate of brokenness
23:35:38 <warp0b00> the cd wont eject
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23:36:47 <VitaminMoo> What CD is in there?
23:38:06 <warp0b00> uh
23:38:09 <warp0b00> gentoo i think
23:38:17 <warp0b00> maybe d2x
23:38:33 <VitaminMoo> Ahh, so it's fast an light, if you throw it like a frisbee.
23:39:04 <warp0b00> yeah 12"ers are good like that
23:41:51 * VitaminMoo ponders posting that to bash out of context
23:42:21 <warp0b00> both lines please
23:42:25 <warp0b00> just to make it more confusing
23:42:51 <VitaminMoo> Nah.... THe first line would screw it up
23:42:58 <VitaminMoo> Actually
23:42:59 <VitaminMoo> Yeah, both work
23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/04.02.16